Russiagate

[jcd11235 0]

billvon

… You know, I can’t help but draw comparisons to Benghazi. …

"Mr. President, I have a few thoughts on making the Benghazi committee permanent so that future generations can investigate it. But first, let me comment on what we've just heard here.
…
"Once again, this chamber is subjected to pleading from a special interest. It's this kind of entitled whining that has bankrupted this country showering favors on people who think they're owed something.
…
"This brings me to Benghazi."

Math tutoring available. Only $6! per hour! First lesson: Factorials!

[DJL 232]

billvon

******But, but . . . . Hillary! Obama!

Benghazi! Benghazi! Somebody should investigate Benghazi!

You laugh - but here's the latest deflection straight from NRA TV:
=========================================
GRANT STINCHFIELD (HOST): You know, I can’t help but draw comparisons to Benghazi. Now that was a terrorist attack, you could make the argument that this guy was a terrorist in what he rained down on that school. You had so many warnings, Kris, you and the men that you fought with over there warned about Benghazi over and over again that there were threats and there were security flaws and issues there. Now we see that there were warnings over and over again. We as Americans, I’m sad to say, we’re not learning lessons from other events and we could have learned – whether it was Benghazi or any other school shooting, this school wasn’t ready and they should have been.

KRIS PARONTO: That’s because we let politicians and political correctness, and that was in Benghazi and that was also in Florida, take charge. We’re not looking at common sense anymore, we’re letting agendas drive this. And when we let agendas drive this, we let left-wing agendas drive this, and I'm going to say this specifically when we let left-wing agendas drive this, this is what we see. We see loss of life. We see people die. If that isn't just a common denominator on this whole thing then people need to, again, wake up. I’m telling you to wake up. You gotta stop listening to the left-wing politicians. If you do we’re going to keep seeing this catastrophic events. We’re going to see the decline of morality in society which is partly responsible for this as well.

(plays clip of sheriff)

STINCHFIELD: It sounds like Hillary Clinton “What difference does it make?” This is what liberal leadership gets you. No responsibility, no accountability, we’ve got people dead from Benghazi, we’ve got people dead at Parkland and liberal leadership is at the height of all of it.
=============================================

So it's all Hillary Clinton's fault. Guns have NOTHING to do with the Florida shooting or Benghazi. Benghazi! Benghazi!

(Now I know what you are thinking - the NRA has a TV channel? Why yes they do.)

Ah yes, bullets don't kill people, a Leftist Agenda kills people. I fully support adding more security to schools and I have yet to see any action in that regard from "the right". I also fully support keeping weapons from people who cannot pass an evaluation (whatever that may be) for a firearms license and have yet to see any action in that regard "the right". It's also being phrased as leftist to ban bump stocks even though it's Trump who pushed that issue.

Dear Republicans, DO SOMETHING. YOU'RE RUNNING THE FUCKING COUNTRY RIGHT NOW.

"I encourage all awesome dangerous behavior." - Jeffro Fincher

[billvon 2,426]

So former Trump campaign official Sam Nunberg is saying he won't comply with a lawful subpoena for evidence in the Russia election-tampering investigation. Why won't he? Well he went on something of a day-long rant to several news organizations to get "his story" out there. Some quotes from that rant:

"I think he [Trump] may have done something during the election." Not really helping his case here.

"Irregardless of whether or not he had money coming to him during the election, OK, during the general, he won that election and he doesn't get credit for it." - Translation - it doesn't matter if he was taking Russian money because HE WON!

"I came up with the wall, I came up with the Muslim ban, I came up with everything to attack Jeb Bush, all that stuff." - And since I was so integral to the Trump campaign, it makes no sense to think my emails had anything to do with the Trump campaign.

"They ask me to go to the grand jury after I sat there for close to five and a half hours, Gloria, I'm not going back in." - Another reason he can't deal with this. "Justice is just too hard. Almost six hours! Let's just avoid it."

"Trump may have very well done something during the election with the Russians." - Again, bad idea if you are claiming "you don't need to look at my emails."

The best people.

[wolfriverjoe 1,351]

billvon

The best people.

Well, he promised to 'drain the swamp'.

Apparently he scraped the bottom of it to find people for his campaign.

"There are NO situations which do not call for a French Maid outfit." Lucky McSwervy

"~ya don't GET old by being weak & stupid!" - Airtwardo

[yoink 321]

billvon

The best people.

It's all in your definition of 'best'.

They won Trump the election. Can't argue with that.

If you're purely results driven as Mr. Trump claims to be he totally had the 'best' people in his campaign. That they're lying, criminal scumbags doesn't matter.

[wolfriverjoe 1,351]

yoink

***
The best people.

It's all in your definition of 'best'.

They won Trump the election. Can't argue with that.

If you're purely results driven as Mr. Trump claims to be he totally had the 'best' people in his campaign. That they're lying, criminal scumbags doesn't matter.

Well, to be a bit pedantic, Trump had better people in his campaign that HRC did.

That doesn't necessarily mean the "best."

And he's had how many resign? Indicted? Guilty pleas?

Compared to Obama?

"There are NO situations which do not call for a French Maid outfit." Lucky McSwervy

"~ya don't GET old by being weak & stupid!" - Airtwardo

[SkyDekker 1,141]

Apparently, after waking up somewhat sober this morning, he is now saying he will comply.

[DJL 232]

SkyDekker

Apparently, after waking up somewhat sober this morning, he is now saying he will comply.

Sounds like he finally got a lawyer smart enough to tell him to STFU before he indicts himself.

"I encourage all awesome dangerous behavior." - Jeffro Fincher

[billvon 2,426]

>It's all in your definition of 'best'.
>They won Trump the election. Can't argue with that.
>If you're purely results driven as Mr. Trump claims to be he totally had the 'best'
>people in his campaign.

True. Of course, by those standards Timothy McVeigh and Jim Jones also chose the best people.

[billvon 2,426]

The Nunberg meltdown is interesting in several ways, including the insight into the Mueller investigation and insight into what was happening within Trump's campaign.

One very significant thing he said concerned Trump's knowledge of the meeting between Trump Jr and Russian agents promising dirt on Clinton. Trump Jr kept the meeting secret for months; this, of course, is the definition of collusion. Trump's one remaining defense could well be "I knew nothing about it; it was all Don Jr!" thus throwing his son under the bus - but protecting himself.

Nunberg provided evidence that this wasn't true, and that Trump knew about the meeting: "He talked about it a week before and I don't know why he did this."

[kallend 1,646]

billvon

The Nunberg meltdown is interesting in several ways, including the insight into the Mueller investigation and insight into what was happening within Trump's campaign.

One very significant thing he said concerned Trump's knowledge of the meeting between Trump Jr and Russian agents promising dirt on Clinton. Trump Jr kept the meeting secret for months; this, of course, is the definition of collusion. Trump's one remaining defense could well be "I knew nothing about it; it was all Don Jr!" thus throwing his son under the bus - but protecting himself.

Nunberg provided evidence that this wasn't true, and that Trump knew about the meeting: "He talked about it a week before and I don't know why he did this."

BUT HILLARY! BENGHAZI! OBAMA!

...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[DJL 232]

I gotta ask, this guy "Nunberg"... Is this all a ruse and Nunberg is short for Nothing Burger and Trump set this up as the world longest punchline?

"I encourage all awesome dangerous behavior." - Jeffro Fincher

[gowlerk 1,923]

DJL

I gotta ask, this guy "Nunberg"... Is this all a ruse and Nunberg is short for Nothing Burger and Trump set this up as the world longest punchline?

Bravo, take a bow.

Always remember the brave children who died defending your right to bear arms. Freedom is not free.

[JoeWeber 2,325]

gowlerk

***I gotta ask, this guy "Nunberg"... Is this all a ruse and Nunberg is short for Nothing Burger and Trump set this up as the world longest punchline?

Bravo, take a bow.

Don't act alarmed but "Nothing Burger" is an anagram of Bring Other Gun. Probably means nothing....

[kallend 1,646]

SO after studiously avoiding interviewing any likely witnesses or reviewing any phone records, emails, etc. for evidence of collusion, and dismissing the views of the intelligence community, the House GOP announced that it found no evidence of collusion.

Fancy that.

...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[DJL 232]

Tillerson out.

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-43388723

We seriously need to get a Whitehouse Bingo game going.

"I encourage all awesome dangerous behavior." - Jeffro Fincher

[SkyDekker 1,141]

On Dec 1, 2017 Donald Trump called Rex Tillerson leaving soon Fake News.

[wmw999 2,146]

I don't believe 4 months counts as "soon" to DJT
"10 minutes from now" counts as "soon."
"When you piss me off" is a reason.

People who like Trump, and think he's doing the right thing -- do you really want a foreign and economic policy that looks only at the immediate anticipated reaction (and by "anticipated" I mean the one that fulfills all the prejudices of your belief set, not "thought through.") This is just as true of the reactionary liberals, but right now they're not in national power.

Trump is not king, and loyalty to the country is more important than loyalty to the individual president. I hope people remember that. And if you think that loyalty to the current president is important because he's president, how loyal were you to the last one? After all, he was president.

Wendy P.

There is nothing more dangerous than breaking a basic safety rule and getting away with it. It removes fear of the consequences and builds false confidence. (tbrown)

[DJL 232]

wmw999

I don't believe 4 months counts as "soon" to DJT
"10 minutes from now" counts as "soon."
"When you piss me off" is a reason.

People who like Trump, and think he's doing the right thing -- do you really want a foreign and economic policy that looks only at the immediate anticipated reaction (and by "anticipated" I mean the one that fulfills all the prejudices of your belief set, not "thought through.") This is just as true of the reactionary liberals, but right now they're not in national power.

Trump is not king, and loyalty to the country is more important than loyalty to the individual president. I hope people remember that. And if you think that loyalty to the current president is important because he's president, how loyal were you to the last one? After all, he was president.

Wendy P.

IF this is about Tillerson speaking up against Russia on his own this is very justified. I don't necessarily agree with it but diplomats cannot announce our foreign policy without putting it through the President.

"I encourage all awesome dangerous behavior." - Jeffro Fincher

[SkyDekker 1,141]

DJL

***I don't believe 4 months counts as "soon" to DJT
"10 minutes from now" counts as "soon."
"When you piss me off" is a reason.

People who like Trump, and think he's doing the right thing -- do you really want a foreign and economic policy that looks only at the immediate anticipated reaction (and by "anticipated" I mean the one that fulfills all the prejudices of your belief set, not "thought through.") This is just as true of the reactionary liberals, but right now they're not in national power.

Trump is not king, and loyalty to the country is more important than loyalty to the individual president. I hope people remember that. And if you think that loyalty to the current president is important because he's president, how loyal were you to the last one? After all, he was president.

Wendy P.

IF this is about Tillerson speaking up against Russia on his own this is very justified. I don't necessarily agree with it but diplomats cannot announce our foreign policy without putting it through the President.

Agreed, speaking ill of the boss' boss will have consequences.

[wolfriverjoe 1,351]

DJL

IF this is about Tillerson speaking up against Russia on his own this is very justified. I don't necessarily agree with it but diplomats cannot announce our foreign policy without putting it through the President.

Well, yes and no.

I agree that, in general, diplomats cannot go 'off script.'

But, the SecState really isn't a 'diplomat.', he's the face of US foreign policy.
He's 4th in succession for the office of president.

And what he said was really necessary.

If Trump didn't say it, it still had to be said.
If Trump was too scared to challenge Russia, too stupid to realize what this means, or simply told by his owner to shut up, it still had to be said.

"There are NO situations which do not call for a French Maid outfit." Lucky McSwervy

"~ya don't GET old by being weak & stupid!" - Airtwardo

[yoink 321]

wmw999

Trump is not king, and loyalty to the country is more important than loyalty to the individual president. I hope people remember that. And if you think that loyalty to the current president is important because he's president, how loyal were you to the last one? After all, he was president.

Wendy P.

Loyalty to 'my team' or 'my tribe' is almost hard wired into humans I think, and at the moment Americans are focused on their political teams, rather than the international tribes.

Now that I'm typing this I have a genuine hypothetical question for Ron - if the Repubicans were being unpatriotic or anti-american, would you vote democrat? What's more important - the team or the tribe?


Look at how easily team sports like football create groups of opposing fans, then from that hardcore rivalries. Growing up when football hooliganism was mainstream it was almost a visceral part of nature - if you're not on my team then you're my enemy. It's as close as I can get to understanding Ron's perspective.

[wolfriverjoe 1,351]

yoink

...Now that I'm typing this I have a genuine hypothetical question for Ron - if the Republicans were being unpatriotic or anti-american, would you vote democrat? What's more important - the team or the tribe?

You don't have to ask that hypothetically.

Ron has made it pretty clear that he supports the Rs and Trump.
And any criticism of them, or reports of 'unpatriotic' behavior is simply 'fake news.'

OTOH, he has also made it clear that the "socialist/communist/liberal" democrats are his 'enemy.'

I highly doubt you could convince him otherwise.

"There are NO situations which do not call for a French Maid outfit." Lucky McSwervy

"~ya don't GET old by being weak & stupid!" - Airtwardo

[SkyDekker 1,141]

Quote

And any criticism of them, or reports of 'unpatriotic' behavior is simply 'fake news.'

Or still better than what Hillary would have been.

"But Hillary" seems to be the way they explain everything to themselves.

[yoink 321]

wolfriverjoe

***
...Now that I'm typing this I have a genuine hypothetical question for Ron - if the Republicans were being unpatriotic or anti-american, would you vote democrat? What's more important - the team or the tribe?

You don't have to ask that hypothetically.

Ron has made it pretty clear that he supports the Rs and Trump.
And any criticism of them, or reports of 'unpatriotic' behavior is simply 'fake news.'

OTOH, he has also made it clear that the "socialist/communist/liberal" democrats are his 'enemy.'

I highly doubt you could convince him otherwise.

Hence my question - what if the republicans were being unpatriotic? could they ever be, or is being Republican being patriotic?

What if he had to choose? At what point do you choose your tribe over your team?