hallux

billvon dont kid yourself. The relevance of this site has been diminished. 4 out of the top 10 topics are ASC or skyride related, you dont have to be obsessed to see it. you merely have to click on general skydiving.

this is great! this whole site should be renamed "about a half dozen people that are obsessed with ASC.Com" Wasnt this site suppose to be the most reliable source for skydiving info??? But really its just a mudslinging outlet. there are more conspiracy theories about ASC, skyride, and its employers or contractors then there are about D.B. Cooper. this place is a laugh riot. And a laughing stock for the sport. when did DZ.com become reduced to this....how embarassing.........

once again you miss the point completely and are describing totally different scenarios then the one at hand. first of all we arent talking about relying on RSL's we are talking about knowing 100 percent sure your reserve is out before you were able to pull the handle. No one is advocating waiting on a RSL. I swear i think you readers have your heads up your butt most of the time. If you dont know what a parachute over your head feels like then you SHOULD go in! ITs the big rectangular thing above your head for those that dont know. anyone that assumes the reserve came out due to a RsL but is still in freefall and doesnt ever pull a handle or look is a dumbass that should have gone in. In no way on any universe is what I was talking about a "good way to have one of those unexplained no-pull fatalities" Its impossible to have one of those fatalities when a huge reserve is over your head. Which is the exact situation we are describing. NO where in any of the OP or my post have we described a situation of relying on a RSL. Why is this picture so hard to paint for you guys? It seems simple enough.....This is not a RSL depencency thread!!!!! Every topic on here gets twisted like this because you guys have to be eager to thrust your knowledge and safety advice on everyone whether its relevant or not. Jesus!!!!!

all these responses and not a single person has addressed the question. everyone is too busy trying to show off, jumping to conclusions and enforcing generic general knowledge. the question is if your reserve is already out, then whats the point of pulling the handle and how does that relate to muscle memory. anyone who jumps tandems with a skyhook for any amount of time has probably eperienced this scenario. spinning mal, cutaway, by the time you feel "stable" and you are about to pull you get stood up by the reserve. Now whats the point of pulling of the handle? That is the question he is asking. Quit frankly its useless! It will do nothing and will not effect your muscle memory at all. More than likely your hand was already on the handle and your muscle memory response has already taken place. At this point you are now acting on cognitive decision making and not muscle memory. If you are aware your reserve is out and you decide to go ahead and pull the handle for the hell of it then that is not muscle memory! or a huge part of muscle memory building. That is a calm calculated decision and will do nothing but give you one more handle to keep up with while you fly your reserve. Always go for the handle but if you get beat by the skyhook then accept your defeat and leave your handle stowed. Bill boothe wins again bitch.

haha no prob OG. and DSE...do you really think i was talking about PT's to break a camera off.....thats funny. I meant pt's to get familiar with your helmets cutaway system. I mean if you are wearing it and might have to use it someday then dont you think you should have good muscle memory to find it? And yes I am somewhat being a smartass. Personally I have C4 rigged to my arms, legs and neck. That way if any of THE BIGGEST SNAG HAZZARDS become entangled i can cut them away. Also I staple the leg of student jumpsuits to their butts so that no tandem passenger legs can get in the way of my drogue. And yes i do enjoy arguing with you. Im not even sure what we are arguing about anymore, nor do I care. It is a good way to keep you talking and active in here though, which is entertaining for me. Also i enjoy your snobbish views and oversaturated opinion on really simple issues. Comical at times...Basically your experience and relationship with the camera/grip/tech world has skewed your ability to see things from the "normal" consumers view. Therefore this VASST experience has rendered most of your advice useless to the everyday skydiving videographer. When we need to put 25lbs of crap on a FTP and shoot a major motion picture then your advice will surely be helpful. The reality is that the normal consumer would be totally happy with GoPro quality footage. I know you have a wealth of tech knowledge but sometimes the simpler the better. Now lets talk snag hazzards. I dont think someone should be allowed to jump a helmet at all until 100 jumps because the helmet itself is a snag hazzard. And having to keep up with it and remember to buckle it is a distraction. At 150 jumps someone can add camera mount to the helmet...no camera just the mount. FOr they are not nearly ready for the risk of entaglement that a camera poses, nor the immense distraction and stress. Now with 50 more jumps they are certainly qualified to handle the camera. but only one because we dont want to get carried away. I say at 300 jumps now two cameras can be added because now they are totally able to predict snag hazzards and handle the situation like PRO's. They are also totally undistracted by it now. YOu know because they have 300 jumps and thats what matters, not the fact that it is something new for them. As far as that little 3M death trap of a GoPro....well it should be totally banned from this sport for its inmeasurable risk and incompatibility with HMA, spectra, and all modern line types. And worst of all we wouldnt want the FTP to get a complex or self esteem issues over its "small package". what are your views on the appropriate time to start jumping cameras? what makes someone mentally ready for it? And dont try to confuse and dazzle us with a sideshow of tech talk you sneaky spotted eagle.

this logic is very sound and well said. I agree with you 100 percent. I suggest doing PT's for your helmet cutaway system also

stabilizing cameras on the ground and stabilizing cameras on someones head in freefall is like comparing apples to oranges. Would you add 18lbs to your helmet? FTP have positives as far as points of movement but they are also very non-aerodynamic in many position which creates more shake either induced by the wind or by the force one must apply to maintain head position. And the burble effect is on any helmet. smaller burble on smaller helmet but thats ok if you have a smalller camera. Its all relative. If you are head down or even on your back then the burble is no longer in play. I'm not going to argue that you get what you pay for with cameras, because its true. The issue is that its not worth it for the pay scale of tandem videos. All day with with large prosumer cameras and DSLR's...then all the negative health risk....not worth it! and the weight of the person in a base has nothing to do with stability it has to do with speed. but I get your point. wind resistance is another issue. I stuck my head out of a plane once with a FTP and big camera. It was the worst shakiest crap ever. If it had been a GoPro on a round helmet it would of looked great. TOO much surface area. as far as your GoPro mount pictures.....well thats comical. IF the mount was secured responsibly and intelligently then that would not happen. Also I would be willing to bet that in a unstable back deployment that line would pull completely underneath that mount. Was that a recreation? or a real incident? If real what was the situation that caused it. Simply using the 3M sticky is ignorant for alot of reasons. every piece of gear is a snag hazzard theoretically, even your appendages. Some risks come with this stuff that we do. I think my stance on this is that there are different tools for different jobs and to me jumping big cameras for tandem videos is ridiculous and jumping small cameras and giant helmets is not neccessary. The FTP is a great helmet but not needed to shoot good video. And snag hazzard is a term that is too loosely used

well I disagree with the stabilizing platform theory. You dont need a giant fluid head to stabilize a small camera on the ground. But a giant camera on a undersized fluid head is useless. I feel the same about helmets. if your helmet fits right then a small helmet for small cameras is fine. Once again lets keep in mind the need of the average video flyer. I'm not talking about shooting a hollywood big budget movie here. true the metering and quality on cheaper cameras isnt as good but for the everyday consumer they will never notice or complain. It certainly isnt different enough to be considered unacceptable for the money they paid for the product. Lets keep in mind the investment and health risk for the skydiving videographer. I dont blame you for taking file format into consideration. Actually that is your most reasonable point when talking about the everyday videographer. Workflow is a very valid concern. I'm not going to argue over which model of litepanel you use. Yes they range from reasonable to very expensive. that wasnt my point, that was a random example. I am looking at my GoPro mount now and I assure you that it would take an act of God to get a line between it and the helmet, its such a ridiculous possibility that it seems stupid to be talking about it. Its certainly way less likely than snagging anything on that living room table called a FTP. And dont think Im discounting the FTP, Im not! If you need real estate then it is great. (lights, strobes, prosumer cameras, multiple cameras, etc....) But for the everyday video guy for normal consumer cameras it is not neccessary. Lets talk stabilization....What is stabilization in freefall? Why would a FTP be more stable? The only thing that makes it more stable is that it large sturdy tight fitting helmet, basically it balances heavy loads better absorbing vibration. And provides realestate to evenly mount your accessories. True if you are shooting tightly zoomed cameras the FTP might be a better platform. Otherwise it is not needed to shoot "stable" video. The key to stability is tight fitting helmet to prevent shuddering. If the helmet is appropriately loaded and fits tight it will not shudder. The mounts used have alot to do with this as well. Finally, one of the biggest factors is body orientation. how is the camera being presented to the wind. Of course I forgot the most important thing...you are always right. You might have a load of tech knowledge and experience but I think you relate it to skydiving poorly. you do have a huge ego though.....which is totally skydiver

excellent reply rhys, DSE is a video professional and too him owning super high end cameras is no big deal. THe issue here is that for a tandem video those big cameras are overkill! and the only reason you need a FTP to stabilize a camera is if the camera ways several pounds. A FTP is not needed to stabilize small cameras. I own a FTP with a canon XH-A1 mounted on it. Completely stupid to jump that for tandem videos. To tell the truth the quality difference in good lighting is hardly noticeable. Now if its sunset and you want to mount a 700 dollar litpanel to it and shoot badass video in the dark, then yes it is awesome. Otherwise its only good for trying to show off. Its really a pain in the ass to deal with too. I dont know why anyone would want to jump it regularly other than to try to market themselves as something "special". As far as snag hazzards go....that is total B.S. Hell your arms and legs are snag hazzards! what are you going to do?....cut them off or tape them to your body? If a line goes around your head then you were in bad shape already. Deploying on your back? Yes a unusual situation can happen but that is a risk you need to be able to accept when you skydive. Any situation that presents snag hazzards for your helmet also presents snag hazzards for everything else on your body. Also a FTP with all kinds of shit on top of it is one of the biggest snag hazzards I can imagine.....if you care about that kind of stuff. The GoPro breaks away easily and Mine is mounted flush with the helmet so I have no idea how a line could get between the mount and the helmet???? Bottom line...the snag hazzard term is overused! Its become a generic deterrent for video set ups. The truth is that every camera poses a equal snag hazzard because the situations that cause snags are so extraordinary and unpredictable that no one can foresee how said situation will play out or how the lines are going to be presented to the cameras(angle,direction,force,etc). way too many variables exist in the unusual deployment orientations that would leave one vunerable to a snag. Under normal deployment there should be no hazzard of dangerous snagging.

who is using the gopro without the housing? and how are you securing it?

i didnt see where Stephen fincher was involved in waverly politics. Also how did you come to the conclusion the fincher(on here) is his nephew? where exactly are you getting this info? Are you personally involved or are just making this stuff up?

hillarious! first of all the ASPCA had nothing to do with it and no one showed up looking for a donation! Also no customers were asked to donate money and none did. So apparently maybe you should have been there to actually know what the hell you are talking about. All that was made up by you guys. Classic. I especially like the part where you guys claimed we threw cats out the airplane and even a live squirrel. That was pretty funny.

exactly Keith! To me a internet forum is just a place to poke harmless fun and joke around. Unfortunately some people like to use them to be hateful. Make no mistake ...my post are purely in fun. I am curious who exactly the criminals are though?? That one is really funny

cat aids was a harmless boogie. If you can prove where anyone got scammed I would love too see it. YOu know nothing about it you werent there. You invented the "scam" in your head. Calling everyone at a DZ criminals is a pretty bold claim and only further shows your true personality. I'm sure that everyone is going to believe that a whole DZ is full of evil horrible people........yea right. Of course they dont like you...look how you have treated them. ANd all because you dont like the owner. I think the real issue is that you hate people with MS. Maybe you dont like those family members so now you support MS??? Not sure. All I know is that you need help and that your obsession is border line psychotic. Quite frankly its scary.

^ | | | out of his mind. also the guy that tried to stop a muscular sclerosis fundraiser....what kind of jerk tries to stop a MS fundraiser? I guess the kind that hates people with MS?? I mean thats the only reason I can come up with.

wow did you really read 170+ post then do the math?? Im honored. And it wasnt a personal attack it was simply a fact. Nothing personal about it. I like you and I would never attack you personally. Just wanted to point out that trying to be serious and posting here makes you way less credible. The skydiving community pretty much considers this place a joke. Its only a select few people that think thier opinions are important enough that the world needs to hear them. If no one listens to you in real life then you can come here and impress some stranger or new jumper

wow! Tk hayes preaching about FAR's. Now thats F'in hillarious! where was your regard for FAR's when you were flying those jumpers illegally? HAHA. God you are like the TV evangelist of FAR's. YOu should get a little stage set up at the DZ and you can preach to all the old people about FAR's while you pass a collection plate for the "spectator" fee. Hope you know this is in fun and Im just messing with you but I really cant believe you post on here. especially about THAT. YOu totally set yourself up. I bet your pretty face is red as hell when you read this. HAHA wish i could see it. You are so cute when enraged with hatred. love you T.K. but seriously, posting here just makes a little less cool

thank you! you made my point with this 99% of skydiving websites do the same thing. Start does indeed serve those areas and has jumpers that travel much further than those cities listed every single weekend.

are these people part of the scam? from all the websites I would say so. I also heard the owner was a federal criminal that ripped a bunch of people off bigtime. "We proudly serve the Skydive Cincinnati, Skydive Columbus, Skydive Dayton, Skydive Cleveland, Skydive Lexington, Skydive Louisville, Skydive Indianapolis areas. We want to take you on your first skydive Tandem Parachute Jump or Accelerated Freefall Skydiving for people who wish to make their first parachute jump. There is no better place to learn to Skydive Ohio, Skydive Kentucky or Skydive Indiana than Start Skydiving Ohio."

Quote from the site _________________________________________________ 'A Gift Certificate Company based in Kennesaw, Ga. that operates under the names of Adventure Skydiving Tennessee, ASC, 1 800 Skyride, Adventure Sports or Thrill Planet has been running websites and internet advertising claiming to offer Skydiving in each and every city and state in America and the Skydiving Center in Waverly, Tn. is part of this scam. " _________________________________________________ Reads like waverly doesnt exist and wrongfully calls them a scam. another quote _________________________________________________ 1 800 Skyride uses the names of major cities and claim to have a Skydive center in the city that their websites are advertising to be located in. The truth is that there is NO skydiving in any major city in America, It's ILLEGAL! The only skydives that happen in the city are skydiving teams jumping in to a major event like a Pro Football game or a NASCAR racing event etc. Those are professional skydivers and are definitely NOT first timers. Normally, Skydive Centers are located 30 to 75 miles from the major city. The 1 800 Skyride/Adventure websites do not give their location and they will not normally tell you where they are until they have your credit card information. __________________________________________________ waverly is 30-75 miles from Nashville and once again makes it sound like no skydiving from this company is available in the nashville area. _________________________________________________ another quote "These charges in combination with the cost of the actual skydive and your travel including a hotel room in Cedartown, Ga. (Atlanta area) could cost you well over $500 to $700 for a skydiving trip that should not have cost over about $200 to $290. (This is if you choose the video). 1 800 Skyride also uses names like Nashville Skydiving or Skydive Nashville to hide their actual location, be advised that this is against _________________________________________________ once again implies that no skydiving exist around nashville. So how does being 30-75 miles from Nashville and offering prices exactly in the range that you listed constitute a scam?

understanding what? sounded like a reading comprehension drill. YOu made this way more difficult than necessary and quite frankly.... silly. You need to understand K.I.S.S. and yes the math is relatively simple and also completely uneccessary. Along with most everything else. The real answer is still that morons exited a plane over a balloon that they mistook as a 2500ft water tower that suddenly popped up next to the DZ. understanding is good, the best way to do that is to get to the point. So whats the groundspeed in KNOTS and was 11 secs a correct seperation? excuse me...was 990ft correct? and what was the age of the girl and on a scale of 1-10 how loose was she? and if her speed is relative to the wind then how does that affect her cock blowing speed? I'm guessing for this convoluted scenario that it was 10 in/sec. Keep in mind that one knot is equal to about 1.5 inches of cock per second.

better an AAD not fire and kill someone that put themself in that position, than have an AAD fire in a airplane with the door open and take down the whole load. Bottom line.....If a AAD fails to fire then it simply failed to save you from a already fatal situation. If a AAD fires unexpectantly and crashes a plane..then it KILLED YOU.....big difference than failing to save you. VIGIL=bad choice

thanks for the ridiculous word problem...Is this part of the USPA's new testing procedure. I certainly hope we have Texas instrument calculators by the door of the otter so we can figure this shit out before exit. God I would love to hear the argument of all the egomaniacs at the door. The real answer to the question is anyone that thinks a ballon is a water tower is a moron. especially at your home DZ. And especially two 4 way teams! nice math problem but couldnt you just tell us whether or not 11 sec is enough seperation for a plane with 90ft/sec groundspeed? I would rather just hear the answer than wade through a pool of convoluted BS. And know we need to convert 90ft/sec to MPH and also knots. Because no pilot I have ever asked gave me his groundspeed in ft/sec. I can only imagine the confusion that answer would cause on the plane. I mean seriously if you are going to give an equation then at least make it relatable and use terms and measurement increments that skydivers can actually relate to and process. Oh yea I especially like where the balloon pilot is tracking the otter with laser range finders and calculating his speed in ft/sec........You could of just given the speed of the otter in KNOTS and skipped all the drama and conversions.

that was one of the best spoof threads I have ever read. Hillarious. I cant believe that 10 people voted no.

gay! is this a skydiving site or a sensitive hearts forum where we share poetry and our inner fag feelings haha