BartsDaddy 4 #26 October 26, 2019 5 hours ago, BIGUN said: If you've got a point - make it. I just wasn't sure if you were being serious or sarcastic. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
turtlespeed 212 #27 October 26, 2019 15 hours ago, gowlerk said: Yup, that's a stupid system alright. That is an excellent example of "Do Something - Do ANYTHING" We need more GUN LAAAAAAAAAAAWS! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kallend 1,623 #28 October 26, 2019 1 hour ago, turtlespeed said: That is an excellent example of "Do Something - Do ANYTHING" We need more GUN LAAAAAAAAAAAWS! No, we already have too many. We need BETTER and MORE EFFECTIVE gun laws. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Bigfalls 110 #29 October 26, 2019 (edited) With this and everything else, maybe California needs to secede from the USA and become their own country or maybe they could join Mexico. I don't know, they just seem to want to do their own thing. Edited October 26, 2019 by Bigfalls misspelling Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kallend 1,623 #30 October 26, 2019 4 hours ago, Bigfalls said: With this and everything else, maybe California needs to secede from the USA and become their own country or maybe they could join Mexico. I don't know, they just seem to want to do their own thing. Well, California would probably come out of that the winner. It is a net giver state, and with 12% of the US population it has 13.3% of the economic output. The big losers would be the taker states, mostly in the deep south and southeast. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
turtlespeed 212 #31 October 28, 2019 On 10/26/2019 at 5:12 PM, kallend said: Well, California would probably come out of that the winner. It is a net giver state, and with 12% of the US population it has 13.3% of the economic output. The big losers would be the taker states, mostly in the deep south and southeast. Then they would need to learn to adapt, and overcome. Have them figure out how to live without the welfare tit. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 2,400 #32 October 28, 2019 3 hours ago, turtlespeed said: Then they would need to learn to adapt, and overcome. Have them figure out how to live without the welfare tit. Well, first they have to admit to themselves that they are ON the tit. They are the first states to demand an end to big government and entitlement programs. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
turtlespeed 212 #33 October 28, 2019 10 minutes ago, billvon said: Well, first they have to admit to themselves that they are ON the tit. They are the first states to demand an end to big government and entitlement programs. They don't have to admit anything - This isn't AA. Just fix it and let them adapt. Cut the funding and they will find another way to make it. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jimjumper 25 #34 November 9, 2019 So the saga continues! I decided to purchase a new gun to get out of this mess, BUT! to purchase a handgun in CA you must show a valid CA drivers license or State ID. I live very rurally and have had numerous instances of mailbox theft (its a mile of dirt road to my box) so I opted for a P.O. box in town. My drivers license and vehicle registration has that as my address so my renewals aren't stolen. CA requires a physical address be present on the license to be acceptable. And a second proof of residence must be presented which is usually a vehicle registration. Neither of mine is acceptable due to the P.O. box address. Alternativey, a utility bill may be used for the second proof but I pay my bills on-line so I don't have that either. I will be going to the DMV and stand in line for 4-6 hours to change the address, then I can get a printout of DMV K4 "Driving Record History" to submit for proof of residency. I'll need to find out if a printed bill from the eIectric co. is acceptable. I have an e-mail in to the CA DOJ to get their opinion but I'll probably get the Bot answer I got the last time. Good grief, I am sure glad our government is taking an active hand in protecting us from gun violence... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
gowlerk 1,912 #35 November 10, 2019 You are exhibiting a remarkable amount of patience all things considered. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BartsDaddy 4 #36 November 10, 2019 29 minutes ago, gowlerk said: You are exhibiting a remarkable amount of patience all things considered. Gun owners in California have to have patience, this state is a joke. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JoeWeber 2,299 #37 November 10, 2019 4 hours ago, jimjumper said: So the saga continues! I decided to purchase a new gun to get out of this mess, BUT! to purchase a handgun in CA you must show a valid CA drivers license or State ID. I live very rurally and have had numerous instances of mailbox theft (its a mile of dirt road to my box) so I opted for a P.O. box in town. My drivers license and vehicle registration has that as my address so my renewals aren't stolen. CA requires a physical address be present on the license to be acceptable. And a second proof of residence must be presented which is usually a vehicle registration. Neither of mine is acceptable due to the P.O. box address. Alternativey, a utility bill may be used for the second proof but I pay my bills on-line so I don't have that either. I will be going to the DMV and stand in line for 4-6 hours to change the address, then I can get a printout of DMV K4 "Driving Record History" to submit for proof of residency. I'll need to find out if a printed bill from the eIectric co. is acceptable. I have an e-mail in to the CA DOJ to get their opinion but I'll probably get the Bot answer I got the last time. Good grief, I am sure glad our government is taking an active hand in protecting us from gun violence... You're a stoic, that's a fact. It's all bullshit and theres no reason that handguns shouldn't be sold in vending machines. Citizens of East Jesus who live at the end of dirt roads are being discriminated against in violation of the 14th amendment; which is second in importance to the second amendment which should have been the first amendment. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
yoink 321 #38 November 10, 2019 5 hours ago, jimjumper said: So the saga continues! I decided to purchase a new gun to get out of this mess, BUT! to purchase a handgun in CA you must show a valid CA drivers license or State ID. I live very rurally and have had numerous instances of mailbox theft (its a mile of dirt road to my box) so I opted for a P.O. box in town. My drivers license and vehicle registration has that as my address so my renewals aren't stolen. CA requires a physical address be present on the license to be acceptable. And a second proof of residence must be presented which is usually a vehicle registration. Neither of mine is acceptable due to the P.O. box address. Alternativey, a utility bill may be used for the second proof but I pay my bills on-line so I don't have that either. I will be going to the DMV and stand in line for 4-6 hours to change the address, then I can get a printout of DMV K4 "Driving Record History" to submit for proof of residency. I'll need to find out if a printed bill from the eIectric co. is acceptable. I have an e-mail in to the CA DOJ to get their opinion but I'll probably get the Bot answer I got the last time. Good grief, I am sure glad our government is taking an active hand in protecting us from gun violence... It’s a pain in the arse for your particular situation and I understand your frustration, but you can see the idea behind requiring a real address rather than a PO Box to buy a firearm, surely? Rather than going to the DMV (which is second only to root canal surgery in pain) call your utility providers and ask them to mail you a physical copy of the bill. It came in 2 days last time I did that. Do you really need a gun quicker than that? 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
yoink 321 #39 November 10, 2019 1 hour ago, BartsDaddy said: Gun owners in California have to have patience, this state is a joke. Yeah. Because the LAST thing you want gun owners to require is patience. What a fucking ridiculous idea! It’s hilarious, isn’t it??? NEED. GUNS. NOW!!!!! 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BartsDaddy 4 #40 November 10, 2019 14 minutes ago, yoink said: It’s a pain in the arse for your particular situation and I understand your frustration, but you can see the idea behind requiring a real address rather than a PO Box to buy a firearm, surely? Rather than going to the DMV (which is second only to root canal surgery in pain) call your utility providers and ask them to mail you a physical copy of the bill. It came in 2 days last time I did that. Do you really need a gun quicker than that? Have you ever bought a gun in Ca? He needs both a ID and a second form of residency. And it will take him longer than 2 days. He may have the paperwork in 2 days than after he goes to the store with all the paperwork that California requires he has to wait another 10 days minimum for the cooling off period. If the DOJ has not came back with an aproval by that time it could be up to 30 days. And then they may say undetermined, then it is up to the gun store rather they release it to him or not. Like I said this state is a joke. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JoeWeber 2,299 #41 November 10, 2019 22 minutes ago, BartsDaddy said: Have you ever bought a gun in Ca? He needs both a ID and a second form of residency. And it will take him longer than 2 days. He may have the paperwork in 2 days than after he goes to the store with all the paperwork that California requires he has to wait another 10 days minimum for the cooling off period. If the DOJ has not came back with an aproval by that time it could be up to 30 days. And then they may say undetermined, then it is up to the gun store rather they release it to him or not. Like I said this state is a joke. So what's the problem? Ex-wife after his ass with an AR-15? Gophers by the hundreds advancing on his organic asparagus patch? What in the holy fuck requires that someone wake up one day and just know that if they don't have another pistol like right fucking now the entire world will come to a screeching halt? Fuck it. Move to Texas. 2 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BartsDaddy 4 #42 November 10, 2019 20 minutes ago, JoeWeber said: So what's the problem? Ex-wife after his ass with an AR-15? Gophers by the hundreds advancing on his organic asparagus patch? What in the holy fuck requires that someone wake up one day and just know that if they don't have another pistol like right fucking now the entire world will come to a screeching halt? Fuck it. Move to Texas. You don't follow the thread very well do you? He is trying to get listed in the system so he can buy ammunition without having to pay more and wait longer. He wasn't looking to buy a gun in the first place, it just makes playing by California's stupid laws easier. But yea I guess everyone should just move to Texas. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
yoink 321 #43 November 10, 2019 (edited) 3 hours ago, BartsDaddy said: Have you ever bought a gun in Ca? He needs both a ID and a second form of residency. And it will take him longer than 2 days. He may have the paperwork in 2 days than after he goes to the store with all the paperwork that California requires he has to wait another 10 days minimum for the cooling off period. If the DOJ has not came back with an aproval by that time it could be up to 30 days. And then they may say undetermined, then it is up to the gun store rather they release it to him or not. Like I said this state is a joke. My family owns a gun store in California, so yeah, I'm pretty familiar with the problems from both sides. I've had a crash course in it since I got married to the daughter of the store owner. You? The laws are what they are and you can bitch about them all you want but Jim's post (the one I responded to) wasn't doing that. He wasn't complaining about what happens AFTER he submits an application but the difficulty he's having in doing the submitting in the first place. You may have missed that point in the rush to make your own. Jim was complaining about the difficulty he was having in his SPECIFIC circumstance and I was offering advice to make it easier. And if he was in the same circumstance in (for example) Texas, he'd face the SAME issue. You simply can't use a PO box to register a firearm (in most states as far as I'm aware), and I agree with that. And for what it's worth I agree, there are loopholes in the new ammunition licensing laws. Like many gun legislation laws the idea is fine. The execution is utter crap. Edited November 10, 2019 by yoink Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jimjumper 25 #44 November 10, 2019 Actually, the idea of requiring a physical address is a good idea but, as noted above, the execution sucks. The reason its a problem for me is I actually have a P.O. Box. If I had rented my box at a UPS store, that shows a physical address similar to an apartment building and it would be no problem, which effectively negates the intent of the regulation. The difference between what lawmakers try to write into law and what bureaucrats execute as policy are 2 different things. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skybytch 259 #45 November 10, 2019 Reload your own or take a road trip to a neighboring state. Problem solved. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
gowlerk 1,912 #46 November 10, 2019 2 minutes ago, skybytch said: Reload your own or take a road trip to a neighboring state. Problem solved. Hmmm.....Is mail order ammo not a thing in the good 'ol USA? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jimjumper 25 #47 November 10, 2019 Not in CA. Has to be shipped to a dealer and then can be picked up after paying a fee for a background check, and waiting however long that takes, and the dealers handling fee. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JoeWeber 2,299 #48 November 10, 2019 13 hours ago, BartsDaddy said: You don't follow the thread very well do you? He is trying to get listed in the system so he can buy ammunition without having to pay more and wait longer. He wasn't looking to buy a gun in the first place, it just makes playing by California's stupid laws easier. But yea I guess everyone should just move to Texas. Your explanation was describing how onerous and time consuming it was to buy a gun in CA, a process you feel makes CA a joke. So yes, I responded to the drift not the original non-problem. Still, so what if it takes a few weeks to get another gun? So what if there are address requirements or other hoops that are inconvenient for some? And, in particular, so what if ammo gets harder and harder to get on demand. Something is coming and, thanks to Heller, and that's likely it. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 2,400 #49 November 10, 2019 13 hours ago, BartsDaddy said: But yea I guess everyone should just move to Texas. I agree. Everyone who is outraged that they can't buy handguns over a counter with no paperwork should move to Texas. Let's add Trump supporters, religious extremists and right wing talk show hosts to that list as well. Crime, traffic and housing prices will all go down here, and Texas can deal with them and their problems. Win/win. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ryoder 1,384 #50 November 10, 2019 There are plenty of crazy guns laws in states other than CA; For example from my personal experience: 1. When I was an IN resident, I had a CCW. Due to reciprocity laws, this also entitled me to carry in MI. 2. When I moved to MI, I learned that only judges and former LEO were issued CCW permits. Yes, you read that correctly; MI allowed IN citizens to carry in MI, but not their own citizens. 3. Then I moved to TX temporarily, and to my astonishment found there was no CCW at all. (This was changed in the mid-1990's). Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites