Wind, fear and poised exits

[apixel 0]

Hello all,

I have a feeling this is going to be more of a mental struggle with my own emotions rather than anything else, but I've always found replies here to be quite helpful, so here it goes. First a little background on my progress so far. I went through my AIF levels 1-8 without any repeats.
On the dives where the instructor held on to me on exit, my exits were fine. On levels 8 - and solo both of my poised exit attempts failed, and I tumbled out - swimming. I'm pretty quick to regain stability though.

I managed to get a bit spooked after my solo level and stopped jumping for 4 months. I developed door fear before allowing myself to face the door again. :-p The itch was finally bad enough that I packed all the essentials, headed down to Florida and decided not to come back until I had an A license in my hand.

Once here I did two re-currency jumps. First was an exit with my instructor, which went fine, and for the second one, I was asked to dive out. I warned my instructor about my previous swimming and tumbling so that he wouldn't be too surprised. Oddly enough, my dive exit went flawlessly. Stable all the way. I'm now in the process of getting some solos under my belt so that I'll be comfortable when doing my 3 required coach levels. For my (new) first solo, I decided to try the dive exit again, and again, it worked out great. For my second solo jump, I figured I should start preparing for the hop and pop level, and start practicing a poised exit again. To my surprise, as soon as I had placed my body partly out of the plane and felt the wind, I was pretty scared. I step out, and again I tumble and swim. I know what I have to do. I know I have to present myself to the relative wind and hold my arch, but obviously fear is getting the best of me for a second or two. I realized that diving out was shielding me from the sensory feeling that I'm about to jump out of a plane, since I don't feel the wind, and hence, I perform better.

What is a little frustrating is that I recover quickly, and my skydives are coming along nicely and are really fun, but obviously a big lack of confidence exits at that moment. I'm hoping that by continuing to try and do them, eventually I'll get a used enough to all that wind, and will be able to perform properly. I'm also doing mental successful exits to help reinforce my actions when I'm actually there. BUT I'm very worried that since every time I've tried to exit poised, I tumble, that it is THAT which is getting reinforced. Any tips?

Sorry about the long post for a simple question, but I wanted to make sure everyone knew where I was mentally.

[Dougiefresh 0]

PM sent.

Human beings, who are almost unique in having the ability to learn from the experience of others, are also remarkable for their apparent disinclination to do so. --Douglas Adams

[skybytch 259]

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BUT I'm very worried that since every time I've tried to exit poised, I tumble, that it is THAT which is getting reinforced. Any tips?

Stop worrying about tumbling.

It's only an exit. Even on a hop and pop you have time to get stable. You said it yourself - "my skydives are coming along nicely and are really fun." Focus on that.

[Superfletch 1]

What he said... Question is: "Are you having fun?" That's all that matters. You're just over thinking it. It will come. You already know how to skydive. The rest of your life you will be trying to do it better. Don't rush it, don't think about it... one day, you'll poise off and Whala! You'll notice that you didn't kick or swim once. :) Just have fun. Perfection will come in time.

Gary "Superfletch" Fletcher
D-26145; USPA Coach, IAD/I, AFF/I
Videographer/Photographer

[skykittykat 0]

I was in exactly the same boat as you during AFF, although the program I went through you had to do so many stable poised exits before moving onto the hop'n'pops. I funnelled nearly every poised exit.

To cut a long story short, it was all about relaxation. Once I relaxed and stopped stressing about doing a poised exit, I flew it fine.

Without overloading yourself, try visualising before your jump and then in the door, take a big deep breath.

One person told me: An exit is not an exit, but an ENTRY into a skydive.

I hope this is some help to you.

Good luck and let us know how you get on.

Liz
p.s. If you would like to know the whole story, mental and all, pm me.

[Travman 6]

What type of aircraft are you going out of?
I flip everytime out of the skyvan, but I am fine out of the otter. The important thing is you can get stable quickly.
If there is someone on the load with a camera, ask them to film your exit, it may help.

[mr2mk1g 10]

Unless there's a reason why you shouldnt (eg linked exit with instructor, gear considerations, just plain told not to) how about deliberately going out unstable.

Just flop out, kick out, tumble, tuck up, whatever. Go have a ball, spinning through the sky. Most students say their unstable exits are the most fun they've had so far.

Doing this will help your confidence in being in odd orientations during the exit. Unstability is nothing to fear at exit on most skydives. Accept it, have a fun with it, then go back to figuring out how to not go unstable. Could do wonders for your confidence... just as I indicated clear it with your instructors first.

[apixel 0]

Thanks a lot everyone. Just putting my over-thinking out there and all of your replies has definitely help. To all of those that have said to enjoy the instability, in a way I do. I'm super relaxed after a good tumble. Like I said, the only frustrating part is not so much that I can't physically do it, but that it's the fear that gets in the way of it. I'll do my best to catch myself at that moment and take a big breath. ( Easier said than done ) I'll definitely bribe the tandem's video person to look my way when I exit. If anything, it will be a good laugh for everyone.

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[lowie 0]

I agree with doing some unstable exits. As soon as you realise you can recover from instability almost immediatley you will start relaxing - in the end it becomes hard to keep unstable as your body will want to relax and fly.

[kelpdiver 2]

It wasn't until my HnPs at the very end of the A process that I got reliably stable on the exit. I can do a rear facing diveout pretty well now. But I had a lot of exit, one roll, then stable jumps. I think my eyes would betray me - belly to earth isn't right when you're still on the hill.

If your DZ doesn't ask you to, consider doing the first HnP at 5500 to practice, knowing you have an extra 2000. Then you'll know how it will be for the lower one, and know how little altitude you lose on these quick subterminal openings.

[NWFlyer 2]

On every exit, there is a voice in my head saying "Trust the arch." My instructors planted it there originally, but it's now my own voice. Head up, relax, breathe. All of these things help me get stable fast. I'm still working on getting it right all the time, but it's more comfortable every time, even if I'm not immediately stable, I'm also not flailing/panicking.

"There is only one basic human right, the right to do as you damn well please. And with it comes the only basic human duty, the duty to take the consequences." -P.J. O'Rourke

[darrenspooner 0]

I reckon if you DELIBERATELY do your best to tumble and swim you will quickly learn to feel a sense of control and mastery. Also, just as prep, ball up in the door, have your back facing outwards, and get someone to shove you. Count to 5, or 10, and then arch. Count and see how long it takes to get stable. Its like, one or two seconds. If you do this experiment I don't think you'll bother so much about hopping and popping.

[skr 1]

Pretty soon this is going to go away on its own
if you keep jumping.

I wonder if you're using the wind as a trigger to
remind yourself of all the scary possibilities, and
all you need to do is learn to see the wind as
your friend.

Maybe drive down the road with your hand out
the window and commune with the feel of the wind.

Or do it in freefall. Instead of maneuvers just hang
out in free plummet and just really, really feel the
wind.

Skr

[apixel 0]

Yup ... this is exactly it. It's funny that you mentioned the car window. If I'm driving and thinking of my jumps, it's all good, but when I let the window down to simulate the "door" opening, my heart skips a beat. It's definitely a wind==fear relationship which I also hope more jumps will take care of. I know it's a mind issue at this point, and I'm now excited about beating it.

[skr 1]

>but when I let the window down to simulate
>the "door" opening, my heart skips a beat

:-)

I remember when I had 5 or 10 jumps, driving
to the dropzone and glancing down at the
speedometer as I was coming to a stop sign.

The needle was dropping through 35 toward
30 toward 25 ... Suddenly it was an altimeter!
I was in freefall! It was almost time to pull !!
My heart raced, my adrenaline surged!

That was 1963, over 40 years ago, but I remember
the whole scene in vivid detail:

A green 57 Ford with an automatic transmission,
a "T" intersection with a concrete island with a
stop sign, empty field off to the right, trees to the
left, vivid blue sky, no clouds, a left turn, the drop
zone about one mile away ...


We're dealing with powerful stuff here.

Jumping out is a big deal.


The wind can become a *really* good friend.


Maybe someday we'll cross paths and make
a jump.

Skr

[tdog 0]

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The needle was dropping through 35 toward
30 toward 25 ... Suddenly it was an altimeter!
I was in freefall! It was almost time to pull !!
My heart raced, my adrenaline surged!

Wow – funny story... I can relate… When I learned to snowboard about 14 years ago - I remember leaving Copper Mountain and getting to the bottom of the first hill on I70 in my car. I all of a sudden floored the car thinking, "I need the momentum to get up the next hill so I don’t have to take of the board and hike." Then my skier friends reminded me that I was crazy, like skiers, cars have no problems getting up hills…

[apixel 0]

Quote

The wind can become a *really* good friend.


Maybe someday we'll cross paths and make
a jump.

Skr

Thanks for the great story. I certainly hope we do get to make a jump. Thanks.

[craig_b 0]

I finally found out this past Saturday what the "wind" is and how it is my best friend. I was in a 2-way camp at Perris and those first exits are something else when you first learn about "the hill" and that we must fly it. I was on the inside and my partner was the floater. My partner that day, who has about 2300 jumps, told me a secret..... (this is one that you go duh! on)..... when we are flying belly down the air supports us in flight as we push against it.... well... when we exit and present to the relative wind THAT is the same thing and we can fly it the same way we do belly to earth. We do have to fight for it but once you feel it the whole exit becomes the beginning of a skydive.

Hang in there and it will come to you.... have fun with the wind. My heart use to jump into my throat with every exit.... the diving exit was so easy but that one heading into the relative was a tumble every time. Come out presenting and ready to fly it but stay parallel to the wing as long as you possibly can.

Have fun..... Blue Skies!

_________________________________________
once you've experienced flight, you forever walk the ground with your head pointed skyward. There you've been and there you long to return.

[rasmack 0]

You have a lot of things to think of, when you have to go out that door at low altitude. The wind tends not to make life easier

My experience was that I would tumble out, if I tried to do everything at once. I ended up simply sticking as much of my body out of the door as I could, so that I would have the wind against my chest from the beginning. This resulted in a nice clean exit. Just my 2c.

HF #682, Team Dirty Sanchez #227
“I simply hate, detest, loathe, despise, and abhor redundancy.”
- Not quite Oscar Wilde...

[timinflorida 0]

I had a friend once who used to tumble out on poised exits when he was beginning skydiving. He got nervous about it and made it worse. What worked everytime was getting himself to relax and look back at me in the plane as he exited. Looking back up at the plane as long as possible when doing a poised exit puts you in a nice arch. It also gives your mind something to concentrate on instead of worrying about performance. Who cares anyway, we are not getting paid for this....I hope you have some great fun jumps!

[apixel 0]

Yikes ... almost three months later ... but I just wanted to let all you guys know that I finally got those poised exits ... and YES ... it was all about being relaxed.It was so strange to get it right after always tumbling away. Tumbling already seemed like the normal thing to do.
Now it's time to actually hop and pop!
Thanks all ... this thread is what helped me work up to it.

-A

[mattjw916 2]

Personally I love to dive out for H&Ps, as a bonus it's a more accurate simulation of quickly exiting an aircraft due to an emergency at a low(ish) altitude. Being able to dive, get stable and pull in only a couple seconds if necessary is a good survival skill, n'est pas?

Besides, it's common for most AFF grads to be freaked out for their first couple H&Ps... don't stress. After a couple dozen of them you won't even think twice about jumping from 3-4k ft poised, linked, diving or whatever...

NSCR-2376, SCR-15080

[Icon134 0]

I had problems getting out stable too... I've found that I prefer hopping out the door (I suppose it is actually a poised exit though not as structured...) and your right I wasn't stable until I simply relaxed and arched...

Now I get to see the plane leave whenever I get out... (I just love the image of the plane against a blue sky.)

Livin' on the Edge... sleeping with my rigger's wife...