Dr StrangeHarpper or: How I Learned to Stopped Worrying (About Global Warming) and Love CO2

[kallend 1,623]

rushmc

******https://wattsupwiththat.com/2017/03/23/state-of-the-climate-2016-based-exclusively-on-observations/


Very good write up

Find another source.

It is a very good site

But please, don't stop limiting yourself
Congratulations, it takes a special kind of person to persist diligently in destroying their own credibility. Well done.

...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[SkyDekker 1,122]

rushmc

***

Quote

Anthony Watts is NOT a denier.

Mussolini wasn't a Nazi either.

I have posted his position statement here before.

Oh, he has a position statement. Well, that changes everything.

[GeorgiaDon 340]

Quote

That article claims there is no definite proof that the large increase in CO2 levels is responsible for the increase in temperature seen in the past 300 years.

That statement is typical of climate change deniers. What do they mean by "definite proof"? What would they except as "definite proof"? What does "definite" mean anyway, 100% certainty? They know full well that science is honest enough to admit that 100% certainty is impossible. There are two routes to knowing X causes Y to happen. The strongest is to do controlled experiments where you manipulate X and see how Y responds. If you do this several times you can calculate the statistical probability that Y varies in response to changes in X. So, we could do an experiment: reduce atmospheric CO2 and see if temperatures decline. But no, the deniers say it is too disruptive to reduce CO2 without knowing for sure what the effect will be. They say there's no proof CO2 is driving climate change, but then don't want to do the experiment, a remarkably circular bit of evasiveness.

The other approach is to try to examine all the other explanations. As Sherlock Holmes said, once all the other explanations have been excluded what remains is the true one, no matter how unlikely it may be. We have excluded every explanation that has been suggested, such as the sun warming up, Milankovitch cycles, etc. It's not enough to just state that "climate changes" without postulating a reason why, something the CO2/climate change deniers have failed to do.

Don

_____________________________________
Tolerance is the cost we must pay for our adventure in liberty. (Dworkin, 1996)
“Education is not filling a bucket, but lighting a fire.” (Yeats)

[billvon 2,400]

>What really scarey is you know more than you do.....

Even better.

[rushmc 18]

billvon

>What really scarey is you know more than you do.....

Even better.

Yes, isn't it

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[billvon 2,400]

Quote

While those on the left like to think of themselves as more evolved what you've evolved into are bullies. Many people don't dare voice an opinion contrary to the liberal beliefs lest they be chastised and branded unworthy.

Sorry, I will try to be more politically correct, and treat all opinions as equal.

Creationism? You make an excellent case. The Earth might be 4.5 billion years old, or it might be 6000. There's really no evidence to choose one over the other.

Anti-vaxxing? Well, there's no CONSENSUS that vaccines protect against disease.

Flat earthers? Would not want them to feel chastised or unworthy by rounder-alarmists.

Smoking? I heard some doctors says it relaxes you. Why stress out your friends and family by telling them alarmist stories about cancer?

Climate change? Carbon monoxide is good for plants AND people. And it was cold today, so there's no warming.

[Phil1111 911]

airdvr

Even in Canada there is healthy skepticism...

Quote

In an open letter to the Canadian Prime Minister, 60 scientists urged caution when it comes to any policy with regard to climate:

While the confident pronouncements of scientifically unqualified environmental groups may provide for sensational headlines, they are no basis for mature policy formation.… There is no “consensus” among climate scientists about the relative importance of the various causes of global climate change.… “Climate change is real” is a meaningless phrase used repeatedly by activists to convince the public that a climate catastrophe is looming and humanity is the cause. Neither of these fears is justified. Global climate changes all the time due to natural causes and the human impact still remains impossible to distinguish from this natural noise.

I guess I'll just remain a skeptic.

The "60 scientists letter" dates from 2006. Its 2017. Every major Canadian government and quasi-official environmental organization recognizes climate change.

In Canada the federal government has been met with ferocious resistance to the new national carbon tax.

"Three groups are asking the federal government to not implement a countrywide carbon tax.

The Canadian Taxpayers Federation, the Saskatchewan Heavy Construction Association and the United Steelworkers union Local 5890 have sent Prime Minister Justin Trudeau a letter outlining how a federal carbon tax will hurt Western Canada.

The federal government is proposing a carbon price of $10 per tonne in 2018 that would rise to $50 per tonne by 2022.

Todd MacKay, the Prairie director for the federation, says a carbon tax will mean less money for working Canadians.

Union spokesman Courtland Klein says many industries have not been given a chance to show their commitment to reducing Canada's carbon footprint.

Shantel Lipp, president of the construction association, says there are no alternative fuel sources for their industry.

"A lot of the construction camps are powered off propane. The equipment, the construction asphalt plants, the crushing plants, all of that is powered off diesel and there are no alternative fuel sources," she said."
http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/saskatchewan/sask-carbon-tax-letter-1.4028709

With such resistance the whole country could be at war soon.

[kallend 1,623]

billvon

>What really scarey is you know more than you do.....

Even better.

I bet you're older than you are, too. Typical!

...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[billvon 2,400]

>I bet you're older than you are, too. Typical!

And much less good looking than I am.

[brenthutch 383]

SkyDekker

Quote

Anthony Watts is NOT a denier.

Mussolini wasn't a Nazi either.

No he was a progressive/liberal

"H. G. Wells, one of the most influential progressives of the 20th century, said in 1932 that progressives must become “liberal fascists” and “enlightened Nazis.” Regarding totalitarianism, he stated: “I have never been able to escape altogether from its relentless logic.” Calling for a “‘Phoenix Rebirth’ of Liberalism” under the umbrella of “Liberal Fascism,” Wells said: “I am asking for a Liberal Fascisti, for enlightened Nazis.”"

[brenthutch 383]

billvon

Quote

While those on the left like to think of themselves as more evolved what you've evolved into are bullies. Many people don't dare voice an opinion contrary to the liberal beliefs lest they be chastised and branded unworthy.

Climate change? Carbon monoxide is good for plants AND people. And it was cold today, so there's no warming.

Who said anything about creationism, anti-vaxxing, flat earthers, smoking or carbon monoxide? The title of the thread is about carbon dioxide.
Your persistent reliance on straw-man arguments speaks volumes.

[Phil1111 911]

Good story in NY times. Some good pictures so read the Times article directly if you can.
https://www.nytimes.com/2017/03/24/world/asia/china-air-pollution-smog-climate-change.html?hp&action=click&pgtype=Homepage&clickSource=story-heading&module=first-column-region®ion=top-news&WT.nav=top-news&_r=0

Climate Change May Be Intensifying China’s Smog Crisis
By JAVIER C. HERNÁNDEZMARCH 24, 2017

BEIJING — Chinese leaders, grappling with some of the world’s worst air pollution, have long assumed the answer to their woes was gradually reducing the level of smog-forming chemicals emitted from power plants, steel factories and cars.

But new research suggests another factor may be hindering China’s efforts to take control of its devastating smog crisis: climate change.

Changing weather patterns linked to rising global temperatures have resulted in a dearth of wind across northern China, according to several recent studies, exacerbating a wave of severe pollution that has been blamed for millions of premature deaths. Wind usually helps blow away smog, but changes in weather patterns in recent decades have left many of China’s most populous cities poorly ventilated, scientists say.

The findings, some of the first to link climate change to smog, may escalate pressure on Chinese leaders to move more swiftly to shutter steel factories and coal-fired power plants amid rising public anger over smog caused by soot and gases like sulfur dioxide. The research could also push China to assume an even more forceful role in international efforts to curb climate change by reducing carbon emissions, at a time when the United States, under President Trump, appears to be backing away from the issue.

“Everyone used to think that controlling smog hinged on reducing regional pollution,” said Liao Hong, a professor at Nanjing University of Information Science and Technology and the co-author of a climate change study published this week. “Now it’s clear that it will require a global effort.”

As public outrage has grown in China over dirty skies and a rash of respiratory illnesses linked to smog, Chinese officials have redoubled efforts in recent years to fight air pollution. They have dispatched teams of police officers to inspect factories, closed down hundreds of coal-fired power plants and imposed limits on driving and activities like outdoor barbecuing.

Premier Li Keqiang, speaking at the annual session of China’s legislature this month, vowed to “make our skies blue again” and promised to take further steps to reduce the use of coal.

But even if Chinese officials push forward with ambitious plans to cut emissions, they may struggle to offset the effects of climate change, the findings suggest.

Ms. Liao’s study, which examined data on pollution in Beijing from 2009 to 2016, predicted that weather conditions associated with severe smog would become increasingly common in coming decades. The study did not account for possible reductions in carbon emissions under the 2015 Paris Agreement on climate change.

Scientists point to the so-called airpocalypse that fell on Beijing in January 2013 as an example of the effects of climate change on smog.

During that episode, Beijing and dozens of other cities in northern China were shrouded in toxic haze for days. Despite emergency measures to cut emissions, the concentration of PM2.5, particles of a size that can penetrate the bloodstream, remained dangerously high.

Researchers now attribute the resilience of smog during that period to unusually stagnant air conditions brought on by climate change. The air was the stillest in three decades during the heavy particulate pollution in 2013, according to a study published this month in the journal.

The study found that the melting of ice in the Arctic, combined with increased snowfall in Siberia, contributed to changes in wind patterns across Asia that winter that failed to clear the air over northern China.

Yuhang Wang, an atmospheric scientist at Georgia Institute of Technology in Atlanta who was a co-author of the study, said the results suggested that Chinese officials would have an especially difficult time curbing air pollution in the winter, when weather conditions are most conducive to smog and more coal is burned for heating. The Ministry of Environmental Protection pledged this month to put in place stricter policies to curb winter air pollution. Beijing is set to host the Winter Olympics in 2022.

“In the long run, emission reductions of both pollutants and greenhouse gases are needed to mitigate the winter haze problem,” Mr. Wang said.

The effect of climate change on air pollution might extend beyond China. In a study last year, for example, Mr. Wang found that warmer and drier conditions might lead to longer stretches of ozone pollution in parts of the southeastern United States. (Previous studies have also shown a link between climate change and ozone pollution.)

The Chinese government has emerged as one of the leading voices on fighting climate change. As the Trump administration hints that it might move away from international efforts to cut emissions, environmentalists are looking to China, the world’s largest emitter of greenhouse gases, to play a leading role in curbing the use of fossil fuels.

The government has pledged to go more aggressively after polluters and to cut excess production in heavy industry. Already, some progress has been made, with particulate pollution falling nearly 10 percent in the Beijing area over the past three winters, according to government statistics.

But many cities, especially in the north, continue to experience severe bouts of smog, resulting in school closures, traffic accidents and increases in hospital visits. Enforcement of environmental laws remains lax, and steel capacity actually rose last year, contributing to a surge in air pollution, a Greenpeace report found.

The growing body of research on the links between climate change and air pollution might serve as a rallying cry for China to take a more aggressive role in cutting greenhouse gas emissions. But it could also give the government another excuse for the country’s pollution problems, analysts said.

“In light of growing local protests against poor air quality, linking this issue with climate conditions outside of China underscores the fact that the pollution problem has international sources in addition to local,” said Marc Lanteigne, a senior lecturer on Chinese defense and security issues at Massey University in New Zealand.

Environmentalists said the role of climate change in exacerbating smog was an important finding. But they underlined the need for local governments to do more to reduce emissions.

“It won’t change the overall conclusion that air pollutant emission is the direct and interior cause for this air pollution problem,” Dong Liansai, a climate and energy advocate at Greenpeace in Beijing, wrote in an email. “Much more action is required.”

[SkyDekker 1,122]

brenthutch

***

Quote

Anthony Watts is NOT a denier.

Mussolini wasn't a Nazi either.

No he was a progressive/liberal

"H. G. Wells, one of the most influential progressives of the 20th century, said in 1932 that progressives must become “liberal fascists” and “enlightened Nazis.” Regarding totalitarianism, he stated: “I have never been able to escape altogether from its relentless logic.” Calling for a “‘Phoenix Rebirth’ of Liberalism” under the umbrella of “Liberal Fascism,” Wells said: “I am asking for a Liberal Fascisti, for enlightened Nazis.”"

Yup, thanks for making my point.

[brenthutch 383]

A distinction without a difference.

[DJL 232]

That sounds like China trying to perpetuate the myth of global warming to make US industries less competitive.

"I encourage all awesome dangerous behavior." - Jeffro Fincher

[brenthutch 383]

Phil1111

Good story in NY times. Some good pictures so read the Times article directly if you can.
https://www.nytimes.com/2017/03/24/world/asia/china-air-pollution-smog-climate-change.html?hp&action=click&pgtype=Homepage&clickSource=story-heading&module=first-column-region®ion=top-news&WT.nav=top-news&_r=0

Climate Change May Be Intensifying China’s Smog Crisis

Or may not be, climate change is mysterious and powerful.
According to Al Gore, climate Change caused Brexit, recent scholarly articles have claimed that climate change may create 10 foot high lizards and horses the size of bunnies.

[billvon 2,400]

>Who said anything about creationism, anti-vaxxing, flat earthers, smoking or carbon monoxide?

Airdvr. He was feeling oppressed by all the pro-science people who were not politically correct enough to affirm his feelings.

[billvon 2,400]

>According to Al Gore . . . .

And Brenthutch brings up his man-crush again.

[headoverheels 291]

brenthutch

Or may not be, climate change is mysterious and powerful.
According to Al Gore, climate Change caused Brexit, recent scholarly articles have claimed that climate change may create 10 foot high lizards and horses the size of bunnies.

No, it is horses the size of ducks, according to the Gorsuch hearings.

[DJL 232]

headoverheels

***
Or may not be, climate change is mysterious and powerful.
According to Al Gore, climate Change caused Brexit, recent scholarly articles have claimed that climate change may create 10 foot high lizards and horses the size of bunnies.

No, it is horses the size of ducks, according to the Gorsuch hearings.

OMG, it already started.... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vX4Jh-44-Nk

"I encourage all awesome dangerous behavior." - Jeffro Fincher

[craigbey 0]

That's a big chicken.

https://youtu.be/VfrShu_Lp2A?t=70

[gowlerk 1,912]

Quote

climate change is mysterious and powerful.

Nope. But your attitude toward facts is. And your arguments are getting just plain silly. But I suppose that's because you've been getting them from silly people.

Always remember the brave children who died defending your right to bear arms. Freedom is not free.

[rushmc 18]

billvon

>According to Al Gore . . . .

And Brenthutch brings up his man-crush again.

More Amazon training revealed....

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[rushmc 18]

gowlerk

Quote

climate change is mysterious and powerful.

Nope. But your attitude toward facts is. And your arguments are getting just plain silly. But I suppose that's because you've been getting them from silly people.

Another irony meter destroied...

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[brenthutch 383]

billvon

>According to Al Gore . . . .

And Brenthutch brings up his man-crush again.

I think you mean YOUR prophet.