mattwhoo 0 #1 March 19, 2002 Ok here is the deal I have done my level 6 AFF jump twice now and not having much luck getting past it. My instructors tell me I'm to focused on what I'm trying to do and that I'm getting tunnel vision and that is causing me to get a little tense and that in turn is causing me to get unstable during the free fall. Also part of the unstable free fall is not getting my legs out. So I understand the problem 100% and agree with them. Talking to my instructor he suggested doing a relaxation dive no real turns or flips just to try to get me to open up and relax a bit and get into a better body position. Now here is the question I was thinking about doing 10 minutes in one of those wind tunnels. It would cost me about the same to do either option a relaxation dive or wind tunnel training. In the end what one do you think would be the better of the 2 options.Thanks Matt Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TheMarshMan1 0 #2 March 19, 2002 Well, in my personal opinion, that would be up to you. If you live near a wind tunnel, go for that- but I wouldnt be making any big trips just to get to one. On the other hand, if it costs the same why not just do a relaxation jump, like you talked about? They both have their plusses and minuses. If you do the wind tunnel, you get say 10 min. of solid "freefall" time, but no actual jump, and no canopy practice (which is just as important). If I was in your shoes- I'd practice my body position on the ground, for a good long time to get that muscle memory in shape, and then go have another whack at level 6 again. Just my .03Blue skies,Marshall "If I could be like that, I would give anything, just to live one day, in those shoes..." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skybytch 259 #3 March 19, 2002 If you can get to a wind tunnel I'd say do that. What you learn there will benefit you for more than just passing the level 6; the instructors there can help you really refine your body position.Then go up and blow through your last couple AFF levels pull and flare,lisa Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mattwhoo 0 #4 March 19, 2002 The drive to the tunnel is not much farther then my DZ. so thats not big deal As far a canopy control goes I agree it is important but i have not had any problems in that department as of yet. Its the relaxation and body position stuff that is causing me to fail.Matt Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
larry 0 #5 March 19, 2002 I’m no expert but I’d love to get some tunnel time even though I already have a license. Personally I agree with skybytch, the 10 minutes of air time would do a world of good.Error in REALITY.SYS - Reboot Universe? ([Y]/N) _Larry Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
RozeAY 0 #6 March 19, 2002 I think the tunnel time would be a help also. That way you will learn to fly your body and will be comfortable with your skills. Since you will be comfortable with your freefall abilities, you will hopefully relax much more next time you tackle level 6 since you know you can do it. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TEB6363 0 #7 March 19, 2002 If you can get to the wind tunnel, it may help a bunch. Just remember that you also have to learn how to relax in the plane, during the exit, and throughout the entire skydive. The wind tunnel may help, buy may not solve the problem. You might also think about adding video to your next skydive to "see" what is going on during the jump.Remember, we do this for FUN. A couple of extra jumps or tunnel time is just more FUN.:::OK, Canopy is Open, No Traffic Around, .. Why are these "Extra" Lines Draping Down??, Damn! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
lummy 4 #8 March 19, 2002 Everyone makes some good points here but I'm going to disagree. You mentioned that you already know what the problem is which is learning to RELAX. From everything I've ever read comparing tunnels to actual jumps, the difference is nite and day. IMO tunnel time is learning to fly with a safety net. If it were me, I'd get in a "relaxation" dive then try L6 again. When I did AFF, the FIRST jump of the day was always the worst for me mostly becauseI would get stressed out. The jumps after, I was always more relaxed.....I'm not talking about your pig tails, I'm talking about your sex appeal.... hit the road and I'm gone.... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Hooknswoop 19 #9 March 19, 2002 Given the easy access to the tunnel, use it. Training in the tunnel takes the pressure of limited time out of the equation, allowing you to relax and learn. Explain to the person that works for skyventure that goes in w/ you your situation. They will coach you and when you head back to the DZ, you will have the ability to relax and complete your level 6. The confidence you gain in the tunnel will help you relax and make the dive easier.I've got about 8 hours of tunnel time and it doesn't matter how good you are or how many jumps you have, the tunnel is an outstanding training tool.Hook Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Sebazz1 2 #10 March 19, 2002 QuoteTalking to my instructor he suggested doing a relaxation dive no real turns or flips just to try to get me to open up and relax a bit and get into a better body positionGreat responses in here. Matt your instructor has a good idea. Imagine a dive with no pressure, just git out of the plane arch relax and just burn up several thousand feet doing nothing but relaxing. There would be no pressure on you to perform. The DZ should be willing if the JM backs you up to give you a discounted jump for that exact dive.The dive flow should be fluid in the future. If try to hard or try to do things to fast you can often get spazzed out. Remember this - Slow is smooth and smooth is fast......Good luck dude!Sebazz......... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
airdrew20012001 0 #11 March 19, 2002 Wind tunnels are boring, skydiving is fun. I would rather do a hop and pop from 3,000 than the wind tunnel. Maybe this'l help: try to remember that skydiving is fun. Even AFF is supposed to be fun though for many it isn't because of the sort of performance anxiety you are talking about. Try visualizing the dive before you go to bed, from exit to touch down. This time, imagine you are doing the dive alone and that you nail it dead. See your body position from the outside (have you ever gotten video?), imagine yourself smiling the whole time. Hell, imagine there is kickin' music of your choice blaring like on video.My roomate had a problem with flat spins then developed performance anxiety that took all the fun out of it. For her, the trick was changing AFF jump masters to one that took the pressure off and made it fun again. Keep telling yourself you will style the next two levels and graduate in two jumps on the same day and you will. Drewfus McDoofus Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
axe96bam 0 #12 March 19, 2002 Matt, go to the tunnel. You will benefit a whole lot more from it than from one relaxation dive. You are no t relaxed probably because you are telling yourself that you just cannot get it right since you failed L6 twice. Go to the tunnel, get your skills polished up and than you will have a lot more confidence in yourself. I am sure that you will end up passing all levels in no time after that. Plus I bet you will learn a few more things in the tunnel too. Just think about it - 10 min of tunnel time is like 10 jumps worth of practice. Plus when was the last time you made 10 jumps in a day or a half a day or even better in half an hour? You will do the 10 min in the tunnel in about half hour worth of time. You can even go to the tunnel in the morning and than go to the DZ after that and finish AFF. Bottom line - go to the tunnel!Alex Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Sebazz1 2 #13 March 19, 2002 QuoteYou will benefit a whole lot more from it than from one relaxation diveAlex how dare you contradict me?!? Just kiddin......If he has gotten as far as level six he has performed the skills he needs to pass already. Now a tunnel will definately improve your skills but not help you relax. It's not like you have a limited working time in the tunnel like you do in real free fall?! i.e. increased pressure with the ground coming at yourelaxation dive can help.........just my $.02.Sebazz......... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
axe96bam 0 #14 March 19, 2002 I guess I dare to disagree because I like that tunnel so much.Alex Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Sebazz1 2 #15 March 19, 2002 You son of a.......lol....j/kSebazz......... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TEB6363 0 #16 March 19, 2002 ALEX,How the Hell are you?? It looks like you are very opinionated.....QuoteI guess I dare to disagree because I like that tunnel so much against Seb's idea.Seriously, I hope things are going great for you.Tom:::OK, Canopy is Open, No Traffic Around, .. Why are these "Extra" Lines Draping Down??, Damn! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rhino 0 #17 March 20, 2002 One hour in the tunnel is like 60 skydives.. Good tradeoff...Semper Fi !!!!!http://www.aahit.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Dumpster 0 #18 March 20, 2002 Hey Alex-Here's .02 from a newbie- I got spazzed out during my static line progression (15 second delays) and one our instructors took me up to full altitude (14,500 in our case) and we just relaxed - It worked for me! And I've noticed the first jump of the day just gets the knots out- Second and on are the good ones!Life begins at 14,000' - Shut up and jump! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PhreeZone 15 #19 March 20, 2002 Actually... an hour in the tunnel is more like 100-150 skydives worth of improvement.... The rapid ability to do 60 seconds freefall, 2-3 minute debrief, and right back in makes the tunnel a great training and teaching aid.I wish you would step back from that ledge my friend... ~3EB Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
axe96bam 0 #20 March 20, 2002 Hey Tom,I am fine. How are you? I just like the tunnel. It improves skills a whole lot and that in itself a big confidence booster. I also agree that if no tunnel is available a relaxation dive is a good thing. I actually took a student on an AFF jump who previously refused to get out of the plane for a S/L jump twice. He liked the AFF jump and stuck with those. But agian, the tunnel is a very valuable tool and you lear a lot more than its equivalent in jumps (in terms of free fall time)Alex Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
KATO33 0 #21 March 21, 2002 Do the Tunnel. I got stuck on level 5 3xs and level 6 2xs . I wish I had the option of a wind tunnel may have saved some money. I did do the tunnel on my last trip to florida . Greatly improved from the first 2 mins. to the last 2mins. Did 8 mins all together. Turned a 3pt 8_way the next day. Before that could barely get a 2-way together. AFF fresh in my mind only 50 total jumps including 2 tandems Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bbarnhouse 0 #22 March 23, 2002 Sounds like performance anxiety to me. Everyone here has offered solid advice, here's my .02 > The main problem is relaxing......which means dude YOU have to breathe. Practice breathing slowly, deeply and wide. Egads if you want further explination on "breathing wide" email me.Now then can I have my penny back? LOLCheersIt only takes a little pixie dust...... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
