BruceSmith 3 #29701 January 6, 2012 QuoteBlevins should have a film festival portion of the symposium. Dorkzone remains anonymous, but we all suspect Snowmman. It is a classic. I don't know what it would take to get Snow to come. I've offered drugs and money but he says he has plenty. I'll see if Marla has any ideas. Farflung will have to screen his excellent video and preside over a critcal discussion of it's thematic nuances and classic cinema elements. Farflung is quite a poet too, can he top the charts again? If Tom, Carol and Al come I'll have to attend as well. I enjoyed their company and presentations. Can we get Georger to come? What is his weakness and can we provide it? How about Jo? Maybe she can weave it into her planned NW research trip. Jo has had more final appearances than Cher. My wife teaches mathematics at a public college, she'd probably like to meet Meyer Louie who practices the same craft. I'd sure love to see Sluggo. I worry about him, no replies. Will Marla run the gauntlet? Blevins might scare her off but she is hella gutsy. I hope Amazon comes and shares a brew or two with Jerry. Vicki should come and meet everyone. I'd welcome a presentation on Mel. Bruce needs to be there. Ralph and any other retired Norjack SA's would be welcome. Sailshaw could give a presentation on Sheridan Peterson. And dare we ask for Orange to travel half way around the world? Jamie Cooper could pressnt his case and maybe perform a song or two. Geoff Gray could sit quietly and have us all wonder what he is actually up to. I'll bet he could present the KC case without getting nearly the backlash that Blevins gets. The posiibilities are endless. 377 Quote Sounds great. Let's do it. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites skyjack71 0 #29702 January 6, 2012 Quote Oh! Entry fee is ten crows. (and a fruit tree). Just why would Jerry's admission be 10 crow (and a fruit tree)? Are you saying JT's claims will be dispelled? Why the fruit tree? Have anything to do with the Tie and the spores? Reading between the line here and that is NOT a good thing to do when Georger is the speaker of the house.Copyright 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012 2013, 2014, 2015 by Jo Weber Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites georger 197 #29703 January 6, 2012 QuoteQuote Oh! Entry fee is ten crows. (and a fruit tree). Just why would Jerry's admission be 10 crow (and a fruit tree)? Are you saying JT's claims will be dispelled? Why the fruit tree? Have anything to do with the Tie and the spores? Reading between the line here and that is NOT a good thing to do when Georger is the speaker of the house. partridge in a pear tree Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites BruceSmith 3 #29704 January 6, 2012 QuoteQuoteQuoteAfter reading Bruce's article, I'm almost convinced nobody actually knows! Bruce, in your work on this case so far, with all the interviews you have done, have you picked up any anecdotes about the weather (in the V23 corridor) that afternoon and evening? Especially anything you would trust from reputable sources? Thanks, G. Quote I've spoken at length with Meyer Louie and the commentary he has shared here on the DZ is identical to what he told me. Also, I heard the older woman at the symposium who was impressed also with the gusty nature of the weather that night. Both folks tell corroborating stories. Both were in the I-5 corridor in and around Portland that night and buffeted by strong winds and lots of rain. Their accounts simply do not match what we're getting from official meteorological sources. Yes, the weather - especially the wind - intensifies dramatically in the Gorge, aka The Columbia Gorge, which funnels the Columbia River, but they are reporting strong winds and heavy rain in lands comparable to those where Cooper jumped. The famous Columbia Gorge begins a bit east of the Washougal area, and my best estimate of this westernmost end of the Gorge is that it begins about 20 miles east of Portland and the I-5. If you're looking on a map, Mt. Hood is on the Oregon side of the river and Mt Adams on the WA side and they form the backbone of the Gorge, which ends about 60 miles east as the Cascade Mountains peter-out as one approaches the lands of the Yakima Reservation in Washington. Winds in the Gorge are always extreme; I would say 20-30 mph on average on a nice summer's day. As a result, the Columbia near The Dalles, Oregon (pronounced Dahls) is a world-renown windsurfing area. In addition, after the symposium I spoke extensively with Dona Elliott at the Ariel Tavern on the subject of the weather and the ground search in the vicinity of Ariel during the days immediately following the skyjacking. Dona summed up the weather of November 24, 1971 very simply: “It was terrible!” Not only was it windy, but Dona said that it was also cold, and she estimated that the snow level fell to about 1,500 feet, which is pretty low. Normal mid-winter snow levels generally do not fall below 2,000. Supporting that, the pix that Geoff Gray showed from chief case agent Charlie Farrell’s collection indicated lots of snow-filled fields and clear-cuts, presumably at lower elevations. This landscape appeared to be rolling hills and seemed to visually support the perspective offered by Tom Kaye that Cooper’s LZ, which was centered in Ariel, was mostly rolling hills with open wood lots and agricultural fields, along with about 10% dense forests. Little or none of it was mountainous, densely forested wilderness area. My best estimate is that the pictures were taken east of Ariel where the hills approach 2-3,000 feet. Nevertheless, there is some steep and rugged terrain in this area, such as the mountains that immediately surround Lake Merwin, which may top 5,000 feet. Supporting Dona, Geoff also writes that federal ground searches were called off in the days just Cooper’s jump because the snow was too deep to negotiate. Not sure how deep, or where the FBI was tromping, but Geoff displayed the FBI’s documents that sounded convincing. Lastly, Meyer told me that the weather that night was so rough that ever since he has used it as a personal gauge for intense weather. “’Is it as bad as was that night?’” is what I say when I see a bad storm,” Meyer told me. Meyer lives close to me and we met for an Italian dinner during the week after the Portland symposium. “So far, I’ve never seen a storm to surpass what I saw that night. Some storms have come close or matched it – but none have been worse.” Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites MarkBennett 5 #29705 January 6, 2012 Quote Quote Blevins: Am I invited to this symposim of yours as a speaker.Jerry Send complete resume, family history, blood type, photo of yourself, photo of your dog. Just kidding. Sure, you can have a speaking slot if you wish. Sorry, but Marla Cooper (who probably wouldn't attend anyway) is UN-invited to speak, unless she can offer up basic evidence that she didn't just make the whole story up to get a book deal. Who knows? Maybe the FBI will match prints to LD and I will have to eat roast crow for dinner the rest of the year. But so far I have seen only evidence that she's simply saying what she must to obtain a book deal, and I object to these tactics. Same goes for BK. Anyone else is welcome. I want to hear from the Bobby Dayton people, especially. Before you hammer on me too hard about Marla, consider this: I have printed up and researched every single interview she's done that I can find. And I can prove easily that she modifies the details in her story when it's convenient, or when 'issues' arise that might make it impossible for LD and Dewey to have pulled off the hijacking. But all she is really doing is digging herself a bigger hole. Example: Now she claims the two men landed only seven miles from Sisters, OR. So how did the money end up at Tena Bar? She says he lost it in the jump. The wind drift must have been fierce that day... Just another example of 'modifications' in her story, which I can easily prove by quoting from her different interviews. Ok, Robert. Fair enough. If you think Marla's continually changing her story: Write your article (with your sources) of how her story has changed. Then, before publishing to your web site, send it to Marla and invite her to respond. If she does, publish both your article and her response. I've read too many written interviews where the writer either misquotes, over-simplifies or just plain gets it wrong. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites 377 21 #29706 January 6, 2012 Blevins wroteQuoteSorry, but Marla Cooper (who probably wouldn't attend anyway) is UN-invited to speak, unless she can offer up basic evidence that she didn't just make the whole story... Geoff Gray was not such a control freak. Marla sure didn't help his book sales but he let her have center stage. I think you should be equally open and welcoming Robert. If everyone had to have proof to support their story you'd have a lot of trouble finding enough speakers to fill the time slot. Don't put up higher entry barriers for some than others. Marla didn't shy away from tough questions at the Portland symposium. If she wants to come to your summer symposium, let her come. A dialogue between the two of you would be very interesting. give her an invitation. 3772018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Orange1 0 #29707 January 6, 2012 Thanks 377... Ah, the Quade post sounds worthwhile looking for The Desert Boogie was on in Swakopmund while I was there... Felt weird not to be jumping at it... Watched the plane from the dunes... Shared a pitstop with an Avgas tanker briefly...lots of little airstrips all over southern Africa. Reading a book called "skeleton coast" by John Marsh... True story of a rescue along the coastline which will appeal to the boy's own adventure types....I'm reading the first edition which has some stuff unrevealed as it was written during ww2 but a kindle version has just been released which I believe is able to name some more names etc. (the Namibian coast is called skeleton coast because of the number of shipwrecks, and those who made it ashore were met with nothing but desert and searing heat). Anyway that is off topic, but what isn't is that I met a couple of people in Nam who I would have sworn were in their mid to late 40s but turned out to be mid 30s, having spent a lot of time outdoors in that harsh environment, which made me wonder again about the reliability of eyewitness estimates of Cooper's age. Skydiving: wasting fossil fuels just for fun. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites BruceSmith 3 #29708 January 6, 2012 When I was still working, a detective who began work on a cold case, sometimes 10 years old, would go back to the original crime report and make a list of what needed to be done. Then read the case file to see if all had been done or if there were errors or omissions. The FBI did on Cooper what had worked before and after on hijackings, it just didn’t work this time. I know if the agent could go back and redo the initial investigation he would, and I think may have found Coop. But 20/20 hindsight is a wonderful ability. Quote So, Rosie B, what would you do if you were in charge of the Cooper case? What would be your priorities? What would be your methods? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites JerryThomas 0 #29709 January 6, 2012 Mark : Why let Marla respond. It's her words that blevins will be using. Are you realy saying Give Marla a chance to change her story or make up a new one . Marla is a lier plain and simple. Jerry Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites 377 21 #29710 January 6, 2012 Jerry, I am just saying an open public dialog between Marla and her doubters would be beneficial. I'd like to see it. So would others. 3772018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Orange1 0 #29711 January 6, 2012 Quote Not a chance, 377. Guessing, theorizing, even if you're mistaken, that's one thing. What Marla is doing is quite another, and has nothing to do with the case. There is a difference between trying to offer a solution to the case and simply USING it for your own ends, while hurting the true investigators at the same time. I'm not making the same mistake Geoff Gray did. If things change regarding her claims, then okay. Otherwise, no. your excuses ring a bit hollow, Blevins. If you pick and choose based on your personal biases, I wouldn't expect anyone to take your symposium particularly seriously.Skydiving: wasting fossil fuels just for fun. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites mrshutter45 21 #29712 January 6, 2012 alot can happen between now and August, she will either still be around or maybe history by then?"It is surprising how aggressive people get, once they latch onto their suspect and say, 'Hey, he's our guy.' No matter what you tell them, they refuse to believe you" Agent Carr FBI Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Orange1 0 #29713 January 6, 2012 QuoteJerry, I am just saying an open public dialog between Marla and her doubters would be beneficial. I'd like to see it. So would others. 377 This. No-one has any solid evidence of anything. Let people make their own minds up about circumstantial evidence and motivations. Preventing people from speaking just casts doubts on the organiser's own motivations.Skydiving: wasting fossil fuels just for fun. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Orange1 0 #29714 January 6, 2012 QuoteMark : Why let Marla respond. It's her words that blevins will be using. Are you realy saying Give Marla a chance to change her story or make up a new one . Marla is a lier plain and simple. Jerry Hello Jerry and happy new year! Surely you don't think Blevins will give an objective synopsis of Marla??!Skydiving: wasting fossil fuels just for fun. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites JerryThomas 0 #29715 January 6, 2012 Orange 1: I was responding to Mark Bennets post not 377. I believe Blevins will allow her to make a bigger fool of her self.If she appears the queations she will be asked will not be so easy for her to answer this time. After all even Marla's family and friend's have stated she has made up this story of her's. Even I have recieved phone calls from her friends stating she is lieing.Happy new year to you and your family and to all on the forum. This is going to be a good year for all. Jerry Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Orange1 0 #29716 January 6, 2012 Quote Orange 1: I was responding to Mark Bennets post not 377. I believe Blevins will allow her to make a bigger fool of her self.If she appears the queations she will be asked will not be so easy for her to answer this time. After all even Marla's family and friend's have stated she has made up this story of her's. Even I have recieved phone calls from her friends stating she is lieing.Happy new year to you and your family and to all on the forum. This is going to be a good year for all. Jerry Ah, ok. And re what you say, this is exactly why Blevins should allow her to speak. Otherwise it looks like he is scared of her I hope it is indeed a good year for all, hope you and shelly are both well. We are trying to figure out if we can fit a trip to the US into our plans for this year but sadly again we are unlikely to make it to the west coast or northwest if we do...Skydiving: wasting fossil fuels just for fun. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites georger 197 #29717 January 6, 2012 QuoteQuoteQuoteQuoteAfter reading Bruce's article, I'm almost convinced nobody actually knows! Bruce, in your work on this case so far, with all the interviews you have done, have you picked up any anecdotes about the weather (in the V23 corridor) that afternoon and evening? Especially anything you would trust from reputable sources? Thanks, G. Quote I've spoken at length with Meyer Louie and the commentary he has shared here on the DZ is identical to what he told me. Also, I heard the older woman at the symposium who was impressed also with the gusty nature of the weather that night. Both folks tell corroborating stories. Both were in the I-5 corridor in and around Portland that night and buffeted by strong winds and lots of rain. Their accounts simply do not match what we're getting from official meteorological sources. Yes, the weather - especially the wind - intensifies dramatically in the Gorge, aka The Columbia Gorge, which funnels the Columbia River, but they are reporting strong winds and heavy rain in lands comparable to those where Cooper jumped. The famous Columbia Gorge begins a bit east of the Washougal area, and my best estimate of this westernmost end of the Gorge is that it begins about 20 miles east of Portland and the I-5. If you're looking on a map, Mt. Hood is on the Oregon side of the river and Mt Adams on the WA side and they form the backbone of the Gorge, which ends about 60 miles east as the Cascade Mountains peter-out as one approaches the lands of the Yakima Reservation in Washington. Winds in the Gorge are always extreme; I would say 20-30 mph on average on a nice summer's day. As a result, the Columbia near The Dalles, Oregon (pronounced Dahls) is a world-renown windsurfing area. In addition, after the symposium I spoke extensively with Dona Elliott at the Ariel Tavern on the subject of the weather and the ground search in the vicinity of Ariel during the days immediately following the skyjacking. Dona summed up the weather of November 24, 1971 very simply: “It was terrible!” Not only was it windy, but Dona said that it was also cold, and she estimated that the snow level fell to about 1,500 feet, which is pretty low. Normal mid-winter snow levels generally do not fall below 2,000. Supporting that, the pix that Geoff Gray showed from chief case agent Charlie Farrell’s collection indicated lots of snow-filled fields and clear-cuts, presumably at lower elevations. This landscape appeared to be rolling hills and seemed to visually support the perspective offered by Tom Kaye that Cooper’s LZ, which was centered in Ariel, was mostly rolling hills with open wood lots and agricultural fields, along with about 10% dense forests. Little or none of it was mountainous, densely forested wilderness area. My best estimate is that the pictures were taken east of Ariel where the hills approach 2-3,000 feet. Nevertheless, there is some steep and rugged terrain in this area, such as the mountains that immediately surround Lake Merwin, which may top 5,000 feet. Supporting Dona, Geoff also writes that federal ground searches were called off in the days just Cooper’s jump because the snow was too deep to negotiate. Not sure how deep, or where the FBI was tromping, but Geoff displayed the FBI’s documents that sounded convincing. Lastly, Meyer told me that the weather that night was so rough that ever since he has used it as a personal gauge for intense weather. “’Is it as bad as was that night?’” is what I say when I see a bad storm,” Meyer told me. Meyer lives close to me and we met for an Italian dinner during the week after the Portland symposium. “So far, I’ve never seen a storm to surpass what I saw that night. Some storms have come close or matched it – but none have been worse.” Thanks Bruce! This is good material. I was posting earlier but our net went down here - forgot maintenance was scheduled for midnight so Im sitting here typing and zap ! Back up now. Thanks. Galen is back in motion - after the holidays. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites georger 197 #29718 January 6, 2012 [while hurting the true investigators at the same time. . Do you have actual evidence this is happening - have you talked to the "true investigators" ? - or is this just another "I know it when I see it" hypothesis on your part? I mean Robt. Youve been wrong before. But I sense I am just wasting my time with you, again. You will do as you do, in any event. You will even cancel the affair, if you decide to. But dont cry fire, in a theatre! That will definately get you negative publicity of the permanent and lasting kind. Hey! Here's a new idea! BLAME ME FOR ANYTHING THAT GOES WRONG! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites georger 197 #29719 January 6, 2012 QuoteOrange 1: I was responding to Mark Bennets post not 377. I believe Blevins will allow her to make a bigger fool of her self.If she appears the queations she will be asked will not be so easy for her to answer this time. After all even Marla's family and friend's have stated she has made up this story of her's. Even I have recieved phone calls from her friends stating she is lieing.Happy new year to you and your family and to all on the forum. This is going to be a good year for all. Jerry Did you get my New Year's greeting? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites georger 197 #29720 January 6, 2012 Quote Quote [while hurting the true investigators at the same time. . Do you have actual evidence this is happening - have you talked to the "true investigators" ? - or is this just another "I know it when I see it" hypothesis on your part? I mean Robt. Youve been wrong before. But I sense I am just wasting my time with you, again. You will do as you do, in any event. You will even cancel the affair, if you decide to. But dont cry fire, in a theatre! That will definately get you negative publicity of the permanent and lasting kind. Hey! Here's a new idea! BLAME ME FOR ANYTHING THAT GOES WRONG! I don't blame you for a thing. I'm not calling it off now, or anytime in the future. But I WILL hold potential speakers to a minimum standard of legitimacy. Call me a tough guy on it, but that's the way it is. This is a community event, it's not about me. And I'm not going to let my hometown down on it. They gave me this job and I have to do the best I can to make sure it isn't a circus, or used as someone's private promotion with motives other than discovering the truth on the Cooper case. Otherwise, what's the point? Can't explain it any better than that. As far as interest, I have about seven months left to fill nine more speaker slots. This shouldn't be a problem. Invites go out next week. The theatre is also the only place at Good Ol' Days where you can merchandise without paying the $250 city fee they usually charge the vendors. I'm openly inviting those people to show up with their stuff, or others who want to present their case with printed material. The Book Swap alone would get me to show up. You think organizing this is EASY? I'm giving it my best shot, though. As I said, you will do as you will do. That is a given. I am sure you will try as best you can. I think you and the people of Auburn have every right to set your own agenda. Thats my final word on this. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites 377 21 #29721 January 6, 2012 If Marla is banned there is little hope of getting Farflung to attend. Unintended consequences... sigh. 3772018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Orange1 0 #29722 January 6, 2012 Quote ]But I WILL hold potential speakers to a minimum standard of legitimacy. uhhhh... at the risk of sounding like someone else, what on earth makes you qualified to judge this? especially given your own vested interest in the matter?Skydiving: wasting fossil fuels just for fun. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites BobKnoss 0 #29723 January 6, 2012 QuoteQuote ]But I WILL hold potential speakers to a minimum standard of legitimacy. uhhhh... at the risk of sounding like someone else, what on earth makes you qualified to judge this? especially given your own vested interest in the matter? I should be the moderator and roast each speaker after their presentation. Hindsight as good as it gets! Can I get a full body armor suit and can we hot wire Blevins? I'll hold the buzzer. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites MarkBennett 5 #29724 January 6, 2012 Quote Jerry, I am just saying an open public dialog between Marla and her doubters would be beneficial. I'd like to see it. So would others. 377 Robert and Jerry, I agree with 377 (and not just because he's a fellow Mark).I don't know Marla well. I met her at the symposium and she's answered a few emails. But she has never shied away from any question. Ever. She even responded to a post when many personal items were drug up. Nobody has to believe Marla's story. You can question her motives. But if you really want to be fair, you have to give her the chance to defend it. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites matthewcline 0 #29725 January 6, 2012 QuoteQuoteQuoteQuote ]But I WILL hold potential speakers to a minimum standard of legitimacy. uhhhh... at the risk of sounding like someone else, what on earth makes you qualified to judge this? especially given your own vested interest in the matter? I should be the moderator and roast each speaker after their presentation. Hindsight as good as it gets! Can I get a full body armor suit and can we hot wire Blevins? I'll hold the buzzer. It's a community event and anyone can attend in the audience. Admission is free. Speaker and vendor selections are a different thing. Those are pre-assigned. If Marla or yourself wish to show up to watch, you are more than welcome. Speakers get either fifteen or thirty minute assigned slots, their choice. An official program is usually made available online, and print copies are handed out at the door. This system has been used for the past several years. Now that would be a hoot! Although, I suspect some here would pale miserably in public when speaking. Some would come across as complete idiots and possibly insane too. Others would receive a sympathy nod, but not be taken seriously. "Talking" symposiums are great, but usually fruitless. A Symposium where physical evidence must be presented to get a slot, that would be beneficial. MattAn Instructors first concern is student safety. So, start being safe, first!!! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Prev 1184 1185 1186 1187 1188 1189 1190 1191 1192 1193 1194 Next Page 1189 of 2541 Join the conversation You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account. 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skyjack71 0 #29702 January 6, 2012 Quote Oh! Entry fee is ten crows. (and a fruit tree). Just why would Jerry's admission be 10 crow (and a fruit tree)? Are you saying JT's claims will be dispelled? Why the fruit tree? Have anything to do with the Tie and the spores? Reading between the line here and that is NOT a good thing to do when Georger is the speaker of the house.Copyright 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012 2013, 2014, 2015 by Jo Weber Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
georger 197 #29703 January 6, 2012 QuoteQuote Oh! Entry fee is ten crows. (and a fruit tree). Just why would Jerry's admission be 10 crow (and a fruit tree)? Are you saying JT's claims will be dispelled? Why the fruit tree? Have anything to do with the Tie and the spores? Reading between the line here and that is NOT a good thing to do when Georger is the speaker of the house. partridge in a pear tree Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BruceSmith 3 #29704 January 6, 2012 QuoteQuoteQuoteAfter reading Bruce's article, I'm almost convinced nobody actually knows! Bruce, in your work on this case so far, with all the interviews you have done, have you picked up any anecdotes about the weather (in the V23 corridor) that afternoon and evening? Especially anything you would trust from reputable sources? Thanks, G. Quote I've spoken at length with Meyer Louie and the commentary he has shared here on the DZ is identical to what he told me. Also, I heard the older woman at the symposium who was impressed also with the gusty nature of the weather that night. Both folks tell corroborating stories. Both were in the I-5 corridor in and around Portland that night and buffeted by strong winds and lots of rain. Their accounts simply do not match what we're getting from official meteorological sources. Yes, the weather - especially the wind - intensifies dramatically in the Gorge, aka The Columbia Gorge, which funnels the Columbia River, but they are reporting strong winds and heavy rain in lands comparable to those where Cooper jumped. The famous Columbia Gorge begins a bit east of the Washougal area, and my best estimate of this westernmost end of the Gorge is that it begins about 20 miles east of Portland and the I-5. If you're looking on a map, Mt. Hood is on the Oregon side of the river and Mt Adams on the WA side and they form the backbone of the Gorge, which ends about 60 miles east as the Cascade Mountains peter-out as one approaches the lands of the Yakima Reservation in Washington. Winds in the Gorge are always extreme; I would say 20-30 mph on average on a nice summer's day. As a result, the Columbia near The Dalles, Oregon (pronounced Dahls) is a world-renown windsurfing area. In addition, after the symposium I spoke extensively with Dona Elliott at the Ariel Tavern on the subject of the weather and the ground search in the vicinity of Ariel during the days immediately following the skyjacking. Dona summed up the weather of November 24, 1971 very simply: “It was terrible!” Not only was it windy, but Dona said that it was also cold, and she estimated that the snow level fell to about 1,500 feet, which is pretty low. Normal mid-winter snow levels generally do not fall below 2,000. Supporting that, the pix that Geoff Gray showed from chief case agent Charlie Farrell’s collection indicated lots of snow-filled fields and clear-cuts, presumably at lower elevations. This landscape appeared to be rolling hills and seemed to visually support the perspective offered by Tom Kaye that Cooper’s LZ, which was centered in Ariel, was mostly rolling hills with open wood lots and agricultural fields, along with about 10% dense forests. Little or none of it was mountainous, densely forested wilderness area. My best estimate is that the pictures were taken east of Ariel where the hills approach 2-3,000 feet. Nevertheless, there is some steep and rugged terrain in this area, such as the mountains that immediately surround Lake Merwin, which may top 5,000 feet. Supporting Dona, Geoff also writes that federal ground searches were called off in the days just Cooper’s jump because the snow was too deep to negotiate. Not sure how deep, or where the FBI was tromping, but Geoff displayed the FBI’s documents that sounded convincing. Lastly, Meyer told me that the weather that night was so rough that ever since he has used it as a personal gauge for intense weather. “’Is it as bad as was that night?’” is what I say when I see a bad storm,” Meyer told me. Meyer lives close to me and we met for an Italian dinner during the week after the Portland symposium. “So far, I’ve never seen a storm to surpass what I saw that night. Some storms have come close or matched it – but none have been worse.” Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites MarkBennett 5 #29705 January 6, 2012 Quote Quote Blevins: Am I invited to this symposim of yours as a speaker.Jerry Send complete resume, family history, blood type, photo of yourself, photo of your dog. Just kidding. Sure, you can have a speaking slot if you wish. Sorry, but Marla Cooper (who probably wouldn't attend anyway) is UN-invited to speak, unless she can offer up basic evidence that she didn't just make the whole story up to get a book deal. Who knows? Maybe the FBI will match prints to LD and I will have to eat roast crow for dinner the rest of the year. But so far I have seen only evidence that she's simply saying what she must to obtain a book deal, and I object to these tactics. Same goes for BK. Anyone else is welcome. I want to hear from the Bobby Dayton people, especially. Before you hammer on me too hard about Marla, consider this: I have printed up and researched every single interview she's done that I can find. And I can prove easily that she modifies the details in her story when it's convenient, or when 'issues' arise that might make it impossible for LD and Dewey to have pulled off the hijacking. But all she is really doing is digging herself a bigger hole. Example: Now she claims the two men landed only seven miles from Sisters, OR. So how did the money end up at Tena Bar? She says he lost it in the jump. The wind drift must have been fierce that day... Just another example of 'modifications' in her story, which I can easily prove by quoting from her different interviews. Ok, Robert. Fair enough. If you think Marla's continually changing her story: Write your article (with your sources) of how her story has changed. Then, before publishing to your web site, send it to Marla and invite her to respond. If she does, publish both your article and her response. I've read too many written interviews where the writer either misquotes, over-simplifies or just plain gets it wrong. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites 377 21 #29706 January 6, 2012 Blevins wroteQuoteSorry, but Marla Cooper (who probably wouldn't attend anyway) is UN-invited to speak, unless she can offer up basic evidence that she didn't just make the whole story... Geoff Gray was not such a control freak. Marla sure didn't help his book sales but he let her have center stage. I think you should be equally open and welcoming Robert. If everyone had to have proof to support their story you'd have a lot of trouble finding enough speakers to fill the time slot. Don't put up higher entry barriers for some than others. Marla didn't shy away from tough questions at the Portland symposium. If she wants to come to your summer symposium, let her come. A dialogue between the two of you would be very interesting. give her an invitation. 3772018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Orange1 0 #29707 January 6, 2012 Thanks 377... Ah, the Quade post sounds worthwhile looking for The Desert Boogie was on in Swakopmund while I was there... Felt weird not to be jumping at it... Watched the plane from the dunes... Shared a pitstop with an Avgas tanker briefly...lots of little airstrips all over southern Africa. Reading a book called "skeleton coast" by John Marsh... True story of a rescue along the coastline which will appeal to the boy's own adventure types....I'm reading the first edition which has some stuff unrevealed as it was written during ww2 but a kindle version has just been released which I believe is able to name some more names etc. (the Namibian coast is called skeleton coast because of the number of shipwrecks, and those who made it ashore were met with nothing but desert and searing heat). Anyway that is off topic, but what isn't is that I met a couple of people in Nam who I would have sworn were in their mid to late 40s but turned out to be mid 30s, having spent a lot of time outdoors in that harsh environment, which made me wonder again about the reliability of eyewitness estimates of Cooper's age. Skydiving: wasting fossil fuels just for fun. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites BruceSmith 3 #29708 January 6, 2012 When I was still working, a detective who began work on a cold case, sometimes 10 years old, would go back to the original crime report and make a list of what needed to be done. Then read the case file to see if all had been done or if there were errors or omissions. The FBI did on Cooper what had worked before and after on hijackings, it just didn’t work this time. I know if the agent could go back and redo the initial investigation he would, and I think may have found Coop. But 20/20 hindsight is a wonderful ability. Quote So, Rosie B, what would you do if you were in charge of the Cooper case? What would be your priorities? What would be your methods? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites JerryThomas 0 #29709 January 6, 2012 Mark : Why let Marla respond. It's her words that blevins will be using. Are you realy saying Give Marla a chance to change her story or make up a new one . Marla is a lier plain and simple. Jerry Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites 377 21 #29710 January 6, 2012 Jerry, I am just saying an open public dialog between Marla and her doubters would be beneficial. I'd like to see it. So would others. 3772018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Orange1 0 #29711 January 6, 2012 Quote Not a chance, 377. Guessing, theorizing, even if you're mistaken, that's one thing. What Marla is doing is quite another, and has nothing to do with the case. There is a difference between trying to offer a solution to the case and simply USING it for your own ends, while hurting the true investigators at the same time. I'm not making the same mistake Geoff Gray did. If things change regarding her claims, then okay. Otherwise, no. your excuses ring a bit hollow, Blevins. If you pick and choose based on your personal biases, I wouldn't expect anyone to take your symposium particularly seriously.Skydiving: wasting fossil fuels just for fun. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites mrshutter45 21 #29712 January 6, 2012 alot can happen between now and August, she will either still be around or maybe history by then?"It is surprising how aggressive people get, once they latch onto their suspect and say, 'Hey, he's our guy.' No matter what you tell them, they refuse to believe you" Agent Carr FBI Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Orange1 0 #29713 January 6, 2012 QuoteJerry, I am just saying an open public dialog between Marla and her doubters would be beneficial. I'd like to see it. So would others. 377 This. No-one has any solid evidence of anything. Let people make their own minds up about circumstantial evidence and motivations. Preventing people from speaking just casts doubts on the organiser's own motivations.Skydiving: wasting fossil fuels just for fun. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Orange1 0 #29714 January 6, 2012 QuoteMark : Why let Marla respond. It's her words that blevins will be using. Are you realy saying Give Marla a chance to change her story or make up a new one . Marla is a lier plain and simple. Jerry Hello Jerry and happy new year! Surely you don't think Blevins will give an objective synopsis of Marla??!Skydiving: wasting fossil fuels just for fun. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites JerryThomas 0 #29715 January 6, 2012 Orange 1: I was responding to Mark Bennets post not 377. I believe Blevins will allow her to make a bigger fool of her self.If she appears the queations she will be asked will not be so easy for her to answer this time. After all even Marla's family and friend's have stated she has made up this story of her's. Even I have recieved phone calls from her friends stating she is lieing.Happy new year to you and your family and to all on the forum. This is going to be a good year for all. Jerry Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Orange1 0 #29716 January 6, 2012 Quote Orange 1: I was responding to Mark Bennets post not 377. I believe Blevins will allow her to make a bigger fool of her self.If she appears the queations she will be asked will not be so easy for her to answer this time. After all even Marla's family and friend's have stated she has made up this story of her's. Even I have recieved phone calls from her friends stating she is lieing.Happy new year to you and your family and to all on the forum. This is going to be a good year for all. Jerry Ah, ok. And re what you say, this is exactly why Blevins should allow her to speak. Otherwise it looks like he is scared of her I hope it is indeed a good year for all, hope you and shelly are both well. We are trying to figure out if we can fit a trip to the US into our plans for this year but sadly again we are unlikely to make it to the west coast or northwest if we do...Skydiving: wasting fossil fuels just for fun. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites georger 197 #29717 January 6, 2012 QuoteQuoteQuoteQuoteAfter reading Bruce's article, I'm almost convinced nobody actually knows! Bruce, in your work on this case so far, with all the interviews you have done, have you picked up any anecdotes about the weather (in the V23 corridor) that afternoon and evening? Especially anything you would trust from reputable sources? Thanks, G. Quote I've spoken at length with Meyer Louie and the commentary he has shared here on the DZ is identical to what he told me. Also, I heard the older woman at the symposium who was impressed also with the gusty nature of the weather that night. Both folks tell corroborating stories. Both were in the I-5 corridor in and around Portland that night and buffeted by strong winds and lots of rain. Their accounts simply do not match what we're getting from official meteorological sources. Yes, the weather - especially the wind - intensifies dramatically in the Gorge, aka The Columbia Gorge, which funnels the Columbia River, but they are reporting strong winds and heavy rain in lands comparable to those where Cooper jumped. The famous Columbia Gorge begins a bit east of the Washougal area, and my best estimate of this westernmost end of the Gorge is that it begins about 20 miles east of Portland and the I-5. If you're looking on a map, Mt. Hood is on the Oregon side of the river and Mt Adams on the WA side and they form the backbone of the Gorge, which ends about 60 miles east as the Cascade Mountains peter-out as one approaches the lands of the Yakima Reservation in Washington. Winds in the Gorge are always extreme; I would say 20-30 mph on average on a nice summer's day. As a result, the Columbia near The Dalles, Oregon (pronounced Dahls) is a world-renown windsurfing area. In addition, after the symposium I spoke extensively with Dona Elliott at the Ariel Tavern on the subject of the weather and the ground search in the vicinity of Ariel during the days immediately following the skyjacking. Dona summed up the weather of November 24, 1971 very simply: “It was terrible!” Not only was it windy, but Dona said that it was also cold, and she estimated that the snow level fell to about 1,500 feet, which is pretty low. Normal mid-winter snow levels generally do not fall below 2,000. Supporting that, the pix that Geoff Gray showed from chief case agent Charlie Farrell’s collection indicated lots of snow-filled fields and clear-cuts, presumably at lower elevations. This landscape appeared to be rolling hills and seemed to visually support the perspective offered by Tom Kaye that Cooper’s LZ, which was centered in Ariel, was mostly rolling hills with open wood lots and agricultural fields, along with about 10% dense forests. Little or none of it was mountainous, densely forested wilderness area. My best estimate is that the pictures were taken east of Ariel where the hills approach 2-3,000 feet. Nevertheless, there is some steep and rugged terrain in this area, such as the mountains that immediately surround Lake Merwin, which may top 5,000 feet. Supporting Dona, Geoff also writes that federal ground searches were called off in the days just Cooper’s jump because the snow was too deep to negotiate. Not sure how deep, or where the FBI was tromping, but Geoff displayed the FBI’s documents that sounded convincing. Lastly, Meyer told me that the weather that night was so rough that ever since he has used it as a personal gauge for intense weather. “’Is it as bad as was that night?’” is what I say when I see a bad storm,” Meyer told me. Meyer lives close to me and we met for an Italian dinner during the week after the Portland symposium. “So far, I’ve never seen a storm to surpass what I saw that night. Some storms have come close or matched it – but none have been worse.” Thanks Bruce! This is good material. I was posting earlier but our net went down here - forgot maintenance was scheduled for midnight so Im sitting here typing and zap ! Back up now. Thanks. Galen is back in motion - after the holidays. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites georger 197 #29718 January 6, 2012 [while hurting the true investigators at the same time. . Do you have actual evidence this is happening - have you talked to the "true investigators" ? - or is this just another "I know it when I see it" hypothesis on your part? I mean Robt. Youve been wrong before. But I sense I am just wasting my time with you, again. You will do as you do, in any event. You will even cancel the affair, if you decide to. But dont cry fire, in a theatre! That will definately get you negative publicity of the permanent and lasting kind. Hey! Here's a new idea! BLAME ME FOR ANYTHING THAT GOES WRONG! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites georger 197 #29719 January 6, 2012 QuoteOrange 1: I was responding to Mark Bennets post not 377. I believe Blevins will allow her to make a bigger fool of her self.If she appears the queations she will be asked will not be so easy for her to answer this time. After all even Marla's family and friend's have stated she has made up this story of her's. Even I have recieved phone calls from her friends stating she is lieing.Happy new year to you and your family and to all on the forum. This is going to be a good year for all. Jerry Did you get my New Year's greeting? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites georger 197 #29720 January 6, 2012 Quote Quote [while hurting the true investigators at the same time. . Do you have actual evidence this is happening - have you talked to the "true investigators" ? - or is this just another "I know it when I see it" hypothesis on your part? I mean Robt. Youve been wrong before. But I sense I am just wasting my time with you, again. You will do as you do, in any event. You will even cancel the affair, if you decide to. But dont cry fire, in a theatre! That will definately get you negative publicity of the permanent and lasting kind. Hey! Here's a new idea! BLAME ME FOR ANYTHING THAT GOES WRONG! I don't blame you for a thing. I'm not calling it off now, or anytime in the future. But I WILL hold potential speakers to a minimum standard of legitimacy. Call me a tough guy on it, but that's the way it is. This is a community event, it's not about me. And I'm not going to let my hometown down on it. They gave me this job and I have to do the best I can to make sure it isn't a circus, or used as someone's private promotion with motives other than discovering the truth on the Cooper case. Otherwise, what's the point? Can't explain it any better than that. As far as interest, I have about seven months left to fill nine more speaker slots. This shouldn't be a problem. Invites go out next week. The theatre is also the only place at Good Ol' Days where you can merchandise without paying the $250 city fee they usually charge the vendors. I'm openly inviting those people to show up with their stuff, or others who want to present their case with printed material. The Book Swap alone would get me to show up. You think organizing this is EASY? I'm giving it my best shot, though. As I said, you will do as you will do. That is a given. I am sure you will try as best you can. I think you and the people of Auburn have every right to set your own agenda. Thats my final word on this. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites 377 21 #29721 January 6, 2012 If Marla is banned there is little hope of getting Farflung to attend. Unintended consequences... sigh. 3772018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Orange1 0 #29722 January 6, 2012 Quote ]But I WILL hold potential speakers to a minimum standard of legitimacy. uhhhh... at the risk of sounding like someone else, what on earth makes you qualified to judge this? especially given your own vested interest in the matter?Skydiving: wasting fossil fuels just for fun. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites BobKnoss 0 #29723 January 6, 2012 QuoteQuote ]But I WILL hold potential speakers to a minimum standard of legitimacy. uhhhh... at the risk of sounding like someone else, what on earth makes you qualified to judge this? especially given your own vested interest in the matter? I should be the moderator and roast each speaker after their presentation. Hindsight as good as it gets! Can I get a full body armor suit and can we hot wire Blevins? I'll hold the buzzer. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites MarkBennett 5 #29724 January 6, 2012 Quote Jerry, I am just saying an open public dialog between Marla and her doubters would be beneficial. I'd like to see it. So would others. 377 Robert and Jerry, I agree with 377 (and not just because he's a fellow Mark).I don't know Marla well. I met her at the symposium and she's answered a few emails. But she has never shied away from any question. Ever. She even responded to a post when many personal items were drug up. Nobody has to believe Marla's story. You can question her motives. But if you really want to be fair, you have to give her the chance to defend it. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites matthewcline 0 #29725 January 6, 2012 QuoteQuoteQuoteQuote ]But I WILL hold potential speakers to a minimum standard of legitimacy. uhhhh... at the risk of sounding like someone else, what on earth makes you qualified to judge this? especially given your own vested interest in the matter? I should be the moderator and roast each speaker after their presentation. Hindsight as good as it gets! Can I get a full body armor suit and can we hot wire Blevins? I'll hold the buzzer. It's a community event and anyone can attend in the audience. Admission is free. Speaker and vendor selections are a different thing. Those are pre-assigned. If Marla or yourself wish to show up to watch, you are more than welcome. Speakers get either fifteen or thirty minute assigned slots, their choice. An official program is usually made available online, and print copies are handed out at the door. This system has been used for the past several years. Now that would be a hoot! Although, I suspect some here would pale miserably in public when speaking. Some would come across as complete idiots and possibly insane too. Others would receive a sympathy nod, but not be taken seriously. "Talking" symposiums are great, but usually fruitless. A Symposium where physical evidence must be presented to get a slot, that would be beneficial. MattAn Instructors first concern is student safety. So, start being safe, first!!! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Prev 1184 1185 1186 1187 1188 1189 1190 1191 1192 1193 1194 Next Page 1189 of 2541 Join the conversation You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account. 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MarkBennett 5 #29705 January 6, 2012 Quote Quote Blevins: Am I invited to this symposim of yours as a speaker.Jerry Send complete resume, family history, blood type, photo of yourself, photo of your dog. Just kidding. Sure, you can have a speaking slot if you wish. Sorry, but Marla Cooper (who probably wouldn't attend anyway) is UN-invited to speak, unless she can offer up basic evidence that she didn't just make the whole story up to get a book deal. Who knows? Maybe the FBI will match prints to LD and I will have to eat roast crow for dinner the rest of the year. But so far I have seen only evidence that she's simply saying what she must to obtain a book deal, and I object to these tactics. Same goes for BK. Anyone else is welcome. I want to hear from the Bobby Dayton people, especially. Before you hammer on me too hard about Marla, consider this: I have printed up and researched every single interview she's done that I can find. And I can prove easily that she modifies the details in her story when it's convenient, or when 'issues' arise that might make it impossible for LD and Dewey to have pulled off the hijacking. But all she is really doing is digging herself a bigger hole. Example: Now she claims the two men landed only seven miles from Sisters, OR. So how did the money end up at Tena Bar? She says he lost it in the jump. The wind drift must have been fierce that day... Just another example of 'modifications' in her story, which I can easily prove by quoting from her different interviews. Ok, Robert. Fair enough. If you think Marla's continually changing her story: Write your article (with your sources) of how her story has changed. Then, before publishing to your web site, send it to Marla and invite her to respond. If she does, publish both your article and her response. I've read too many written interviews where the writer either misquotes, over-simplifies or just plain gets it wrong. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
377 21 #29706 January 6, 2012 Blevins wroteQuoteSorry, but Marla Cooper (who probably wouldn't attend anyway) is UN-invited to speak, unless she can offer up basic evidence that she didn't just make the whole story... Geoff Gray was not such a control freak. Marla sure didn't help his book sales but he let her have center stage. I think you should be equally open and welcoming Robert. If everyone had to have proof to support their story you'd have a lot of trouble finding enough speakers to fill the time slot. Don't put up higher entry barriers for some than others. Marla didn't shy away from tough questions at the Portland symposium. If she wants to come to your summer symposium, let her come. A dialogue between the two of you would be very interesting. give her an invitation. 3772018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Orange1 0 #29707 January 6, 2012 Thanks 377... Ah, the Quade post sounds worthwhile looking for The Desert Boogie was on in Swakopmund while I was there... Felt weird not to be jumping at it... Watched the plane from the dunes... Shared a pitstop with an Avgas tanker briefly...lots of little airstrips all over southern Africa. Reading a book called "skeleton coast" by John Marsh... True story of a rescue along the coastline which will appeal to the boy's own adventure types....I'm reading the first edition which has some stuff unrevealed as it was written during ww2 but a kindle version has just been released which I believe is able to name some more names etc. (the Namibian coast is called skeleton coast because of the number of shipwrecks, and those who made it ashore were met with nothing but desert and searing heat). Anyway that is off topic, but what isn't is that I met a couple of people in Nam who I would have sworn were in their mid to late 40s but turned out to be mid 30s, having spent a lot of time outdoors in that harsh environment, which made me wonder again about the reliability of eyewitness estimates of Cooper's age. Skydiving: wasting fossil fuels just for fun. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BruceSmith 3 #29708 January 6, 2012 When I was still working, a detective who began work on a cold case, sometimes 10 years old, would go back to the original crime report and make a list of what needed to be done. Then read the case file to see if all had been done or if there were errors or omissions. The FBI did on Cooper what had worked before and after on hijackings, it just didn’t work this time. I know if the agent could go back and redo the initial investigation he would, and I think may have found Coop. But 20/20 hindsight is a wonderful ability. Quote So, Rosie B, what would you do if you were in charge of the Cooper case? What would be your priorities? What would be your methods? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites JerryThomas 0 #29709 January 6, 2012 Mark : Why let Marla respond. It's her words that blevins will be using. Are you realy saying Give Marla a chance to change her story or make up a new one . Marla is a lier plain and simple. Jerry Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites 377 21 #29710 January 6, 2012 Jerry, I am just saying an open public dialog between Marla and her doubters would be beneficial. I'd like to see it. So would others. 3772018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Orange1 0 #29711 January 6, 2012 Quote Not a chance, 377. Guessing, theorizing, even if you're mistaken, that's one thing. What Marla is doing is quite another, and has nothing to do with the case. There is a difference between trying to offer a solution to the case and simply USING it for your own ends, while hurting the true investigators at the same time. I'm not making the same mistake Geoff Gray did. If things change regarding her claims, then okay. Otherwise, no. your excuses ring a bit hollow, Blevins. If you pick and choose based on your personal biases, I wouldn't expect anyone to take your symposium particularly seriously.Skydiving: wasting fossil fuels just for fun. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites mrshutter45 21 #29712 January 6, 2012 alot can happen between now and August, she will either still be around or maybe history by then?"It is surprising how aggressive people get, once they latch onto their suspect and say, 'Hey, he's our guy.' No matter what you tell them, they refuse to believe you" Agent Carr FBI Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Orange1 0 #29713 January 6, 2012 QuoteJerry, I am just saying an open public dialog between Marla and her doubters would be beneficial. I'd like to see it. So would others. 377 This. No-one has any solid evidence of anything. Let people make their own minds up about circumstantial evidence and motivations. Preventing people from speaking just casts doubts on the organiser's own motivations.Skydiving: wasting fossil fuels just for fun. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Orange1 0 #29714 January 6, 2012 QuoteMark : Why let Marla respond. It's her words that blevins will be using. Are you realy saying Give Marla a chance to change her story or make up a new one . Marla is a lier plain and simple. Jerry Hello Jerry and happy new year! Surely you don't think Blevins will give an objective synopsis of Marla??!Skydiving: wasting fossil fuels just for fun. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites JerryThomas 0 #29715 January 6, 2012 Orange 1: I was responding to Mark Bennets post not 377. I believe Blevins will allow her to make a bigger fool of her self.If she appears the queations she will be asked will not be so easy for her to answer this time. After all even Marla's family and friend's have stated she has made up this story of her's. Even I have recieved phone calls from her friends stating she is lieing.Happy new year to you and your family and to all on the forum. This is going to be a good year for all. Jerry Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Orange1 0 #29716 January 6, 2012 Quote Orange 1: I was responding to Mark Bennets post not 377. I believe Blevins will allow her to make a bigger fool of her self.If she appears the queations she will be asked will not be so easy for her to answer this time. After all even Marla's family and friend's have stated she has made up this story of her's. Even I have recieved phone calls from her friends stating she is lieing.Happy new year to you and your family and to all on the forum. This is going to be a good year for all. Jerry Ah, ok. And re what you say, this is exactly why Blevins should allow her to speak. Otherwise it looks like he is scared of her I hope it is indeed a good year for all, hope you and shelly are both well. We are trying to figure out if we can fit a trip to the US into our plans for this year but sadly again we are unlikely to make it to the west coast or northwest if we do...Skydiving: wasting fossil fuels just for fun. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites georger 197 #29717 January 6, 2012 QuoteQuoteQuoteQuoteAfter reading Bruce's article, I'm almost convinced nobody actually knows! Bruce, in your work on this case so far, with all the interviews you have done, have you picked up any anecdotes about the weather (in the V23 corridor) that afternoon and evening? Especially anything you would trust from reputable sources? Thanks, G. Quote I've spoken at length with Meyer Louie and the commentary he has shared here on the DZ is identical to what he told me. Also, I heard the older woman at the symposium who was impressed also with the gusty nature of the weather that night. Both folks tell corroborating stories. Both were in the I-5 corridor in and around Portland that night and buffeted by strong winds and lots of rain. Their accounts simply do not match what we're getting from official meteorological sources. Yes, the weather - especially the wind - intensifies dramatically in the Gorge, aka The Columbia Gorge, which funnels the Columbia River, but they are reporting strong winds and heavy rain in lands comparable to those where Cooper jumped. The famous Columbia Gorge begins a bit east of the Washougal area, and my best estimate of this westernmost end of the Gorge is that it begins about 20 miles east of Portland and the I-5. If you're looking on a map, Mt. Hood is on the Oregon side of the river and Mt Adams on the WA side and they form the backbone of the Gorge, which ends about 60 miles east as the Cascade Mountains peter-out as one approaches the lands of the Yakima Reservation in Washington. Winds in the Gorge are always extreme; I would say 20-30 mph on average on a nice summer's day. As a result, the Columbia near The Dalles, Oregon (pronounced Dahls) is a world-renown windsurfing area. In addition, after the symposium I spoke extensively with Dona Elliott at the Ariel Tavern on the subject of the weather and the ground search in the vicinity of Ariel during the days immediately following the skyjacking. Dona summed up the weather of November 24, 1971 very simply: “It was terrible!” Not only was it windy, but Dona said that it was also cold, and she estimated that the snow level fell to about 1,500 feet, which is pretty low. Normal mid-winter snow levels generally do not fall below 2,000. Supporting that, the pix that Geoff Gray showed from chief case agent Charlie Farrell’s collection indicated lots of snow-filled fields and clear-cuts, presumably at lower elevations. This landscape appeared to be rolling hills and seemed to visually support the perspective offered by Tom Kaye that Cooper’s LZ, which was centered in Ariel, was mostly rolling hills with open wood lots and agricultural fields, along with about 10% dense forests. Little or none of it was mountainous, densely forested wilderness area. My best estimate is that the pictures were taken east of Ariel where the hills approach 2-3,000 feet. Nevertheless, there is some steep and rugged terrain in this area, such as the mountains that immediately surround Lake Merwin, which may top 5,000 feet. Supporting Dona, Geoff also writes that federal ground searches were called off in the days just Cooper’s jump because the snow was too deep to negotiate. Not sure how deep, or where the FBI was tromping, but Geoff displayed the FBI’s documents that sounded convincing. Lastly, Meyer told me that the weather that night was so rough that ever since he has used it as a personal gauge for intense weather. “’Is it as bad as was that night?’” is what I say when I see a bad storm,” Meyer told me. Meyer lives close to me and we met for an Italian dinner during the week after the Portland symposium. “So far, I’ve never seen a storm to surpass what I saw that night. Some storms have come close or matched it – but none have been worse.” Thanks Bruce! This is good material. I was posting earlier but our net went down here - forgot maintenance was scheduled for midnight so Im sitting here typing and zap ! Back up now. Thanks. Galen is back in motion - after the holidays. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites georger 197 #29718 January 6, 2012 [while hurting the true investigators at the same time. . Do you have actual evidence this is happening - have you talked to the "true investigators" ? - or is this just another "I know it when I see it" hypothesis on your part? I mean Robt. Youve been wrong before. But I sense I am just wasting my time with you, again. You will do as you do, in any event. You will even cancel the affair, if you decide to. But dont cry fire, in a theatre! That will definately get you negative publicity of the permanent and lasting kind. Hey! Here's a new idea! BLAME ME FOR ANYTHING THAT GOES WRONG! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites georger 197 #29719 January 6, 2012 QuoteOrange 1: I was responding to Mark Bennets post not 377. I believe Blevins will allow her to make a bigger fool of her self.If she appears the queations she will be asked will not be so easy for her to answer this time. After all even Marla's family and friend's have stated she has made up this story of her's. Even I have recieved phone calls from her friends stating she is lieing.Happy new year to you and your family and to all on the forum. This is going to be a good year for all. Jerry Did you get my New Year's greeting? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites georger 197 #29720 January 6, 2012 Quote Quote [while hurting the true investigators at the same time. . Do you have actual evidence this is happening - have you talked to the "true investigators" ? - or is this just another "I know it when I see it" hypothesis on your part? I mean Robt. Youve been wrong before. But I sense I am just wasting my time with you, again. You will do as you do, in any event. You will even cancel the affair, if you decide to. But dont cry fire, in a theatre! That will definately get you negative publicity of the permanent and lasting kind. Hey! Here's a new idea! BLAME ME FOR ANYTHING THAT GOES WRONG! I don't blame you for a thing. I'm not calling it off now, or anytime in the future. But I WILL hold potential speakers to a minimum standard of legitimacy. Call me a tough guy on it, but that's the way it is. This is a community event, it's not about me. And I'm not going to let my hometown down on it. They gave me this job and I have to do the best I can to make sure it isn't a circus, or used as someone's private promotion with motives other than discovering the truth on the Cooper case. Otherwise, what's the point? Can't explain it any better than that. As far as interest, I have about seven months left to fill nine more speaker slots. This shouldn't be a problem. Invites go out next week. The theatre is also the only place at Good Ol' Days where you can merchandise without paying the $250 city fee they usually charge the vendors. I'm openly inviting those people to show up with their stuff, or others who want to present their case with printed material. The Book Swap alone would get me to show up. You think organizing this is EASY? I'm giving it my best shot, though. As I said, you will do as you will do. That is a given. I am sure you will try as best you can. I think you and the people of Auburn have every right to set your own agenda. Thats my final word on this. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites 377 21 #29721 January 6, 2012 If Marla is banned there is little hope of getting Farflung to attend. Unintended consequences... sigh. 3772018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Orange1 0 #29722 January 6, 2012 Quote ]But I WILL hold potential speakers to a minimum standard of legitimacy. uhhhh... at the risk of sounding like someone else, what on earth makes you qualified to judge this? especially given your own vested interest in the matter?Skydiving: wasting fossil fuels just for fun. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites BobKnoss 0 #29723 January 6, 2012 QuoteQuote ]But I WILL hold potential speakers to a minimum standard of legitimacy. uhhhh... at the risk of sounding like someone else, what on earth makes you qualified to judge this? especially given your own vested interest in the matter? I should be the moderator and roast each speaker after their presentation. Hindsight as good as it gets! Can I get a full body armor suit and can we hot wire Blevins? I'll hold the buzzer. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites MarkBennett 5 #29724 January 6, 2012 Quote Jerry, I am just saying an open public dialog between Marla and her doubters would be beneficial. I'd like to see it. So would others. 377 Robert and Jerry, I agree with 377 (and not just because he's a fellow Mark).I don't know Marla well. I met her at the symposium and she's answered a few emails. But she has never shied away from any question. Ever. She even responded to a post when many personal items were drug up. Nobody has to believe Marla's story. You can question her motives. But if you really want to be fair, you have to give her the chance to defend it. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites matthewcline 0 #29725 January 6, 2012 QuoteQuoteQuoteQuote ]But I WILL hold potential speakers to a minimum standard of legitimacy. uhhhh... at the risk of sounding like someone else, what on earth makes you qualified to judge this? especially given your own vested interest in the matter? I should be the moderator and roast each speaker after their presentation. Hindsight as good as it gets! Can I get a full body armor suit and can we hot wire Blevins? I'll hold the buzzer. It's a community event and anyone can attend in the audience. Admission is free. Speaker and vendor selections are a different thing. Those are pre-assigned. If Marla or yourself wish to show up to watch, you are more than welcome. Speakers get either fifteen or thirty minute assigned slots, their choice. An official program is usually made available online, and print copies are handed out at the door. This system has been used for the past several years. Now that would be a hoot! Although, I suspect some here would pale miserably in public when speaking. Some would come across as complete idiots and possibly insane too. Others would receive a sympathy nod, but not be taken seriously. "Talking" symposiums are great, but usually fruitless. A Symposium where physical evidence must be presented to get a slot, that would be beneficial. MattAn Instructors first concern is student safety. So, start being safe, first!!! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Prev 1184 1185 1186 1187 1188 1189 1190 1191 1192 1193 1194 Next Page 1189 of 2541 Join the conversation You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account. 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JerryThomas 0 #29709 January 6, 2012 Mark : Why let Marla respond. It's her words that blevins will be using. Are you realy saying Give Marla a chance to change her story or make up a new one . Marla is a lier plain and simple. Jerry Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
377 21 #29710 January 6, 2012 Jerry, I am just saying an open public dialog between Marla and her doubters would be beneficial. I'd like to see it. So would others. 3772018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Orange1 0 #29711 January 6, 2012 Quote Not a chance, 377. Guessing, theorizing, even if you're mistaken, that's one thing. What Marla is doing is quite another, and has nothing to do with the case. There is a difference between trying to offer a solution to the case and simply USING it for your own ends, while hurting the true investigators at the same time. I'm not making the same mistake Geoff Gray did. If things change regarding her claims, then okay. Otherwise, no. your excuses ring a bit hollow, Blevins. If you pick and choose based on your personal biases, I wouldn't expect anyone to take your symposium particularly seriously.Skydiving: wasting fossil fuels just for fun. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mrshutter45 21 #29712 January 6, 2012 alot can happen between now and August, she will either still be around or maybe history by then?"It is surprising how aggressive people get, once they latch onto their suspect and say, 'Hey, he's our guy.' No matter what you tell them, they refuse to believe you" Agent Carr FBI Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Orange1 0 #29713 January 6, 2012 QuoteJerry, I am just saying an open public dialog between Marla and her doubters would be beneficial. I'd like to see it. So would others. 377 This. No-one has any solid evidence of anything. Let people make their own minds up about circumstantial evidence and motivations. Preventing people from speaking just casts doubts on the organiser's own motivations.Skydiving: wasting fossil fuels just for fun. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Orange1 0 #29714 January 6, 2012 QuoteMark : Why let Marla respond. It's her words that blevins will be using. Are you realy saying Give Marla a chance to change her story or make up a new one . Marla is a lier plain and simple. Jerry Hello Jerry and happy new year! Surely you don't think Blevins will give an objective synopsis of Marla??!Skydiving: wasting fossil fuels just for fun. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JerryThomas 0 #29715 January 6, 2012 Orange 1: I was responding to Mark Bennets post not 377. I believe Blevins will allow her to make a bigger fool of her self.If she appears the queations she will be asked will not be so easy for her to answer this time. After all even Marla's family and friend's have stated she has made up this story of her's. Even I have recieved phone calls from her friends stating she is lieing.Happy new year to you and your family and to all on the forum. This is going to be a good year for all. Jerry Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Orange1 0 #29716 January 6, 2012 Quote Orange 1: I was responding to Mark Bennets post not 377. I believe Blevins will allow her to make a bigger fool of her self.If she appears the queations she will be asked will not be so easy for her to answer this time. After all even Marla's family and friend's have stated she has made up this story of her's. Even I have recieved phone calls from her friends stating she is lieing.Happy new year to you and your family and to all on the forum. This is going to be a good year for all. Jerry Ah, ok. And re what you say, this is exactly why Blevins should allow her to speak. Otherwise it looks like he is scared of her I hope it is indeed a good year for all, hope you and shelly are both well. We are trying to figure out if we can fit a trip to the US into our plans for this year but sadly again we are unlikely to make it to the west coast or northwest if we do...Skydiving: wasting fossil fuels just for fun. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
georger 197 #29717 January 6, 2012 QuoteQuoteQuoteQuoteAfter reading Bruce's article, I'm almost convinced nobody actually knows! Bruce, in your work on this case so far, with all the interviews you have done, have you picked up any anecdotes about the weather (in the V23 corridor) that afternoon and evening? Especially anything you would trust from reputable sources? Thanks, G. Quote I've spoken at length with Meyer Louie and the commentary he has shared here on the DZ is identical to what he told me. Also, I heard the older woman at the symposium who was impressed also with the gusty nature of the weather that night. Both folks tell corroborating stories. Both were in the I-5 corridor in and around Portland that night and buffeted by strong winds and lots of rain. Their accounts simply do not match what we're getting from official meteorological sources. Yes, the weather - especially the wind - intensifies dramatically in the Gorge, aka The Columbia Gorge, which funnels the Columbia River, but they are reporting strong winds and heavy rain in lands comparable to those where Cooper jumped. The famous Columbia Gorge begins a bit east of the Washougal area, and my best estimate of this westernmost end of the Gorge is that it begins about 20 miles east of Portland and the I-5. If you're looking on a map, Mt. Hood is on the Oregon side of the river and Mt Adams on the WA side and they form the backbone of the Gorge, which ends about 60 miles east as the Cascade Mountains peter-out as one approaches the lands of the Yakima Reservation in Washington. Winds in the Gorge are always extreme; I would say 20-30 mph on average on a nice summer's day. As a result, the Columbia near The Dalles, Oregon (pronounced Dahls) is a world-renown windsurfing area. In addition, after the symposium I spoke extensively with Dona Elliott at the Ariel Tavern on the subject of the weather and the ground search in the vicinity of Ariel during the days immediately following the skyjacking. Dona summed up the weather of November 24, 1971 very simply: “It was terrible!” Not only was it windy, but Dona said that it was also cold, and she estimated that the snow level fell to about 1,500 feet, which is pretty low. Normal mid-winter snow levels generally do not fall below 2,000. Supporting that, the pix that Geoff Gray showed from chief case agent Charlie Farrell’s collection indicated lots of snow-filled fields and clear-cuts, presumably at lower elevations. This landscape appeared to be rolling hills and seemed to visually support the perspective offered by Tom Kaye that Cooper’s LZ, which was centered in Ariel, was mostly rolling hills with open wood lots and agricultural fields, along with about 10% dense forests. Little or none of it was mountainous, densely forested wilderness area. My best estimate is that the pictures were taken east of Ariel where the hills approach 2-3,000 feet. Nevertheless, there is some steep and rugged terrain in this area, such as the mountains that immediately surround Lake Merwin, which may top 5,000 feet. Supporting Dona, Geoff also writes that federal ground searches were called off in the days just Cooper’s jump because the snow was too deep to negotiate. Not sure how deep, or where the FBI was tromping, but Geoff displayed the FBI’s documents that sounded convincing. Lastly, Meyer told me that the weather that night was so rough that ever since he has used it as a personal gauge for intense weather. “’Is it as bad as was that night?’” is what I say when I see a bad storm,” Meyer told me. Meyer lives close to me and we met for an Italian dinner during the week after the Portland symposium. “So far, I’ve never seen a storm to surpass what I saw that night. Some storms have come close or matched it – but none have been worse.” Thanks Bruce! This is good material. I was posting earlier but our net went down here - forgot maintenance was scheduled for midnight so Im sitting here typing and zap ! Back up now. Thanks. Galen is back in motion - after the holidays. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites georger 197 #29718 January 6, 2012 [while hurting the true investigators at the same time. . Do you have actual evidence this is happening - have you talked to the "true investigators" ? - or is this just another "I know it when I see it" hypothesis on your part? I mean Robt. Youve been wrong before. But I sense I am just wasting my time with you, again. You will do as you do, in any event. You will even cancel the affair, if you decide to. But dont cry fire, in a theatre! That will definately get you negative publicity of the permanent and lasting kind. Hey! Here's a new idea! BLAME ME FOR ANYTHING THAT GOES WRONG! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites georger 197 #29719 January 6, 2012 QuoteOrange 1: I was responding to Mark Bennets post not 377. I believe Blevins will allow her to make a bigger fool of her self.If she appears the queations she will be asked will not be so easy for her to answer this time. After all even Marla's family and friend's have stated she has made up this story of her's. Even I have recieved phone calls from her friends stating she is lieing.Happy new year to you and your family and to all on the forum. This is going to be a good year for all. Jerry Did you get my New Year's greeting? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites georger 197 #29720 January 6, 2012 Quote Quote [while hurting the true investigators at the same time. . Do you have actual evidence this is happening - have you talked to the "true investigators" ? - or is this just another "I know it when I see it" hypothesis on your part? I mean Robt. Youve been wrong before. But I sense I am just wasting my time with you, again. You will do as you do, in any event. You will even cancel the affair, if you decide to. But dont cry fire, in a theatre! That will definately get you negative publicity of the permanent and lasting kind. Hey! Here's a new idea! BLAME ME FOR ANYTHING THAT GOES WRONG! I don't blame you for a thing. I'm not calling it off now, or anytime in the future. But I WILL hold potential speakers to a minimum standard of legitimacy. Call me a tough guy on it, but that's the way it is. This is a community event, it's not about me. And I'm not going to let my hometown down on it. They gave me this job and I have to do the best I can to make sure it isn't a circus, or used as someone's private promotion with motives other than discovering the truth on the Cooper case. Otherwise, what's the point? Can't explain it any better than that. As far as interest, I have about seven months left to fill nine more speaker slots. This shouldn't be a problem. Invites go out next week. The theatre is also the only place at Good Ol' Days where you can merchandise without paying the $250 city fee they usually charge the vendors. I'm openly inviting those people to show up with their stuff, or others who want to present their case with printed material. The Book Swap alone would get me to show up. You think organizing this is EASY? I'm giving it my best shot, though. As I said, you will do as you will do. That is a given. I am sure you will try as best you can. I think you and the people of Auburn have every right to set your own agenda. Thats my final word on this. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites 377 21 #29721 January 6, 2012 If Marla is banned there is little hope of getting Farflung to attend. Unintended consequences... sigh. 3772018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Orange1 0 #29722 January 6, 2012 Quote ]But I WILL hold potential speakers to a minimum standard of legitimacy. uhhhh... at the risk of sounding like someone else, what on earth makes you qualified to judge this? especially given your own vested interest in the matter?Skydiving: wasting fossil fuels just for fun. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites BobKnoss 0 #29723 January 6, 2012 QuoteQuote ]But I WILL hold potential speakers to a minimum standard of legitimacy. uhhhh... at the risk of sounding like someone else, what on earth makes you qualified to judge this? especially given your own vested interest in the matter? I should be the moderator and roast each speaker after their presentation. Hindsight as good as it gets! Can I get a full body armor suit and can we hot wire Blevins? I'll hold the buzzer. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites MarkBennett 5 #29724 January 6, 2012 Quote Jerry, I am just saying an open public dialog between Marla and her doubters would be beneficial. I'd like to see it. So would others. 377 Robert and Jerry, I agree with 377 (and not just because he's a fellow Mark).I don't know Marla well. I met her at the symposium and she's answered a few emails. But she has never shied away from any question. Ever. She even responded to a post when many personal items were drug up. Nobody has to believe Marla's story. You can question her motives. But if you really want to be fair, you have to give her the chance to defend it. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites matthewcline 0 #29725 January 6, 2012 QuoteQuoteQuoteQuote ]But I WILL hold potential speakers to a minimum standard of legitimacy. uhhhh... at the risk of sounding like someone else, what on earth makes you qualified to judge this? especially given your own vested interest in the matter? I should be the moderator and roast each speaker after their presentation. Hindsight as good as it gets! Can I get a full body armor suit and can we hot wire Blevins? I'll hold the buzzer. It's a community event and anyone can attend in the audience. Admission is free. Speaker and vendor selections are a different thing. Those are pre-assigned. If Marla or yourself wish to show up to watch, you are more than welcome. Speakers get either fifteen or thirty minute assigned slots, their choice. An official program is usually made available online, and print copies are handed out at the door. This system has been used for the past several years. Now that would be a hoot! Although, I suspect some here would pale miserably in public when speaking. Some would come across as complete idiots and possibly insane too. Others would receive a sympathy nod, but not be taken seriously. "Talking" symposiums are great, but usually fruitless. A Symposium where physical evidence must be presented to get a slot, that would be beneficial. MattAn Instructors first concern is student safety. So, start being safe, first!!! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Prev 1184 1185 1186 1187 1188 1189 1190 1191 1192 1193 1194 Next Page 1189 of 2541 Join the conversation You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account. Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible. Reply to this topic... × Pasted as rich text. Paste as plain text instead Only 75 emoji are allowed. × Your link has been automatically embedded. Display as a link instead × Your previous content has been restored. Clear editor × You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL. Insert image from URL × Desktop Tablet Phone Submit Reply 47 47 Go To Topic Listing
georger 197 #29718 January 6, 2012 [while hurting the true investigators at the same time. . Do you have actual evidence this is happening - have you talked to the "true investigators" ? - or is this just another "I know it when I see it" hypothesis on your part? I mean Robt. Youve been wrong before. But I sense I am just wasting my time with you, again. You will do as you do, in any event. You will even cancel the affair, if you decide to. But dont cry fire, in a theatre! That will definately get you negative publicity of the permanent and lasting kind. Hey! Here's a new idea! BLAME ME FOR ANYTHING THAT GOES WRONG! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
georger 197 #29719 January 6, 2012 QuoteOrange 1: I was responding to Mark Bennets post not 377. I believe Blevins will allow her to make a bigger fool of her self.If she appears the queations she will be asked will not be so easy for her to answer this time. After all even Marla's family and friend's have stated she has made up this story of her's. Even I have recieved phone calls from her friends stating she is lieing.Happy new year to you and your family and to all on the forum. This is going to be a good year for all. Jerry Did you get my New Year's greeting? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
georger 197 #29720 January 6, 2012 Quote Quote [while hurting the true investigators at the same time. . Do you have actual evidence this is happening - have you talked to the "true investigators" ? - or is this just another "I know it when I see it" hypothesis on your part? I mean Robt. Youve been wrong before. But I sense I am just wasting my time with you, again. You will do as you do, in any event. You will even cancel the affair, if you decide to. But dont cry fire, in a theatre! That will definately get you negative publicity of the permanent and lasting kind. Hey! Here's a new idea! BLAME ME FOR ANYTHING THAT GOES WRONG! I don't blame you for a thing. I'm not calling it off now, or anytime in the future. But I WILL hold potential speakers to a minimum standard of legitimacy. Call me a tough guy on it, but that's the way it is. This is a community event, it's not about me. And I'm not going to let my hometown down on it. They gave me this job and I have to do the best I can to make sure it isn't a circus, or used as someone's private promotion with motives other than discovering the truth on the Cooper case. Otherwise, what's the point? Can't explain it any better than that. As far as interest, I have about seven months left to fill nine more speaker slots. This shouldn't be a problem. Invites go out next week. The theatre is also the only place at Good Ol' Days where you can merchandise without paying the $250 city fee they usually charge the vendors. I'm openly inviting those people to show up with their stuff, or others who want to present their case with printed material. The Book Swap alone would get me to show up. You think organizing this is EASY? I'm giving it my best shot, though. As I said, you will do as you will do. That is a given. I am sure you will try as best you can. I think you and the people of Auburn have every right to set your own agenda. Thats my final word on this. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
377 21 #29721 January 6, 2012 If Marla is banned there is little hope of getting Farflung to attend. Unintended consequences... sigh. 3772018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Orange1 0 #29722 January 6, 2012 Quote ]But I WILL hold potential speakers to a minimum standard of legitimacy. uhhhh... at the risk of sounding like someone else, what on earth makes you qualified to judge this? especially given your own vested interest in the matter?Skydiving: wasting fossil fuels just for fun. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BobKnoss 0 #29723 January 6, 2012 QuoteQuote ]But I WILL hold potential speakers to a minimum standard of legitimacy. uhhhh... at the risk of sounding like someone else, what on earth makes you qualified to judge this? especially given your own vested interest in the matter? I should be the moderator and roast each speaker after their presentation. Hindsight as good as it gets! Can I get a full body armor suit and can we hot wire Blevins? I'll hold the buzzer. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
MarkBennett 5 #29724 January 6, 2012 Quote Jerry, I am just saying an open public dialog between Marla and her doubters would be beneficial. I'd like to see it. So would others. 377 Robert and Jerry, I agree with 377 (and not just because he's a fellow Mark).I don't know Marla well. I met her at the symposium and she's answered a few emails. But she has never shied away from any question. Ever. She even responded to a post when many personal items were drug up. Nobody has to believe Marla's story. You can question her motives. But if you really want to be fair, you have to give her the chance to defend it. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
matthewcline 0 #29725 January 6, 2012 QuoteQuoteQuoteQuote ]But I WILL hold potential speakers to a minimum standard of legitimacy. uhhhh... at the risk of sounding like someone else, what on earth makes you qualified to judge this? especially given your own vested interest in the matter? I should be the moderator and roast each speaker after their presentation. Hindsight as good as it gets! Can I get a full body armor suit and can we hot wire Blevins? I'll hold the buzzer. It's a community event and anyone can attend in the audience. Admission is free. Speaker and vendor selections are a different thing. Those are pre-assigned. If Marla or yourself wish to show up to watch, you are more than welcome. Speakers get either fifteen or thirty minute assigned slots, their choice. An official program is usually made available online, and print copies are handed out at the door. This system has been used for the past several years. Now that would be a hoot! Although, I suspect some here would pale miserably in public when speaking. Some would come across as complete idiots and possibly insane too. Others would receive a sympathy nod, but not be taken seriously. "Talking" symposiums are great, but usually fruitless. A Symposium where physical evidence must be presented to get a slot, that would be beneficial. MattAn Instructors first concern is student safety. So, start being safe, first!!! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
