freethefly 6 #201 November 22, 2006 ***That means one direction, one flag, one purpose.Quote Adolf Hitler probably said the samething. HA!!!! I win! (in reference to Ratbert and Godwins Law)"...And once you're gone, you can't come back When you're out of the blue and into the black." Neil Young Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Royd 0 #202 November 22, 2006 QuoteSo Allah is unwelcome in the USA because the USA is Christian territory? Only the Allah that tells them to kill the infidel. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Royd 0 #203 November 22, 2006 Quote No, it's not. If you think it is, that says something much worse about you than it does about them. There are any number of minorities who run around with a chip on their shoulder, and look for opportunities to get it knocked off. If you can't see that, then you are wearing rose colored glasses. I can name any number of incidents from Cyntia McKinney to Rosie O'Donnell only yesterday. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites SkyDekker 1,145 #204 November 22, 2006 QuoteThere are any number of minorities who run around with a chip on their shoulder You are so very right, like the small group of ignorant white people scared of 6 non-white people praying. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites jenfly00 0 #205 November 22, 2006 QuoteQuote No, it's not. If you think it is, that says something much worse about you than it does about them. There are any number of minorities who run around with a chip on their shoulder, and look for opportunities to get it knocked off. If you can't see that, then you are wearing rose colored glasses. I'm looking, and what I see is any number of facist neo-cons who use any weak excuse they can come up with to further justify their one-flag, one religion, one sexual orientation, one race, no Bill of Rights America. If you can't see that ...----------------------- "O brave new world that has such people in it". Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites NCclimber 0 #206 November 22, 2006 No doubt, there are plenty of people who look for any old excuse to get their panties bunched. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Royd 0 #207 November 22, 2006 -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- That means one direction, one flag, one purpose. That is the true freedom of all of mankind. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- QuoteUh? That's a pretty strong statement, which as stated I do not grasp. Can you elaborate?I knew that it didn't look right, but hey, it was Friday night. The main purpose of this country is to promote the true freedom of mankind. There is a bit of a quandry concerning Islam. If they are given rein to practise their religion to its fullest extent, the rest of the world would be in submission to them. Let's not kid ourselves. It is their long term goal, and they are not above using terror to acheive their goal, mostly because the message that they have to offer just isn't that appealing. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Andy9o8 0 #208 November 22, 2006 Quote...concerning Islam. If they are given rein to practise their religion to its fullest extent, ... In the US, the First Amendment already gives them that rein. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites NCclimber 0 #209 November 22, 2006 QuoteQuote...concerning Islam. If they are given rein to practise their religion to its fullest extent, ... In the US, the First Amendment already gives them that rein. And it doesn't prohibit others (like cartoonists) from offering criticisms. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Andy9o8 0 #210 November 22, 2006 QuoteQuoteQuote...concerning Islam. If they are given rein to practise their religion to its fullest extent, ... In the US, the First Amendment already gives them that rein. And it doesn't prohibit others (like cartoonists) from offering criticisms. True, but that's a separate issue from the topic of the thread. See, when someone says "if we give Muslims free rein to practice their religion to its fullest extent..." it makes me think of others, during my lifetime, who've said, "if we let THOSE people move into white neighborhoods any time they want..." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites billvon 2,434 #211 November 22, 2006 > The main purpose of this country is to promote the true freedom of mankind. Well, no. The true purpose of this country is to allow _americans_ to remain free. The US constitution doesn't apply to Laos, or Nigeria. > There is a bit of a quandry concerning Islam. If they are given rein to > practise their religion to its fullest extent, the rest of the world would be in >submission to them. That's true of christianity too. (Remember the Crusades?) So nowadays we let people do whatever they want, but we have a strict separation between church and state. No holy wars - but if you want to pray to Christ, God, Allah, Vishnu or the FSM, go for it. >Let's not kid ourselves. It is their long term goal, and they are not above > using terror to acheive their goal, mostly because the message that they >have to offer just isn't that appealing. You're thinking of Al Qaeda. Claiming all muslims are like Al Qaeda is like claiming all christians are like Timothy McVeigh. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites ExAFO 0 #212 November 22, 2006 Bottom Line: They were disruptive on an airline flight. The rules for removing passengers in such a case are content-neutral. If I started singing Insane Clown Posse songs in a loud voice, I'd be rightfully removed. YOU DON'T FUCK ABOUT AND CAUSE A SCENE ON AN AIRLINER.Illinois needs a CCW Law. NOW. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Remster 24 #213 November 22, 2006 QuoteBottom Line: They were disruptive on an airline flight. No they werent! Get the freaking story straight! They prayed in the terminal!Remster Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites freethefly 6 #214 November 22, 2006 QuoteThey were disruptive on an airline flight They did absolutely nothing on the plane but go to their seats and sat down. Three of them prayed in the terminal. No law against praying. Again they did nothing wrong. Someone passed a note to an attendent pointing out that some Arabic men were getting on the plane. No law against Arabic people boarding planes. They were not disruptive. It was the ignorance of the note passer that was wrong. It really does seem that Bin Laden is winning as he is being succesful in turning Americans against Americans. All of the clerics are American. He is being succesful in cultivating fear of Islam. Of all of the Muslims I have met, they all have been kind and courteous. I have no fear of them as Al qaeda does not represent Islam. To those who lump the two together, shame on you for taking the bait that Al qaeda laid out as you are only assisting the enemy by doing so. Educate yourself and Bin Laden and his kind will go away."...And once you're gone, you can't come back When you're out of the blue and into the black." Neil Young Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Zipp0 1 #215 November 22, 2006 We have all been inconvenienced to some degree in the wake of 9/11. Arabic men should be the least surpised when they get some extra scrutiny, and they should stop their damn whining. I'll bet you $1000 that Americans (caucasian) men travelling to Iran get some extra scrutiny there. Would I whine about it? No. It is expected. If these men had any class, they would talk to reporters and explain that they understand why people might be afraid, but they hope people can understand that they deplore violence and seek peace. -------------------------- Chuck Norris doesn't do push-ups, he pushes the Earth down. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites sundevil777 94 #216 November 22, 2006 I'll bet the note said a lot more than "some Arabic men were getting on the plane". They also said some things that were suspicious in the terminal. Islamofacists have cultivated a fear of Islam, and other Muslims are afraid to speak out forcefully against it because of a fear for their lives. I think that makes the Islamofacists in control of Islam.People are sick and tired of being told that ordinary and decent people are fed up in this country with being sick and tired. I’m certainly not, and I’m sick and tired of being told that I am Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Butters 0 #217 November 22, 2006 QuoteQuote...concerning Islam. If they are given rein to practise their religion to its fullest extent, ... In the US, the First Amendment already gives them that rein. Incorrect. You are allowed to practice your religion to the fullest extent so long as it complies with all other laws (this is not free rein). Native Americans, Rastafarians, etc... are not allowed to perform rituals that do not comply with laws regarding drug cultivation and usage."That looks dangerous." Leopold Stotch Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites dbattman 0 #218 November 22, 2006 QuoteBottom Line: They were disruptive on an airline flight. The rules for removing passengers in such a case are content-neutral. If I started singing Insane Clown Posse songs in a loud voice, I'd be rightfully removed. YOU DON'T FUCK ABOUT AND CAUSE A SCENE ON AN AIRLINER. People get kicked off for alot less these days. Excuse me, would you mind stowing that for takeoff? No paralleles implied here, but I do alot of flying and I've seen more than my share of incidents between passengers and crew. I can tell you there are generally a lot more to these than what would be reported in the abbreviated news wires. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Skyrad 0 #219 November 22, 2006 QuoteI'll bet the note said a lot more than "some Arabic men were getting on the plane". They also said some things that were suspicious in the terminal. Islamofacists have cultivated a fear of Islam, and other Muslims are afraid to speak out forcefully against it because of a fear for their lives. I think that makes the Islamofacists in control of Islam. Not that again... you're just going to belive what you want to belive regardless of the facts.When an author is too meticulous about his style, you may presume that his mind is frivolous and his content flimsy. Lucius Annaeus Seneca Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Andy9o8 0 #220 November 22, 2006 QuoteQuoteQuote...concerning Islam. If they are given rein to practise their religion to its fullest extent, ... In the US, the First Amendment already gives them that rein. Incorrect. You are allowed to practice your religion to the fullest extent so long as it complies with all other laws (this is not free rein). Native Americans, Rastafarians, etc... are not allowed to perform rituals that do not comply with laws regarding drug cultivation and usage. Strawman argument. These guys were not smoking ganja or taking peyote on the plane. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites rehmwa 2 #221 November 22, 2006 QuoteIf these men had any class, they would talk to reporters and explain that they understand why people might be afraid, but they hope people can understand that they deplore violence and seek peace. good note - there are six of them, I assume a couple might actually do that and the others will whine and make a bunch of noise about it. Which are classy and which will play the 'victim' here? No different than any other 'group' here nowadays. But we'll hear the interviews of the 'victims' before anything else. It sells better. ... Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites SpeedRacer 1 #222 November 22, 2006 The whole thing was bullshit. I'm not going to let a handful of Al Quaeda fanatics cause me to live in fear. This is America. Living in a free country involves some risk. If you don't have the balls to take the risks inherent in a free country, move to someplace less free. Speed Racer -------------------------------------------------- Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Butters 0 #223 November 22, 2006 QuoteQuoteQuoteQuote...concerning Islam. If they are given rein to practise their religion to its fullest extent, ... In the US, the First Amendment already gives them that rein. Incorrect. You are allowed to practice your religion to the fullest extent so long as it complies with all other laws (this is not free rein). Native Americans, Rastafarians, etc... are not allowed to perform rituals that do not comply with laws regarding drug cultivation and usage. Strawman argument. These guys were not smoking ganja or taking peyote on the plane. The original statement was that the First Amendment gave religion free rein and the reply was providing a case in which it doesn't. Please read previous posts before replying to statements made."That looks dangerous." Leopold Stotch Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Gravitymaster 0 #224 November 22, 2006 QuoteThe whole thing was bullshit. I'm not going to let a handful of Al Quaeda fanatics cause me to live in fear. This is America. Living in a free country involves some risk. If you don't have the balls to take the risks inherent in a free country, move to someplace less free. Just as with skydiving, I try to minimize my risk. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Andy9o8 0 #225 November 22, 2006 QuoteQuoteBottom Line: They were disruptive on an airline flight. No they werent! Get the freaking story straight! They prayed in the terminal! Ah, but nobody wants to be inconvenienced with the facts. Oh well, here they are anyway: http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/15824096/ ***A passenger raised concerns about the imams — three of whom said their normal evening prayers in the airport terminal before boarding the Phoenix-bound plane, according to one — through a note passed to a flight attendant, according to Andrea Rader, a spokeswoman for US Airways. ...three members of the group prayed in the terminal before the six boarded the plane. They entered individually, except for one member who is blind and needed to be guided, Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Prev 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 Next Page 9 of 19 Join the conversation You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account. Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible. Reply to this topic... × Pasted as rich text. Paste as plain text instead Only 75 emoji are allowed. × Your link has been automatically embedded. 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Royd 0 #202 November 22, 2006 QuoteSo Allah is unwelcome in the USA because the USA is Christian territory? Only the Allah that tells them to kill the infidel. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Royd 0 #203 November 22, 2006 Quote No, it's not. If you think it is, that says something much worse about you than it does about them. There are any number of minorities who run around with a chip on their shoulder, and look for opportunities to get it knocked off. If you can't see that, then you are wearing rose colored glasses. I can name any number of incidents from Cyntia McKinney to Rosie O'Donnell only yesterday. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SkyDekker 1,145 #204 November 22, 2006 QuoteThere are any number of minorities who run around with a chip on their shoulder You are so very right, like the small group of ignorant white people scared of 6 non-white people praying. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jenfly00 0 #205 November 22, 2006 QuoteQuote No, it's not. If you think it is, that says something much worse about you than it does about them. There are any number of minorities who run around with a chip on their shoulder, and look for opportunities to get it knocked off. If you can't see that, then you are wearing rose colored glasses. I'm looking, and what I see is any number of facist neo-cons who use any weak excuse they can come up with to further justify their one-flag, one religion, one sexual orientation, one race, no Bill of Rights America. If you can't see that ...----------------------- "O brave new world that has such people in it". Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
NCclimber 0 #206 November 22, 2006 No doubt, there are plenty of people who look for any old excuse to get their panties bunched. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Royd 0 #207 November 22, 2006 -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- That means one direction, one flag, one purpose. That is the true freedom of all of mankind. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- QuoteUh? That's a pretty strong statement, which as stated I do not grasp. Can you elaborate?I knew that it didn't look right, but hey, it was Friday night. The main purpose of this country is to promote the true freedom of mankind. There is a bit of a quandry concerning Islam. If they are given rein to practise their religion to its fullest extent, the rest of the world would be in submission to them. Let's not kid ourselves. It is their long term goal, and they are not above using terror to acheive their goal, mostly because the message that they have to offer just isn't that appealing. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Andy9o8 0 #208 November 22, 2006 Quote...concerning Islam. If they are given rein to practise their religion to its fullest extent, ... In the US, the First Amendment already gives them that rein. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
NCclimber 0 #209 November 22, 2006 QuoteQuote...concerning Islam. If they are given rein to practise their religion to its fullest extent, ... In the US, the First Amendment already gives them that rein. And it doesn't prohibit others (like cartoonists) from offering criticisms. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Andy9o8 0 #210 November 22, 2006 QuoteQuoteQuote...concerning Islam. If they are given rein to practise their religion to its fullest extent, ... In the US, the First Amendment already gives them that rein. And it doesn't prohibit others (like cartoonists) from offering criticisms. True, but that's a separate issue from the topic of the thread. See, when someone says "if we give Muslims free rein to practice their religion to its fullest extent..." it makes me think of others, during my lifetime, who've said, "if we let THOSE people move into white neighborhoods any time they want..." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 2,434 #211 November 22, 2006 > The main purpose of this country is to promote the true freedom of mankind. Well, no. The true purpose of this country is to allow _americans_ to remain free. The US constitution doesn't apply to Laos, or Nigeria. > There is a bit of a quandry concerning Islam. If they are given rein to > practise their religion to its fullest extent, the rest of the world would be in >submission to them. That's true of christianity too. (Remember the Crusades?) So nowadays we let people do whatever they want, but we have a strict separation between church and state. No holy wars - but if you want to pray to Christ, God, Allah, Vishnu or the FSM, go for it. >Let's not kid ourselves. It is their long term goal, and they are not above > using terror to acheive their goal, mostly because the message that they >have to offer just isn't that appealing. You're thinking of Al Qaeda. Claiming all muslims are like Al Qaeda is like claiming all christians are like Timothy McVeigh. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ExAFO 0 #212 November 22, 2006 Bottom Line: They were disruptive on an airline flight. The rules for removing passengers in such a case are content-neutral. If I started singing Insane Clown Posse songs in a loud voice, I'd be rightfully removed. YOU DON'T FUCK ABOUT AND CAUSE A SCENE ON AN AIRLINER.Illinois needs a CCW Law. NOW. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Remster 24 #213 November 22, 2006 QuoteBottom Line: They were disruptive on an airline flight. No they werent! Get the freaking story straight! They prayed in the terminal!Remster Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
freethefly 6 #214 November 22, 2006 QuoteThey were disruptive on an airline flight They did absolutely nothing on the plane but go to their seats and sat down. Three of them prayed in the terminal. No law against praying. Again they did nothing wrong. Someone passed a note to an attendent pointing out that some Arabic men were getting on the plane. No law against Arabic people boarding planes. They were not disruptive. It was the ignorance of the note passer that was wrong. It really does seem that Bin Laden is winning as he is being succesful in turning Americans against Americans. All of the clerics are American. He is being succesful in cultivating fear of Islam. Of all of the Muslims I have met, they all have been kind and courteous. I have no fear of them as Al qaeda does not represent Islam. To those who lump the two together, shame on you for taking the bait that Al qaeda laid out as you are only assisting the enemy by doing so. Educate yourself and Bin Laden and his kind will go away."...And once you're gone, you can't come back When you're out of the blue and into the black." Neil Young Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Zipp0 1 #215 November 22, 2006 We have all been inconvenienced to some degree in the wake of 9/11. Arabic men should be the least surpised when they get some extra scrutiny, and they should stop their damn whining. I'll bet you $1000 that Americans (caucasian) men travelling to Iran get some extra scrutiny there. Would I whine about it? No. It is expected. If these men had any class, they would talk to reporters and explain that they understand why people might be afraid, but they hope people can understand that they deplore violence and seek peace. -------------------------- Chuck Norris doesn't do push-ups, he pushes the Earth down. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
sundevil777 94 #216 November 22, 2006 I'll bet the note said a lot more than "some Arabic men were getting on the plane". They also said some things that were suspicious in the terminal. Islamofacists have cultivated a fear of Islam, and other Muslims are afraid to speak out forcefully against it because of a fear for their lives. I think that makes the Islamofacists in control of Islam.People are sick and tired of being told that ordinary and decent people are fed up in this country with being sick and tired. I’m certainly not, and I’m sick and tired of being told that I am Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Butters 0 #217 November 22, 2006 QuoteQuote...concerning Islam. If they are given rein to practise their religion to its fullest extent, ... In the US, the First Amendment already gives them that rein. Incorrect. You are allowed to practice your religion to the fullest extent so long as it complies with all other laws (this is not free rein). Native Americans, Rastafarians, etc... are not allowed to perform rituals that do not comply with laws regarding drug cultivation and usage."That looks dangerous." Leopold Stotch Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
dbattman 0 #218 November 22, 2006 QuoteBottom Line: They were disruptive on an airline flight. The rules for removing passengers in such a case are content-neutral. If I started singing Insane Clown Posse songs in a loud voice, I'd be rightfully removed. YOU DON'T FUCK ABOUT AND CAUSE A SCENE ON AN AIRLINER. People get kicked off for alot less these days. Excuse me, would you mind stowing that for takeoff? No paralleles implied here, but I do alot of flying and I've seen more than my share of incidents between passengers and crew. I can tell you there are generally a lot more to these than what would be reported in the abbreviated news wires. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Skyrad 0 #219 November 22, 2006 QuoteI'll bet the note said a lot more than "some Arabic men were getting on the plane". They also said some things that were suspicious in the terminal. Islamofacists have cultivated a fear of Islam, and other Muslims are afraid to speak out forcefully against it because of a fear for their lives. I think that makes the Islamofacists in control of Islam. Not that again... you're just going to belive what you want to belive regardless of the facts.When an author is too meticulous about his style, you may presume that his mind is frivolous and his content flimsy. Lucius Annaeus Seneca Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Andy9o8 0 #220 November 22, 2006 QuoteQuoteQuote...concerning Islam. If they are given rein to practise their religion to its fullest extent, ... In the US, the First Amendment already gives them that rein. Incorrect. You are allowed to practice your religion to the fullest extent so long as it complies with all other laws (this is not free rein). Native Americans, Rastafarians, etc... are not allowed to perform rituals that do not comply with laws regarding drug cultivation and usage. Strawman argument. These guys were not smoking ganja or taking peyote on the plane. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rehmwa 2 #221 November 22, 2006 QuoteIf these men had any class, they would talk to reporters and explain that they understand why people might be afraid, but they hope people can understand that they deplore violence and seek peace. good note - there are six of them, I assume a couple might actually do that and the others will whine and make a bunch of noise about it. Which are classy and which will play the 'victim' here? No different than any other 'group' here nowadays. But we'll hear the interviews of the 'victims' before anything else. It sells better. ... Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SpeedRacer 1 #222 November 22, 2006 The whole thing was bullshit. I'm not going to let a handful of Al Quaeda fanatics cause me to live in fear. This is America. Living in a free country involves some risk. If you don't have the balls to take the risks inherent in a free country, move to someplace less free. Speed Racer -------------------------------------------------- Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Butters 0 #223 November 22, 2006 QuoteQuoteQuoteQuote...concerning Islam. If they are given rein to practise their religion to its fullest extent, ... In the US, the First Amendment already gives them that rein. Incorrect. You are allowed to practice your religion to the fullest extent so long as it complies with all other laws (this is not free rein). Native Americans, Rastafarians, etc... are not allowed to perform rituals that do not comply with laws regarding drug cultivation and usage. Strawman argument. These guys were not smoking ganja or taking peyote on the plane. The original statement was that the First Amendment gave religion free rein and the reply was providing a case in which it doesn't. Please read previous posts before replying to statements made."That looks dangerous." Leopold Stotch Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Gravitymaster 0 #224 November 22, 2006 QuoteThe whole thing was bullshit. I'm not going to let a handful of Al Quaeda fanatics cause me to live in fear. This is America. Living in a free country involves some risk. If you don't have the balls to take the risks inherent in a free country, move to someplace less free. Just as with skydiving, I try to minimize my risk. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Andy9o8 0 #225 November 22, 2006 QuoteQuoteBottom Line: They were disruptive on an airline flight. No they werent! Get the freaking story straight! They prayed in the terminal! Ah, but nobody wants to be inconvenienced with the facts. Oh well, here they are anyway: http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/15824096/ ***A passenger raised concerns about the imams — three of whom said their normal evening prayers in the airport terminal before boarding the Phoenix-bound plane, according to one — through a note passed to a flight attendant, according to Andrea Rader, a spokeswoman for US Airways. ...three members of the group prayed in the terminal before the six boarded the plane. They entered individually, except for one member who is blind and needed to be guided, Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
