Hillary on Sexual Assault

[airdvr 198]

"To every survivor of sexual assault...You have the right to be heard. You have the right to be believed. We're with you." —Hillary

That's some funny shit right there...

Please don't dent the planet.

Destinations by Roxanne

[Amazon 7]

airdvr

"To every survivor of sexual assault...You have the right to be heard. You have the right to be believed. We're with you." —Hillary

That's some funny shit right there...

http://www.people.com/article/amanda-peterson-family-says-actress-raped-age-15?xid=socialflow_twitter_peoplemag

[ds8221 0]

http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2014/06/20/exclusive-hillary-clinton-took-me-through-hell-rape-victim-says.html

http://townhall.com/columnists/katiepavlich/2014/06/19/hillary-clintons-legacy-defending-rapists-and-sexual-predators-n1853105/page/full

https://web.archive.org/web/20070516192906/http:/chblue.com/Feb1999/022599/clintonwomen022599.htm

[Boomerdog 0]

Quote

"To every survivor of sexual assault...You have the right to be heard. You have the right to be believed. We're with you." —Hillary

That's some funny shit right there...

Nurse Ratchet has posed some wry irony in that quote.

[GeorgiaDon 340]

So is it now the conservative argument that accused rapists should not be allowed a lawyer to defend them? Or is it that their defense should not actually try to present a competent defense?

I thought the Constitution assured everyone of the right to legal representation in court. I guess that's just another part of the Constitution that is dispensable (to some people) if doing so allows for some political advantage.

Don

_____________________________________
Tolerance is the cost we must pay for our adventure in liberty. (Dworkin, 1996)
“Education is not filling a bucket, but lighting a fire.” (Yeats)

[Boomerdog 0]

I'm filing you response under the category of "unclear on the concept."

May I humbly encourage you to read America's Favorite Mother-In-Law's comments again.

Here's a hint: She's not talking to (or about) those accused and her selective memory (or lack of it) about her husband's past escapades IS the wry irony I allude to.

OBTW: Sexual assault DOES occur. We "evil" conservatives are well aware of such horrendous facts.

[Amazon 7]

GeorgiaDon

So is it now the conservative argument that accused rapists should not be allowed a lawyer to defend them? Or is it that their defense should not actually try to present a competent defense?

I thought the Constitution assured everyone of the right to legal representation in court. I guess that's just another part of the Constitution that is dispensable (to some people) if doing so allows for some political advantage.

Don

It's Hillary.. so any stupid conservative argument about all the sexual abuse or rape in our society like so many of their politicians who have discounted it for years.... victim shaming women that have been raped is always on their table.

I posted a link of the consequences of what happens when many never get their day in court and suffer in silence. if you look in any crowd of women.... you will see the survivors of sexual abuse...

The numbers are staggering... I would think that conservatives would give a damn that 1 in 5 women report being raped or sexually abused in their lives... some studies are as high as one in 3....

But now they can bring on the all rapes are just morning after remorse excuse and did not really happen.
I guess until it is their wives or daughters that it happens too.... then off they go wanting to kill the perpetrator....... that it can not possibly happen.

Shame on those who think this is not a thing.....

[Amazon 7]

Boomerdog

I'm filing you response under the category of "unclear on the concept."

May I humbly encourage you to read America's Favorite Mother-In-Law's comments again.

Here's a hint: She's not talking to (or about) those accused and her selective memory (or lack of it) about her husband's past escapades IS the wry irony I allude to.

OBTW: Sexual assault DOES occur. We "evil" conservatives are well aware of such horrendous facts.

What do you think the numbers are of the women who served in your units while in the military would say about the numbers who never got their day in court because they were just not important enough as their rapists to the USAF..

[airdvr 198]

Amazon

***So is it now the conservative argument that accused rapists should not be allowed a lawyer to defend them? Or is it that their defense should not actually try to present a competent defense?

I thought the Constitution assured everyone of the right to legal representation in court. I guess that's just another part of the Constitution that is dispensable (to some people) if doing so allows for some political advantage.

Don

It's Hillary.. so any stupid conservative argument about all the sexual abuse or rape in our society like so many of their politicians who have discounted it for years.... victim shaming women that have been raped is always on their table.

I posted a link of the consequences of what happens when many never get their day in court and suffer in silence. if you look in any crowd of women.... you will see the survivors of sexual abuse...

The numbers are staggering... I would think that conservatives would give a damn that 1 in 5 women report being raped or sexually abused in their lives... some studies are as high as one in 3....

But now they can bring on the all rapes are just morning after remorse excuse and did not really happen.
I guess until it is their wives or daughters that it happens too.... then off they go wanting to kill the perpetrator....... that it can not possibly happen.

Shame on those who think this is not a thing.....

You obviously missed the irony...sorry.

Please don't dent the planet.

Destinations by Roxanne

[Boomerdog 0]

Quote

What do you think the numbers are of the women who served in your units while in the military would say about the numbers who never got their day in court because they were just not important enough as their rapists to the USAF..

Personally? I recommended two incidents of sexual harassment and one of sexual assault BACK IN THE EARLY 80's for Court-Martial action and all three resulted in convictions. One more case of sexual harassment I investigated in 1996 resulted in a conviction. You may have a point (of which I will agree) that this issue did receive short shrift on a larger scale. However, if such a situation in my unit on those in my purview of responsibility came my way, we checked it out, investigated it and if the evidence was there, we recommended JAG prosecution.

Fair enough?

[Amazon 7]

Boomerdog

Quote

What do you think the numbers are of the women who served in your units while in the military would say about the numbers who never got their day in court because they were just not important enough as their rapists to the USAF..

Personally? I recommended two incidents of sexual harassment and one of sexual assault BACK IN THE EARLY 80's for Court-Martial action and all three resulted in convictions. One more case of sexual harassment I investigated in 1996 resulted in a conviction. You may have a point (of which I will agree) that this issue did receive short shrift on a larger scale. However, if such a situation in my unit on those in my purview of responsibility came my way, we checked it out, investigated it and if the evidence was there, we recommended JAG prosecution.

Fair enough?

Good job.....

My uncle was a JAG officer and retired in the late 60's after staying in for way too long. He started his career as a photo interpreter in India early in War II. He served all over the world in his years. He knew the numbers and tried to talk me out of joining in 1971 because of it.

[Boomerdog 0]

Quote

My uncle was a JAG officer and retired in the late 60's after staying in for way too long. He started his career as a photo interpreter in India early in War II. He served all over the world in his years. He knew the numbers and tried to talk me out of joining in 1971 because of it.

Different times, differing perspectives. It's not right. No woman deserves to be treated in such a manner. Women were well establishing their presence in the military in the mid to late 70's. Personally, I welcomed it. A lot of the career fields in the military were filled by women who in many cases exceeded the performance of men. What I observed was a lot more acceptance than resistance. When women were assaulted or sexually harassed, both actions were not only vile but negatively affected the good order and discipline of the military and hence required prosecution of offenders if the evidence from the investigation met the legal definition of the respective offenses and at the time, there were solid legal definitions of both.

[Anvilbrother 0]

You are avoiding the main subject. Hillary in her earlier jobs defended alleged rapists and told their accused she did not believe them, etc, etc, then now that she wants to be president she wants to listen to the girls and believe them etc etc.

Postes r made from an iPad or iPhone. Spelling and gramhair mistakes guaranteed move along,

[DanG 1]

Quote

Hillary in her earlier jobs defended alleged rapists and told their accused she did not believe them, etc,

She did? I thought the irony was that she defended Bill in his many cases of alleged sexual assualt/harrassment. I can't remember any thing like what you described.

- Dan G

[Anvilbrother 0]

Well that too, did you not see the links posted above by another user.

Postes r made from an iPad or iPhone. Spelling and gramhair mistakes guaranteed move along,

[Amazon 7]

Anvilbrother

You are avoiding the main subject. Hillary in her earlier jobs defended alleged rapists and told their accused she did not believe them, etc, etc, then now that she wants to be president she wants to listen to the girls and believe them etc etc.

Excuse me..... but what is it that lawyers do again????

I am thinkin you would be even more vociferous if she had not done the job her profession does.

[DanG 1]

Quote

Well that too, did you not see the links posted above by another user.

Ah, was "defended" I thought you meant that she defended the rapists actions, not that she defended them in court.

I don't like Hillary at all, but I think everyone deserves aggressive defense in court, regardless of what they are charged with.

- Dan G

[Anvilbrother 0]

Sure sure. Was she forced to take a case where she had to represent and defend rapists? Is so then I guess she did not have any choice. For me it's about who you are. If you can willingly represent people who either by their own admission to you or by having common sense and putting the story together know they are guilty of rape, or other violent crimes you are a POS.

Postes r made from an iPad or iPhone. Spelling and gramhair mistakes guaranteed move along,

[Amazon 7]

Anvilbrother

Sure sure. Was she forced to take a case where she had to represent and defend rapists? Is so then I guess she did not have any choice. For me it's about who you are. If you can willingly represent people who either by their own admission to you or by having common sense and putting the story together know they are guilty of rape, or other violent crimes you are a POS.

You may know how a firehouse works.... but do you think an attorney who is not a partner yet in a law firm gets to choose the cases assigned to them???

[billvon 2,426]

> If you can willingly represent people who either by their own admission to you
>or by having common sense and putting the story together know they are
>guilty of rape, or other violent crimes you are a POS.

Sorry to hear that you think our system of justice is a POS. There are plenty of other systems you might be happier with.

[ryoder 1,395]

Anvilbrother

Sure sure. Was she forced to take a case where she had to represent and defend rapists? Is so then I guess she did not have any choice. For me it's about who you are. If you can willingly represent people who either by their own admission to you or by having common sense and putting the story together know they are guilty of rape, or other violent crimes you are a POS.

So no attorney should represent a person who is guilty.
W/o an attorney representing them, a person cannot be tried.
If they cannot be tried, then they must be let go.
Is that what you are advocating?

"There are only three things of value: younger women, faster airplanes, and bigger crocodiles" - Arthur Jones.

[Anvilbrother 0]

So it's ok because she had to got it.

If my job required me to ignore the fact that I know or even had a good idea that the person raped a girl, then stand up and still defend them I would find another job or field of law. That is some fucked up morals.

Postes r made from an iPad or iPhone. Spelling and gramhair mistakes guaranteed move along,

[billvon 2,426]

>If my job required me to ignore the fact that I know or even had a good idea
>that the person raped a girl, then stand up and still defend them I would find
>another job or field of law. That is some fucked up morals.

Then I guess policeman and doctor are out as options as well (might have to protect or care for a criminal there, too.) And whatever you do do NOT become a county clerk.

It will be interesting to see what happens if we discover that Ben Carson once treated a rapist, or used aborted fetuses in his research.

[Anvilbrother 0]

I will reply to you and bill both with the same thing. Any lawyer who knowingly defends someone they know is guilty is a seriously messed up person.

We all know there are people that will do this, so the legal system is in no jeopardy of collapse due to a sudden rise in lawyers with morals, so that is never going to happen.

Don't act like this is the first time you have ever read or heard anyone question the morals of a defense lawyer there are books written about this.

Postes r made from an iPad or iPhone. Spelling and gramhair mistakes guaranteed move along,

[billvon 2,426]

> Any lawyer who knowingly defends someone they know is guilty is a seriously
> messed up person.

I know a few such people. They are not messed up people. I suspect if you got to know one, you would change your mind.

Whenever someone has the temerity to state something about law enforcement here, a cop is quick to say "you don't have a clue. Why don't you do a ride-along?" Perhaps a similar experience with a public defender would be eye-opening.