quade 3
I find it more odd and disturbing to kill a 20 week old baby and then flush it down the drain and pretend it didn't exist simply because it wasn't convenient to let the baby live.
jclalor 12
QuoteYour link didn't work for me so I have no idea what the truth of the story is. From the link it looks like he took the still-born body home to play with it with his kids. If that is the case, then yes, that would be considered highly odd.
The link was sourced from this Washington post story:
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A61804-2005Apr17.html
jclalor 12
QuoteQuoteI find it more odd and disturbing to kill a 20 week old baby and then flush it down the drain and pretend it didn't exist simply because it wasn't convenient to let the baby live.
So you still find it odd?
airdvr 200
Most people find jumping from functioning aircraft an odd behavior.
Thankfully I have no idea how it might feel to lose an unborn child.
Thankfully I have no idea how it might feel to lose an unborn child.
Please don't dent the planet.
Destinations by Roxanne
Destinations by Roxanne
jgoose71 0
I really wish they had dug this deep into Obama's drug dealing college days....
"There is an art, it says, or, rather, a knack to flying. The knack lies in learning how to throw yourself at the ground and miss."
Life, the Universe, and Everything
Life, the Universe, and Everything
Marinus 0
QuoteI find it more odd and disturbing to kill a 20 week old baby and then flush it down the drain and pretend it didn't exist simply because it wasn't convenient to let the baby live.
Unfortunately, the only thing that prevents unwanted pregnancies (and thus the demand for abortions) are purity balls, and those are very, very odd and disturbing.
jclalor 12
There was no "digging" at all, Santorum volunteered this information.
QuoteQuoteQuoteI find it more odd and disturbing to kill a 20 week old baby and then flush it down the drain and pretend it didn't exist simply because it wasn't convenient to let the baby live.
So you still find it odd?
Define odd.
Everyone greives in their own way. If this helped him, his wife and his children to deal with this baby's death, who are we to judge him. At least he is teaching his children a lesson on the value he places on a human life as oppossed to those who IMO have a callus disregard for it. I suspect those who find this behaviour odd are in the latter catagory.
There are organizations out there that help with these matters and assist a family with their coping, suh as the United Appeal for the Dead.
My wife is hotter than your wife.
My wife is hotter than your wife.
piisfish 136
I find that a muslim disguised as Santa is oddQuoteMost people find jumping from functioning aircraft an odd behavior.
Thankfully I have no idea how it might feel to lose an unborn child.
scissors beat paper, paper beat rock, rock beat wingsuit - KarlM
jclalor 12
I don't mean to diminish the pain a parent experiences after loosing a 20 week fetus, it is how ever not the same as a parent loosing a child.
People do grieve differently to death, that does not mean people cannot grieve in odd ways. This was odd.
People do grieve differently to death, that does not mean people cannot grieve in odd ways. This was odd.
QuoteI don't mean to diminish the pain a parent experiences after loosing a 20 week fetus, it is how ever not the same as a parent loosing a child.
People do grieve differently to death, that does not mean people cannot grieve in odd ways. This was odd.
That's your view. Obviously his is different.
Do you find that muslims pray 5 times a day odd, also?
Andy9o8 0
I don't think "playing with the body" is a fair description of what the Santorums did. They were mourning over the body. Have you ever held, caressed and spoken to the body of a loved one who had just died? I have, more than once. It's pretty normal and typical human behavior.
I've also known some people, not very religious, who chose to treat the miscarriage of a fetus as the death of a child, complete with baptism/naming and funeral. No, it's not very common, but that's how some people choose to deal with it.
I dislike Santorum on so many levels. And yeah, he's kinda weird. But he and his family were in grief, and coping with it as best as they saw fit. They should be left the hell alone about this.
I've also known some people, not very religious, who chose to treat the miscarriage of a fetus as the death of a child, complete with baptism/naming and funeral. No, it's not very common, but that's how some people choose to deal with it.
I dislike Santorum on so many levels. And yeah, he's kinda weird. But he and his family were in grief, and coping with it as best as they saw fit. They should be left the hell alone about this.
jclalor 12
Then he should of kept this to his self, and not hung a picture of the fetus on his senate office wall .
Andy9o8 0
And I, for one, despair the tendency to rip someone a new asshole about the minutest aspects of their personal lives just because they're politicians. As I've said in other threads, it's the aspect of politics that disgusts me, and it's why I've chosen not to be a player, not even as a "hobbyist", in elective politics.
Quote
QuoteThe mourning process for the loss of a child is different for everyone. It is often quite traumatic and rightfully so.
The mourning process is different for everyone, I do think most people would find this behavior very odd.
Then I am certainly glad that you don't speak for most people.
Political posturing and other bullshit that goes on in here aside - I disagree with his position from a medical standpoint. A stillborn 20wk fetus would not survive outside the womb, with our current limits of medical technology - so do I think calling it a "baby" is weird, sure.
From an emotional standpoint, that was to be their child. It's not like they took it home, put it in a baseball hat and tried to play catch with it.
I have sat and grieved with a families after being the one to deliver still born children. There is no way to describe the pain and grief that the parents to be suffer, unless you have been through it yourself. In a way, I would consider them fortunate as it may be somewhat "easier" to cope with the idea that the fetus was still non-viable. I have unfortunately been involved with delivering dead near-term infants, and I can honestly say it is something that I never want to do again. The emotional toll, even on me was just painful to deal with.
Given that you list Pediatric Nursing as a profession, I am curious - what exactly do you have a problem with here? Have you not had to deal with enough grieving families that this truly seems that weird? I mean no personal offense, but political feelings aside, what exactly is your problem?
/don't even like Santorum
QuoteThen he should of kept this to his self, and not hung a picture of the fetus on his senate office wall .
It says the baby lived for 2 hours. I thought even the most far out lefties only considered it a "fetus" before it is born. Seriously, you are starting to come off as very callus in your criticism of him. BTW, I don't care much for Santorum's politics but I respect his right as a father and a human being to grieve in whatever way he deems appropriate
GeorgiaDon 340
Agree with you two 100%. This "issue" is not germain to anything having to do with how Santorum would behave as president.
There are lots of reasons to disagree (or apparently agree, for some people) with Santorum's proposed policies. Better to spend time/bandwidth on that.
Don
There are lots of reasons to disagree (or apparently agree, for some people) with Santorum's proposed policies. Better to spend time/bandwidth on that.
Don
_____________________________________
Tolerance is the cost we must pay for our adventure in liberty. (Dworkin, 1996)
“Education is not filling a bucket, but lighting a fire.” (Yeats)
Tolerance is the cost we must pay for our adventure in liberty. (Dworkin, 1996)
“Education is not filling a bucket, but lighting a fire.” (Yeats)
billvon 2,478
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>It says the baby lived for 2 hours. I thought even the most far out lefties only
>considered it a "fetus" before it is born.
?? Did the baby live for 2 hours or 20 weeks?
>considered it a "fetus" before it is born.
?? Did the baby live for 2 hours or 20 weeks?
Quote>It says the baby lived for 2 hours. I thought even the most far out lefties only
>considered it a "fetus" before it is born.
?? Did the baby live for 2 hours or 20 weeks?
The writer of this piece of **cough..cough** "journalism edited it apparently to appeal to the mentality of his readers. Here is what it says if you follow the link to the original story from the Washington Post
QuoteIn his Senate office, on a shelf next to an autographed baseball, Sen. Rick Santorum keeps a framed photo of his son Gabriel Michael, the fourth of his seven children. Named for two archangels, Gabriel Michael was born prematurely, at 20 weeks, on Oct. 11, 1996, and lived two hours outside the womb.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A61804-2005Apr17.html
This is why I fnd this so offensive to be attacking Santorum for this. I wonder how any of his critics would have handled this if it was their "child".
The mourning process is different for everyone, I do think most people would find this behavior very odd.
Your link didn't work for me so I have no idea what the truth of the story is. From the link it looks like he took the still-born body home to play with it with his kids. If that is the case, then yes, that would be considered highly odd.
That said, I have no idea if that's even what the real story is, let alone the factual truth.
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