Vallerina 2 #26 October 21, 2003 The best argument I heard during speech class in favor of legalizing drugs: Alcohol is legal. We let fathers go get drunk, come home, puke, and beat their kids. If we let pot be legal, that father would stay home and watch a movie with his kids. My personal stance: I see both good and bad reasons of legalizing drugs. Some should never be legal (sorry, I just can't justify legalizing heroin for tax purposes.) My guess is that if you legalized pot, since it's so widely available, people who didn't try it before wouldn't try it if it was legal. My problem with legalizing pot is people driving under the influence. It's hard to determine if they are high while driving or if they just smoke enough and have a large amount of THC in their system. I've heard there are saliva tests to see if someone had recently smoked, but I believe they were not accurate enough for my liking.There's a thin line between Saturday night and Sunday morning Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jfields 0 #27 October 21, 2003 QuoteGood boy, Justin. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Woof. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- You kinky buggers..... And you are a fine one to talk about that. Not to mention, that is four days old, you slacker. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites skydivejersey 0 #28 October 21, 2003 Your bod. Do what you like to it. Legalise drugs. Having then illegal doesn't stop anyone taking them anyway. Totally pointless and just stuffing people into jail for no reason. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Tonto 1 #29 October 21, 2003 Legalise all. Free choice remains. tIt's the year of the Pig. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites rehmwa 2 #30 October 21, 2003 QuoteIf people are so stupid that they feel the need to inflict this harm are their bodies then I am total support of their right to do so. However, I am also in support of DWI laws applying to them and employers test them for drugs and having every right to discriminate when hiring based on drug use. *************************************** Steel nailed it, but then how long would it be before the employers start getting nailed on discrimination lawsuits just because they don't want a pothead working for them? ... Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Layton 0 #31 October 21, 2003 val yuou are right in all violent crimes boose is a factor in 95 % of them.pot makes people lazy and at the most they would eat everything in the house.im a total abstainer (spelling).one of them 12 step people.been clean awhile too. right now im watching my youngest battle the coke thing.opps sorry to ramble.***if you are going to be stupid you better be tough Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites pds 0 #32 October 21, 2003 yes. for all kinds of terrific reasons other than getting high.namaste, motherfucker. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites TomAiello 25 #33 October 21, 2003 QuoteQuoteLegalize all of 'em. Tax 'em just like alcohol and nicotine. Agreed! Hey, I thought you were a Libertarian? The Libertarian answer is: Legalize all of 'em. Tax none of them, and repeal the taxes on alchohol and nicotine--and everything else.-- Tom Aiello [email protected] SnakeRiverBASE.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites meltdown 0 #34 October 21, 2003 Hell yes legalize drugs, for those 18 and over. There is no logical reason why an adult using a drug in his home should be tossed in jail. Trying to enforce unenforcable drug laws is government waste at it's worst. They should be regulated and taxed just like cigarettes and alcohol (the destructive drugs deemed to be acceptable), and funds should be made available from those tax monies for treatment programs for those who wish to quit. It will give our farmers who are currently subsidized by the taxpayer something profitable to grow, rather than paying them for NOT growing something. But most of all, it's freedom for the individual to do as he pleases with his or her body, without government intrusion. Of course, if someone fucks up he should be held accountable, and driving under the influence laws should be made tougher. Just my opinion. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites billvon 2,476 #35 October 21, 2003 >Legalize all of 'em. Tax none of them, and repeal the taxes on >alchohol and nicotine--and everything else. The libertarian party advocates that government should provide military protection of our country, and courts and police to protect our basic rights. How would they get the money to do that? (It's a lot less money than we'd need now, but they'd still need some.) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites TomAiello 25 #36 October 21, 2003 Quote>Legalize all of 'em. Tax none of them, and repeal the taxes on >alchohol and nicotine--and everything else. The libertarian party advocates that government should provide military protection of our country, and courts and police to protect our basic rights. How would they get the money to do that? (It's a lot less money than we'd need now, but they'd still need some.) There are various non-tax ways to raise that money. Before the imposition of the income tax, for example, the U.S. government subsisted largely on tariffs. I think that's probably not the best idea, but it is one of them. You could also consider user fees (for the courts, etc), straight poll taxes (for police services and military) or the creation of a "federal endownment" by the liquidation of current government property.-- Tom Aiello [email protected] SnakeRiverBASE.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites SkymonkeyONE 3 #37 October 21, 2003 QuoteGood boy, Justin. Legalize all of 'em. Tax 'em just like alcohol and nicotine. Legalize and tax. Pay the consequences if you are caught driving impaired or being otherwise disorderly in public. Chuck Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites selbbub78 0 #38 October 21, 2003 Legalize marijuana!!! It'd make random drug tests so much better "Women fake orgasms - men fake whole relationships" – Sharon Stone "The world is my dropzone" (wise crewdog quote) "The light dims, until full darkness pierces into the world."-KDM Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites skybytch 259 #39 October 21, 2003 QuoteHey, I thought you were a Libertarian? I am. But as I see it, "drugs" will be legalized quicker if the government and general public can see some immediate benefits to doing so. Taxation, while imho "wrong", would raise revenue that could be used for treatment (not that it would be, just that it could be). Legalize and tax now and we can work on eliminating the taxes later. When there are more Libertarian's in office. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites billvon 2,476 #40 October 21, 2003 >There are various non-tax ways to raise that money. The things you listed are all taxes - tariffs, user fees, poll fees etc are just another way of requiring people to pay money. About the only way to have it _truly_ not called a tax is to make it voluntary. The issue usually comes down to 'fairness,' what's the most fair way to get people to monetarily support the government. Income taxes are relatively fair in that low-income people don't pay much in taxes. Probably the most fair and impartial method of all is to divide government costs by the number of adults in the US and require them all to pay that amount. That would never fly of course because it would bankrupt some people while hardly impacting others at all. User fees are a good way to raise money, although people seem almost pathologically opposed to user fees on anything people use a lot (like roads.) It would certainly be a good way to pay for ATC, the highway system, environmental protection, and the FCC - but perhaps not such a good way to pay for the military, since everyone in the US benefits from a strong defensive military. Tariffs essentially penalize trade to pay for the government, so you have to be OK with a slightly less robust economy. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites NoShitThereIWas 0 #41 October 21, 2003 I agree with 90% of these posts. I think some drugs should be legalized and taxed. But I think others should definitely be "controlled substances" only accessible with a doctor's prescription. I don't see marijuana as a huge deal and think it is no worse or more harmful or dangerous than cigarettes, alcohol or tobacco. As a side note, how many lives are lost or ruined and how much damage is done in a comparison of marijuana, alcohol, cigarettes and other hard core drugs? I do have a bit of a problem with highly addictive hard core drugs becoming legalized and commonplace. In a place like America where lots of citizens have stress in their normal lives, I can see going to the local pharmacy to pick up one's daily heroin fix a problem. And I absolutely agree that no one should ever drive or endanger anyone else when they are impaired period. Impairment means different thing to different people and I think we all know when we are impaired and shouldn't be behind the wheel, leaving airplanes or other potentially dangerous activities whether it is impairment from drinking, drugs, or any other physical, emotional or mental impairment.Roy Bacon: "Elvises, light your fires." Sting: "Be yourself no matter what they say." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites SkydiveNFlorida 0 #42 October 21, 2003 Which drugs? I mean, are we talking over the counter legal here? Think of how many recreational drugs are not illegal, but rather are prescription only and therefore illegal to take w/o a script... Are we going to make those over the counter, too? Why should ex, acid, cocaine, etc be ok to buy over the counter, but not oxicontin or xanax? You could OD on almost anything, which is why we have controlled substances. So, how can we make it ok to buy some things that one can overdose on (ie, heroin), and not others (ie, oxicontin)? Too many points to consider. I think pot could safely be legalized, but that's about it. Angela. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites doublespock 0 #43 October 21, 2003 Amen Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites doublespock 0 #44 October 21, 2003 Imagine if it were that easy? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Prev 1 2 Next Page 2 of 2 Join the conversation You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account. 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skydivejersey 0 #28 October 21, 2003 Your bod. Do what you like to it. Legalise drugs. Having then illegal doesn't stop anyone taking them anyway. Totally pointless and just stuffing people into jail for no reason. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Tonto 1 #29 October 21, 2003 Legalise all. Free choice remains. tIt's the year of the Pig. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rehmwa 2 #30 October 21, 2003 QuoteIf people are so stupid that they feel the need to inflict this harm are their bodies then I am total support of their right to do so. However, I am also in support of DWI laws applying to them and employers test them for drugs and having every right to discriminate when hiring based on drug use. *************************************** Steel nailed it, but then how long would it be before the employers start getting nailed on discrimination lawsuits just because they don't want a pothead working for them? ... Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Layton 0 #31 October 21, 2003 val yuou are right in all violent crimes boose is a factor in 95 % of them.pot makes people lazy and at the most they would eat everything in the house.im a total abstainer (spelling).one of them 12 step people.been clean awhile too. right now im watching my youngest battle the coke thing.opps sorry to ramble.***if you are going to be stupid you better be tough Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
pds 0 #32 October 21, 2003 yes. for all kinds of terrific reasons other than getting high.namaste, motherfucker. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TomAiello 25 #33 October 21, 2003 QuoteQuoteLegalize all of 'em. Tax 'em just like alcohol and nicotine. Agreed! Hey, I thought you were a Libertarian? The Libertarian answer is: Legalize all of 'em. Tax none of them, and repeal the taxes on alchohol and nicotine--and everything else.-- Tom Aiello [email protected] SnakeRiverBASE.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
meltdown 0 #34 October 21, 2003 Hell yes legalize drugs, for those 18 and over. There is no logical reason why an adult using a drug in his home should be tossed in jail. Trying to enforce unenforcable drug laws is government waste at it's worst. They should be regulated and taxed just like cigarettes and alcohol (the destructive drugs deemed to be acceptable), and funds should be made available from those tax monies for treatment programs for those who wish to quit. It will give our farmers who are currently subsidized by the taxpayer something profitable to grow, rather than paying them for NOT growing something. But most of all, it's freedom for the individual to do as he pleases with his or her body, without government intrusion. Of course, if someone fucks up he should be held accountable, and driving under the influence laws should be made tougher. Just my opinion. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 2,476 #35 October 21, 2003 >Legalize all of 'em. Tax none of them, and repeal the taxes on >alchohol and nicotine--and everything else. The libertarian party advocates that government should provide military protection of our country, and courts and police to protect our basic rights. How would they get the money to do that? (It's a lot less money than we'd need now, but they'd still need some.) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TomAiello 25 #36 October 21, 2003 Quote>Legalize all of 'em. Tax none of them, and repeal the taxes on >alchohol and nicotine--and everything else. The libertarian party advocates that government should provide military protection of our country, and courts and police to protect our basic rights. How would they get the money to do that? (It's a lot less money than we'd need now, but they'd still need some.) There are various non-tax ways to raise that money. Before the imposition of the income tax, for example, the U.S. government subsisted largely on tariffs. I think that's probably not the best idea, but it is one of them. You could also consider user fees (for the courts, etc), straight poll taxes (for police services and military) or the creation of a "federal endownment" by the liquidation of current government property.-- Tom Aiello [email protected] SnakeRiverBASE.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SkymonkeyONE 3 #37 October 21, 2003 QuoteGood boy, Justin. Legalize all of 'em. Tax 'em just like alcohol and nicotine. Legalize and tax. Pay the consequences if you are caught driving impaired or being otherwise disorderly in public. Chuck Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
selbbub78 0 #38 October 21, 2003 Legalize marijuana!!! It'd make random drug tests so much better "Women fake orgasms - men fake whole relationships" – Sharon Stone "The world is my dropzone" (wise crewdog quote) "The light dims, until full darkness pierces into the world."-KDM Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skybytch 259 #39 October 21, 2003 QuoteHey, I thought you were a Libertarian? I am. But as I see it, "drugs" will be legalized quicker if the government and general public can see some immediate benefits to doing so. Taxation, while imho "wrong", would raise revenue that could be used for treatment (not that it would be, just that it could be). Legalize and tax now and we can work on eliminating the taxes later. When there are more Libertarian's in office. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 2,476 #40 October 21, 2003 >There are various non-tax ways to raise that money. The things you listed are all taxes - tariffs, user fees, poll fees etc are just another way of requiring people to pay money. About the only way to have it _truly_ not called a tax is to make it voluntary. The issue usually comes down to 'fairness,' what's the most fair way to get people to monetarily support the government. Income taxes are relatively fair in that low-income people don't pay much in taxes. Probably the most fair and impartial method of all is to divide government costs by the number of adults in the US and require them all to pay that amount. That would never fly of course because it would bankrupt some people while hardly impacting others at all. User fees are a good way to raise money, although people seem almost pathologically opposed to user fees on anything people use a lot (like roads.) It would certainly be a good way to pay for ATC, the highway system, environmental protection, and the FCC - but perhaps not such a good way to pay for the military, since everyone in the US benefits from a strong defensive military. Tariffs essentially penalize trade to pay for the government, so you have to be OK with a slightly less robust economy. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
NoShitThereIWas 0 #41 October 21, 2003 I agree with 90% of these posts. I think some drugs should be legalized and taxed. But I think others should definitely be "controlled substances" only accessible with a doctor's prescription. I don't see marijuana as a huge deal and think it is no worse or more harmful or dangerous than cigarettes, alcohol or tobacco. As a side note, how many lives are lost or ruined and how much damage is done in a comparison of marijuana, alcohol, cigarettes and other hard core drugs? I do have a bit of a problem with highly addictive hard core drugs becoming legalized and commonplace. In a place like America where lots of citizens have stress in their normal lives, I can see going to the local pharmacy to pick up one's daily heroin fix a problem. And I absolutely agree that no one should ever drive or endanger anyone else when they are impaired period. Impairment means different thing to different people and I think we all know when we are impaired and shouldn't be behind the wheel, leaving airplanes or other potentially dangerous activities whether it is impairment from drinking, drugs, or any other physical, emotional or mental impairment.Roy Bacon: "Elvises, light your fires." Sting: "Be yourself no matter what they say." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SkydiveNFlorida 0 #42 October 21, 2003 Which drugs? I mean, are we talking over the counter legal here? Think of how many recreational drugs are not illegal, but rather are prescription only and therefore illegal to take w/o a script... Are we going to make those over the counter, too? Why should ex, acid, cocaine, etc be ok to buy over the counter, but not oxicontin or xanax? You could OD on almost anything, which is why we have controlled substances. So, how can we make it ok to buy some things that one can overdose on (ie, heroin), and not others (ie, oxicontin)? Too many points to consider. I think pot could safely be legalized, but that's about it. Angela. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
doublespock 0 #44 October 21, 2003 Imagine if it were that easy? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
