DB Cooper

[Orange1 0]

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I'm wondering if you could pitch a buyout to a consortium from China and Yugoslavia. They'd be able to bring access to cheaper/larger weapons to the party.

You do realise "Yugoslavia" hasn't existed for nearly 2 decades now...???

Excellent. I knew we needed review. Just keep fleshing out the details.

Actually, your choice of countries is interesting. I was in Croatia (on 'holiday', I promise ) last year. And I have Lithuanian ancestry. You see how this conspiracy theory is coming together? Now we just need some nutter, I mean, sleuth to show that "District 9" is actually a documentary and not a work of fiction and ...

Skydiving: wasting fossil fuels just for fun.

[377 21]

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You do realise "Yugoslavia" hasn't existed for nearly 2 decades now...???

Forgive him Orange. He hasn't been the same since the collapse of the USSR. He lost the Dacha, the Party privileges, the summer interns from the Ukraine, all that stuff.

Have you seen "Good Bye Lenin"? We are doing that for Snow. It takes a big map server and some smart address detection and rerouting, but it works reasonably well.

377

2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.

[Erroll 49]

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.....eeesh

Now there is a good old South Africanism one doesn't often see on the 'Net! (albeit this one was written by an American)

[Amazon 7]

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.....eeesh

Now there is good old South Africanism one doesn't often see on the 'Net! (albeit this one was written by an American)

[georger 197]

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Jo,

You wrote: "I DID NOT STATE WEBER GRADUATED FROM RANGER TRAINING - have only stated that he had ranger training."

PROVE IT! No excuses, just present your evidence.

377

I think I get it!
Jo is talking about Forest Rangers!
That includes anyone who ever raked leaves on Federal property. Its all - Ranger Training!

[Farflung 0]

Of the four people to jump three survived and Cooper is unknown.

Two had jump training and one had never touched a harness before, Cooper is unknown.

The three landed in obstacle free, open and flat areas, Cooper is unknown but Battle Ground to Portland is open, flat pastures and farmland.

Of the four, three were captured quickly because they blabbed, were spotted or tracked after the jump. Cooper is unknown.

Of the four, one spent $30 the night of the jump, one was captured with his dough while the other lost his during the jump where a farmer found it all and turned it in. Cooper was separated from around $6,000 and no other examples have surfaced.

The three that were captured were for most accounts quite average individuals. Average intelligence, income and lifestyles. They did have an event which triggered their nefarious deeds such as unemployment or a demanding spouse. None of them had made long term plans or considered downstream effects. Things such as processing the money or moving or changing identity. What would these people do with such large amounts of cash? Putting it in a bank is unlikely and laundering a large amount would make them a get out of jail free card for who ever they did business with.

That money was going to be more difficult than what appears on the surface. Gold would be easier to fence but $200,000 in 1971 would have been over 400 pounds.

Other than the Patricia Hearst "Grocery Ransom" has anyone ever escaped with a pile of cash? It appears you would have to plan on leaving the country at minimum and the three jumpers had no such consideration. Not exactly masterminds. They almost seem fatalistic in how the hijackings were carried out. I would have no plans on how to handle the ransom because I did not figure I'd make it that far.

Joe Conforte is thumbing his nose at a multi-million dollar tax debt from the shores of Brazil without worry about being identified. Publishing your life's story from Rio would not involve a great deal of risk and would sell quite well if you could produce just one $20 bill with a magic serial number.

Cooper would be in his 70's by now and managed to commit his crime without killing anyone before achieving cult Robin Hood status. If anyone could profit handsomely from a bad deed it is Cooper. Yet not a legitimate peep.

[377 21]

Patty "Tanya" Hearst got a presidential pardon. I wonder if Cooper could come up with a story good enough for Obama to pardon him?

Jo made me do it.
Duane made me do it.
I was an MK Ultra CIA mind control victim
Snowmman made me do it.

Any better suggestions?

Good post Farflung. Lots of meat.

"Tanya" was quite the convert. She could field strip an M1 carbine and reassemble it faster than all her SLA colleagues. They converted some into fully automatic weapons by modifying the seer mechanism. Jerry's kind of girl.

377

2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.

[snowmman 3]

Okay, so Yugoslavia -> Serbia and Montenegro in 2003.
They declare independence from each other in 2006.

Orange1 journeys to Croatia (next door) in 2008.

And now Orange1 wants to suggest that I didn't know about her Lithuanian background.

Let me just remind everyone:

I post a description of the 727 airstair operations, from a website in the Netherlands on Jan 27, 2009.
http://www.dropzone.com/cgi-bin/forum/gforum.cgi?post=3470188;search_string=Netherlands;#3470188


On Dec 11, 2009, I just "randomly" mention the Netherlands again.
http://www.dropzone.com/cgi-bin/forum/gforum.cgi?post=3750644;search_string=Netherlands;#3750644

Now lets look at Northwest flight A333 on Dec 25, 2009

A Northwest Airlines Airbus A330-300 in Delta colors, registration N820NW performing flight NW-253 from Amsterdam (Netherlands) to Detroit,MI (USA) with 278 passengers, was on approach to Detroit just lowering the landing gear, when a Nigerian male passenger attempted to ignite a powdery substance attached to one of his leg.

The airplane had arrived in Amsterdam as flight NW-240 from Minneapolis,MN (USA) about 100 minutes before departure of flight 253. The itinerary of the Nigerian passenger is unclear, there are unconfirmed reports, he may have flown from Lagos (Nigeria) to Amsterdam on flight KL-588 connecting to flight NW-253 to Detroit. Flight KL-588 arrived in Amsterdam 2:50 hours before scheduled departure of NW-253.

[snowmman 3]

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Patty "Tanya" Hearst got a presidential pardon. I wonder if Cooper could come up with a story good enough for Obama to pardon him?

Jo made me do it.
Duane made me do it.
I was an MK Ultra CIA mind control victim
Snowmman made me do it.

Any better suggestions?

Good post Far Flung. Lots of meat.

"Tanya" was quite the convert. She could field strip an M1 carbine and reassemble it faster than all her SLA colleagues. They converted some into fully automatic weapons by modifying the seer mechanism. Jerry's kind of girl.

377

I got a whole rant about this airline "screening" stuff.
What we're seeing is the opposite side of the 18-year-old-will-do-anything coin.

The airline security stuff is aimed at excluding the "dumb" terrorist.

But what if you assume any terrorist is technically astute, well-funded, and as smart as you are, with access to similar resources? That's the real problem. Coupled to $200 tickets giving you access to a flying missile.

There's no way to protect against that. That's the basic lie.

Maybe we should just shift back to no screening?

Basically we've come to live with the guaranteed death toll with cars. We'll have to get past the lie of "air safety" and just live with the guaranteed problems with mass air travel. Making it smaller, fewer passengers, $10,000 tickets would make it safer, but the negative economic and social fallout, guarantees that won't happen.

It's going to be "acceptable risk"

You could imagine outlawing large planes with large fuel tanks. Force only small planes. That would eliminate certain risks.

The main thing is eliminating it as a propaganda target.

The thing is, the recent thing succeeded in creating "terror". They didn't even have to blow up the plane.
It's not like they needed to actually kill people to send their message.

[snowmman 3]

Farflung tried to cover up by saying "Of the four people to jump three survived and Cooper is unknown."

wrong..(I left out LaPoint the last time I told you "wrong")

LaPoint
Heady
Hahneman
McNally
McCoy
Cooper

And then there's the recent guy in the Phillipines that jumped with the homemade parachute. (377 liked that guy).
I posted detail here:
http://www.dropzone.com/cgi-bin/forum/gforum.cgi?post=3521504;search_string=phillipines;#3521504

I'm betting you guys don't even remember his name: "Reginald Chua"

Phillipines Airlines Flight 812
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Philippine_Airlines_Flight_812

Reginald taught me how to jump. That's why I know Jerry is full of shit.

Note he was incorrectly identified as ""Augusto Lakandula" from the name on his ticket. (see the wikipedia)

Research! Go date a librarian.

[377 21]

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I think I get it!
Jo is talking about Forest Rangers!
That includes anyone who ever raked leaves on Federal property. Its all - Ranger Training!

Smokey the Bear had Ranger training then. He was not a Polar Bear and consequently did not take Arctic Smoke Jumper training with Duane. Duane earned his jump wings at ADAK, class of 67. Windy cold bitch of a DZ, but it bred tough jumpers.

Jo posts all these Ranger pictures and then says that she never claimed Duane was pictured among them. So why post them? Why post anything?

Sometimes I REALLY wonder if Jo knows that forest rangers and Army Rangers are not the same animal. You do know that don't you Jo? The first are civilians who tend parks, the latter are combat soldiers.

377

2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.

[snowmman 3]

Farflung: "Other than the Patricia Hearst "Grocery Ransom" has anyone ever escaped with a pile of cash?"

it's all in the thread.
see the biggest bank robbery in WA
(the "trenchcoat robbers")

http://www.dropzone.com/cgi-bin/forum/gforum.cgi?post=3259613;search_string=builder;#3259613

I'm starting to think you've not read the entire thread.

reposting from above

Read this account of the trenchcoat guys. Biggest US bank take. $4,461,681. In Ckret's territory, and Seafirst bank, but before Ckret was there? (1997). The money weighed 355 lbs. wow.

(edit) Link went poof since I posted before.
New links. First from The New Yorker, July 8, 2002
by Alex Kotlowitz
http://alexkotlowitz.com/03_02.html
court case
http://207.41.19.15/Web/newopinions.nsf/4bc2cbe0ce5be94e88256927007a37b9/76337dc6ef5f316788256927007a7428?OpenDocument

How did they get caught? Wife bitching to the builder.
Note that paying in cash in paper bags was fine. Bitching wasn't fine. Also shows that our ideas of difficulty in "passing money" might be misinformed?

"They hired a local builder, Michael Senty, and with him designed a three-level, cedarlog home by the water. Penney paid Senty mostly in cash, in fifty and hundred dollar bills, wrapped in rubber bands and delivered in brown lunch bags. "I was led to believe that she inherited the money," Senty said.
....

By the spring of 1996, the Lake Superior home was almost complete. Penney hounded Senty about the final adjustments so relentlessly that, angered by her badgering, he placed an anonymous call to the Internal Revenue Service and reported that a woman named Myra Penney had paid for a home in Hovland entirely in cash."

IRS guy followed up on the anonymous tip and figured out the builder. Rest was history.

[snowmman 3]

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I think I get it!
Jo is talking about Forest Rangers!
That includes anyone who ever raked leaves on Federal property. Its all - Ranger Training!

Smokey the Bear had Ranger training then. He was not a Polar Bear and consequently did not take Arctic Smoke Jumper training with Duane. Duane earned his jump wings at ADAK, class of 67. Windy cold bitch of a DZ, but it bred tough jumpers.

Jo posts all these Ranger pictures and then says that she never claimed Duane was pictured among them. So why post them? Why post anything?

Sometimes I REALLY wonder if Jo knows that forest rangers and Army Rangers are not the same animal. You do know that don't you Jo? The first are civilians who tend parks, the latter are combat soldiers.

377

The only thing I wonder about, is how long it took everyone to agree Jo was actually kind of nuts.

Why so long?

[377 21]

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Maybe we should just shift back to no screening?

I'd fly that airline if fares reflected lowered security costs. Stupid FAA TSA made CARGO carriers do reinforced cockpit door mods which in many cases cost well into six figures per plane. More weight, higher fuel burn for the rest of the plane's life, etc etc.

Any creative engineer could get a bomb past TSA screening. Modified laptop batteries could have small lithium cells to do a powerup if asked and the rest could be C4. It wouldn't be hard to get the x ray image to look OK. Etc. etc.

Trains often carry more passengers per vehicle than planes, but planes carry the wealthy. TSA makes a half hearted attempt to control train security but they get real serious about planes.

377

2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.

[377 21]

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Research! Go date a librarian.

I did that once Snow, back in 72. She had the glasses and all that. We did a lot of research.

377

2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.

[snowmman 3]

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Maybe we should just shift back to no screening?

I'd fly that airline if fares reflected lowered security costs. Stupid FAA TSA made CARGO carriers do reinforced cockpit door mods which in many cases cost well into six figures per plane. More weight, higher fuel burn for the rest of the plane's life, etc etc.

Any creative engineer could get a bomb past TSA screening. Modified laptop batteries could have small lithium cells to do a powerup if asked and the rest could be C4. It wouldn't be hard to get the x ray image to look OK. Etc. etc.

Trains often carry more passengers per vehicle than planes, but planes carry the wealthy. TSA makes a half hearted attempt to control train security but they get real serious about planes.

377

You could make passengers change clothes to bunny suits and no carryon, and you would still have problems.

remote wireless communication with checked luggage is easy nowadays. You just need a passenger with a trigger, if he really wants to off himself. Put the bomb in checked luggage.

It's amazing how many billions are being spent on this screening stuff.

It just seems economically unfeasible. I can't see how it gets maintained unless it's all state supported (i.e. doesn't come from direct passenger fees)

[snowmman 3]

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Research! Go date a librarian.

I did that once Snow, back in 72. She had the glasses and all that. We did a lot of research.

377

:)
When I was in college I worked at a library.
My friend married a librarian. Met her windsurfing. She was/is kinda hot, actually.

[Farflung 0]

snowman,

Good additional data points with Heady and Hahneman. This will increase the US originated jump pool to six with five quick captures and five known successful jumps with experience levels spanning Goober to Master. Still leaves a mixed bag of men from 20's to late 40's.

The passing of money is NOT difficult. The sustainability of having passed that money is the hard part.

I was asking specifically about ransoms since they require a third party to handle it before the crook can get to it. Robbing a bank or business is not the same as receiving a ransom then getting away.

Yep, the wife bitched about the house because she didn't want to get ripped off by the carpenter. The irony makes me tingle 'down there.' Just because she is a low life thief does not mean she lost her eye for value. She also assumed that all business men that accept cash payments are not reporting this on their income tax. Great for movies but too risky in real life.

Go ahead and take that cash and don't report it. Now pray nothing happens that requires an insurance adjuster or some accountant producing actuarial stats. Then hope there is never a problem with an employee on the job who gets hurt or divorced and the wife of the employee bitches to her lawyer about you paying the husband under the table. Oh yeah, your asking for a penthouse suite in the tower of pain.

People will accept cash payments for many services and products. If some of that cash is found to be from a ransom you must not carry the expectation of being protected because you generously paid in cash and with a 15 percent bump. You are going to be in the cross hairs of the Department of Whatever and the house of cash will fall apart.

So Mr. $47,000 @ year, where did you get all this cash for a waterfront home? Think its a free country? Inheritance - we have a paper trail for that...who died? Saved it up you say? Well you show past deductions on your 1040's which would make such a savings balance mathematically impossible. At this moment you are either getting charged with tax fraud or theft. Well played so far. Are you getting that warm feeling in your groin from a bladder failure? I'm pretty sure you will once you have realized you are painted into a federal corner while comfortably seated in one of their field offices.

Having piles of cash is in fact no big deal as long as it stays buried and used extremely sparingly, as in - no changie your life style. Perhaps I'm wrong and should break out the 'ol shovel.

[Farflung 0]

Since it was 1971, I would have used Bearer Bonds.

Using much lighter financial instruments would allow the use of my only trusted accomplices.

After jumping I would pass the ransom off to them to carry to a predesignated location in Brazil.

One would be familiar with South America and the brains while the other would be tireless and driven.

[377 21]

Speaking of bearer bonds and two trusted accomplices, what ever became of this saga?

http://www.contrarianprofits.com/articles/how-the-bearer-bonds-saga-could-bring-down-the-us/18081

377

2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.

[happythoughts 0]

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If DBC landed safely and then got away, then finding
the actual landing area adds nothing.

even if a few bills, the immunity idol, and artifacts are there?

You obviously dont watch Survivor much!

I'd play on Survivor if they put us on the island
with only two sharp knives and a bottle of tequila.

After two days of not eating, all the "alliances" and "competitions" wouldn't seem that important.
No second episode necessary. The show wouldn't last a week.

We already have money. Even the rig would not
add anything. I doubt that DNA would last 30 years.

DNA would not find anyone, it would merely exclude someone. We already know it is Duane.

[happythoughts 0]

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I think I get it!
Jo is talking about Forest Rangers!
That includes anyone who ever raked leaves on Federal property. Its all - Ranger Training!

Humorously enough (for nearly everyone), I know of such
a case of mistaken identity.

A bunch of jumpers from a nearby dropzone were in a
local bar. One of the town denizens picked a fight with
two "Forest Rangers".

He and his buddy ended up in the parking lot in poor shape.

"I was just laying there and pretending to be unconscious so he'd quit kicking me."

Turned out the Ranger on the shirts did not mean forest. A couple of guys doing a little jumping on vacation.
After that, the locals were very polite to skydivers. You just never know.


Duane was a Double-Naught Spy

[Orange1 0]

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Okay, so Yugoslavia -> Serbia and Montenegro in 2003.
They declare independence from each other in 2006.

Orange1 journeys to Croatia (next door) in 2008.

...
Let me just remind everyone:

I post a description of the 727 airstair operations, from a website in the Netherlands on Jan 27, 2009.
...
On Dec 11, 2009, I just "randomly" mention the Netherlands again. ...

Believe it or not we went to Croatia via Amsterdam ... ( I guess that proves the conspiracy! Once someone has figured it out, please let me know)

...btw when you said Yugoslavia I presumed you meant 'old' Yugoslavia - which along with Serbia and Montenegro included Bosnia, Croatia, Slovenia and Macedonia (which at Greece's insisentence became know as the FYR of Macedonia after independence).

Skydiving: wasting fossil fuels just for fun.

[SKYWHUFFO 0]

who drew this map?????

[snowmman 3]

Farflung: "Having piles of cash is in fact no big deal as long as it stays buried and used extremely sparingly, as in - no changie your life style. Perhaps I'm wrong and should break out the 'ol shovel. "

The drug industry is the modern example of having to deal with large volumes of cash. It's amazing the caches of bills they discover constantly in Mexico.

And you know this crazy case, right?
Franz Felhaber (started happening in 2005)
He's stilling trying to exchange his weird money.

http://archives.chicagotribune.com/2008/jul/28/business/chi-franz-felhaber-080728-ht
The businessman arrived at the Treasury Department carrying a suitcase stuffed with about $5.2 million in petrified, nearly unrecognizable bills. He asked to swap it for a cashier’s check.

Money like this normally arrives after a bank burns or a vault floods. It doesn’t just show up at the visitor’s entrance on a Tuesday morning.

But Franz Felhaber’s banking habits had stopped making sense to the government long ago.

For years, authorities say, he and his family have popped in and out of U.S. banks, looking to change about $20 million in decaying $100 bills for clean cash