ObamaCare Cancelled Your Health Insurance.

[DaVinci 0]

Quote

Why should a 3 year old girl who needs a heart and lung transplant pay the same rate for insurance coverage as a healthy 3 year old girl?

Way to ignore the fact that a guy that drinks is not a 3YO.

Way to ignore the simple fact that all I did was point out how the insurance system has to work.

So, would YOU be willing to pay more for car insurance to allow drunk drivers to get insurance? Simple question, please answer it.

[DaVinci 0]

Quote

I know! Only a damn liberal would post bullshit like:

Pointing out the only way the ACA will work using another example is not "liberal".

Ignoring the facts presented... Might be.

[DanG 1]

Read the whole thread, not just your own posts.

- Dan G

[jclalor 12]

DaVinci

Quote

Why should a 3 year old girl who needs a heart and lung transplant pay the same rate for insurance coverage as a healthy 3 year old girl?

Way to ignore the fact that a guy that drinks is not a 3YO.

Way to ignore the simple fact that all I did was point out how the insurance system has to work.

So, would YOU be willing to pay more for car insurance to allow drunk drivers to get insurance? Simple question, please answer it.

Of course not, but that's not the question. Should I pay the same insurance rates as a smoker? Under the ADA smokers pay more. Should normal folks pay the the same rates as Base Jumpers?

A man of your age should realize the world is not always fair.

[wmw999 2,123]

The problem is that health insurance and auto insurance aren't the same. One's damages are generally more limited in auto insurance (unless you end up at fault in a really grisly accident, or you have PIP). And yes, one's record does enter.

What to do about people who were just born unlucky, or who make less-than-optimal (but not abysmal) life choices? Things like drinking and getting liver disease -- not because you're an alkie, but because you were born with a substandard liver? Like not eating healthy food, and ending up with high cholesterol?

The number of variables when it comes to health is much higher than it is with cars. There isn't a great option, unless we can all go work for companies that are big enough not to take health into account when they hire. That's not going to happen.

ACA is not a great solution. It's (probably) better than what we had for the aggregate of Americans, but it's worse for some, and better for some.

In 10 years I sincerely hope we're not still using ACA as it is now. And I even more sincerely hope that we're not back to the way it's been, where you have to hit the insurance jackpot, and medical bills are the largest single cause of bankruptcies in the US (62% list them as primary cause).

Wendy P.

There is nothing more dangerous than breaking a basic safety rule and getting away with it. It removes fear of the consequences and builds false confidence. (tbrown)

[chedlin 0]

Your addictinginfo link is interesting but also deceptive. BCBS of Florida was certainly ripping her off with the junk plan (I can't call that garbage insurance), but consumer reports didn't find her a $165/mo plan either.

They found her a $485 a month plan that the taxpayers pay 2/3 of.

Nobody is being honest in this debate. Our healthcare system has been terribly broken, and will still be. The free market doesn't work smoothly when demand is inflexible.

Nobody can ask how much their helicopter ride from the DZ to the trauma center is going to cost or wait until they can negotiate the best price. Then they get billed for the cost to keep the system on standby, something EVERYONE benefits from.

[kallend 1,632]

www.theatlantic.com/business/archive/2013/11/everything-you-need-to-know-about-obamacare-and-death-spirals/281315/

...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[rickjump1 0]

http://news.yahoo.com/clinton-adds-obamas-health-care-headache-213700613.html"Washington (AFP) - Bill Clinton weighed in on the crisis over the troubled new US health care law Tuesday, handing President Barack Obama a new political headache."

"I personally believe, even if it takes a change in the law, that the president should honor the commitment the federal government made to those people and let them keep what they've got," Clinton said in an interview with the OZY.com website published on Tuesday.

Do your part for global warming: ban beans and hold all popcorn farts.

[Andy9o8 0]

FWIW, I agree w/Bill Clinton re: that. God, I love that man.

[Andy9o8 0]

kallend

No it didn't.

And my premium went down.

Lawyer-friend of mine is a middle-aged solo practitioner. Shares a secretary w/3 other solos; that's her whole "staff". Meat & potatoes kind of work; very middle-income. Buys her own (private) insurance for her & her family, from one of the major name-brand health insurers. Has pretty good coverage, with a higher deductible to make it affordable. Has been paying about $350/month.

She just got one of those notices from her carrier. After the grandfathered-in period, if she wants the same coverage, albeit now with a mandatory lower deductible and stuff like maternity care she no longer needs, the new price: $1,100.

Completely blindsided. She's so livid she says if it doesn't get fixed before her deadline is up, she's never walking into a voting booth again.

[RonD1120 58]

Andy9o8

***
No it didn't.

And my premium went down.

Lawyer-friend of mine is a middle-aged solo practitioner. Shares a secretary w/3 other solos; that's her whole "staff". Meat & potatoes kind of work; very middle-income. Buys her own (private) insurance for her & her family, from one of the major name-brand health insurers. Has pretty good coverage, with a higher deductible to make it affordable. Has been paying about $350/month.

She just got one of those notices from her carrier. After the grandfathered-in period, if she wants the same coverage, albeit now with a mandatory lower deductible and stuff like maternity care she no longer needs, the new price: $1,100.

Completely blindsided. She's so livid she says if it doesn't get fixed before her deadline is up, she's never walking into a voting booth again.

Thank you for sharing this true life anecdote.

Jack Harris and Tedd Webb interviewed their personal physician on air the other day. He indicated increased reporting and other administrative problems with ACA. He stopped short of saying it is a complete nightmare.

The question continues to surface that the ACA is designed to fail thus making the government the single payor system for healthcare. If complete socialized medicine is manifested the $900B health insurance industry ceases to exist. Furthermore, how will future doctors view the cost of education? In other words, would someone desire to go through all that is required to became a licensed medical doctor and be forced to work for the government?

Look for the shiny things of God revealed by the Holy Spirit. They only last for an instant but it is a Holy Instant. Let your soul absorb them.

[DaVinci 0]

DanG

Read the whole thread, not just your own posts.

I have.... It seems you have not.

[DaVinci 0]

jclalor

***

Quote

Why should a 3 year old girl who needs a heart and lung transplant pay the same rate for insurance coverage as a healthy 3 year old girl?

Way to ignore the fact that a guy that drinks is not a 3YO.

Way to ignore the simple fact that all I did was point out how the insurance system has to work.

So, would YOU be willing to pay more for car insurance to allow drunk drivers to get insurance? Simple question, please answer it.

Of course not, but that's not the question. Should I pay the same insurance rates as a smoker? Under the ADA smokers pay more. Should normal folks pay the the same rates as Base Jumpers?

A man of your age should realize the world is not always fair.

Simple questions:

Do you think you should pay the same car insurance rate as a guy with 4 DUI's?

Should a guy riding a motorcycle get to pay the same car insurance as a guy driving a Volvo?

Should a person who is fit and healthy have to pay the same insurance as a heavy drinker who is technically obese?

[wmw999 2,123]

Quote

Should a person who is fit and healthy have to pay the same insurance as a heavy drinker who is technically obese?

Does he swoop?

Wendy P.

There is nothing more dangerous than breaking a basic safety rule and getting away with it. It removes fear of the consequences and builds false confidence. (tbrown)

[lawrocket 3]

[Reply]Should a person who is fit and healthy have to pay the same insurance as a heavy drinker who is technically obese?

[normiss 622]

"Spreading the wealth"

[turtlespeed 212]

Andy9o8

FWIW, I agree w/Bill Clinton re: that. God, I love that man.

Y'all having a bromance?

I'm not usually into the whole 3-way thing, but you got me a little excited with that. - Skymama
BTR #1 / OTB^5 Official #2 / Hellfish #408 / VSCR #108/Tortuga/Orfun

[turtlespeed 212]

normiss

"Spreading the wealth"

redistribution.

I'm not usually into the whole 3-way thing, but you got me a little excited with that. - Skymama
BTR #1 / OTB^5 Official #2 / Hellfish #408 / VSCR #108/Tortuga/Orfun

[champu 1]

wmw999

ACA is not a great solution. It's (probably) better than what we had for the aggregate of Americans, but it's worse for some, and better for some.

In 10 years I sincerely hope we're not still using ACA as it is now. And I even more sincerely hope that we're not back to the way it's been, where you have to hit the insurance jackpot, and medical bills are the largest single cause of bankruptcies in the US (62% list them as primary cause).

Wendy P.

My biggest concern with the ACA is what is going to happen with the subsidies in the long term. Any time the government subsidizes anything it just grows the price (see: mortgage deduction and housing prices, education loans and tuition rates, etc.) And while the ACA has mandates on the percentage insurance companies spend towards healthcare, they can just spend more to make more. ("Hey Doc, I have a headache" "Well then let's get you a CT Scan!") Political pressure will make it very difficult to do anything but spend more and more on subsidies as time goes on, and we'll end up with another 12-figure blob of "manditory" spending on the federal budget every year.

My biggest gripe about the ACA (and this really gets to the heart of my stance on most controversial things that people support the government doing) is people who convert personal irrelevance of a law and a vague agreement with the stated goal of a law into support for that law and a willingness to marginalize cases of people being screwed by it. Are some people going to get the short end of the stick when the government does just about anything? Sure. And while I think most understand the size of that group is important, the shortness of the sticks they get is important too.

[DaVinci 0]

lawrocket

[Reply]Should a person who is fit and healthy have to pay the same insurance as a heavy drinker who is technically obese?

Yes. That's the whole point of the damned law. It's designed to make it more affordable for the obese heavy drinker by charging more to the fit and healthy person.

This is how the government plans to lower the cost of healthcare - by making it cost more, spreading the costs to people who weren't paying for them, and subsidizing.

[wmw999 2,123]

I'm not sure that not upsetting people is part of your posting style.

Wendy P.

There is nothing more dangerous than breaking a basic safety rule and getting away with it. It removes fear of the consequences and builds false confidence. (tbrown)

[normiss 622]

Don't discourage him, I want to see what a coach potato is.

[lawrocket 3]

DaVinci

***[Reply]Should a person who is fit and healthy have to pay the same insurance as a heavy drinker who is technically obese?

Yes. That's the whole point of the damned law. It's designed to make it more affordable for the obese heavy drinker by charging more to the fit and healthy person.

This is how the government plans to lower the cost of healthcare - by making it cost more, spreading the costs to people who weren't paying for them, and subsidizing.

[JerryBaumchen 1,049]

Hi Andy,

Quote

maternity care she no longer needs

At 73 & a vasectomy 35 yrs ago, I no longer feel I should need pediatric coverage either.



JerryBaumchen

PS) While I cannot predict the future, I am optomistic enough to believe that there will be corrections ( ala Bill Clinton's comments for example ) to the bill just for your indicated lady & me.

[rushmc 18]

JerryBaumchen

Hi Andy,

Quote

maternity care she no longer needs

At 73 & a vasectomy 35 yrs ago, I no longer feel I should need pediatric coverage either.



JerryBaumchen

PS) While I cannot predict the future, I am optomistic enough to believe that there will be corrections ( ala Bill Clinton's comments for example ) to the bill just for your indicated lady & me.

Well, the government thinks you do!!!

And on a side note
Does everyone here realize that those policies that no longer meet the mandate, those policies that can not be renewed because of said mandate, ALL have been approved by state insurance boards?

Does eveyone also know that states regulate who can sell insurance? That those who did sell needed to be licenced and have continuing education every year. And now those people, by Federal order, can be replaced with non-trained, non-educated navigatiors?

Damn, what a great great lie we have been sold

wow

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln