Phil1111 910 #26 May 3, 2018 ryoder Trump: "I didn't know about the Stormy Daniels payoff." Cohen: "I paid her out of my own pocket." Giuliani: "Trump reimbursed Cohen for the payoff." https://www.politico.com/story/2018/05/02/giuliani-trump-cohen-stormy-daniels-566029 Its all part of Giuliani's new strategy. Bury Washington, the swamp, so deep in lies that a jury will collectively die of old age. Before the case is fully laid out at trial. At the same time run Cohen over with a M-1 tank. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jcd11235 0 #27 May 3, 2018 ryoder Trump: "I didn't know about the Stormy Daniels payoff." Cohen: "I paid her out of my own pocket." Giuliani: "Trump reimbursed Cohen for the payoff." https://www.politico.com/story/2018/05/02/giuliani-trump-cohen-stormy-daniels-566029 "'I’m giving you a fact that you don’t know,' Giuliani, the former New York mayor who recently joined the president’s legal team, told Fox News host Sean Hannity. 'It’s not campaign money. No campaign finance violation. They funneled through a law firm and the president repaid it.'" Are FoxNews listeners really so gullible as to believe that $130,000 spent to silence Clifford before the election is not a campaign contribution? It makes zero difference whether the money was paid from campaign funds or not; it was effectively an expenditure made for the primary purpose of providing benefit to the campaign.Math tutoring available. Only $6! per hour! First lesson: Factorials! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kallend 1,623 #28 May 3, 2018 jcd11235 Are FoxNews listeners really so gullible ..... Rhetorical, right? Like Breitbart and Infowars believers.... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
gowlerk 1,912 #29 May 3, 2018 kallend*** Are FoxNews listeners really so gullible ..... Rhetorical, right? Like Breitbart and Infowars believers. The Trumpeters have been given their new talking points. I expect Marc to weigh in shortly to re-spew them here.Always remember the brave children who died defending your right to bear arms. Freedom is not free. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jcd11235 0 #30 May 3, 2018 kallend *** Are FoxNews listeners really so gullible ..... Rhetorical, right? I could ask you the same question! Math tutoring available. Only $6! per hour! First lesson: Factorials! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ryoder 1,384 #31 May 3, 2018 Michael Avenatti was on Colbert last night. He revealed that he has a wire receipt for the transfer of $130K to Stormy Daniels. The interesting thing is that it was transferred from California, meaning that the CA Attorney General has the jurisdiction to launch his own investigation, which would be immune to any pardons by Trump. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jkzbOMxrMeA"There are only three things of value: younger women, faster airplanes, and bigger crocodiles" - Arthur Jones. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 2,400 #32 May 3, 2018 >He revealed that he has a wire receipt for the transfer of $130K to Stormy Daniels. The >interesting thing is that it was transferred from California So far we have a lot of claims: Hope Hicks 11/16: Trump "absolutely, unequivocally" did not have an affair with Daniels. Cohen 1/18: The "outlandish allegations against my client" including the hush money payment are untrue. Cohen 1/18: Daniels said that they did not have a "sexual and/or romantic affair." Cohen 2/18: OK I did pay Daniels but "the payment to Ms. Clifford was lawful, and was not a campaign contribution or a campaign expenditure by anyone.” Sanders 3/18: Trump didn't do it and "there was no knowledge of any payments from the president." Cohen 3/18: Yeah I paid her but Trump never paid me back. Trump 4/18: I didn't know about the payoff; "you’ll have to ask Michael Cohen. Michael is my attorney, and you’ll have to ask Michael Cohen." Trump 4/18: OK yeah there was a Stormy Daniels deal. "He represents me — like with this crazy Stormy Daniels deal he represented me." Giuliani 5/18: Trump paid Cohen for the hush money he spent - "we have all the documentary proof for it." Now we have a payment coming from California, where neither Cohen nor Trump were doing business. I look forward to the next story about what _really_ happened. I imagine that at this very moment Giuliani is thinking hard to come up with a new narrative, while nervously watching Trump tweet. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
gowlerk 1,912 #33 May 3, 2018 Yes, it's fun to watch the lies pile up and the ridiculous twisting and dodging going on. In the end the payment probably did violate campaign finance laws. But so what? The penalties for those violations will be minuscule, even if they are prosecuted. Which is very doubtful. It is just another filthy story in the string of filth that is the life of the current POTUS.Always remember the brave children who died defending your right to bear arms. Freedom is not free. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kallend 1,623 #34 May 3, 2018 From the FEC website: If any person, including a relative or friend of the candidate, gives or loans the candidate money “for the purpose of influencing any election for federal office,” the funds are not considered personal funds of the candidate even if they are given to the candidate directly. Instead, the gift or loan is considered a contribution from the donor to the campaign, subject to the per-election limit and reportable by the campaign. This is true even if the candidate uses the funds for personal living expenses while campaigning. Cohen paid, then Trump paid him back; looks like a loan to me.... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jakee 1,254 #35 May 3, 2018 gowlerkYes, it's fun to watch the lies pile up and the ridiculous twisting and dodging going on. I'm honestly quite interested to see what the Trump believers like Rush think about this. Lies like this are not normal procedure for politicians. There are twistings of fact, lies of omission, misleading statements, that sort of thing. But this kind of obsolute, black and white, barefaced lie is genuinely not how the game usually works. Actually I think I know what the Trumpettes will say "It doesn't matter because the payment wasn't illegal." Ok... so why did Trump lie about it? Why did he hold the voters in such contempt?Do you want to have an ideagasm? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
gowlerk 1,912 #36 May 3, 2018 QuoteActually I think I know what the Trumpettes will say "It doesn't matter because the payment wasn't illegal." Ok... so why did Trump lie about it? Why did he hold the voters in such contempt? To be realistic it's a sex scandal. Yes, it's a cover up of a sex scandal, but by now most people know about married people cheating and then covering it up. On the list of bad things Trump has been involved in this is a very small matter. It only appears large because it gets a ton of coverage. It will change absolutely no one's mind about Trump. They will simply say that Clinton got away with abusing his office getting a BJ from a young intern. And do you know what? They are right. Abusing power like that is really far worse that paying off a porn star 10 years before becoming an office holder. As fun as watching the squirming and bullshit is, in the end this one is a true nothingburger for Trump. Although it will probably destroy Cohen. There are many far worse things to go after Trump over.Always remember the brave children who died defending your right to bear arms. Freedom is not free. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ryoder 1,384 #37 May 3, 2018 gowlerkAs fun as watching the squirming and bullshit is, in the end this one is a true nothingburger for Trump. Although it will probably destroy Cohen. There are many far worse things to go after Trump over. Unless Cohen's only job was to pay off women, he most likely knows a lot more about Trump. So flipping Cohen could be a lot more than a nothingburger."There are only three things of value: younger women, faster airplanes, and bigger crocodiles" - Arthur Jones. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Remster 24 #38 May 3, 2018 QuoteAlthough it will probably destroy Cohen And that's how the prosecutors will probably handle it. Use it as leverage on Cohen to get more and more dirt on Trump.Remster Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
gowlerk 1,912 #39 May 3, 2018 QuoteSo flipping Cohen could be a lot more than a nothingburger. Cohen will be a stand up guy. He knows the rules.Always remember the brave children who died defending your right to bear arms. Freedom is not free. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ryoder 1,384 #40 May 3, 2018 kallend From the FEC website: If any person, including a relative or friend of the candidate, gives or loans the candidate money “for the purpose of influencing any election for federal office,” the funds are not considered personal funds of the candidate even if they are given to the candidate directly. Instead, the gift or loan is considered a contribution from the donor to the campaign, subject to the per-election limit and reportable by the campaign. This is true even if the candidate uses the funds for personal living expenses while campaigning. Cohen paid, then Trump paid him back; looks like a loan to me. I'm guessing you got that quote from George Conway's tweet? https://twitter.com/gtconway3d/status/992015378762096640/photo/1 BTW George's wife's name is Kellyanne."There are only three things of value: younger women, faster airplanes, and bigger crocodiles" - Arthur Jones. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jakee 1,254 #41 May 3, 2018 QuoteAbusing power like that is really far worse that paying off a porn star 10 years before becoming an office holder. No, he paid her off on the eve of becoming an office holder. That's why it's a campaign finance thing. But even then, like with Russia, it's not the thing but the cover up. Cohen and Trump are framing the payment as a quick way to stop Daniels from spreading lies about an affair with Trump during the election. They're basically saying it was fraud, blackmail and extortion on her part. By admitting being a party to the payment Trump doesn't even admit that the affair happened. So why the absolute, brazen, bound-to-be-found-out lie that he knew nothing about it and wasn't involved?Do you want to have an ideagasm? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
gowlerk 1,912 #42 May 3, 2018 QuoteNo, he paid her off on the eve of becoming an office holder. That's why it's a campaign finance thing. Yes, he could face a fine of up to twice the $130,000.00. Maybe someday. Long after the legal battles over the POTUS can even be charged and he has left office. Nothingburger. Move on to the things that matter. The policies he is pushing and the money his family is quietly trying to use his power to amass. The fact that 14/88 ers are feeling empowered.Always remember the brave children who died defending your right to bear arms. Freedom is not free. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 2,400 #43 May 3, 2018 >On the list of bad things Trump has been involved in this is a very small matter. It only >appears large because it gets a ton of coverage. It will change absolutely no one's mind >about Trump. I agree. And if, tomorrow, he tweets out "Yeah I had an affair with her! Anyone would. Besides, she couldn't resist me" then the issue would go away. Daniels would make millions on tour, Trumpies would defend his actions, Democrats would attack and after a few days the media would move on to the latest sex abuse allegations from network anchors. It would become history on the level of the pussy-grabbing tape. But I have a feeling that's not going to happen. Trump himself is going to keep this in the spotlight with his reality-show approach to his presidency (and his legal representation.) And as you mentioned, the lying is what will eventually result in charges, rather than anything from the affair itself. In terms of Cohen, again, his lies are what are going to get him in trouble. And while lying over an affair is a "nothingburger" his work for Russia is not. He's currently being investigated, for example, for arranging a $150,000 "donation" from a Ukranian billionaire to Trump. And those investigations are important for the security of the US. So overall I agree - the hooha over the Daniels affair is a tempest in a teapot, no more significant than the blue dress. But if it gets Cohen put in a position to cooperate with the Russia investigation or go to jail for a long time, then it's had both a beneficial and important effect for the US. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ryoder 1,384 #44 May 3, 2018 It appears that the story Guiliani tells of Cohen's actions are also in violation of the American Bar: https://www.americanbar.org/groups/professional_responsibility/services/ethicssearch/ethicstipseptember2015.html"There are only three things of value: younger women, faster airplanes, and bigger crocodiles" - Arthur Jones. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DJL 232 #45 May 3, 2018 ryoderIt appears that the story Guiliani tells of Cohen's actions are also in violation of the American Bar: https://www.americanbar.org/groups/professional_responsibility/services/ethicssearch/ethicstipseptember2015.html He's not doing so great in his attempt to be relevant again."I encourage all awesome dangerous behavior." - Jeffro Fincher Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 2,400 #46 May 3, 2018 >He's not doing so great in his attempt to be relevant again. Waiting for him to mention how he was mayor during 9/11. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DanG 1 #47 May 3, 2018 He was!?! Tell me more! - Dan G Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 2,400 #48 May 4, 2018 Uh oh! Trump hasn't thrown him under yet, but that bus is only a few stops away! Trump today: “Rudy is a great guy... he’s working hard, learning the subject matter... he is a great guy. He knows it’s a witch hunt, that’s what he knows. Rudy knows it’s a witch hunt, he started yesterday... he’ll get his facts straight. It’s actually very simple, there has been a lot of misinformation really.” "And Rudy, we love Rudy, a special guy, he really understands that this is a witch hunt. He understands that probably better than anybody ... But when he made certain statements, he just started yesterday. So that's it." In a week or so I predict something along the lines of "Rudy who? Yeah, I don't really know him. He got us coffee maybe. He wasn't really involved." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Bob_Church 7 #49 May 4, 2018 DanGHe was!?! Tell me more! But before that he was a prosecutor, and a Pro at it. People like Michael Milkin were breaking laws that most people couldn't even understand. It would take a real genius to convict those weasels and Giuliiani was it. As soon as I heard that he was going to the White House I thought that maybe Trump has just screwed himself. Giuliani isn't some toady and he's way too smart for Trump to pull the wool over his eyes. 'The Serpent on the Rock' by Kurt Eichenwald is a great book about Giuliani vs The Crooks and surprisingly entertaining considering the topic. And the more you learn about Venture Capital and the so-called Economic Miracle of the 80s the more upset you'll get. But it's good stuff to know. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jcd11235 0 #50 May 5, 2018 jakeeActually I think I know what the Trumpettes will say "It doesn't matter because the payment wasn't illegal." I'd have probably guessed, "But Clinton got a blowjob. And Benghazi!"Math tutoring available. Only $6! per hour! First lesson: Factorials! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
