Help - Plasma TV choice?

[Michele 1]

My Dad is the best Dad ever. My brother and his family need a new TV, so Dad is going to buy them one for their family room for Christmas (a few weeks early). Dad said he wanted to get the plasma tv for them, because they've got three kids, and they watch a lot of movies.

SO. Because I know absolutely NOTHING about plasma TVs, the best, the worst, or the indifferent, I thought I'd ask all of you for your opinions...

What is the best TV? The most common size (not the largest, but the larger rather than smaller sizes)? Best brand? Best store to purchase them? How much should Dad expect to spend? Any fancy doodahs needed, like a whole speaker set, or ??? What do I need to know to make a good purchase? Any NEVERS or ALWAYS? Can I buy it on the 'net and have it shipped directly to my brother's house?

Help! I want to make this a great present, so that Dad can be happy he's giving it. Any advice, direction, help, or experiences would be definitely appreciated.

Thanks!

Ciels-
Michele

~Do Angels keep the dreams we seek
While our hearts lie bleeding?~

[Mark24688m 0]

Honestly, I wouldnt go plasma. Plasma TVs are very very expensive for a technology that won't last that long. I would either go with a DLP or an LCD. I have both in my house and they are both amazing tvs (Samsung 50in and 40in.) They both have amazing pictures in HD. In my personal opinion, I think the lcd looks a tad bit nicer, but not by much. The prices for these tvs are also dropping lately, so you can get a 40" Samsung LCD for about $1500 now. Talk to the people at th store and they can tell you everything you need to know to make the best decision.

[grue 1]

Quote

Honestly, I wouldnt go plasma. Plasma TVs are very very expensive for a technology that won't last that long. I would either go with a DLP or an LCD. I have both in my house and they are both amazing tvs (Samsung 50in and 40in.) They both have amazing pictures in HD. In my personal opinion, I think the lcd looks a tad bit nicer, but not by much. The prices for these tvs are also dropping lately, so you can get a 40" Samsung LCD for about $1500 now. Talk to the people at th store and they can tell you everything you need to know to make the best decision.

You'd be right, if you weren't completely wrong.

A current-generation plasma is usually LESS expensive than an LCD of similar size and brand, and will generally have a higher picture quality. As for the longevity, it's claimed that a current gen plasma will have a half life of approximately 60,000 hours, compared to the 40-50,000 hours out of an LCD panel.

LCoS and LCD projection aren't bad, but do keep in mind you'll need to replace the bulb every 8,000 hours or so, which equates to about 3 years, often less, for most Americans.

DLP is the bottom shelf in terms of picture quality typically. That's not to say they're actually bad, just that pretty much everything else is better.

Michele:
That having been said, if the room the TV will go into has a light of large light sources, such as large windows or something along those lines, you may experience glare issues with a plasma display. If you can go plasma, I suggest Samsung panels if you don't want to shell out for a Pioneer display. Panasonics are good, IF you are willing to have someone calibrate it. Their out of the box settings are abysmal.

If you cannot go plasma, then you might want to consider an LCD panel instead. The 40" 720p Samsung that the above poster referred to is a fantastic display. The 46" isn't quite as good in terms of image quality, for whatever reason. LCDs do also have the downside that if the children mentioned before are rowdy, they are easier to damage than a plasma, due to the physical characteristics of the displays.

If you have any more questions, PM me or whatever.

cavete terrae.

[Amazon 7]

look up 1080p

in HDTV that is as good as it gets...

[grue 1]

Quote

look up 1080p

in HDTV that is as good as it gets...

1080p is great, if you have a TV that can support it, a good source for it, and you have good eyes to tell the difference. Most people don't have any of the three.

cavete terrae.

[Amazon 7]

Quote

1080p is great, if you have a TV that can support it, a good source for it, and you have good eyes to tell the difference. Most people don't have any of the three.

Some do... have all three

[grue 1]

Quote

Quote

1080p is great, if you have a TV that can support it, a good source for it, and you have good eyes to tell the difference. Most people don't have any of the three.

Some do... have all three

I have #3, I'll get #1 in a few weeks, but in my opinion #2 doesn't exist yet, except when you're using it as a computer display.

cavete terrae.

[Amazon 7]

A few links...


1080p
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1080p

HD-DVD
http://www.audioholics.com/ces/CEStechnology/HDDVDCESinterview.php

Notice the date.. Jan 2006.. they are out now.. and some HD DVD are out as well...if you look really hard

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HD_DVD


AND the Toshiba is on sale.. not the top of the line.. but.. DUDE.. It rocks..

http://amazon.com/s/ref=nb_ss_gw/105-4618267-8090033?url=search-alias%3Daps&field-keywords=1080p+HD+DVD&Go.x=8&Go.y=10


and the HD DVD Titles are available...

V for Vendetta
http://www.amazon.com/Vendetta-HD-DVD-Paul-Giamatti/dp/B000I2JKFG/sr=8-9/qid=1164522511/ref=pd_bbs_sr_9/103-3286752-2095813?ie=UTF8&s=dvd


The Blue ray supposedly will be better but we are back to the old VHS v Beta format...wars

Serenity
http://www.amazon.com/Serenity-HD-DVD-Joss-Whedon/dp/B000FA57N0/sr=8-12/qid=1164522511/ref=pd_bbs_sr_12/103-3286752-2095813?ie=UTF8&s=dvd

Troy
http://www.amazon.com/Troy-HD-DVD/dp/B000E5KJI4/sr=8-31/qid=1164522719/ref=sr_1_31/103-3286752-2095813?ie=UTF8&s=dvd

[grue 1]

Quote

A few links...


1080p
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1080p

HD-DVD
http://www.audioholics.com/ces/CEStechnology/HDDVDCESinterview.php

Notice the date.. Jan 2006.. they are out now.. and some HD DVD are out as well...if you look really hard

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HD_DVD


AND the Toshiba is on sale.. not the top of the line.. but.. DUDE.. It rocks..

http://amazon.com/s/ref=nb_ss_gw/105-4618267-8090033?url=search-alias%3Daps&field-keywords=1080p+HD+DVD&Go.x=8&Go.y=10


and the HD DVD Titles are available...

V for Vendetta
http://www.amazon.com/Vendetta-HD-DVD-Paul-Giamatti/dp/B000I2JKFG/sr=8-9/qid=1164522511/ref=pd_bbs_sr_9/103-3286752-2095813?ie=UTF8&s=dvd

Serenity
http://www.amazon.com/Serenity-HD-DVD-Joss-Whedon/dp/B000FA57N0/sr=8-12/qid=1164522511/ref=pd_bbs_sr_12/103-3286752-2095813?ie=UTF8&s=dvd

I'm a home theatre salesman and installer, I'm welllll aware of all these. I've probably got more time using them than most of the people who own them. I've actually spent several hours in front of an HD-DVD and a Blu-Ray setup on various 1080p displays, and while both are good, I don't find either to be worth the cash at the moment. While a direct-view panel will buffer the frames in such a manner to make a 1080i signal appear to be quasi-progressive, I don't think the image quality is really there yet. There are still noticeable compression artifacts for both formats (not to mention neither are truly 1080p with current players), and the Toshiba hardware is crashy.

cavete terrae.

[Amazon 7]

Quote

I've probably got more time using them than most of the people who own them.

Think about where I live... the crappy weather place.... where you stay indoors lots....

I like my Toshiba... for what it is... its phenomenal..

[sunshine 2]

I know nothing about this new technology stuff. All i can do is wish you the best of luck in gathering information. It just doesn't make sense to me. I'm sooo technologically challenged.

___________________________________________
meow

I get a Mike hug! I get a Mike hug!

[Amazon 7]

Come Visit Sunny I will show you mine

[Amazon 7]

Oh here is a list of currently available HD DVD movies.

The Last Samurai (2004), Warner Bros. (Release date April 18, 2006)
Million Dollar Baby (2004), Warner Bros. (Release date April 18, 2006)
The Phantom of the Opera (2004), Warner Bros. (Release date April 18, 2006)
Serenity (2005), Universal Studios (Release date April 18, 2006)
Apollo 13 (1995), Universal Studios (Release date April 25, 2006)
Doom: Unrated Extended Edition (2005), Universal Studios (Release date April 25, 2006)
GoodFellas (1990), Warner Bros. (Release date May 2, 2006)
Swordfish (2001), Warner Bros. (Release date May 2, 2006)
Assault on Precinct 13 (2005), Universal Studios (Release date May 9, 2006)
Cinderella Man (2005), Universal Studios (Release date May 9, 2006)
Jarhead (2005), Universal Studios (Release date May 9, 2006)
Rumor Has It (2005), Warner Bros. (Release date May 9, 2006) (Hybrid HD DVD and DVD version on dual sided disc)
Training Day (2001), Warner Bros. (Release date May 9, 2006)
Terminator 3: Rise of the Machines (2003), Warner Bros. (Release date May 9, 2006)
Full Metal Jacket (1987), Warner Bros. (Release date May 16, 2006)
Unforgiven (1992), Warner Bros. (Release date May 16, 2006)
Blazing Saddles (1974), Warner Bros. (Release date May 23, 2006)
The Bourne Supremacy (2004), Universal Studios (Release date May 23, 2006)
The Chronicles of Riddick: Unrated Director's Cut (2004), Universal Studios (Release date May 23, 2006)
The Fugitive (1993), Warner Bros. (Release date May 23, 2006)
U-571 (2000), Universal Studios (Release date May 23, 2006)
Van Helsing (2004), Universal Studios (Release date May 23, 2006)
Constantine (2005), Warner Bros. (Release date June 6, 2006)
Firewall (2006), Warner Bros. (Release date June 6, 2006) (Hybrid HD DVD and DVD version on dual sided disc)
The Perfect Storm (2000), Warner Bros. (Release date June 6, 2006)
A View From Space with Heavenly Music (2006), Concert Hot Spot (Release date June 6, 2006)
16 Blocks (2006), Warner Bros. (Release date June 13, 2006) (Hybrid HD DVD and DVD version on dual sided disc)
Happy Gilmore (1996), Universal Studios (Release date June 13, 2006)
The Rundown (2003), Universal Studios (Release date June 13, 2006)
Kiss Kiss, Bang Bang (2005), Warner Bros. (Release date June 20, 2006)
Syriana (2005), Warner Bros. (Release date June 20, 2006)
Lethal Weapon (1987), Warner Bros. (Release date June 27, 2006)
Guitarscape Planet (2005), Concert Hot Spot (Release date June 27, 2006)
The Dukes of Hazzard (2005), Warner Bros. (Release date July 11, 2006)
Enter The Dragon (1973), Warner Bros. (Release date July 11, 2006)
Friday Night Lights (2004), Universal Studios (Release date July 11, 2006)
Pitch Black: Unrated Director's Cut (2000), Universal Studios (Release date July 11, 2006)
ATL (2004), Warner Bros. (Release date July 18, 2006)
Sahara (2005), Paramount Pictures (Release date July 25, 2006)
Lara Croft: Tomb Raider (2001), Paramount Pictures (Release date July 25, 2006)
Sky Captain and the World of Tomorrow (2004), Paramount Pictures (Release date July 25, 2006)
Sleepy Hollow (1999), Paramount Pictures (Release date July 25, 2006)
Four Brothers (2005), Paramount Pictures (Release date August 1, 2006)
We Were Soldiers (2002), Paramount Pictures (Release date August 1, 2006)
The Manchurian Candidate (2004), Paramount Pictures (Release date August 1, 2006)
U2 - Rattle & Hum (1988) (Release date August 8, 2006)
Æon Flux (2005), Paramount Pictures (Release date August 8, 2006)
The Italian Job (2003), Paramount Pictures (Release date August 8, 2006)
National Lampoon's Animal House (1978), Universal Studios (Release date August 15, 2006)
Ray (2004), Universal Studios (Release date August 15, 2006)
Unleashed (2005), Universal Studios (Release date August 15, 2006)
The Bone Collector (2001), Universal Studios (Release date August 22, 2006)
Caddyshack (1980), Warner Bros. (Release date August 22, 2006)
Good Night, and Good Luck. (2006), Warner Bros. (Release date August 22, 2006)
The Interpreter (2005), Universal Studios (Release date August 22, 2006)
The Searchers (1956), Warner Bros. (Release date August 22, 2006)
Spy Game (2001), Universal Studios (Release date August 22, 2006)
That's the Way of the World (1975), BCI Home Entertainment (Release date August 29, 2006)
Red Dragon (2002), Universal Studios (Release date September 12, 2006)
Seabiscuit (2003), Universal Studios (Release date September 12, 2006)
Traffic (2000), Universal Studios (Release date September 12, 2006)
Backdraft (1991), Universal Studios (Release date September 12, 2006)
Space Cowboys (2000), Warner Bros. (Release date September 12, 2006)
House of Wax (2005), Warner Bros. (Release date September 12, 2006)
Dazed and Confused (1993), Universal Studios (Release date September 19, 2006)
End of Days (1999) (Release date September 19, 2006)
Fear and Loathing in Las Vegas (1998) (Release date September 19, 2006)
Galaxina (1980), BCI Home Entertainment (Release date September 19, 2006)
Golgo 13 (1977), BCI Home Entertainment (Release date September 19, 2006)
Land of the Dead (Unrated) (2005), Universal Studios (Release date September 19, 2006)
The Fast and the Furious (2001), Universal Studios (Release date September 26, 2006)
2 Fast 2 Furious (2003), Universal Studios (Release date September 26, 2006)
The Fast and the Furious: Tokyo Drift (2006), Universal Studios (Release date September 26, 2006)
Army of Darkness (1993), Universal Studios (Release date October 10, 2006)
Batman Begins (2005), Warner Bros. (Release date October 10, 2006)
Tim Burton's Corpse Bride (2005), Warner Bros. (Release date October 10, 2006)
Charlie and the Chocolate Factory (2005), Warner Bros. (Release date October 10, 2006)
Willy Wonka & the Chocolate Factory (1971), Warner Bros. (Release date October 10, 2006)
Fast Times at Ridgemont High ((1982), Universal Studios (Release date October 10, 2006)
The Polar Express (2004), Warner Bros. (Release date October 10, 2006)
Waist Deep (2006), Universal Studios (Release date October 10, 2006)
12 Monkeys (1995), Universal Studios (Release date October 24, 2006)
The Interpreter (2005), Universal Studios (Release date October 24, 2006)
Out of Sight (1998), Universal Studios (Release date October 24, 2006)
Slither (2006), Universal Studios (Release date October 24, 2006)
Spartacus (1960), Universal Studios (Release date October 24, 2006)
John Carpenter's The Thing (1982), Universal Studios (Release date October 24, 2006)
Mission: Impossible (1996), Paramount Pictures (Release date October 30, 2006)
Mission: Impossible II (2000), Paramount Pictures (Release date October 30, 2006)
Mission: Impossible III (2006), Paramount Pictures (Release date October 30, 2006)
Under Siege (1992), Warner Bros. (Release date October 31, 2006)
V For Vendetta (2006), Warner Bros. (Release date October 31, 2006)
Nacho Libre (2006), Paramount Pictures (Release date November 7, 2006)
Reds (1981), Paramount Pictures (Release date November 7, 2006)
Accepted (2006), Universal Studios (Release date November 14, 2006)
Casablanca (1942), Warner Bros. (Release date November 14, 2006)
Forbidden Planet (1956), Warner Bros. (Release date November 14, 2006)
Peter Jackson's King Kong (2005), Universal Studios (Release date November 14, 2006)
Mutiny on the Bounty (1962), Warner Bros. (Release date November 14, 2006)
Waterworld (1995), Universal Studios (Release date November 14, 2006)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_HD_DVD_releases

[Samurai136 0]

I'm thinking there could be a reason for me to go for a walk in a cornfield with my video camera, burn a DVD and send it to you....

What would that look like in HD?

"Buttons aren't toys." - Trillian
Ken

[grue 1]

There are plenty of titles. I'm just not happy with the hardware that plays them.

cavete terrae.

[MikeForsythe 0]

Okay, lets see if I can sum up this pissing match between Grue vs. Amazon

Grue = salesman saying TRUST ME vs. Amazon = Do what I say or suffer my RED WRATH

The winner is clearly Amazon

Nuff said, stay safe,
Mike

Time and pressure will always show you who a person really is!

[grue 1]

Quote

Okay, lets see if I can sum up this pissing match between Grue vs. Amazon

Grue = salesman saying TRUST ME vs. Amazon = Do what I say or suffer my RED WRATH

The winner is clearly Amazon

Nuff said, stay safe,
Mike

Salesman who doesn't work on commission, and has nothing to gain, and hates everyone to the point of brutal honesty on all things.

cavete terrae.

[Amazon 7]

Like Fucking CORN.....


You would need an HD CAm....

[Remster 24]

I'll side with Grue on this one.

1080p is a great technology. But dont expect to see to value of your investment now: its more a get geared up for the next phase of HD. The current HD feeds you get are good enough on a 1080i or good 720 displays. And its good for bragging rights.

Sizewise: Michele: dont go too big. The bigger the screen, the bibber the pixels. If your TV watching room is large, and you can be far enough eawy from the display, the go for it. If you have a room where you have to be less then 10 feet from the display, big isnt your friend. I watch some fotball at a friend's place who has HD cable on a 50 inch plasma, and, well, I was underwelmed because of that. We were 6 feet away.

Whatever you do, get a HD feed.

Remster

[Icon134 0]

Quote

You would need an HD CAm....

and acccess to an HD-DVD burner...

Livin' on the Edge... sleeping with my rigger's wife...

[tdog 0]

Michele,

In case Grue's posts are confusing since he did not start at the basics...

There are three "flat" or "thin" technologies:

1) Rear projection DLP/LCD. These units are about 1 foot deep, and can go real large in screen size. These still need to be in a wall unit or on a shelf, not to be mounted on a wall like a picture. For every inch of screen, they can be cheaper than flat tvs of the same sizes, but you have a $250ish lightbulb to replace and they are 1 foot deep. LCD uses a LCD panel to filter light, DLP uses Texas Instruments Digital Light Processing (millions of little mirrors) technology to filter the light. DLP is the technology that movie theatres that have switched to digital projection are likely to use - and is used almost exclusively for professional projection screens for concerts and events (20 foot screens on stages). Both technologies have moved to smaller projection surfaces (TVS) after starting in the large projector market.

2) Flat panel LCD. These are 1.5" deep and look like the "Plasma" wall mounts - and are basically the same technology as a flat LCD computer monitor, just much larger. They are known for longevity, but suffer from blacks that are not as black as other technologies - and some complain that (especially older technology) was not good for video games because the LCD could not keep up with the quick moving images.

3) Flat panel Plasma. These came out long before the LCD flat panels - and still often are cheaper than LCD per the same size. The older generations were known to buzz at higher altitudes (like Colorado) - and to burn in - meaning if you watched a program where there was a solid logo in the corner - or god forbid you paused your TIVO and then forgot and left it on - you would find a negative image "burned" into the screen. The solution that the video equipment rental houses discovered to fix this problem was to overdrive a solid white image for a few days to erase the image - but you need expensive video equipment to overdrive white.

These are two websites that I liked for giving me reviews:

http://www.plasmatvbuyingguide.com/
http://www.LCDtvbuyingguide.com/

If you want Plasma - Panasonic seems to always have the best picture, and was the gold standard for the professional 42 inch model for price/quality/picture. This is what my eyes told me, and what the online reviews have said. The professional grade Panasonics used to not even come with speakers - but once they moved to target consumers they added audio and tuners and stuff people need/want in their homes.

LCD - Sony seems to get a lot of good buzz in the market...


Where to buy? I was looking for a "flat" TV for years - and I always said, "when they get $500 cheaper I will buy". I have a discerning eye - my professional job is broadcast and event lighting, sound and video - which means I light people to be shown on video, and have installed sound systems for concerts for bands you likely know well. Thus I also have a rather nice home theatre...

I went to COSTCO and got a rather nice 40 inch LCD (Philips, which when sitting next to a Sony, I could only see very minor and very slight deviations) on a huge sale that could not be beat. I bet this is going to make Grue fall out of his skin - but with the sale price I could not justify going to even an online retailer, let alone a boutique installer/retailer. This unit will last a few years in my family room then will move to the bedroom when a good 50 inch comes out for the family room that is in a price I like.

Costco had a few good name brands on the shelf when I was there, but since their inventory always changes, no promises now. They had a real nice Panasonic, like expected, had the best blacks of everything they had - at a great price - but I wanted LCD for a few reasons...

Also, I asked the Costco store employee, "what is your return policy?" He said, "as long as you are a member, if it breaks or you don't like it, return it." Yes - they will take it back in two years when and if it breaks. I checked the written return policy, and the only limit they institute is 6 months on computers - and this is not a computer!

Since most online stores and even boutique stores make their money with a service plan and have very limited return policies - I could not justify passing by the Costco return policy and price.

[jcd11235 0]

Some rules of thumb from a recovering audiophile / home theater nut:

Diagonal screen size should be (no larger than) about half the distance from the screen to the main viewing seats.

When buying a television, spend the money on the screen, not the audio capabilities. You will generally get much better sound from a separate audio system. (Caveat: As a general rule, companies that make good electrical components, such as receivers and CD players, make lousy speakers, and vice versa.)

You can't get too many input/output ports, nor too many types. What you may not have a use for now may be very useful in a couple of years.

I personally would not buy any HD television that I could not easily use as a computer monitor. Home computers and home theater control systems are becoming much less distinguishable.

Math tutoring available. Only $6! per hour! First lesson: Factorials!

[The111 1]

Quote

Oh here is a list of currently available HD DVD movies.

Some of those movies were filmed decades ago. Would their original recording source even be able to justify putting them on an HD DVD today? That's like back in the 90's when I'd rip my cassette tapes to 192kbps mp3's.

www.WingsuitPhotos.com

[DustyP 0]

i gonna have to agree with some people...
i also say, DLP is the way to go...
it's only about $250 for a bulb, that needs relpaced every7-10 years unless sooner!
plasma, need recharged about evey 2-5 years! and the burn the screen! so if you watch the same channel all the time, you goona see some effects of that over time!
sony makes the best Plasma. and you get what you pay for! don't buy a show model.....ever!
samsung make the best DLP.....depends on what you want!
if hes persistant on gettin a plasma, try and talk him into a LCD!
plasma is over rated
and also....
try and find one "intergrated"
intergrated means that.....to watch "HIGH DEF" you need nothing extra.
if you bought one NON INTERGRATED, your goin to have to a cable box to watch the high def channels.
i have a 50" samsung DLP intergrated
i get 5 free high def!
for $8 more i could get 5 more channels
DLP is the Best Bet!!

.

[mdrejhon 8]

Right now, I use a 120" front projection system (formerly a CRT as pictured below, but now an LCoS):
http://www.marky.com/hometheater

So I'll chime in my 2 cents.

Plasma picture quality seems to have remained relatively constant in recent years. LCD flat panels were formerly very inferior (blurry, washed-out colors, murky grey-colored blacks) but the newer LCD's are so much better now.

Among plasma versus LCD flat panels:
My eyes formerly preferred the better plasmas. But with the advent of the new LCD's with much better blacks and faster response, I think my eyes now kind of prefer the newer LCD flat panels -- less "digital" looking than plasmas. (At least the models approaching 2000:1 contrast ratio or better) I can't wait until LED backlights allow 100% NTSC color spectrum representation. When 1080p LCD's with LED backlights (with black frames between images for good fast-motion sports and CRT-quality videogames) become inexpensive enough, I'll probably get one of these when I don't want to turn on a projector.

For now I'll use my front projection system -- it's cheap per pixel for impressive image sizes. For only $999 you can an impressive 100 inch HDTV image (1280x720) in the form of the Optoma HD70 DLP Projector. Recently released, it is the first widescreen full-HDTV (720p) front projector that goes under $1000. The HD70 uses the "HD2 darkchip2" DLP chip, the exact same chip formerly used in $8000 projectors not too long ago! You can keep your existing TV, but add a pulldown screen and this HDTV projetor.

Optoma HD70 DLP: The world's first widescreen full-HDTV projector under $1000:
Optoma HD70 DLP Projector