1st swoop canopy?

[AirMan 0]

I've been jumping a Safire 139, but wish to get into swooping. I'd like to stay with about a 135, maybe a 120 canopy size. I am wondering what is a good, elliptical, swooping canopy to begin learning with? I have 410 jumps total, with which at least 100 are on the Safire. Thanks!

[TALONSKY 0]

I started learning to swoop on a Safire. I think they are a good intermediate canopy with a fairly long recovery arch(that is if it is a safire 1 and not a safire 2). They have lighter front riser pressure and are not too sensitive to input.
Kirk

[twnsnd 1]

There is no better canopy to learn how to swoop than the one you already know how to fly. Downsizing or changing planform will only make it harder and more dangerous to learn. Use what you have now and once you have you have mastered all the basics of swooping, then a small downsize will be in order.

-We are the Swoophaters. We have travelled back in time to hate on your swoops.-

[Spizzzarko 0]

You really don't need an elliptical canopy to "swoop". Swooping really comes from the carry over of speed to landing. I will admit that some canopy's are better suited for swooping than others.
Let's take the stilletto for example. This is what I learned on. It has a much flatter glide than some other canopy's on the market, and it will naturaly plane out pretty well compared to other canopy's. This can also be a hindrance to you. Because it has such a short recovery arc it forces you to turn a little closer to the ground, which leaves less margin for error, and in this game errors kill. You should be able to "swoop" the canopy you have now before you decide to down size or change planforms. A certian canopy doesn't guarentee a longer or better swoop. It all comes down to the pilot.

[AirMan 0]

Thanks to all of you who have replied...Its very helpful. I guess what I was really wondering is, if I wanted to go fully elliptical, or just step-up to a more Hi-Po canopy from a Safire, what would be a good next canopy?

[SkydiveMO 0]

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I started learning to swoop on a Safire...
There is no better canopy to learn how to swoop than the one you already know how to fly...
You really don't need an elliptical canopy to "swoop"...

See a pattern starting? I learned to swoop on a Triathlon, if you can make it swoop you can make anything swoop. I test jumped a Safire and thought it was easy to dive and planed out nicely, very easy to fly. Going eliptical will just give you a faster turn rate and more speed, making learning harder. See what your current canopy can do it is a great flier and can swoop with the best of them.

[freeflydrew 0]

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Thanks to all of you who have replied...Its very helpful. I guess what I was really wondering is, if I wanted to go fully elliptical, or just step-up to a more Hi-Po canopy from a Safire, what would be a good next canopy?

55 icarus vx (joke)

Why not try the safire2 of the same size or a size down...

[SkydiveMO 0]

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if I wanted to go fully elliptical, or just step-up to a more Hi-Po canopy from a Safire, what would be a good next canopy?

If you like your Safire 139 why not try a Crossfire 139 demo.

[skydivegirl 0]

I know you are looking for another canopy but...
I just thought I'd mention that our DZO gets very nice swoops with his Safire

Pink Mafia Sis #26

[CanuckInUSA 0]

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If you like your Safire 139 why not try a Crossfire 139 demo.

I love my Crossfire2. But I think the direction that this thread has been taking is that the Saffire is very much a swoopable canopy. I have one jump on the original Saffire 149 and I liked and swooped it very well for my experience level at the time. You don't need an elliptical canopy to swoop.

Okay back to your regular scheduled programming. I love my Crossfire2.

Try not to worry about the things you have no control over

[ccowden 0]

Sabre2
Crossfire

[johnny1488 1]

Stick with a safire. When you dial in your swoop (slowly at first as to avoid the meat wagon) you will find swooping a xfire a lot easier. If you want to learn faster (and probably safer) start with the safire then go xfire. I have about 400 jumps on safires learning to swoop. If I had started on the xfire, I think I would have a lot less room for error (something you'ld be smart to give yorself when you're learning.)

Read up on technique and maybe get some coaching and you will have plenty to work on with a safire.

Johnny
--"This ain't no book club, we're all gonna die!"
Mike Rome

[marks 0]

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I know you are looking for another canopy but...
I just thought I'd mention that our DZO gets very nice swoops with his Safire

geese.;. you have no idea how many jumps that canpopy has ...... probably almost as many if not more.. jumps than i have total...

[brits17 0]

howdy, just so you know, i put about 500 jumps on my safire 109, loaded barely over 1:1, and learned to swoop the shiznits outta that thing. seriously... put it this way... a good swoop on my safire equals a crappy swoop on my velocity.

if you're wanting something else though, i'd say somewhere along the lines of a fully elliptical, like a crossfire. but again, learn to swoop that safire first, it works i promise!

_______________________
aerialkinetics.com

[skymama 35]

I'm not a swooper but it seems logical to me that you should learn to swoop on the canopy you're already comfortable with, especially since people said it's a good canopy to swoop on. What about going to a good canopy school? There's a great one in DeLand, check out the Home page here.

She is Da Man, and you better not mess with Da Man,
because she will lay some keepdown on you faster than, well, really fast. ~Billvon

[AirMan 0]

Thank you all for the great advice! If I didn't know any better, I'd say ya'll are trying to tell me to keep the Safire, learn to swoop the heck out of it, and THEN move up to a more hi-po canopy...hmmmm.

[BrianSGermain 1]

Definitely a Samurai. It is the safest choice all-around. It has a reasonable recovey arc, not too long, not oo short. It has fairly light front risr pressure, which will alow you to start and finish your turn high, without the canopy pulling out of the dive. The airlock system makes the canopy incredibly rigid, and won't collapse in turnbulence. It is built stranger than reeve are, and will last you thousands of jumps. It is a very well-thought-out, well constructed design that is unparalleled.
check out the website: www.bigairsportz.com

Instructional Videos:www.AdventureWisdom.com
Keynote Speaking:www.TranscendingFEAR.com
Canopies and Courses:www.BIGAIRSPORTZ.com

[ZoneRat 0]

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Thank you all for the great advice! If I didn't know any better, I'd say ya'll are trying to tell me to keep the Safire, learn to swoop the heck out of it, and THEN move up to a more hi-po canopy...hmmmm.

So. Sounds like you are going to stick with the Safire for a bit.

What will be your next step towards learning to swoop?

Just curious.

“There are more things in Heaven and Earth, Horatio, than are dreamt of in your philosophies.”

[AirMan 0]

I guess my next step will be to buy an Extreme VX 74 and crank some serious toggle-turns down around 100 ft. Haha, just kiddin. The buzz is to begin with straight-in front riser approaches, but doing so up high, all the while learning how long you can hold pressure and how much altitude your losing, and then slowly take it lower. Then onto some 90 degree riser carving turns...I guess.

[ianmdrennan 2]

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The buzz is to begin with straight-in front riser approaches, but doing so up high, all the while learning how long you can hold pressure and how much altitude your losing, and then slowly take it lower. Then onto some 90 degree riser carving turns

Nice.

Another good thing to do is "practice saving yourself".

What I mean by that is when you're way up high and you're practicing all your front riser stuff in clear airspace, pretend like you've done a majorly low turn and need to really dig yourself outta the corner. Try and feel and look at what your canopy does and how the pressure on the toggles feel.

It's better to know how it's going to respond up high than down low
Remember everyone ends up in the corner at some point or another, the sooner you learn to identify being in the corner before it's too late and how to deal with it, the better off you'll be. In case there's any misunderstanding I'm not saying go put yourself in the corner, but rather realize that at some point it will happen and practice for it.

Another good skill for a swooper to know is high speed carving turns, often we see people like the Factory teams doing them really low to the ground. While fun to watch they're a great tool if you ever put yourself in a situation where you've begun and turn and absolutely have to complete the turn to avoid obstacles (general rule is always give yourself outs, but sometimes we make mistakes) you can use this maneuver higher than ground level (tree top height even or whatever the situation dictates) to successfully complete the turn and avoid the obstacles while losing as little altitude as possible.

Hope this helps.

Blue skies
Ian

Performance Designs Factory Team

[ZoneRat 0]

That sounds about right. Not a swooper myself, so I don't really have a right to an opinion on it. More of an RW guy these days. As such, my team schedules training weekends with video and coaching.

If I decided become a swooper, I'd do it the same way. Schedule a few weekends of hop n' pops with video and coaching. Really focus on it without the distractions of freefall. Just a thought.

We have about the same number of jumps- and I'm no rigger... I'm probably out of line profering thoughts or advice... just don't want to see anyone get hurt.

Swooping's serious stuff. Everyone agrees. But I sometimes wonder if the mass majority of those deciding to learn, act accordingly.

For example, I plan on spending 300 jumps specifically targetted at learning 4-way this year. But if when I hose a 4-way, I don't increase the likelihood of bodily injury.

I hope new swoopers extend the same type of focus learning their discipline. Hopefully more. They have more to lose.

Just my thoughts. Forgive me if they seem simplistic.

“There are more things in Heaven and Earth, Horatio, than are dreamt of in your philosophies.”