chuckakers 370 #276 January 5, 2009 Quote>The jews don't declare death to their neighbors or people of different faiths. And Muslims don't drop nuclear bombs on innocent women and children when that bombing isn't even needed to win a war. But that's a bad reason to condemn all Christians. Yeah, whatever on the nuke thing. Let's stay on course, Bill. Many (dare I say most) Arabs want the Jews dead and Israel gone. We can dispute the cause of this particular attack, but it is the Jews - not the Arabs - who have given the live and let live approach a try over and over again. Explain to me how Israel should behave when their neighbors openly say they want to destroy them just for being Jewish.Chuck Akers D-10855 Houston, TX Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 2,421 #277 January 5, 2009 > Many (dare I say most) Arabs want the Jews dead and Israel gone. I've met perhaps 40 Arabs in my life. None want Jews dead. Which Arabs have you met that want Jews dead? I'm not saying that none do, but I think the statement that "most Arabs want Jews dead" comes from watching TV rather than any sort of reality. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SpeedRacer 1 #278 January 5, 2009 And some of the Indians (Comanches, Apaches, Sioux) wanted us dead just because we were white Europeans. ....or did they have another reason? Speed Racer -------------------------------------------------- Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Andy9o8 0 #279 January 5, 2009 QuoteAnd some of the Indians (Comanches, Apaches, Sioux) wanted us dead just because we were white Europeans. ....or did they have another reason? They wanted our blue jeans. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kelpdiver 2 #280 January 5, 2009 Quote>It's still not a war by proxy for us. We're not attacking anyone, we're >defending. If you are claiming that the recent Israeli offensive is actually defense, then you're just playing word games. No, I'm saying that their actions are by their own choice, not carrying out the wishes of the US. Proxy fight impllies that DC is directing the action. It's been long established that the Israelis act independently of our desires. They are our allies, not our puppets. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JohnRich 4 #281 January 5, 2009 QuoteI've met perhaps 40 Arabs in my life. None want Jews dead. Which Arabs have you met that want Jews dead? I'm not saying that none do, but I think the statement that "most Arabs want Jews dead" comes from watching TV rather than any sort of reality. The ones firing the rockets are the problem ones. And the rest of them aren't doing anything to stop them. So, if they're going to look the other way instead of doing what's right, then they can't blame Israel for retaliating to stop the rocket attacks. If they don't like Israel retaliating, then they should stop the rockets themselves. If the majority of Palestinians really want peace, then it's up to them to do this. They need to take care of their own problem people, so that Israel won't have to. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
StreetScooby 5 #282 January 6, 2009 Quote OK. In that case, the Hamas rocket attacks were peace overtures that were brutally rebuffed by an evil government. Huh?We are all engines of karma Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 2,421 #283 January 6, 2009 >Huh? If offense = defense, then rocket attacks = peace overtures. Equally silly definitions. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
StreetScooby 5 #284 January 6, 2009 Quote And Muslims don't drop nuclear bombs on innocent women and children when that bombing isn't even needed to win a war. WTF? You are really getting out there in this thread. As Paul Tibbets said, there is no morality in war. You win. Our My culture won. Look how it has turned out. What have the Muslims done with their culture? Nothing to brag about, IMO. Our My culture SHOULD be celebrated. I no longer expect guys like you to do so. You are too guilt ridden. Such a shame. You probably don't even have kids. I do have kids, and there is no way in hell I'm going to let a guy like you have ANY influence on them. I will mock you and your ilk at my dinner table. And when you and your ilk are long dead, it will be my offspring that continue my culture.We are all engines of karma Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Andy9o8 0 #285 January 6, 2009 Quote>Huh? If offense = defense, then rocket attacks = peace overtures. Equally silly definitions. Sorry, Bill, but you're the one sillying the definitions. Semantics do not alter the facts. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JohnRich 4 #286 January 6, 2009 QuoteIf offense = defense, then rocket attacks = peace overtures. Equally silly definitions. That's like saying that if the neighborhood kid is breaking your windows with a slingshot from his own yard across the street, that you shouldn't be allowed to walk across the street and confiscate his slingshot. When you're being attacked from afar with rockets, it's not "offense" to go after the rocket-launch sites on your enemy's land. That's defense. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
falxori 0 #287 January 6, 2009 QuoteThey need to take care of their own problem people, so that Israel won't have to. the problem people used to be problem people, now they are the government... "Carpe diem, quam minimum credula postero." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
shropshire 0 #288 January 6, 2009 Menachem Begin ? terrorist turned politico? Depends upon ones perspective I guess. (.)Y(.) Chivalry is not dead; it only sleeps for want of work to do. - Jerome K Jerome Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
falxori 0 #289 January 6, 2009 QuoteMenachem Begin ? terrorist turned politico? Depends upon ones perspective I guess even if you go by that twisted logic... when Begin became a politician he was no longer a terrorist, was he? this is a switch the Palestinians have not made. Arafat started to but he too kept terrorism as a valid option... "Carpe diem, quam minimum credula postero." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
shropshire 0 #290 January 6, 2009 Agree and that's a fair point - up to a point (BTW It's not twisted logic, it's history) (.)Y(.) Chivalry is not dead; it only sleeps for want of work to do. - Jerome K Jerome Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rhys 0 #291 January 6, 2009 QuoteThat's like saying that if the neighborhood kid is breaking your windows with a slingshot from his own yard across the street, that you shouldn't be allowed to walk across the street and confiscate his slingshot. When you're being attacked from afar with rockets, it's not "offense" to go after the rocket-launch sites on your enemy's land. That's defense. You hit the nail on the head, But shooting the kid with a shotgun wouldn't be the best way to deal with the situation and that is what israel are doing. What is it with the military that they cannot use covert subtle operations to achieve thier objective? Cheaper more effective, less destuctive conflict. Reducing civilian casualties and damage to infrastructure..... ... but where is the money in that!"When the power of love overcomes the love of power, then the world will see peace." - 'Jimi' Hendrix Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
shropshire 0 #292 January 6, 2009 Not only shooting the kid with a shotgun, but anyone else standing near by too. (.)Y(.) Chivalry is not dead; it only sleeps for want of work to do. - Jerome K Jerome Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jgoose71 0 #293 January 6, 2009 Quote You hit the nail on the head, But shooting the kid with a shotgun wouldn't be the best way to deal with the situation and that is what israel are doing. What is it with the military that they cannot use covert subtle operations to achieve thier objective? Cheaper more effective, less destuctive conflict. Reducing civilian casualties and damage to infrastructure..... ... but where is the money in that! The problem with covert operations is a jew sneaking around in palistine. He would stick out like a sore thumb. Could you imagine a big corn fed white as can be Kansas boy conducting covert ops in, say, china? Everyone in that region can pick up even the slightest diffrence in dialect, so that kind of thing can be difficult. And everyone has seen the videos of what happens to people over there who are just SUSPECTED of taking evil jewish money. For lack of better options, this is it."There is an art, it says, or, rather, a knack to flying. The knack lies in learning how to throw yourself at the ground and miss." Life, the Universe, and Everything Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mnealtx 0 #294 January 6, 2009 QuoteNot only shooting the kid with a shotgun, but anyone else standing near by too. Yup, those katyusha rockets are just the LATEST in surgical precision guided weapons, aren't they? And, of course, Hamas is SO careful to make sure that they ONLY hit military targets and would NEVER do something like targeting shopping malls or crowded restaurants. Mike I love you, Shannon and Jim. POPS 9708 , SCR 14706 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
shropshire 0 #295 January 6, 2009 2 wrongs don't make a right Mike... There are naught folks on BOTH sides. The Israelis have also banned international journalists going into to Gaza um, what rights do they have over someone elses country? (.)Y(.) Chivalry is not dead; it only sleeps for want of work to do. - Jerome K Jerome Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mnealtx 0 #296 January 6, 2009 Quote2 wrongs don't make a right Mike... There are naught folks on BOTH sides. I don't dispute that - only making the point that the outcry is entirely one-sided, that's all. QuoteThe Israelis have also banned international journalists going into to Gaza um, what rights do they have over someone elses country? Did Gaza suddently stop having a shoreline?Mike I love you, Shannon and Jim. POPS 9708 , SCR 14706 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
shropshire 0 #297 January 6, 2009 You're right about the outcry being one sided (surprising to see it even coming from traditionally Israel supporters - Daily Mail, for example). My guess that it looks like overkill (sic) - Big Bully picking on weaker bully but primarily IMHO, because of the innocents being caught in the middle. Israel is not winning friends in most parts of the world, this time. (.)Y(.) Chivalry is not dead; it only sleeps for want of work to do. - Jerome K Jerome Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Darius11 12 #298 January 6, 2009 Quote We're not fighting someone by proxy here. We're supporting a democratic ally Yea because in all democracies we have Jews only roads, and segregation. You know some due process would be nice as well. Quote well as 45% of the world's Jewish population (with 45% more in the US). Unfortunately for a lot of the Jewish population in the USA that’s all it is about so the facts don’t matter. As I have said before I don’t understand someone sacrificing humanity for a sense of camaraderie. Before I am a citizen of a country or belong to a religion I am a humane being. Some gems from Falxori Quote after years of unprovoked constant rocket attacks from Gaza Yes there is nothing to see here move right along. Yes yes they are born crazy they just like blowing them selves up. Keep on moving nothing to see here. We are inocent as snow. Quote we did, and we chose democracy. not sure it will last if Israel is destroyed by its neighbours. Israel had the chance to accept the Palestinian democratically elected officials as well, yet because they didn’t get who they wanted (makes a lot of sense) they decided they weren’t going to recognize them. But off course Israel is guilt free they do no wrong. From chuckakers Quote Many (dare I say most) Arabs want the Jews dead and Israel gone. When did you take your survey? I wish I were so sure to know what more then a billion people are thinking at all times. Your Special aren’t you? The reasons the Israelis are hated is they built homes on top of others, destroyed lives and have been killing and oppressing the Palestinians for more then 60 years. If they were black they would be called the N word, if they were Brown they would be called the SN word. Its easy to hate people who have takin your land and continue to kill man, woman, and child. Sorry just came back and read this thread. And some of the things said are just out of the realm of reality. All this will do is give more people a legitimate reason to hate Israel and recruit more people for Hamas. We saw how successful the operation in Lebanon were. They simply made Hezabolah a more powerful entity and took a lot of inocent lives.I'd rather be hated for who I am, than loved for who I am not." - Kurt Cobain Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
434 2 #299 January 6, 2009 If I lived in Israel, I would hate Arabs, if I was an Arab I would hate Jewish, and as an europeen I am happy I won the lottery and can read both news, and think for myselves! The news pictures in Europe is quite different than USA getting, and that makes me a bit concerned! Hamas using "fireworks" and Israel using heavy war machine! Palestinians is living in a camp wich Israel guarding! If I lived in Palestinia I would been a terrorist myselves! Why? Because I had no freedom! I had no hope! I see only blood coming my way! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Andrewwhyte 1 #300 January 6, 2009 Quote QuoteThe Israelis have also banned international journalists going into to Gaza um, what rights do they have over someone elses country? Did Gaza suddently stop having a shoreline? As far as I know Israel has never stopped controlling Gaza's sea traffic. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
