need to know before going 4way

[potatoman 0]

A few things I saw this weekend, and would like to broadcast this to students going into 4way teams:

Remember that you are now tracking 90degree away from other jumpers. This is not 2 way where you track 180deg. Your seperation is there, but less than usual. Keep your eyes open, and don't worry too much about the one collapsed end cell. You can still turn your canopy with a collapsed end cell, but you are going to struggle when there is a wrap.

Check your team's gear. Do not get complacent. If you are doing 10 jumps for the day, keep on checking. Chest strap wired ocrrectly, legs straps, pins, flaps, puffs etc.

Know your opening altitude. Stick to it. There is a camera man above you. Do not just deploy if you get high on the formation, or you think you are not going to make the DZ. The cam guy is right above you.

Learn how to track, flat, and be able to turn in your track. Also, be able to check for others tracking next to you, without going off course.

Full face helmet, advised.

Know what a burble is, and know how to best avoid it. Body slams are serious, and hence the next thing, AAD.

If your buddy gets knocked, do NOT follow him. Chances are you will not catch him, end up low, this is not the movies. AFF instructors struggle to catch students who have no control. You are moving from student to 4way.... Remember, your buddy might at any point in time deploy, he has just been knocked, and might be disoriented, hence decission to deploy.

Don't do more than you are comfortable with. Teams tend to push more jumps. Presure, wanna do better etc. If you are tired, stop. You are not going to perform well when you are tired, and you are going to make mistakes.

Don't make changes to your gear. You do not want to have different gear on a jump where you need to focus on flying. Things go wrong.

Plan your jump properly. Don't decide as you board to change the exit, or add another point.

Altitude. If you for some reason cannot get the altitude required (ATC or something), ABORT the 4way, and do your hop and pop, or just solo it out. Depending on alti, you might now have 15sec working time, but are used to more. You will probably go low before you realize it.

Which brings me to audibles. More safety, good. Also, know you settings on the audible. If it is set to beep 500ft above the decided breakoff, don't break at the beep. You will confuse everyone on the jump.

And lastly, dependant on the aircraft, check how to do the climbout. More people in the door, means more chance of popping a pin, maybe a slip on the step etc. Practice it before the time, and sequence is important.

My couple of tips....

You have the right to your opinion, and I have the right to tell you how Fu***** stupid it is.
Davelepka - "This isn't an x-box, or a Chevy truck forum"
Whatever you do, don't listen to ChrisD.

[SecondRound 0]

As a really new jumper I really appreciate this list. Is there a chance it could be made a sticky or or something else so I can refer to it at the appropriate time? Thanks for a great post.

[strife 0]

+1 thanks

Print it and stick it in the back of your log book

[potatoman 0]

Hey, this is copyright protected.

You have the right to your opinion, and I have the right to tell you how Fu***** stupid it is.
Davelepka - "This isn't an x-box, or a Chevy truck forum"
Whatever you do, don't listen to ChrisD.

[wmw999 2,121]

Great post.
Here are some more rules for 4-way

Wendy P.

There is nothing more dangerous than breaking a basic safety rule and getting away with it. It removes fear of the consequences and builds false confidence. (tbrown)

[Remster 24]

Quote

Great post.
Here are some more rules for 4-way

Wendy P.

Great stuff.

And here, I will render all that expensive Airspeed coaching completely superfluous. After numerous hours of coaching from them, observing their coaching other teams, and generally spying on them, I have distilled the essence of all their coaching. Never has such amount of skydiving wisdom been condensed into such short, to the point, and completely all-encompassing set of rules. You are welcome:

1- Hold that exit a little longer
2- Stay off grips longer
3- Later headswitch

Remster

[StreetScooby 5]

Hate to say this, but my first thought was - should people that need to be told this really be doing 4-way? But, you do need to start somewhere. Piras always taught that a 4-way group needs 50 randoms to really get a good fall rate together before moving on to blocks. Maybe that should be thrown in here, also.

Quote

Which brings me to audibles. More safety, good. Also, know you settings on the audible. If it is set to beep 500ft above the decided breakoff, don't break at the beep. You will confuse everyone on the jump.

I always liked it when people wore altimeters. You could easily check the jumper across from you to see where you were, and they could do the same.

We are all engines of karma

[piisfish 135]

Quote

And here, I will render all that expensive Airspeed coaching completely superfluous. After numerous hours of coaching from them, observing their coaching other teams, and generally spying on them, I have distilled the essence of all their coaching. Never has such amount of skydiving wisdom been condensed into such short, to the point, and completely all-encompassing set of rules. You are welcome:

1- Hold that exit a little longer
2- Stay off grips longer
3- Later headswitch

I have concentrated your distillate and got to :
Slow is smooth.
Smooth is fast.

scissors beat paper, paper beat rock, rock beat wingsuit - KarlM

[SecondRound 0]

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+1 thanks

Print it and stick it in the back of your log book

Printed and in my logbook. Thanks for the suggestion

[Remster 24]

Quote

Quote

And here, I will render all that expensive Airspeed coaching completely superfluous. After numerous hours of coaching from them, observing their coaching other teams, and generally spying on them, I have distilled the essence of all their coaching. Never has such amount of skydiving wisdom been condensed into such short, to the point, and completely all-encompassing set of rules. You are welcome:

1- Hold that exit a little longer
2- Stay off grips longer
3- Later headswitch

I have concentrated your distillate and got to :
Slow is smooth.
Smooth is fast.

That's too fluffy. My tips are concrete and to the point.

Remster

[dzkeith 0]

Quote

Quote

And here, I will render all that expensive Airspeed coaching completely superfluous. After numerous hours of coaching from them, observing their coaching other teams, and generally spying on them, I have distilled the essence of all their coaching. Never has such amount of skydiving wisdom been condensed into such short, to the point, and completely all-encompassing set of rules. You are welcome:

1- Hold that exit a little longer
2- Stay off grips longer
3- Later headswitch

I have concentrated your distillate and got to :
Slow is smooth.
Smooth is fast.

As my coach said, "Nothing good happens during a head-switch"

[Remster 24]

Quote

Quote

Quote

And here, I will render all that expensive Airspeed coaching completely superfluous. After numerous hours of coaching from them, observing their coaching other teams, and generally spying on them, I have distilled the essence of all their coaching. Never has such amount of skydiving wisdom been condensed into such short, to the point, and completely all-encompassing set of rules. You are welcome:

1- Hold that exit a little longer
2- Stay off grips longer
3- Later headswitch

I have concentrated your distillate and got to :
Slow is smooth.
Smooth is fast.

As my coach said, "Nothing good happens during a head-switch"

That's typically when the other 3 fuckers decide to move away from you. Every single time.

Remster

[StreetScooby 5]

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As my coach said, "Nothing good happens during a head-switch"

I like that!

We are all engines of karma

[rehmwa 2]

Quote

I have concentrated your distillate and got to :
Slow is smooth.
Smooth is fast.

calm is smooth
smooth is fast


slow is slow

...
Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants

[StreetScooby 5]

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calm is smooth
smooth is fast


slow is slow

Well put...
LOL.

We are all engines of karma

[BillyVance 34]

And...

Plan the dive
Dive the plan.

"Mediocre people don't like high achievers, and high achievers don't like mediocre people." - SIX TIME National Champion coach Nick Saban

[Andy9o8 0]

Quote

Quote

I have concentrated your distillate and got to :
Slow is smooth.
Smooth is fast.

calm is smooth
smooth is fast

slow is slow

The first skydiving instructional book I ever bought, as a student jumper back in the 70s, was Sport Parachuting by Charles Ryan . I don't think I have it any more, but in the chapter on competition "turning style", I remember it offered the following advice (I'm working from memory, so it's not a precise quite, but it's close): The way to go fast is not to try to go fast, it's to have complete control over every component of what you're doing, and the speed will be the natural result.

I think that same principle applies to competition RW.

[AndyBoyd 0]

Quote

Quote

Quote

I have concentrated your distillate and got to :
Slow is smooth.
Smooth is fast.

calm is smooth
smooth is fast

slow is slow

The first skydiving instructional book I ever bought, as a student jumper back in the 70s, was Sport Parachuting by Charles Ryan . I don't think I have it any more, but in the chapter on competition "turning style", I remember it offered the following advice (I'm working from memory, so it's not a precise quite, but it's close): The way to go fast is not to try to go fast, it's to have complete control over every component of what you're doing, and the speed will be the natural result.

I think that same principle applies to competition RW.

This is accurate. But slow is still slow. And fast is fast.

[loudtom 5]

Hello Andrew,
I see I am not going to need the copy I made of the original post to bring to our first full team meeting with you responding to this thread. I can't wait. I think we are going to have fun and learn an awful lot. See ya soon yo,
Tom

tom #90 #54 #08 and now #5 with a Bronze :-)

[elightle 8]

Quote

Piras always taught that a 4-way group needs 50 randoms to really get a good fall rate together before moving on to blocks. Maybe that should be thrown in here, also.

If the team is doing tunnel training, 50 randoms might not be necessary.

[nigel99 143]

Quote

Quote

Quote

Quote

I have concentrated your distillate and got to :
Slow is smooth.
Smooth is fast.

calm is smooth
smooth is fast

slow is slow

The first skydiving instructional book I ever bought, as a student jumper back in the 70s, was Sport Parachuting by Charles Ryan . I don't think I have it any more, but in the chapter on competition "turning style", I remember it offered the following advice (I'm working from memory, so it's not a precise quite, but it's close): The way to go fast is not to try to go fast, it's to have complete control over every component of what you're doing, and the speed will be the natural result.

I think that same principle applies to competition RW.

This is accurate. But slow is still slow. And fast is fast.

The recent Dan BC articles addressed this. Slow is slow, he has a good write up available online at parachutist online.

Level, slot, dock (LSD) are my favourites.

Experienced jumper - someone who has made mistakes more often than I have and lived.

[potatoman 0]

Lucy in the sky with diamonds....

I like the LSD.

Another thing which is also good, and this is not for you pro's out there:
Before you do a turn/move, think arch, then move. People tend to fixate on the move, and forget to arch, making them unstable, or chaning their level rapidly. (can be more or less of an arch)

This way, inbetween every move, you still maintain a stable good arch.

You have the right to your opinion, and I have the right to tell you how Fu***** stupid it is.
Davelepka - "This isn't an x-box, or a Chevy truck forum"
Whatever you do, don't listen to ChrisD.