What do you consider a veteran ?

[keithbar 1]

I never describe myself or even think of myself as a veteran. I went into the army right out of high school. Did 4 years. From 79 to 83. But it was peace time. My dad wad a veteran . Over 28 years in the army green beret. Two tours in Vietnam. The young guys today over there getting shot at and blown up are definitely veterans..what does everyone else think qualifies?

i have on occasion been accused of pulling low . My response. Naw I wasn't low I'm just such a big guy I look closer than I really am .

[wolfriverjoe 1,342]

If you signed the contract, took the oath & put on the uniform, you are a veteran.

I won't make a distinction between "peacetime" and "wartime" vets because everyone who served basically agreed to go get shot at if ordered to.

And there are some places that are pretty dangerous, even in so-called "peacetime." DMZ in Korea comes to mind first, but there are others.

"There are NO situations which do not call for a French Maid outfit." Lucky McSwervy

"~ya don't GET old by being weak & stupid!" - Airtwardo

[keithbar 1]

don't get me wrong I'm not saying a distinction should be made. it's just that in my own head I never think of myself in those terms when I was in basic training after 6 weeks of being confined to the barracks nobody had been off post or seen a television or newspaper the drill instructors called us into a classroom told US President Jimmy Carter had declared war on Cuba we're all going to have our mos changed to 11 bravo. and be sent to Fort Benning Georgia for an accelerated 2 week infantry training course.and could expect to be fighting on the front lines in under a month I was a 18 year old punk kid and they were grown men around me cry like babies I raise my hand when one of the sergeants cold on me I said sarge I don't want to go to war but if I have to. can i request a transfer to a real infantry company? because I don't want to have to go to war with these pussy S. O.B.'s around me. one of the drill inst. pull me aside and rold me he liked that answer. and let me in on the joke while they let the other guys squirm a little longer I bet they couldn't get away with playing that joke today. somebody would say they had mentally damaged of them. or some such shit.

i have on occasion been accused of pulling low . My response. Naw I wasn't low I'm just such a big guy I look closer than I really am .

[Boomerdog 0]

You served four years and upon your separation from the service, you were provided a DD Form 214. YOU ARE A VETERAN!

[oldwomanc6 38]

wolfriverjoe

If you signed the contract, took the oath & put on the uniform, you are a veteran.

+1

lisa
WSCR 594
FB 1023
CBDB 9

[skymama 35]

Quote

If you signed the contract, took the oath & put on the uniform, you are a veteran.

+1 for me too.

I respect anyone who signs that contract to potentially sacrifice their life for the benefit of others. If it was an easy decision to make, we'd all do it. It's courageous to sign up to be in the military. Thanks to all who do!

She is Da Man, and you better not mess with Da Man,
because she will lay some keepdown on you faster than, well, really fast. ~Billvon

[JerryBaumchen 1,048]

Hi joe,

Quote

agreed to go get shot at if ordered to.

I cannot tell you word for word what the oath was ( in Dec '59 ) but I do remember the part about 'giving your life in defense of your country.' I do remember hesitating just a little before I repeated it.



Jerry Baumchen

[keithbar 1]

I'm not saying i shouldn't think of myself in those terms. I just don't. it's one of my weird quirks i guess. i think of myself as a medical professional. a nurse. a skydiver. a hunter. a archer. a fisherman. when i was married for 11 years i thought of myself as a father. when i helped raise jessica from 3 years old to 14. but now 10 years later she is 24 and i haven't even seen her since she was 14. i guess I will never be able to think of myself as grandpa. although i may be for all i know.

i have on occasion been accused of pulling low . My response. Naw I wasn't low I'm just such a big guy I look closer than I really am .

[D22369 0]

you took the oath, you served, you could have been called up at any time.

your a veteran whether it was in peacetime or during war.


Roy

They say I suffer from insanity.... But I actually enjoy it.

[JWest 0]

As someone who did a tour in afghan and didn't fire a single bullet or get directly shot at I don't like being thanked for my service. I didn't do anything and I'm not special. I would prefer to be left alone. Now WWII vets fox example did something worth thanking them for. I'm also the kind of person that will respect ribbons way before I respect rank.

[BillyVance 34]

IMO the real heroes are the ones that actually did something but won't take credit for it and prefer to be left alone.

We'll just give them their due respect nonetheless.

My godfather served two tours in Vietnam in artillery. One day in a convoy of troop-carrying trucks, he watched a young Viet boy run up to the truck in front of his and lob something into it. Everybody on that truck started to panic before BOOOM! Blood and body parts everywhere. His words were "War Is Hell"

Now he is 80 and I couldn't be any prouder of him. He served for years as a missionary to state inmates at Holman Prison at Atmore, AL, including death row inmates, until his health no longer permitted him to do so.

"Mediocre people don't like high achievers, and high achievers don't like mediocre people." - SIX TIME National Champion coach Nick Saban

[GD64 1]

keithbar........No one gives a fuck if you have a body count or not. A lot of that is "wrong place, wrong time!" You did your time in "the big green machine" and hopefully got out of it relatively intact. You're a VET!!

[rifleman 61]

IMO, a Veteran is anyone who swore the oath and effectively signed a cheque made payable to "My Country" and in the amount wrote in "Up to and including my life."

Atheism is a Non-Prophet Organisation

[theonlyski 3]

Anyone who has served honorably is a veteran in my eyes.

I was never directly shot at (a few IDF attacks that didn't land near me) over my 3 tours in Iraq, but like someone above said, many of the people who have been shot at/doing the shooting have been wrong place, wrong time (with some exceptions of people actively going out looking for trouble). Given how often I was moving by air or ground, and to the nature of the locations I was at, I'm actually a little surprised I never got engaged.

I know a few guys that were 'let go' from the military. One for possessing and distributing child porn, at least one or two more for just shitty attitudes and such. I do not consider them veterans.

The military wasn't a hard job as far as doing your job all the time. 90% of E-4 and below just have to be at the right place, at the right time, in the right uniform (that they gave you), doing the right thing with the right attitude. The hardest part was the physical demand and psychological issues that come up due to where you're at, what you're doing and why you're doing it.

"I may be a dirty pirate hooker...but I'm not about to go stand on the corner." iluvtofly
DPH -7, TDS 578, Muff 5153, SCR 14890
I'm an asshole, and I approve this message

[normiss 622]

They GAVE you uniforms???
I had to buy mine!

[Rick 67]

normiss

They GAVE you uniforms???
I had to buy mine!

right that was a bill I never expected after boot camp

You can't be drunk all day if you don't start early!

[BIGUN 1,055]

I was in before you and long after you got out.

You were in during the height of the Cold War. You have any idea the threat of nuclear engagement going on at that time? I do. Until 1977; I was on a nuclear base in Germany as an Nuclear Operations & Intel Sergeant. Not a week went by that we didn't raise the missiles. Exercise or real shit? We didn't know until the missiles got put back in the barn.

It was one of the most tumultuous times in our history and you signed up for it. The only reason you may not "feel" like a vet is because the "Cold War Medal" has been killed numerous times over the past 20 years.

But, you served while this was going on... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cold_War_%281979%E2%80%9385%29

Yes, you are a Veteran. And, you served during a time that fear kept peace. You were a part of that peace. And, as the sign entering into Ft. Lewis states, "Our Job is Peace." Know that you helped get the job done.

Wear the title of Veteran proudly.

Nobody has time to listen; because they're desperately chasing the need of being heard.

[Rick 67]

BIGUN

I was in before you and long after you got out.

You were in during the height of the Cold War. You have any idea the threat of nuclear engagement going on at that time? I do. Until 1977; I was on a nuclear base in Germany as an Nuclear Operations & Intel Sergeant. Not a week went by that we didn't raise the missiles. Exercise or real shit? We didn't know until the missiles got put back in the barn.

It was one of the most tumultuous times in our history and you signed up for it. The only reason you may not "feel" like a vet is because the "Cold War Medal" has been killed numerous times over the past 20 years.

But, you served while this was going on... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cold_War_%281979%E2%80%9385%29

Yes, you are a Veteran. And, you served during a time that fear kept peace. You were a part of that peace. And, as the sign entering into Ft. Lewis states, "Our Job is Peace." Know that you helped get the job done.

Wear the title of Veteran proudly.

I was on active duty from '77-'81 no official conflicts going on but we sure had the F-4's loaded for bear on alert a lot when we were dealing with Gaddafi or shadowing the soviet fleet around the Med

I can't join the VFW (no W's at the time) but I certainly consider myself a veteran

You can't be drunk all day if you don't start early!

[mattjw916 2]

Times change. Our "enemies" that we trained to fight aren't the ones being encountered now.

I managed to completely miss every major conflict during my active duty time or be stationed on the other side of the world when anything remotely interesting was happening. /shrug

We still managed to lose a bunch of people to training and traffic accidents and suicide on a consistent basis so it wasn't all fun and games versus civilian life.

NSCR-2376, SCR-15080

[theonlyski 3]

normiss

They GAVE you uniforms???
I had to buy mine!

I got 4 sets of BDUs in basic and ended up buying a set of ACUs when I got to my unit (as that's what everyone else was wearing).

Before each deployment, they gave us 4 more sets of ACUs (I think). 3 deployments in 5 years means we ended up with enough uniforms to open a small surplus shop.

"I may be a dirty pirate hooker...but I'm not about to go stand on the corner." iluvtofly
DPH -7, TDS 578, Muff 5153, SCR 14890
I'm an asshole, and I approve this message

[normiss 622]

Navy Fleet Reserve?













(they have a bar down the street from the Camp House)

[keithbar 1]

I guess "my war " would have been Grenada. but the 82nd handled that without it needing the help of the 101st

i have on occasion been accused of pulling low . My response. Naw I wasn't low I'm just such a big guy I look closer than I really am .

[jackwallace 3]

If you want to feel like a vet, help take care of the new vets. Go up to them at the airport or anywhere you meet them. Shake their hand, look them in the eye and tell them thanks for serving. Then tell them to get in the VA system as soon as they get out.

U only make 2 jumps: the first one for some weird reason and the last one that you lived through. The rest are just filler.
scr 316

[shotandahalf 0]

I too was in during the cold war. I spent two years at a front line fighter base in Germany. Even though I was never shot at I do consider myself a Veteran. I have much respect for anyone who has put on a uniform, and being a Patriot Guard member I have had the Privilege to stand in Honor of many Veterans, past and present.

[Boomerdog 0]

Quote

But it was peace time.

I confess to the "cherry pick" of the sentence but I won't use it out of context.

I would suggest prudence in the use of "peace time" during that time is misleading. It was a war, a Cold War where two superpowers of different ideologies squared off with a bunch of nuclear weapons threatening to destroy each other and the rest of the world. It was a war in the shadows where many died but no one talked.

The B-52's, the land based missiles, and the Boomers out on sea patrol weren't there for s#!ts and grins. I think (just my opinion mind you) that the only reason both sides did use a considerable amount of restraint was that both sides knew the stakes and that they loved their children more than they hated each other. The Soviets were also sobered by the fact that they lost 30 - 60 million people during WWII.

To the personal side, while I've previously addressed an important part of the legal definition of a Veteran, there's a personal side with respect to values and mindset.

Your'e not alone in thinking and mindset. I put 22 years in. Big whoop! In the balance, I enjoyed all of those years. Like a vast majority of Vets, the values of selflessness, service, and discipline are as much a part of me today as when I was in. It gets ingrained and does not go away and so it becomes a part of day to day living which we see as routine and not particularly special. Like many other Vets, it's what I chose; no one forced my hand. I would imagine that the same you learned and experienced in those four years of your service has stayed with you as well. The fact that you may or may not have engaged in combat ops is no the issue. You like I were small parts of a larger strategy. We did what we did simply because it was the job we were given.

In his book, "America" Alistair Cooke looks at the American Soldier from the context of the Minuteman...the Citizen Soldier who keeps the rifle at the ready and answers the call but when the fight is over, returns to civilian life picking up where they left off. George Washington said something similar, "When I assumed the citizen, I did not lay aside the soldier."

We did our jobs, kept the faith and now a younger generation replaces us to take up the mantle.
Take a step back and think about it...VETERAN.

P.S. Now don't go thinking too much about what is already self evident; it's time to skydive!