Awesome things "god" does.

[fasted3 0]

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I sure as hell dont believe that humans are the top of the evolutionary ladder in the universe

Why not? I don't think there is any proof otherwise.

But what do I know?

[winsor 186]

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>Why?

Cause reality generally trumps posts on an Internet forum.

Wait a minute...

Are you suggesting there is a difference?

[Coreece 190]

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>Why?

Cause reality generally trumps posts on an Internet forum.

And reality wouldn't have changed except for the fact that they know God exists...Wouldn't they still think his acts to be appalling?

Your secrets are the true reflection of who you really are...

[winsor 186]

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>Why?

Cause reality generally trumps posts on an Internet forum.

And reality wouldn't have changed except for the fact that they know God exists...Wouldn't they still think his acts to be appalling?

Fallacy: Argumentum ad Baculum (appeal to force)

"Agree with me or you are TOAST! You wouldn't LIKE me when I am ANGRY! Now, am I right?"

"Uh, yeah, sure. Whatever you say."

[Coreece 190]

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>Why?

Cause reality generally trumps posts on an Internet forum.

And reality wouldn't have changed except for the fact that they know God exists...Wouldn't they still think his acts to be appalling?

Fallacy: Argumentum ad Baculum (appeal to force)

"Agree with me or you are TOAST! You wouldn't LIKE me when I am ANGRY! Now, am I right?"

"Uh, yeah, sure. Whatever you say."

Is that a yes?

Your secrets are the true reflection of who you really are...

[billvon 2,400]

>And reality wouldn't have changed except for the fact that they know
>God exists...Wouldn't they still think his acts to be appalling?

Sure. But the sudden appearance of an omniscient, omnipotent deity (especially one prone to tantrums, like Shiva) is going to change reality quite a bit for most people - including yourself, I'd wager. So the statement "reality wouldn't have changed except . . ." is like seeing someone who's dead and saying "he's alive except . . ."

[ChrisL 2]

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If I'm presented with incontrovertible proof I will certainly take it into consideration and possibly change my position.

If God were to reveal his Shekinah Glory to non believers, wouldn't they still think he's a "fucking dick," or will they shit their pants and drop to their knees and repent in a pool of piss? That is the question...

I never thought God was a "fucking dick" even when I believed in him. Those are someone elses words, so its not appropriate for you to toss them at me in response to a serious post.

I dont think he is a dick now either, nor do I think Santa Claus is a dick because its alleged that he gave
some people coal in their stockings for not measuring up to his expectations.

Still, I'd rather get a lump of coal than an eternity in hell, so all in all if I was going to believe in fairy tales
I think I'd go with Santa

I think if God is what you say he is and revealed himself to anyone, believer and non-believer alike,
they might just shit their pants.

__

My mighty steed

[freethefly 6]

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The bible never dates the planet, as much as some people, believers and not, would like to claim that it does.

It does not give a specific age. It does provide a chronological timeline that puts the age of the planet at roughly 6500 years old. Using the timeline from the "first day", the day that Adam was "created" and the age when he died (about 930 years old ), along with the genealogy of those descending from him (as ages are given) the OT spans roughly 4000-4500 years. The supposing death of Christ happened 2011 years ago. This would place the age of the planet at roughly 6000-6500+ years.

"...And once you're gone, you can't come back
When you're out of the blue and into the black."
Neil Young

[winsor 186]

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>Why?

Cause reality generally trumps posts on an Internet forum.

And reality wouldn't have changed except for the fact that they know God exists...Wouldn't they still think his acts to be appalling?

[winsor 186]

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If I'm presented with incontrovertible proof I will certainly take it into consideration and possibly change my position.

If God were to reveal his Shekinah Glory to non believers, wouldn't they still think he's a "fucking dick," or will they shit their pants and drop to their knees and repent in a pool of piss? That is the question...

I never thought God was a "fucking dick" even when I believed in him. Those are someone elses words, so its not appropriate for you to toss them at me in response to a serious post.

I dont think he is a dick now either, nor do I think Santa Claus is a dick because its alleged that he gave
some people coal in their stockings for not measuring up to his expectations.

Still, I'd rather get a lump of coal than an eternity in hell, so all in all if I was going to believe in fairy tales
I think I'd go with Santa

I think if God is what you say he is and revealed himself to anyone, believer and non-believer alike,
they might just shit their pants.

FWIW, the hell stuff showed up when pagans got involved.

There is no suggestion of an afterlife in Torah, and the fallen angel who plays such a big part of the Magic Jewish Zombie mythos is largely absent in the Hebrew Scriptures.

The fact that our family lore from the Bronze Age (plus what we took on during the Babylonian Exile) has been coopted in mutant form is not our fault. Our stories were twisted to begin with, but the Europeans took them and sprained them.


BSBD,

Winsor

[maadmax 0]

[
Is that a yes?

[Shotgun 1]

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If God were to reveal his Shekinah Glory to non believers, wouldn't they still think he's a "fucking dick," . . .

I guess that would depend on whether he was acting like a fucking dick when he revealed himself.... I mean, if he caused me to spill hot coffee in my lap or something...

[Coreece 190]

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>And reality wouldn't have changed except for the fact that they know
>God exists...Wouldn't they still think his acts to be appalling?

Sure.

Ok then, so Jay's earlier statment that started this brief chain of posts rings true.

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No amount of "proof" or argumentation will be sufficient for you. No matter what is said or shown to you will change your heart.

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But the sudden appearance of an omniscient, omnipotent deity (especially one prone to tantrums, like Shiva) is going to change reality quite a bit for most people - including yourself, I'd wager.

It's probably best to just stick to the generality and keep me out of it. It wouldn't be wise to place a wager without knowing those odds...

Your secrets are the true reflection of who you really are...

[Coreece 190]

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I never thought God was a "fucking dick" even when I believed in him. Those are someone elses words, so its not appropriate for you to toss them at me in response to a serious post.

I know you didn't say that which is why I kept it general...but I see your concern. I apologize for making it appear that way. It wasn't my intention.

Your secrets are the true reflection of who you really are...

[jakee 1,255]

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No amount of "proof" or argumentation will be sufficient for you.

There is no proof. There isn't even "proof".

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No matter what is said or shown to you will change your heart.

Lots has been said. Nothing has been shown.

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I would argue that you will not and even can not believe or have saving faith in Christ without divine interevention.

See, actual divine intervention, now that would be proof.

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Every breath you take is on loan from God and you curse him with every breath.

No. In the post you were replying to he just said that he doesn't blame God, he just doesn't think he exists. I don't know why it is that you can't understand that?

Do you want to have an ideagasm?

[Coreece 190]

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If God were to reveal his Shekinah Glory to non believers, wouldn't they still think he's a "fucking dick," . . .

I guess that would depend on whether he was acting like a fucking dick when he revealed himself.... I mean, if he caused me to spill hot coffee in my lap or something...

Your secrets are the true reflection of who you really are...

[winsor 186]

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[
Is that a yes?

Wow, talk about a case in point for cognitive dissonance.

No, that is anything but a yes. That is what one says to a rabid psychotic in the hope of placating him or her, and has precious little to do with accuracy.

It was an example of fallacy - illogical by definition - and the attempt to apply meaning to it is telling.

Irony score: 10

[Coreece 190]

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[
Is that a yes?

Wow, talk about a case in point for cognitive dissonance.

No, that is anything but a yes. That is what one says to a rabid psychotic in the hope of placating him or her, and has precious little to do with accuracy.

It was an example of fallacy - illogical by definition - and the attempt to apply meaning to it is telling.

Irony score: 10

Entertainment Score: 10+, you swallowed the hook bait and sinker on that one!!


...

[freethefly 6]

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If God were to reveal his Shekinah Glory to non believers, wouldn't they still think he's a "fucking dick," . . .

I guess that would depend on whether he was acting like a fucking dick when he revealed himself.... I mean, if he caused me to spill hot coffee in my lap or something...

And... you just may have a personal injury lawsuit against the The Almighty.
Just in case, you might want to contact Andy or Lawrocket.

"...And once you're gone, you can't come back
When you're out of the blue and into the black."
Neil Young

[devildog 0]

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The bible never dates the planet, as much as some people, believers and not, would like to claim that it does.

It does not give a specific age. It does provide a chronological timeline that puts the age of the planet at roughly 6500 years old. Using the timeline from the "first day", the day that Adam was "created" and the age when he died (about 930 years old ), along with the genealogy of those descending from him (as ages are given) the OT spans roughly 4000-4500 years. The supposing death of Christ happened 2011 years ago. This would place the age of the planet at roughly 6000-6500+ years.

No, actually it doesn't work that way. Using the genealogy tree is a flawed method because the language used simply means descendant, not father->son. It could be 1 generation or 1000. The language doesn't differentiate whatsoever.

You stop breathing for a few minutes and everyone jumps to conclusions.

[freethefly 6]

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No, actually it doesn't work that way.

Actually, it does.
Next, I suppose, you will tell me that a day to God is a 1000 years!

"...And once you're gone, you can't come back
When you're out of the blue and into the black."
Neil Young

[devildog 0]

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No, actually it doesn't work that way.

Actually, it does.
Next, I suppose, you will tell me that a day to God is a 1000 years!

According to certain passages, yes. But as far as the Hebrew is concerned, yalad in this case, the word does not mean direct descendant, just "descendant". A careful reading of even the English translations shows this to be the case.

You stop breathing for a few minutes and everyone jumps to conclusions.

[Meso 38]

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According to certain passages, yes. But as far as the Hebrew is concerned, yalad in this case, the word does not mean direct descendant, just "descendant". A careful reading of even the English translations shows this to be the case.

Wow, if we're going to go into the semantics of translations in the bible and the way it skews people's interpretations of the meaning we may need a whole new thread. The translation and use of the word Lucifer being one that stands out.

[normiss 622]

If they can't translate the simple meaning of 'one day', how the hell will they ever convince people of their little fantasy?

Somethings about facts, truths, and stories really do matter.

It would appear the bible could be considered the most successful work of fiction ever.

I wonder if Casey Anthony's life story will garner this much attention some 6000 to 20 million years later.
Depending on one's interpretation, meaning, or definition of 'years' of course.

[winsor 186]

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If they can't translate the simple meaning of 'one day', how the hell will they ever convince people of their little fantasy?

Somethings about facts, truths, and stories really do matter.

It would appear the bible could be considered the most successful work of fiction ever.

I wonder if Casey Anthony's life story will garner this much attention some 6000 to 20 million years later.
Depending on one's interpretation, meaning, or definition of 'years' of course.

The origins of the Hebrew Scriptures have almost nothing to do with the significance attached to them in retrospect - by Europeans in particular. The Hebrews are an Asian culture.

I know very few rabbis who would fail to raise an eyebrow at an exceedingly literal interpretation of these works. Asked whether the year 5771 is accurate in the sense that Adam was created knowing how to count, what day it was, the significance of time and so forth resulted in exaggerated eye-rolling, and the response that the importance was from the standpoint of tradition, rather than chronology.

Bereshit (Genesis) was a Cliff's Notes version of lore assimilated in Mesopotamia (largely Sumerian) during the Babylonian Exile, as recorded by Ezra the Scribe. Prior to Ezra committing to written form the "first four" books, Torah consisted solely of Devarim (Deuteronomy).

Just because you are a tad skeptical about Zeus, Athena, Poseidon et al. does not mean that the Iliad and Odyssey are without value because mythology makes up a large part of the narrative. Similarly, the significance of Torah is not strictly a function of the existance of a deity.

Much of the Tanakh is the result of embellishment at the very least (Esther is a prime example), but the writings are typical of styles in use by various cultures in the Bronze into Iron Ages.

As Shonfield makes clear in The Passover Plot, attempting to ascribe literal interpretation to works from another culture is difficult at best.

Beware the Holy Typo.


BSBD,

Winsor