sundevil777 93 #51 April 4, 2006 Getting a repack can certainly find previous screw-ups, but because screw ups can happen at every repack, how are you better by doing it more often?People are sick and tired of being told that ordinary and decent people are fed up in this country with being sick and tired. I’m certainly not, and I’m sick and tired of being told that I am Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
stratostar 5 #52 April 4, 2006 better safe then sorry,and use a rigger you trust and don't interupt him when working and don't play with the tools. ~you can't pay for kids schoolin' with love of skydiving! ~ Airtwardo Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Gravitymaster 0 #53 April 4, 2006 Quote120 days is bullshit. I have extended my cycle to 1 year. There are no gremlins that climb into your reserve container and create line overs after 120 days. Pencil packing is nothing personal against my rigger. It has to do with my problem with authority. Take good care of your rig, and it will be fine. If you go swimming with it in the pond, get it repacked. When you go to get it repacked destroy the old packing data card. This is so simple. I noticed in your profile you have a Coach rating. Would you have a problem with a student forging your name on his student progression card in order to get his A Licence sooner? - Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
sundevil777 93 #54 April 4, 2006 Quotebetter safe then sorry,and use a rigger you trust and don't interupt him when working and don't play with the tools. ~ Quite right. The only time I'm sure nothing terribly stupid has happened like leaving temp pins or molar straps is when I've watched the repack. When those 'witnessed' repacks were due 4 months later, I would have been very happy to just pay something to the same rigger to pencil pack his own job.People are sick and tired of being told that ordinary and decent people are fed up in this country with being sick and tired. I’m certainly not, and I’m sick and tired of being told that I am Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 2,400 #55 April 4, 2006 >If you knew how many times temp pins and other things have >been found at the next repack cycle when a rigger just fucked up . . . Which seems like more of a reason NOT to get it repacked if you have a known-good pack job in there. (i.e. you watched a very competent rigger repack it last time, and you're at a boogie and the only available rigger is that 16 year old you mention.) >I know a 16yr old (he looks 21) who took his dads rigging kit >and seal press to a boogie in order to rig, and no he didn't have >permission to have it. I think forging names for OTHER people's rigs is a completely different story. It's one thing to risk your own life out of laziness/convenience; quite another to risk someone else's. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SkyPsycho 0 #56 April 5, 2006 Quotethe only time I get my rig repacked is when I gut away the rest of u are just wasting money. into the pond and almost drown? swim ya little bitch..........heh i shoulda used some binary explosive instead of shooting fireworks at ya...... _______________________________ HK MP5SD.........silence is golden Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mjosparky 3 #57 April 5, 2006 QuotePencil packing is nothing personal against my rigger. It has to do with my problem with authority. Its all about "ME" fuck the rest of them fools.My idea of a fair fight is clubbing baby seals Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
diablopilot 2 #58 April 5, 2006 Quote120 days is bullshit. I have extended my cycle to 1 year. There are no gremlins that climb into your reserve container and create line overs after 120 days. Pencil packing is nothing personal against my rigger. It has to do with my problem with authority. Take good care of your rig, and it will be fine. If you go swimming with it in the pond, get it repacked. When you go to get it repacked destroy the old packing data card. This is so simple. It is personal with your rigger. It's his ass you're putting on the line. Wanna pencil pack? Get your own ticket.---------------------------------------------- You're not as good as you think you are. Seriously. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
CSpenceFLY 1 #59 April 5, 2006 The Airforce Academy uses a one year cycle. . Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mjosparky 3 #60 April 5, 2006 QuoteThe Airforce Academy uses a one year cycle. . And the Air force has one aircrew system (Thin Pack) with a 5 year repack cycle, France is 12 months and New Zealand is 6 months. What is your point?My idea of a fair fight is clubbing baby seals Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
htrammel 0 #61 April 5, 2006 Quote>Forging someone's name on a packing data card is no different >than forging his name on a check. Forgery is forgery. Nonsense. People who forge your name on a check are stealing from you. And that is different than forging your name on a packing data card. Not sure I completely agree. But that's beside the point. If one is inclined to forge a data card they should be aware of FAA Order 2150.3A "Compliance & Enforcement Program". Specifically Appendix 5, provides that "any person who knowingly forges, counterfiets, alters, or falsely makes any certificate....blah, blah...shall be deemed guilty of a misdemeanor and subject to a fine of $500 for a first offence and $2000 for a second offence". Here's the kicker..."each day of such violation shall constitute a separate offence". So it's not just the rigger you are putting in jeapardy, but you could also be putting yourself in line for a sizeable fine. Not trying to be the a$$hole FAA guy. I'm a jumper too and am not fond of the current repack cycle requirement. But, until USPA is successful at getting it extended, it is what it is. Just an FYI. (If anyone has more specific questions on the legal stuff, feel free to PM me.) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bozo 0 #62 April 5, 2006 Quote[reply Not trying to be the a$$hole FAA guy. ( Yes you are. :o) bozo bozo Pain is fleeting. Glory lasts forever. Chicks dig scars. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 2,400 #63 April 5, 2006 >but you could also be putting yourself in line for a sizeable fine. Which is how it should be. If you're lazy enough to pencil pack, then you pay the consequences if you get caught. That's the reason I said the thing about the whole new data card - that way there is no question who's responsible for the forgery. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
dreamsville 0 #64 April 5, 2006 I am almost shocked that we are having this conversation.I don't drink during the day, so I don't know what it is about this airline. I keep falling out the door of the plane. Harry, FB #4143 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
popsjumper 2 #65 April 6, 2006 I couldn't vote because I've never pencil-packed and never will and I don't know what my rigger would do if he caught someone doing it. I'm not a rigger but I offer this: In my long life, I have learned that it is much easier, less aggravating, and less costly to live within the rules.My reality and yours are quite different. I think we're all Bozos on this bus. Falcon5232, SCS8170, SCSA353, POPS9398, DS239 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
NWFlyer 2 #66 April 6, 2006 QuoteI couldn't vote because I've never pencil-packed and never will and I don't know what my rigger would do if he caught someone doing it. I'm not a rigger but I offer this: In my long life, I have learned that it is much easier, less aggravating, and less costly to live within the rules. Nicely put, Andy, and it matches up well with how I live my life. I would add one more thing: If you don't like the rules, work to change them (as USPA and PIA are doing with their efforts to change the 120-day repack cycle). Don't break them just because you disagree with them. Especially if it puts someone else's ass on the line."There is only one basic human right, the right to do as you damn well please. And with it comes the only basic human duty, the duty to take the consequences." -P.J. O'Rourke Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bozo 0 #67 April 6, 2006 QuoteI couldn't vote because I've never pencil-packed and never will . I will hold you up as my role model...in my next life. bozo bozo Pain is fleeting. Glory lasts forever. Chicks dig scars. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
RMURRAY 1 #68 April 6, 2006 QuoteQuoteI couldn't vote because I've never pencil-packed and never will . I will hold you up as my role model...in my next life. bozo exactly. cycle should be 365 days. at least that is what I use. rm Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
zenkith 0 #69 April 6, 2006 QuoteWhen he catches you pencil-packing, does your local rigger ....? If the rigger chooses to make an issue of my 'pencil pack' instead of just performing the work that I am bringing to him/her...this wannabe cop will find that we take our work elsewhere. There is ZERO liability on the rigger whose own records would show the 'pencil pack' to be just that in the event of an 'incident'. There are many technically proficient riggers in your general locale, Rob, so it's up to you the tone you wish to set... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mark 102 #70 April 6, 2006 QuoteIf the rigger chooses to make an issue of my 'pencil pack' instead of just performing the work that I am bringing to him/her...this wannabe cop will find that we take our work elsewhere. Please don't throw me in the briar patch. Mark Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
NWFlyer 2 #71 April 7, 2006 Call me self-righteous, call me a newbie, whatever, but I'd actively choose the type of rigger who would get pissed off at a pencil pack. Shows me they give a shit about doing things the right way and would be highly unlikely to pencil-pack my rig if I gave it back to them without pulling the handles. One of the reasons I don't think a 120-day repack cycle is that unreasonable is that a problem was found on my very first repack cycle - a problem with the Vigil cutter protruding (defective unit - this was the first pack job on a brand-new unit) that didn't manifest itself when the initial assembly and repack was done. Fortunately, it was discovered at the repack and not while the rig was in use. So I got the message early on that shit does happen that makes periodic repacks a good thing. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bozo 0 #72 April 7, 2006 QuoteCall me self-righteous, call me a newbie, whatever,. Ok...youre a self righteous newbie. Out of all of this dicussion and discourse I have come to the conclusion that a whole bunch of you kiddies dont know your gear very well and are afraid of it. I went thru the riggers course in 1982...for one reason.....to pack my own reserve. I also learned about the intimacies of my gear....lost my gear fear. I also know an unnamed individual who pencil packed a rig for 4 years......it opened fine when he needed it. Dont misunderstand......i'm not saying its right...or even safe....but it does happen A LOT. bozo Pain is fleeting. Glory lasts forever. Chicks dig scars. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jumper03 0 #73 April 7, 2006 QuoteQuoteCall me self-righteous, call me a newbie, whatever,. Ok...youre a self righteous newbie. Out of all of this dicussion and discourse I have come to the conclusion that a whole bunch of you kiddies dont know your gear very well and are afraid of it. I went thru the riggers course in 1982...for one reason.....to pack my own reserve. I also learned about the intimacies of my gear....lost my gear fear. I also know an unnamed individual who pencil packed a rig for 4 years......it opened fine when he needed it. Dont misunderstand......i'm not saying its right...or even safe....but it does happen A LOT. That's fine. As long as you are pencil packing your own name on your own gear fine. I don't think that's the issue being discussed here. It's pencil packing with SOMEONE ELSE'S NAME that is the problem.Scars remind us that the past is real Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
popsjumper 2 #74 April 7, 2006 Quote...There is ZERO liability on the rigger whose own records would show the 'pencil pack' to be just that in the event of an 'incident'... I disagree as a previous poster already pointed out; if a rigger's name is on it, he has to "jump through the hoops" to prove his innocence and that's not cool to put that on him. Like Jumper03 said...your pack, your name, you're on your own but don't put some innocent rigger's name on it.My reality and yours are quite different. I think we're all Bozos on this bus. Falcon5232, SCS8170, SCSA353, POPS9398, DS239 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
popsjumper 2 #75 April 7, 2006 Quote...Out of all of this dicussion and discourse I have come to the conclusion that a whole bunch of you kiddies dont know your gear very well and are afraid of it. Nice attitude. Very condescending. Very presumptuous. Missing the point altogether.My reality and yours are quite different. I think we're all Bozos on this bus. Falcon5232, SCS8170, SCSA353, POPS9398, DS239 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
