kevin922 0 #26 February 21, 2003 QuoteSo because it ruins your memories of him, he's selfish? Maybe his life sucks and he can't take it anymore. Instead of being concerned with his own well being, he should think about you and how it will affect you? Yeah right. I am a BIG supporter of suicide. People shouldn't have to live if they don't want to. Accept the fact that people won't always agree with you. If you were a true freind, you would support a freind even if they made a decision you disagreed with. I would hope you're also a big supporter of trying to work through things first.. Sunshine: Oh having a bad day? Here take my gun! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TequilaGirl 0 #27 February 21, 2003 I am going to have to agree with Wildblue on this one.....I would never be happy for someone who killed themselves - in fact - I might even wonder why I couldn't stop it or see it coming......usually the signs are there - you just have to react when you see them...... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
wildblue 4 #28 February 21, 2003 QuoteSo because it ruins your memories of him, he's selfish? Yes. The definition of selfish = thinking of no one but yourself. Like it or not, you have a responsibilty to those around you, and just bowing out of life will affect them, normally in adverse ways. It won't affect you at all, you'll be dead. And only in extremely rare cases do I even see how life could be so hard and painful that you just choose to quit. QuoteIf you were a true freind, you would support a freind even if they made a decision you disagreed with No, that's bullshit, and that's a fake friend, not a true friend. If I think someone does something stupid, I'll tell them. If I think they did something shitty, I won't say "oh, but it's ok, you're my friend, I'll support anything you do" - if you want unconditional support, go to a shrink or a priest.it's like incest - you're substituting convenience for quality Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SkyDekker 1,141 #29 February 21, 2003 I did read the logs, it is sad that someone who was so obviously asking for help was not helped. In my mind most of them were afraid to step in, afraid to get themselves in trouble or afraid to get him in trouble. That simple fear caused death and that is really really sad. My condolences to his family, Justin Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DYEVOUT 0 #30 February 21, 2003 "That simple fear caused death" ------------------------------------------- I'm thinking the ludicrous amounts of dangerous chemicals this moron ingested caused death. The others' fear prevented them from DELAYING it. ----------------=8^)---------------------- "I think that was the wrong tennis court." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
lukepinion 0 #31 February 21, 2003 If you were a true freind, you would support a freind even if they made a decision you disagreed with.[/reply It seems that if you were a true friend you would try to help them through it and see the joy in life. Depression is a serious illness and can be treated. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
NtheSeaOrSky 0 #32 February 21, 2003 QuoteI am a BIG supporter of suicide. People shouldn't have to live if they don't want to. Accept the fact that people won't always agree with you. If you were a true freind, you would support a freind even if they made a decision you disagreed with. I am not going to tell you my stance on this subject....rather I will ask you to dig a little deeper.... If you truly supported a friends decision...could you help them commit suicide??? I mean if you are truly ok with it, could you hold the needle and syringe and inject the drug??? Or maybe 'modify' their rig a bit????? Just food for thought.Life is not fair and there are no guarantees... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
sunshine 2 #33 February 21, 2003 Ok, i never said i would help someone if i knew in advance. But after the fact i will support their decision. I would never turn my back on someone just cause they chose to kill themself. If i had known in advance my friend was going to kneel on a traintrack and wait to be run over, of course i wouldn't help her. Now she's gone, i still think of the good times and by no means hate her for what she did. Nor do i think she was selfish. Just cause i support peoples decisions doesn't mean i agree with them. Doesn't mean i would encourage them to commit suicide either. Everything i said come from the "after they've done the deed" stand point. ___________________________________________ meow I get a Mike hug! I get a Mike hug! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
blewaway5 0 #34 February 21, 2003 Hi sunny one. I just thought I'd jump in and play devil's advocate here with you. You just said that "Just cause I support people's decisions doesn't mean I agree with them." If you support something, you are, by your actions, agreeing to further it. Take this whole Iraq invasion crap, can you not agree with it but still support it? They'd kick you out of the demostration if you were protesting the possibility of war and you were carrying a sign that said "I support Bush!" I guess my point is whether you accept suicde as a legitimate way out or you think suicide is a bullsh*t way for a person to punk out and not take a chance that life could get better, you can't just ride the fence and claim both are legitimate. Besides, fences have fence poles, and when you hit those bastards they leave a mark. Truman Sparks for President Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Vallerina 2 #35 February 21, 2003 QuoteIf you support something, you are, by your actions, agreeing to further it. I disagree. A friend of mine had an abortion. People strongly disagreed with abortion (her family is Catholic), but they supported her anyways.There's a thin line between Saturday night and Sunday morning Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
NtheSeaOrSky 0 #36 February 21, 2003 I think they supported HER not her decision. But, I could be wrong.Life is not fair and there are no guarantees... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Snowflake 0 #37 February 21, 2003 QuoteI read the transcript...I never got the feeling he wanted to kill himself?? Maybe I'm wrong, but it seemed like he wanted to see how f*cked up he could get by pushing the limits of what he had done before and what he was comfortable with Hate to say mean things about dead people but 300+mg of Methadone not to mention all the other shit is leaving the realm of expirementation. So it's either Darwin at work, suicide, or just plain stupidity take your pick. To even try to blame the people in the chat room is rediculous. How do they know he's telling the truth and even the drugs they saw in the video could've been fake and they told him not to take anymore except for on knuckle head. I feel for his family though Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Skystorm 0 #38 February 22, 2003 Just my 2 cents worth. I have 2 friends who tried to commit suicide. One cut her wrists and the other had the gun to her head when I called her (I didn't knew this at the time). Both these women have had extremely hard lives. The one was going through a very messy divorce, without any support from her family and the other has an illness which requires chemotherapy. If they had sucseeded (sp?) in taking their own lives, I would've lost two of my most amazing friends, but I would've tried to understand why they did it. Because I knew what had happened in their lives. Luckily, we got through it alive. I can't tell them I know what they feel, because I don't. But I can support them, cry with them, feel angry with them and be silent with them. What I'm trying to say is, who am I to judge them? It was their choice whether they wanted to live or not. I would try and talk a person trying to commit suicide out of it, if I knew what they were planning. But if it happened and they didn't reach out to someone, I wouldn't judge them. Gene Police: "YOU!! Out of the pool, NOW!!!" Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Skydiver4u2 0 #39 February 22, 2003 Anyone wanna chat Anyone can ride in a plane. But it takes a special person to jump out of it. Skydive for fun. Track for life. Blue Skies. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
suz 0 #40 February 22, 2003 After reading the disturbing news, I dont think that I want to read it. Not giving you a personal stab Kevin, I just personally think I wouldnt be able to cope well reading the attachment. Like Bobsled said, "No-one gets out of life alive" I like to add my 2c on that.... Quote from my favourite song at the moment.... "I know I was born, and I know that I'll die. The in between is mine. I am mine." Such a terrible way to end a life. This hits home for me hard. If anybody read my post about a week or so ago, I have a very close friend addicted to 'whack', and she's lost her soul to it. The best way I can describe her...she seems like a mindless body walking the earth. I hope you guys can understand where I am coming from when I mentioned that I didnt want to see the attachment.But there is always a good thing that comes from situations like this. All the addicts, who saw his life end so dramatically will hopefully come round and clean themselves up. I dont mean to sound all "goody-goody". This is just a subject I am very passionate about, at the moment. Don't bother me, I'm living happily ever after Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
sillyolethang 0 #41 February 22, 2003 That was one of the most incredibly sadest things I have ever read...first I started with the logs, then on to the press versions. No matter if he wanted to end his life or not, people are put here for a reason and this young man had potential...now no one shall ever know. If you see someone in "need", of anything really, not only depression...of food, water, support, ANYTHING...reach out your hand, make the call. Amy Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
suz 0 #42 February 22, 2003 Quote Luckily, we got through it alive. I can't tell them I know what they feel, because I don't. But I can support them, cry with them, feel angry with them and be silent with them. You made me cry reading that. What a beautiful friend you are. Just to hold one's hand while they cry, can mend a big hole. Angels do walk this earth. Don't bother me, I'm living happily ever after Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
AndyMan 7 #43 February 22, 2003 QuoteI had a friend that committed suicide about 8 years ago. I miss her, but she made her choice and i gotta respect that. I'm surprised. We've learned so much about depression in the last 20 years. We know that clinical depression is a neurological disorder, and not a reflection on that individual. I see somebody choosing to kill themselves when clinically depressed as somebody who chooses to rob a 7-11 to feed their crack addiction - they're not in any position to make that judgment, and are doing it for reasons they don't understand and can't control. Depression is a disease that must be spotted and treated. Back home I have a lot of hard core geek friends who often spent hours and hours on BBS's, then chat rooms and other electronic meeting places. Some of these guys were incredibly anti-social because of their "nerdiness". In hindsight, the degree to which so many people completely isolate themselves from others, only serves to allow depression to manifest itself deeper and deeper into the psyche. The fact that there are these electronic meeting places that allow people to come out of their reclusiveness, and actually have some good social contact is wonderful. Online communities help a great many people have meaningful lives. They're truely great things, and really are changing the world. But they only go so far. A good friend will see in someone that they're not doing well, will reach a hand out to help. This is a lot harder online because it's so rare that we actually get a glimpse of people's true state. I'm reminded of a Far Side cartoon with a dog infront of a computer, the caption reads "on the internet, nobody knows you're a dog." It's just really hard to see someone who's in trouble through the filters of an online interaction. My heart goes out to the friends and family of this guy, but it only reinforces how important it is to be able to spot signs of depression, and do whatever you can to make sure that person gets the help that they need. Depression is not a weakness of character, it's a disease that needs to be treated, quickly. _Am__ You put the fun in "funnel" - craichead. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
seedy 0 #44 February 22, 2003 QuoteI see somebody choosing to kill themselves when clinically depressed as somebody who chooses to rob a 7-11 to feed their crack addiction - they're not in any position to make that judgment, and are doing it for reasons they don't understand and can't control. So you are saying drug addiction is an illness and not a choice? I intend to live forever -- so far, so good. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
AndyMan 7 #45 February 22, 2003 QuoteSo you are saying drug addiction is an illness and not a choice? Absolutely. Drug addiction is an ilness requiring treatment. Alcoholism is also an illness requiring treatment. Choices may lead to the disease, just as choices may lead to HIV, but the disease itself is not a choice. Nobody chooses to be an addict, nobody decides they want HIV. My comparison falls apart at one level, though. People choose paths that lead them to alcoholism and addiction, it's not clear what paths lead to depression. This is getting off track, though. Depression is a serious illness, that if left untreated will kill your friends. It is an often fatal disease. We need to be aware of what the signs of it are, and do everything we can to help people when we do see it. _Am__ You put the fun in "funnel" - craichead. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
CrazyThomas 0 #46 February 23, 2003 Not suicide. This was just an overdose. See, drug users tend to build up a tolerance, and after the tolerance is built up, more drugs are taken. Yes, this was an obscene amount of drugs. But does anyone know the amount of drugs done before this by this person? 360mg of methadone is lethal? That's like saying everyone is the same, and drugs affect everyone the same, regardless of history. Also like saying that nobody can do 21 shots of liquor on their 21st birthday. This is just a case of someone pushing the limits. It is a BASE jumper pulling lower than ever before. It is a 400-way attempt, because the 300-way succeeded without fatality. It is a race car driver trying to squeeze an extra inch of performance out of his car. It is the NASA trying to push Columbia a little farther than before. It is simply pushing the limits. Why must we push the limits? Everyone has their own answer. This person failed in their pursuit. That is all. Suicide is intentional, and usually a note is left. A mistake happens, and the end result is not predictable. Just my drug thoughts......... Thomas Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Slink2 0 #47 February 23, 2003 Darwin at work does that include hook turn assholes? and pond swoopers? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kris 0 #48 February 23, 2003 QuoteDarwin at work does that include hook turn assholes? and pond swoopers? Troll. If not, at 68 jumps I wouldn't be bashing something you don't know much about. KrisSky, Muff Bro, Rodriguez Bro, and Bastion of Purity and Innocence!™ Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Slink2 0 #49 February 23, 2003 The fatality page and watching a swooper exit for the last time over skydivedeathcago is enough for me punk! cool until your on list! isn't it! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kris 0 #50 February 23, 2003 QuoteThe fatality page and watching a swooper exit for the last time over skydivedeathcago is enough for me punk! cool until your on list! isn't it! Punk? My, what a witty reparté you have. To quote someone else on here, I have shoes with more jumps than you. As for your nickname for SDC, I suggest that you look at the fatality stats again, especially the fact that the recent fatalities there were all experienced jumpers who, in some cases, made a bad decision. SDC had nothing to do with it other than the fact that their DZ had a run of bad luck. Your youth in the sport is showing, don't let your false righteousness show as well. Whether it is cool or not...well, if you think 99% of the people who choose to do high-performance landings do it to look cool you are sadly wrong from what I have seen. Me personally, I'm not learning to swoop just to be cool, I just do it for me. KrisSky, Muff Bro, Rodriguez Bro, and Bastion of Purity and Innocence!™ Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
