BlindBrick 0 #1 May 1, 2005 Yesterday, my dz placed me on restriction. Concerned about my deployment speed, they limited me to 7 second hop and pops until i can get a suit that slows my terminal down to 120. My typical bellyfly speed is 165 though my range is ~155-175. While I agree that both my body and gear is taking a beating opening at these speeds, I do not want to give up the ability to fly at those speeds. Given that, is there any suit building techniques that would allow me my normal fall rate but then be able to slow down for deployment? If so, does any jumpsuit company do these type suits particuarly well? -Blind"If you end up in an alligator's jaws, naked, you probably did something to deserve it." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
beowulf 1 #2 May 1, 2005 damn that is about what my sitfly speed is at. I would never want to through out going that fast. At those speeds you won't be able to jump with most people. Why would you want that kind of speed on your belly? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kris 0 #3 May 1, 2005 Why would you want a belly speed of 165? And here I thought my un-suited belly speed of 145 was bad. As far as suits go, one of the best RW suits for anvils like us is a BevSuit. Do a search of some of AggieDave's posts about his. You're probably looking at a really baggy polycotton cut, with wings and afterburners.Sky, Muff Bro, Rodriguez Bro, and Bastion of Purity and Innocence!™ Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BlindBrick 0 #4 May 1, 2005 QuoteWhy would you want that kind of speed on your belly? I like bellyflying with the freeflyers. Hybrids are so much easier when you do not have to deal with a big speed difference -Blind"If you end up in an alligator's jaws, naked, you probably did something to deserve it." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kris 0 #5 May 1, 2005 QuoteHybrids are so much easier when you do not have to deal with a big speed difference But that's the point of a hybrid. Two or more bellyflyers with freeflyers hanging to increase the speed to at or near freefly speed (~165). If you get a suit that slows you down considerably, you can still collapse the wings and arch to bring your speed up, then use them to slow you down for tracking and opening. The other important fact here is tracking. At the speeds you're doing, I can't see how you're getting a good lengthy track away from formations. Your gear wasn't meant to keep taking the kind of opening shock you're probably giving it, Brick.Sky, Muff Bro, Rodriguez Bro, and Bastion of Purity and Innocence!™ Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Amazon 7 #6 May 1, 2005 Quotebaggy polycotton NOOOOO go with a heavy baggy cotton... more drag.. and big wings do not hurt at all. Big people need all the help they can get. Nice thing about the suit in the picture... is its old school... It has LOTS of wing.. and you can collapes the wing to speed up. and with the openings in the legs and arms it inflates nicely when you are in a sit or a stand. Its great amusement for people jumping with you to watch. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
cvfd1399 0 #7 May 1, 2005 What is your dry weight, and wing loading on what kind of gear? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skybytch 259 #8 May 1, 2005 QuoteYou're probably looking at a really baggy polycotton cut, with wings and afterburners. I'd suggest heavyweight cotton fabric (or medium weight polycotton in two layers), loose cut with a large wing, booties in cordura, standard (ie baggy) forearms and swoop cords. Big "competition" grips add a little more drag too. What you don't want is spandex. Besides Bev, other good slow RW suits include AirTime's Tony Suit and Flite Suit's Flite Suit. What kind of suit are you using now, Blind? How slow can you go when you try to go slow? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BlindBrick 0 #9 May 1, 2005 QuoteWhat is your dry weight, and wing loading on what kind of gear? 317 exit weight, Wingloading my custom Safire II at 1.2, my R-max reserve at 1.1. Container is a Mirage RTS(ie modded G3). -Blind"If you end up in an alligator's jaws, naked, you probably did something to deserve it." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BlindBrick 0 #10 May 1, 2005 QuoteWhat kind of suit are you using now, Blind? How slow can you go when you try to go slow? No suit right now. Usually I jump baggy jeans and a T. If I cup right to the edge of instability I can get down to 150 or so, but at that point I feel too unstable to throw out. What I've been doing the last few jumps is cupping to that point, then arching a little to wave off and deploy. According to Neptunes, that is giving me a deployment speed of around 160-165. -Blind"If you end up in an alligator's jaws, naked, you probably did something to deserve it." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
beowulf 1 #11 May 1, 2005 ouch those openings have to hurt. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
GravityGirl 0 #12 May 2, 2005 Jeans and a T-shirt??? AND suit would offer more range. I was going to say, "Call Ray Farrell of Flite Suit and ask about Gills." But now you can just PM Skybitch! ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Peace and Blue Skies! Bonnie ==>Gravity Gear! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
piisfish 135 #13 May 2, 2005 ever thought about a system similar to a drogue (sp. ?) like on tandems to slow you down before deployment ?? a similar system is used by www.jet-man to slow down his horizontal speed before deployment. I am conscious that this system might require you breakoff and start opening procedures a bit higher... but might be woth it, for yourself and for the gear.scissors beat paper, paper beat rock, rock beat wingsuit - KarlM Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
riggerrob 561 #14 May 2, 2005 Forget the drogue, they are way more trouble than they are worth. Trust me, I did 9 jumps with drogues yesterday. What you really need is a big, baggy suit made of thick poly cotton with swoop cords, booties and all the other gadgets. The ultimate would be a late-1970s balloon suit with vents, etc. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DrewGPM 0 #15 May 2, 2005 QuoteI like bellyflying with the freeflyers. Hybrids are so much easier when you do not have to deal with a big speed difference From one large mammal to another, get a jump suit and work on your fall rate. Those fast jumps are fun, but the longer you wait to work on controlling your fall rate, the harder it will be to master. You learn so many bad habits...and those are hard to break. I spent 400 jumping a suit that was too small. My average fall rate was 130, and my body position was more like a de-arch. I learned to fly like that, but my range sucked. I couldn't jump with most people because they couldn't/wouldn't keep up with me. When i did jump with them, I was in the base of formations, then i'd go low when we transitioned from point 1 to point 2. I got so frustrated that I stopped doing anything bigger than an 8 way. That eventually lead to me jumping with freefliers. But I was missing out on a lot of fun jumps. I regret waiting so long to get a better suit. Two years ago i picked up a new suit from http://www.zutesute.com/index.html and it changed EVERYTHING. I've been as slow as 117 and my average is down to 122-125 on most jumps. I still go low on some of the bigger formations, but now i have the fall rate range to get back to the formation. Do yourself a favor, get some coaching in a wind tunnel. there are a lot of drill they can show you. My first time in the tunnel i was stuck on the bottom, and that was using the biggest suit they had. By the end of the 3 day tunnel camp I was using my own suit and flying around the tunnel like it was nothing. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DrewGPM 0 #16 May 2, 2005 QuoteI'd suggest heavyweight cotton fabric (or medium weight polycotton in two layers), loose cut with a large wing, booties in cordura, standard (ie baggy) forearms and swoop cords. Big "competition" grips add a little more drag too. What you don't want is spandex. I agree with everything except swoop cords. Everyone told me to get them, so i did. Unfortunately they don't help you slow down your base fall rate. When you go low on a formation, swoop cords will get you back up. But you can't fly with them once you get back up there. As soon as the swoop cord relaxes, you go low again. I wasted 20-30 jumps trying to fly the swoop cords. Now they are disconnected on most jumps. The base fall rate comes down to body position, jump suit material, the booties and how baggy the suit fits. heavy material is key. Big booties generate a lot of drag. Big grippers help, especially if you get inside and outside grippers on the legs. Extra fabric in the forearm and big wings are a must. Two layers of fabric on the front helps too. Don't use a lot black fabric, that bad boy is gonna be hot enough as it is! For the love of god, no spandex. Big guys in spandex of any kind just wrong...trust me, i tried on a speedo once...lesson learned! The body position is important too. Stay very flat, almost no arch at all. Point your toes to the side while you fly, it helps you utilize all that bootie fabric. Get coaching and tunnel time to figure out the body position, it's faster than figuring it out noe jump at a time. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
justinb138 0 #17 May 2, 2005 QuoteJeans and a T-shirt??? AND suit would offer more range. I was going to say, "Call Ray Farrell of Flite Suit and ask about Gills." But now you can just PM Skybitch! What are the Gills? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
AndyMan 7 #18 May 2, 2005 I agree with avoiding swoop cords. They're real handy if you're trying to do big RW and are diving out last, but they're not very helpful in terms of slowing down a heavier jumper. They help a jumper extend the "slow end" of the range. The problem for a heavier jumper is getting a good range in the first place. Swoop cords are a solution to a different problem. TonySuits makes a great BigBoy suit. Arms and legs are made of cordura, booties are vented in a way that they'll actually inflate. When I wear my Big Boy suit, I've even found myself in the situation where I have to work to go fast - something I've never had to do before. I also agree, DrewGPM in a speedo is not a pretty thought! _Am__ You put the fun in "funnel" - craichead. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
chriswelker 0 #19 May 3, 2005 A jumper at our DZ this past weekend that is 6'2 with an exit weight of 305 lbs, exited last out of a KingAir and docked on a 9 way was wearing a WindLine jumpsuit.He actually can actually float in this suit. How tall are you? Chris Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BlindBrick 0 #20 May 3, 2005 Quote How tall are you? 6 ft even -Blind"If you end up in an alligator's jaws, naked, you probably did something to deserve it." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mjosparky 3 #21 May 4, 2005 Too bad they are not made anymore, but Silly Suit would work just great. More material than my Hobby Cat sail and made of canvas duck. And swoop cords work just fine if they are built right and adjusted right. Part of going fast is being able to stop. Swoops can be used in many different situations. It takes some time to learn how and when to use them and if you don't know how to use them, they won't work. Just like everything else. SparkyMy idea of a fair fight is clubbing baby seals Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
