DB Cooper

[BruceSmith 3]

I'll have more on this story in the days to come, plus pictures; they will all be posted on the Mountain News - WA.

In the meantime:

Parachutes, report on Norman Hayden meeting, October 24, 2011

This is a brief post on my trip to see Norman Hayden and his parachute that allegedly went for a ride from Sea-Tac to Reno about 40 years ago. I traveled in the company of Bruce Thun, manager of Pierce County Airport in Puyallup, WA.

Mr. Hayden was very gracious and generous with his time, and he showed us the parachute straight away.

However, in the course of the afternoon, he seemed to downplay the importance of his chute and his role in the Cooper story, although he maintains a Cooper file filled with newspaper clippings.

The rig was comparable to what is listed as Chute #1 in the FBI "parachute" document, p.227.

The container was "tan, soft cotton," although it looked more like a more rugged duck-cloth fabric. It appeared very much like worn-in Carhartt jacket material.

The canopy was identified on the rigging card as a white, 26-foot conical, rip-stop, and Norman was able to peel a couple inches of the canopy out of the container and it did look like white rip-stop nylon.

However, the container looked old, like WWII vintage, even though the manufacturing label said September 1957. I didn’t see any “wear marks,” as suggested in the FBI docs.

Although the bag looked old the harness material looked new, and I didn't see any special padding on them. There was a rectangular foam pad, covered in grayish-blue nylon that looked like a little pillow and was located in the middle part of the harness, as if it was padding to make the rig more comfortable for an acrobatic pilot to wear. The container was a Pioneer, type 226. I saw no Steinthal markings of any kind for the canopy, as FBI Cooper case agent Larry Carr has suggested.

The first signature on the rigging card was EJ Cossey, certification number 1579638, and dated May 21, 1971. The chute was re-packed twice after return from the FBI – 1982 and 1984. Norman has never used it to jump with. He is strictly a “precision acrobatic pilot.” He loves flying, and has restored many planes, apparently. Plus, his shop is filled with dozens of large scale model RC planes, which is a retirement hobby, he told us.

However, Norman was unable to provide any authenticating documents for the parachute.

In addition, I spoke with Barry Halstad of Pacific Aviation, which was located at Boeing Field in 1971.

I spoke with Mr. Halstad after my retune home from Norman, and Barry called me upon the suggestions of Norman. The two gentlemen seem to be good friends, and Barry joked quite a bit about Norman.

Barry is the guy who was the go-between Norman and NWO operations, probably the George Harrison that is identified in the FBI docs, although both Barry and Norman do not recall the name. Halstad said that NWO called him directly about 3-5 pm in the afternoon of Nov 24 because Pacific Aviation sold acrobatic aircraft and the folks at Sea-Tac knew that he would have back chutes for these planes. FAA regs require acro pilots to have a chute for themselves and one for a passenger. Both Barry and Norm stated that it was routine that the chutes used in acro planes would be identical rigs.

Barry said that he told the NWO guy that he did have chutes, but that all of them were cone-shaped seat packs, not back packs. However, he informed NWO that a recent customer of his, Norman, who had just bought a Decathlon acrobatic craft from Barry, had also recently purchased two back pack parachutes and had them at his shop in Kent.

Barry says he called Norman after the NWO guy hung up, and alerted him to prepare the back chutes for transport to NWO via taxi. Barry thinks he may have also called the taxi and made other transportation arrangements with the NWO guy, but he is unsure of this.

Barry has never heard of Earl Cossey, and had no idea that there was ever any controversy about Norman owning the two back pack parachutes that went on board 305.

Norman wasn’t 100% sure where the taxi went, nor is Barry. The FBI docs say that Norman had told the FBI that it had gone to Boeing Flight Service, Seattle, but that meant nothing to either gentleman when I asked about it.

Norman told me that all he remembers is that he put the two chutes in the taxi, gave him the address that the NWO ops guy gave him, and a receipt book for the NWO guy to sign. Norman says the cabbie retuned with the receipt book sign, but Norman says he doesn’t know where it might be at this time.

In addition, Norman says that he never spoke directly with anyone from the FBI. Further, Norman continued to claim that as far as he knows both back chutes were identical. He seemed a bit dismayed and wistful about bureaucratic in-accuracies when I read aloud the FBI description of the two back pack parachutes and their many differences.

However, Barry openly wonders if the FBI received four back pack parachutes that day – two from Norman that were identical, and two from Earl Cossey that were not. As a result, my next phone call is to find George Harrison of NWO, now Delta Airlines.

When Norman put the parachute on, a big smile broke out across his face and he said, “Hey, now that feels good.”

He is 79 years old, and when he was wearing the chute he clowned around for us.

It appears that he lives by himself in a small apartment in his shop, and Norman seems to be financially stable. He has several late-model vehicles parked in the shop, which is a sprawling 20,000 sq feet and clean-as-a-whistle.

Norman is a very interesting guy. He is a genius-engineer and machinist. His shop is filled with beautifully restored or original miniature engines, including a unique replica of a working Sterling heat engine, designed in 1820. Uncannily; it works on the pressure differentials between hot and cool air in a chamber that is heated by a little flame. Norm has built several miniatures of them that work flawlessly.

I had traveled to Norman’s shop in the company of Bruce Thun, the manager of Pierce County Airport in Puyallup, WA, also know by its original name, Thun Field, named after Bruce’s father, John. Traveling with Bruce Thun was a complete joy, and his personal knowledge of the Cooper story and its local players was fascinating.

In the 1971 era, Bruce was a jump plane pilot, and knew of Earl Cossey, who had a superb reputation as a skilled skydiver.

Further, in his duties as the manager of Thun Field, he was part of the National Geographic documentary filming in December 2008 at Thun Field, which featured local authors Ron and Pat Forman and focused on the Barb Dayton angle. During this intensive shoot, Earl Cossey was on site and Bruce met him.

In addition, Norman Hayden rented a hangar for a considerable period of time at Thun Field as well, apparently during the 1980s.

Bruce Thun told me that in 1971 there were three main skydiving field in western Washington – Issaquah Sky Sports, which is east of Seattle; a spot in Snohomish County north of Seattle; and Thun Field, which is located in central Pierce County, about 25 miles southeast of Tacoma, and about 35 miles away from Mt Rainier, which can be see in its full glory on clear days to the southeast.

[JerryThomas 0]

Jo; You know for a fact that Duane was not Cooper. All your stories are made up why do you continue to try and implicate him in this case. You have already admitted your Lies. Should I reference the posts that proves my statement. Jerry

[377 21]

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Both Barry and Norm stated that it was routine that the chutes used in acro planes would be identical rigs.

Not always. In the 1980's I went for a grueling acro ride (those negative Gs are nauseating) in a Great Lakes biplane. The passenger chute rig was an older surplus harness/container and the pilots rig was a much more recent commercial rig with padded straps etc.

I can ride extreme roller coasters all day long but this ride came close to making me sick. I did manage to hold my lunch, but it was close. I also experienced a near blackout in a 4+? G pull up. My vision field narrowed tremendously and color vision went to monochrome. I used the stomach tightening grunt technique to stem blood flow to my lower body and managed to stay conscious. We did an hour of acro. I was exhausted, nearly sick, but I never said "enough". The pilot was one of my skydiving instructors from the old days who had given up jumping and taken up acro flying.

The tan rig sure sounds to me like it was the one described in the leaked FBI report. The lack of the noted wear mark is puzzling though. The 26 ft Navy Conical is a GREAT canopy. My first reserve ride was on one. Soft landing.

We are indebted to you Bruce.

377

2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.

[377 21]

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The Amboy Chute had nothing to do with the Cooper Case. Larry Carr contacted me in reference to this Chute. It was inspected by Cossey and my self. the condition of the chute was determined to be not that old. Jerry

Jerry,

Was it a person or cargo canopy? Silk or twill nylon? Did the suspension lines go all the way up to the apex and down the other side or were they just attached to the skirt band at the bottom?

We know it was made in 1946 so what did you mean when you said the "condition was not that old"?

I don't think it's a Cooper chute but I am really curious what it is and how it ended up buried at Amboy.

377

2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.

[Orange1 0]

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Latin Descent has been misused.
All Florence was trying to do was to denote color type of complexion. Her only comparisions were Latin to indicate the golden undertones.
.

And Florence told you this herself, did she?
Or are you just making assumptions again and stating them as facts?

Skydiving: wasting fossil fuels just for fun.

[hangdiver 1]

Many thanks Bruce for pursuing this to the extent you did and I'm sure you're not finished.

What a fascinating find...!!!

I stand by my philosophy...Question Everything!!!

eta: “In the beginner's mind there are many possibilities but in the expert's there are few”
Shunryu Suzuki

hangdiver

"Mans got to know his limitations"
Harry Callahan

[BruceSmith 3]

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Both Barry and Norm stated that it was routine that the chutes used in acro planes would be identical rigs.

Not always. In the 1980's I went for a grueling acro ride (those negative Gs are nauseating) in a Great Lakes biplane. The passenger chute rig was an older surplus harness/container and the pilots rig was a much more recent commercial rig with padded straps etc.

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Cool story, Three-Seven- Seven, but I do have more information about Norman Hayden's purchasing habits.

Barry, who sold him an airplane, was insistent in telling me that Norman always went "first-class" when buying stuff, and that was quite evident in his selection of aricraft and acro gear. Now, Norman doesn't remember where, when or who he bought the parachutes from - it could be Cossey, or not - but Barry is convinced that Norman would have shopped for the best gear at the best price, and would have found it by buying two identical chutes.

That said, if he bought used chutes, why, or how, could they be identical? That would be unusual in my opinion, unless he bought them from a retiring acro pilot who had bought the parachutes when they were brand new, etc.

Reading the tea-leaves a little further here, Norman is the kind of guy who would cherish the sublime simplicity of identical parachutes and the value that would afford in an emergency.

One more thing. After copious - and good-natured - coaching from Hangdiver on the finer points of parachute rigging, the rig I saw yesterday had a left-sided in-board pull, meaning that the rip chord handle was mounted on the left shoulder strap facing inward toward the sternum-chest area of the skydiver. (How'd I do Hangdiver????)

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[ClassClown 0]

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Jo; You know for a fact that Duane was not Cooper. All your stories are made up why do you continue to try and implicate him in this case. You have already admitted your Lies. Should I reference the posts that proves my statement. Jerry

Please reference the post Jerry.

[377 21]

Bruce wrote

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One more thing. After copious - and good-natured - coaching from Hangdiver on the finer points of parachute rigging, the rig I saw yesterday had a left-sided in-board pull, meaning that the rip chord handle was mounted on the left shoulder strap facing inward toward the sternum-chest area of the skydiver. (How'd I do Hangdiver????)

Hangdiver knows more about rigging than I do, but I think you are doing fine Bruce.

If Norman was really going "first class" why would he have purchased rigs that contained used military surplus canopies? By used I mean packed and ready for use. I doubt if many (or any) surplus emergency chutes were ever deployed in a military jump.

In 71 commercial LoPo round canopies were widely available. They cost waaaay more than surplus canopies but had fabric that was of lower porosity than the surplus canopies like the 28 ft C9 and 26 ft Navy conical. The surplus canopies became known as "Cheapo" canopies indicating higher porosity and lower price than LoPos. The LoPos let you down softer compared to a similar sized Cheapo.

I wonder if Cossey is mistaken or misquoted in saying he put the rigs in a taxicab? Your opinion Bruce?

377

2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.

[377 21]

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Larry Carr told us it was a Pioneer type 226 sn 9/57

we never could figure out what type 226 was, or the sn.

NOW IT"S OBVIOUS
sn 9/57 was the date of manufacture? Bruce has confirmed the rig-not-taken was a 1957 rig

Bruce: was the 1957 printed on the container or what???

this is good info.

here's where Carr gave the detail on the pioneer:

http://www.dropzone.com/cgi-bin/forum/gforum.cgi?post=3396594;search_string=type%20226;#3396594

I like old chute gear, this is getting interesting. Now if we could only find an FBI report on radio intercepts that night in the suspected exit area.

"Breaker breaker, the Eagle has landed."

377

2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.

[377 21]

I wonder what Coss charged Norman for an old (1957!) rig with a used Navy surplus canopy?

Hope it was under $350. I hate to see people overpay for old parachute gear.

Don't get me wrong, I was jumping a 1951 C9 as late as 1978, but I paid peanuts for it.

377

2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.

[377 21]

Bruce wrote:

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Although the bag looked old the harness material looked new, and I didn't see any special padding on them. There was a rectangular foam pad, covered in grayish-blue nylon that looked like a little pillow and was located in the middle part of the harness, as if it was padding to make the rig more comfortable for an acrobatic pilot to wear. The container was a Pioneer, type 226. I saw no Steinthal markings of any kind for the canopy, as FBI Cooper case agent Larry Carr has suggested.

If the mfr name wasnt on the packing card then the FBI must have opened the rig and looked at the data panel on the 26 ft conical canopy to see who made it. As I recall, 26 ft. Navy conicals were made by a number of different suppliers, Pioneer, Irvin, etc.

I still have the Navy conical that saved my life. I've gotten rid of most of my old gear but I am attached to that reserve canopy. Best $25 I ever spent!

377

2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.

[Robert99 37]

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I wonder what Coss charged Norman for an old (1957!) rig with a used Navy surplus canopy?

Hope it was under $350. I hate to see people overpay for old parachute gear.

Don't get me wrong, I was jumping a 1951 C9 as late as 1978, but I paid peanuts for it.

377

377, In the late 1960s in the mid-west, a surplus 28 foot emergency chute cost about $100 for the total rig. An NB-6 cost about $200 for the total rig. The cost differential was worth it since the NB-6 was very compact compared to the other chutes and this made it possible for pilots to wear it in very cramped cockpits.

I owned an NB-6 apparently until early November 1971 when the aircraft I used it in was sold.

[hangdiver 1]

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(How'd I do Hangdiver????)

I think you are doing a great job there Bruce.

377 knows old rigs better than me...I made my first jump in 1974 my second in Pope Valley in 1980 and really didn't know shit until I started jumping full time in 1989.

Although I did learn how to pack a Para Commander in an old converted military rig with pins and cones in Pope in 1980 that had an out-board right hand pull on the main and of course a belly wart...according to the Cooper transcripts...a front chute.

I've also packed my own reserve a number of times and saved my life with it once.

Yes...Yes...I was supervised by my rigging instructor.

I never got my Rigger ticket due to circumstances beyond my control. I really would like to get it someday.

Nice job Bruce...I really would like to come to Ariel in November...but that silly cash flow thing keeps cropping up...we'll see.

eta: Hey Bruce...see if Norman Hayden will come and bring the rig...that would be a treat for everyone!!!

hangdiver

"Mans got to know his limitations"
Harry Callahan

[377 21]

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377, In the late 1960s in the mid-west, a surplus 28 foot emergency chute cost about $100 for the total rig. An NB-6 cost about $200 for the total rig. The cost differential was worth it since the NB-6 was very compact compared to the other chutes and this made it possible for pilots to wear it in very cramped cockpits.

Did the $200 NB6 bailout rigs contain 26 ft Navy conical canopies?

I had a guy offer me $250 and a 24 ft ripstop canopy for my 26 ft Navy conical canopy in 1968. I seem to recall that C9s were abundant and cheap but Navy conicals were getting scarce and pricey. My Navy conical was literally like new, and it still is. Only one ride. Capewell cutaway over scenic Pope Valley, about 1973.

377

2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.

[Robert99 37]

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377, In the late 1960s in the mid-west, a surplus 28 foot emergency chute cost about $100 for the total rig. An NB-6 cost about $200 for the total rig. The cost differential was worth it since the NB-6 was very compact compared to the other chutes and this made it possible for pilots to wear it in very cramped cockpits.

Did the $200 NB6 bailout rigs contain 26 ft Navy conical canopies?

I had a guy offer me $250 and a 24 ft ripstop canopy for my 26 ft Navy conical canopy in 1968. I seem to recall that C9s were abundant and cheap but Navy conicals were getting scarce and pricey. My Navy conical was literally like new, and it still is. Only one ride. Capewell cutaway over scenic Pope Valley, about 1973.

377

The $200 bucks included the 26 foot conical, which was the whole point of the purchase. And those canopies were very hard to find. Mine was a used one, maybe 15 or 20 years old, but it was still worth it in that day and age.

Some minor changes were made to the container, under the rigger's directions, to help adapt the chute to the sailplane that I flew when wearing it. It was the best deal possible at that time since the newer civilian chutes were just being introduced and cost several times more than the NB-6.

[BruceSmith 3]

The story is up, with plenty of pictures of the rig and Norman Hayden.

http://themountainnewswa.net/2011/10/25/db-cooper-case-heats-up-again-with-controversy-over-parachutes/

Yes, I know it's lacking the clicky stuff, but I've been writing for the past nine hours, and now is not a good time to learn how to do it...maybe a DZ friend can enhance.

[377 21]

http://themountainnewswa.net/2011/10/25/db-cooper-case-heats-up-again-with-controversy-over-parachutes/

2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.

[377 21]

Good job Bruce.

A few errors:

NB6 and NB8 are harness/containers. They are not canopies. They were made to contain (in Navy service) a 26 foot conical and a 28 foot round (C9) respectively.

I've never heard of a 28 foot conical.

Gawd, the Pioneer rig Coss sold to and or repacked for Norman is frigging ancient. It doesn't even have a stiffener plate which assures that the ripcord cable will pull the pins straight up. The cable housing end above the cones is just tacked with thread wrapped around it, no plate. I declined to jump a surplus rental rig that was set up like that.

Loved the Sterling Engine!!

Thanks Bruce, we owe you.

377

2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.

[georger 197]

Quote

The story is up, with plenty of pictures of the rig and Norman Hayden.

http://themountainnewswa.net/2011/10/25/db-cooper-case-heats-up-again-with-controversy-over-parachutes/

Yes, I know it's lacking the clicky stuff, but I've been writing for the past nine hours, and now is not a good time to learn how to do it...maybe a DZ friend can enhance.

Superb job Bruce.

Persue the 4-chute scenario. ? 2/4/6/8 ? Calls
within calls . . .

[skyjack71 0]

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Jo; You know for a fact that Duane was not Cooper. All your stories are made up why do you continue to try and implicate him in this case. You have already admitted your Lies. Should I reference the posts that proves my statement. Jerry

Please reference the post Jerry.

Jerry is just hollering to here himself . He just makes a fools out of himself. Every time he comes up with the posts he ignores what was said previously.
All of the stuff he claims I am "lieing about" is just JT trying to be heard. I have news article for yrs ago where he makes a complete fool out of his self and yet he thought he was the "a celebrity that day". He needs to concentrate on controling his own life and emotions and leave me be.

Copyright 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012 2013, 2014, 2015 by Jo Weber

[377 21]

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Post this. This is conclusive.
Remember how Larry Carr posted "sn 9/57" for the Pioneer type 226?
and we couldn't figure that out as a serial number????

well look here:

http://themountainnewswa.files.wordpress.com/2011/10/dbc-parachutes-hayden-card-pararchute-identification-4.jpg

The Date of Mfr line, with Sept 1957 is UNDER the line for Serial No.
That's how the 9/57 was logged as sn, as reported by Larry Carr.
So it's obvious how the SAC logged the info as s/n, instead of Date of Mfr.

Great getting the picture Bruce.
Now: we need the second still secret FBI report that had the "sn 9/57" info Larry Carr quoted.
and probably Steinthal.

!!!

2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.

[377 21]

Braden's window said that Ted was a suspect in setting up truck hijackings.

Did the FBI in investigate Braden?

Was he ever considered a Norjack suspect?

Was the hijacking matter a ruse to cover an inquiry that was really focused on Norjack?

The FBI didn't miss Sheridan Peterson.

Did they miss Ted Braden?

Braden was an Army deserter fugitive, in need of money, an expert skydiver and military parachutist, experienced at identity theft and covert international travel.

No evidence that he was DBC, but if I were the FBI I'd sure have taken a look at him.

377

2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.

[377 21]

From the Igloo:

Quote

The "Sept 1957" was written on the wrong line. it was written on the Serial No. line.

the Date of Mfr line is below it.

I though it was just the SAC misreading it, but the card was filled out incorrectly. That was the problem.
And the SAC, not knowing parachutes, didn't realize that.

There should have been a serial number in the lines between Type and Date of Mfr..Instead DOM was written where serial number should have gone.

My quick look before didn't correctly identify the issue, but the point is the same

377

2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.

[377 21]

Blevins wrote

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The ownership of the parachutes is a tempest in a teapot at best.

Perhaps, but it opens up questions about Cossey's memory and veracity.

Also, our prior info about the types of rigs was wrong.

No D rings on either rig making the reserves useless unless DBC had a few carabiners.

No Pioneer Paracommander sport canopy.

It was not a pointless inquiry by any means. I think Gray, Snow and Bruce have opened up some new evidentiary issues.

It doesnt tell us who Cooper was, but his chute choice now makes a lot more sense. He chose the right one, in my opinion, but was it a reasoned decision or a coin toss?

377

2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.