kevin922 0 #1 June 15, 2004 I saw a email come across about the boogie in AZ (the wingsuit boogie) Just curious how many people are actually planning on doing this. Cost: $1164.87 (cash price, $1199.81 for credit) plus $15.00 registration for the boogie, this includes 6 jumps a day for 6 days (36 jumps) plus wingsuit instruction. So if you break it down, 36 jumps @ 15.00 jump = 540.00 + 15.00 boogie fee =555.00 -1164.87 = $609.87 for instruction. BTW this is a non refundable ticket event meaning you get crap weather one day you're out 6 jumps and this is a 3 students per 1 instructor ratio as well... So if you just show up and want to fly wingsuit, are you stuck doing it with whoever is not participating in the boogie I guess? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SkymonkeyONE 3 #2 June 15, 2004 Kevin, that is less than $16 per jump for fully coached/debriefed skydives. Do you know how much people pay for top-rate freefly coaching? Try $75 per jump. The package cost for the "campers" pays for a lot of things in the overall scheme of things. When putting together "proper" camps and boogies, organizers must calculate their up-front total cost for getting the right instructors/coaches/organizers there then all the other "fluff." (T-shirts, chow, beer, etc). If you think I am going to ride a bicycle to Eloy, AZ and then sleep on the floor of the bunkhouse, then you are sadly mistaken. Remember, this is my real job. Chuck Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kevin922 0 #3 June 15, 2004 QuoteKevin, that is less than $16 per jump for fully coached/debriefed skydives. Do you know how much people pay for top-rate freefly coaching? Try $75 per jump. The package cost for the "campers" pays for a lot of things in the overall scheme of things. When putting together "proper" camps and boogies, organizers must calculate their up-front total cost for getting the right instructors/coaches/organizers there then all the other "fluff." (T-shirts, chow, beer, etc). If you think I am going to ride a bicycle to Eloy, AZ and then sleep on the floor of the bunkhouse, then you are sadly mistaken. Remember, this is my real job. Chuck Forgive me for not understanding, but how is that less than 16.00 a jump? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PhreeZone 15 #4 June 15, 2004 At about $35 per jump it might be worth it for some people. But at a 3 to 1 ratio I have to wonder just how much debrief there will be if the flock gets seperation. That one person that wondered off a flock (expecially beginners) might not get any attention on a dive unless there are a few video angles. Chuck, could you give some details on how the coaching format will work in situations like that? It looked like all the same skill levels were going to be kept together till the end of the day in which there would be a mass flock with all groups. How are the beginners that hold a very loose flock going to be coached on a 1-1 basis?Yesterday is history And tomorrow is a mystery Parachutemanuals.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bbarnhouse 0 #5 June 15, 2004 The price also includes 1 meal per day and lodging. The $15 registration is for the Halloween Boogie and includes...free beer! To answer the initial question...the BRITS are coming..the Brits are coming...and the Germans... This is also intended to get recognition from the FAI and possibly a World record at some point down the road. What would a 3 day Airspeed camp cost ya? Twice as much and wouldn't include a meal, nor lodging. SkymonkeyOne, Jari, Lou and I all thought it a good value. But hey...regular coaching in most places will cost ya $75 per jump QuoteBTW this is a non refundable ticket event meaning you get crap weather one day you're out 6 jumps and this is a 3 students per 1 instructor ratio as well... No...it means that you can upgrade the tickets and use them ,or save them for the future...like..Holiday Boogie? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kevin922 0 #6 June 15, 2004 Ah.. ok I musta skipped the lodging & meals bit. Much better deal now that this has been clarified. Flockon Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SkymonkeyONE 3 #7 June 15, 2004 QuoteForgive me for not understanding, but how is that less than 16.00 a jump? What I mean is that you are only paying $16 per jump for the coaching (on top of the averaged cost per slot). Once again, I challenge you to find first-rate instruction/coaching in freefly or competition RW for that price. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
The111 0 #8 June 15, 2004 QuoteWhat I mean is that you are only paying $16 per jump for the coaching (on top of the averaged cost per slot). Once again, I challenge you to find first-rate instruction/coaching in freefly or competition RW for that price. Slightly off topic, and I'm not arguing with you (since tunnel does not equal sky), but for non WS coaching I personally think the tunnel beats all. Note I haven't even RECEIVED any tunnel instruction, and only a few coached skydives, but as you pointed out the average cost for a coached skydive is 400% the price of a non-coached skydive (~$72 vs ~$18). Tunnel coaching, on the other hand, 125% the price of non-coached tunnel time ($750/hr vs $600/hr). Considering all this, I don't know why anyone would choose sky coaching over tunnel coaching (the only downside if tunnel prices are much better in large time quantities).www.WingsuitPhotos.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bbarnhouse 0 #9 June 15, 2004 Quotethe only downside if tunnel prices are much better in large time quantities). Well since you went off topic and havent flown in a tunnel...wingsuits in a tunnel..hummmmmm Our tunnel will be operational this fall, and one more reason to go to Eloy. Now back to the topic at hand. This is an opportunity to learn with the bomb diggety of wingsuit flyers. My statement would be instead of looking for reasons why not...look for the reason why to! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
The111 0 #10 June 15, 2004 QuoteWell since you went off topic and havent flown in a tunnel...wingsuits in a tunnel..hummmmmm You know I wasn't implying WS in tunnel, right? I was referring to the price of freefall coaching, which is off-topic as I admitted. Too, I have flown in tunnels (not WS!). (non-traditional grammar courtesy of Arlo) More off topic: WS in tunnel *has* been done. www.WingsuitPhotos.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kevin922 0 #11 June 15, 2004 Quote More off topic: WS in tunnel *has* been done. yes if I recall correctly it involved someone holding the flyers feet and the flyer flying up and hitting the side of the wall constantly :) It would take some skill to fly a wingsuit in a tunnel, but that skill isn't the same as flying a wingsuit... thus it's pointless :) i'm talking about vertical tunnels, aircraft tunnels like they've used to test wingsuits are a different beast. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bbarnhouse 0 #12 June 15, 2004 QuoteNote I haven't even RECEIVED any tunnel instruction I have flown in tunnels Quote My bad I took it to mean that you hadn't been in one. I do believe that ws in a tunnel has happened. but as I recall it didnt go very well. Back to your regularly scheduled topic. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Deuce 1 #13 June 16, 2004 Good lord Bets, you are so sweet. A vertical tunnel will be worthless for wingsuit. It was dynamite for RW and FF training, though. I am REALLY looking forward to the Eloy tunnel. The Perris tunnel is just the bomb. I'd like to get Bets vertical with me horizontal in there. It was great watching Eli with Tony doing that. Wingsuits will need a horizontal or maybe 45 degree tunnel for training. Niche market. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bbarnhouse 0 #14 June 16, 2004 I have a couple of bomb diggety photos that Gasson took of me and the Diamond. Dude...the stuff ya can do when you think about it. I'm looking forward to flying with him. With what we have accomplished thus far...it should prove to be mighty interesting. Now...lets get that flock on in October! X's and O's B2 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ManBird 0 #15 June 16, 2004 QuoteWingsuits will need a horizontal or maybe 45 degree tunnel for training. 22° http://www.deepart.org/code/CountTracula/"¯"`-._.-¯) ManBird (¯-._.-´"¯" Click Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Deuce 1 #16 June 16, 2004 I need an additional 23 degrees when I have my 11 pound flash/dig/vid setup on Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ManBird 0 #17 June 16, 2004 QuoteI need an additional 23 degrees when I have my 11 pound flash/dig/vid setup on No, you need a spare neck."¯"`-._.-¯) ManBird (¯-._.-´"¯" Click Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
VectorBoy 0 #18 June 16, 2004 Hey people, I may be mistaken but is the skills camp a mandatory precurser to the winsuit part of the boogie? I assumed that one could attend just the boogie portion, No? please get clarification about this out as several people have been asking me about that. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kevin922 0 #19 June 16, 2004 Quote Hey people, I may be mistaken but is the skills camp a mandatory precurser to the winsuit part of the boogie? I assumed that one could attend just the boogie portion, No? please get clarification about this out as several people have been asking me about that. On FBM.com, it appears the "boogie" is actually only 2 days, it's the halloween boogie I believe.. the skills camp is the week long thing which requires the cha-ching. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
VectorBoy 0 #20 June 16, 2004 I was under the impression that the campo was ONLY 2 intensive and fun days, after which everyone at the boogie could flock together. I could see where someone would want to work on their skills if they are not that current or get comfortable with a larger flock if they don't have this opertunity to fly with others at their home DZ. Or in the case of someone having all of the above wanting to fly with a pilot who has 2,000 + wingsuit jumps to take them to the next level. But I really need to know if the skills camp is an all exclusivo situation lasting the whole 6 days and separate from the jumpers that will just be attending the boogie and only have the weekend to play. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bbarnhouse 0 #21 June 16, 2004 QuoteI was under the impression that the campo was ONLY 2 intensive and fun days, after which everyone at the boogie could flock together. The skills camp is 2 days which is prior to the BirdMan Boogie. The costs were formulated on the entire stay and includes the camp and boogie. If you want to come out for the Halloween Boogie you are most welcome to do so. It is intended to be exclusive...BUT we want to be inclusive...so bring it on! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
LouDiamond 1 #22 July 14, 2004 QuoteBut at a 3 to 1 ratio I have to wonder just how much debrief there will be if the flock gets seperation. Point of clarification since this seems to have confused at least one person. An instructor will be jumping with 1 of his 3 assigned students, 1 on 1, per jump on the dives that require it. The grouping and flock dives will all be built apon slowly based on the individuals/groups overall ability. First you must crawl, walk and then run. Each student will be debriefed on their individual and group dives. What this means is that Instructors are going to have very busy days during the skills camp but in no way will the level of coaching be allowed to suffer, everyone will be properly debriefed after their dive. However, getting video dubs from camera equipt instructors may have to wait until the end of the day in some cases. Of special note: Jari, myself and Chuck and the other BMCI's will be using the skills camp/Boogie and other Birdman events as an opportunity to evaluate those people who have the skills necessary for an upcoming(date /time/location undetermined still) invitational meet where the overall goal is FAI recognition and ultimately sanctioning of Wingsuits as a recognized skydiving discipline. This event is still being organized and clarification/specifics on FAI requirements are being researched at this time. An official announcement will be made by Birdman Inc. when all the details have been worked out."It's just skydiving..additional drama is not required" Some people dream about flying, I live my dream SKYMONKEY PUBLISHING Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ikenever 1 #23 July 15, 2004 www.fai.org/sporting_code/sc5.pdf Pay some current FAI judges to help write the Synopsis, provisions, judging training, rules, safety and scoring for each event. After your committee or council drafts the event give it to your hired judges and have them score it. Their experience is knowledge... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
LouDiamond 1 #24 August 31, 2004 BUMP to remind everyone that this date is getting closer and the contingent from accross the sea is bring a lot of birds with them.Don't be disappointed, register before it's full. For more detailed info you can check SDA web site HERE"It's just skydiving..additional drama is not required" Some people dream about flying, I live my dream SKYMONKEY PUBLISHING Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guana 0 #25 August 31, 2004 I tried to inquire back on the 4th of August , when it was first posted, and was told that instructors would have to be checked with. I was excited at the concept of learnig from the best. Then I was told I would be recontacted about it by the 16th. Still never heard anything so I figured it was full or not happening. When coming from another country arrangments have to be made way ahead of time for tickets, time off etc. Its now almost a month later and I see possibly there are slots open and you are encouraging others to book early?? I figured it was booked since I never even got any reply back at all and gave up on making travel arrangements. To bad skydivers generally seem to be such slackers when it comes to business responsibilities. A reply would have at least been courteous. Who is organizing it and who should have been contacted to get an actual answer, details and perhaps booked a slot? Others may still be interested and hopefully can get more info than I got. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
