Religion as a moral compass???

[quade 3]

wmw999

The "anything" I was referring to was pre big-bang, not the chemistry which indubitably resulted in life as we know it.

Then you only need to go a step smaller into quantum physics.

quade -
The World's Most Boring Skydiver

[Darius11 12]

Quote

And I'm comfortable with the above being the opposite. We have no reason at all, and life it totally meaningless in the long term.

It could be meaningless true but we came from somewhere even if that where is as simple as energy, or star dust

I don't claim to know like all of us i am imprisoned on this plain of existence so my view is biased. I just have never seen something come out of nothing. So the evidence i have in my head tells me there is something.

I'd rather be hated for who I am, than loved for who I am not." - Kurt Cobain

[quade 3]

Quote

I just have never seen something come out of nothing. So the evidence i have in my head tells me there is something.

You've never seen it because it happens at a scale well below the ability of humans to see it, but it happens every day, every moment, all around you. Like radio waves you can't see, it can still be detected.

quade -
The World's Most Boring Skydiver

[Darius11 12]

Yea but they came from somewhere that transmitted them.

what comes from nothing?


Edit: for the record i meant not see if all the technologies we have not just my eyes.

I'd rather be hated for who I am, than loved for who I am not." - Kurt Cobain

[wmw999 2,122]

What makes you think I have a problem with quantum physics?

Wendy P.

There is nothing more dangerous than breaking a basic safety rule and getting away with it. It removes fear of the consequences and builds false confidence. (tbrown)

[quade 3]

wmw999

What makes you think I have a problem with quantum physics?

Your apparent disbelief in the concept of matter appearing and disappearing out of nothing at the quantum level.

quade -
The World's Most Boring Skydiver

[Darius11 12]

Oh you are right Mr. quade. No need to answer my question then.

I would add that is as far as we can tell.

I'd rather be hated for who I am, than loved for who I am not." - Kurt Cobain

[rehmwa 2]

quade

Then you only need to go a step smaller into quantum physics.

that sentence is cool for at least 4 reasons


none to do with the thread topic

...
Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants

[wmw999 2,122]

I think you misunderstand. The fact that I can discuss or even describe what some people believe without calling them morons doesn't mean I agree with them.

Wendy P.

There is nothing more dangerous than breaking a basic safety rule and getting away with it. It removes fear of the consequences and builds false confidence. (tbrown)

[rehmwa 2]

wmw999

I think you misunderstand. The fact that I can discuss or even describe what some people believe without calling them morons doesn't mean I agree with them.

actually - one thing I've learned in Speaker's Corner is that it is a lot more rare than I thought to find individuals that realize that <<>>

I was quite amazed at this revelation.


the converse is people say "I don't understand how he could......" when what they really mean is "I certainly wouldn't have acted that way or made those decision had I been in his shoes"

is that the converse? or just another way of saying the same thing?

...
Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants

[wmw999 2,122]

Quote

it is a lot more rare than I thought to find individuals that realize that >>

Well they're just doo-doo-heads

Wendy P.

There is nothing more dangerous than breaking a basic safety rule and getting away with it. It removes fear of the consequences and builds false confidence. (tbrown)

[quade 3]

wmw999

I think you misunderstand. The fact that I can discuss or even describe what some people believe without calling them morons doesn't mean I agree with them.

You are correct. I misunderstood. I didn't realize you were playing (hmmm, devil's?) theist's advocate.

quade -
The World's Most Boring Skydiver

[rehmwa 2]

wmw999

Well they're just doo-doo-heads

well, you are, literally, a 'rocket scientist' so I'd give the benefit of the doubt in terms of your math and science background


Quade - your posts are on a roll, best when subtle.


do you find your space stringy? or loopy?

...
Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants

[wmw999 2,122]

Quote

in terms of your math and science background

ROFLOLPIMP

Wendy P.

There is nothing more dangerous than breaking a basic safety rule and getting away with it. It removes fear of the consequences and builds false confidence. (tbrown)

[quade 3]

rehmwa

do you find your space stringy? or loopy?

Neither! At least not until some experiments can be performed. LQG suggests it can be experimented with. If the experiments match up with LQG, then we'll have a better answer.

Edited to add:

I do sort of have an issue with Planck length/time. I find it disturbing the universe is analogue until it reaches a point at which it becomes binary. What it means is the computer being used to run this simulation has an extremely high resolution, but then even it has a limit. ;)

quade -
The World's Most Boring Skydiver

[lawrocket 3]

[Reply]I have never seen an atheist stand on a street corner, on a soapbox, with a bullhorn, telling people their way is the "right" way.

[RonD1120 58]

Doesn't a number divided by itself equal 1?

0 gods/0 gods = 1 God

Look for the shiny things of God revealed by the Holy Spirit. They only last for an instant but it is a Holy Instant. Let your soul absorb them.

[JerryBaumchen 1,048]

Hi Paul,

Perfect!!!!

+1 and counting.

JerryBaumchen

[Stumpy 256]

RonD1120

Doesn't a number divided by itself equal 1?

0 gods/0 gods = 1 God

Maths - F. Please revise further

Never try to eat more than you can lift

[champu 1]

RonD1120

Doesn't a number divided by itself equal 1?

Not as a general rule, no. As I said, zero as a number is more abstract than people usually give it credit for.

0/0 is undefined (meaning it doesn't have a defined value) and futhermore it's indeterminate (meaning, roughly, there's not even a way to figure out what values are near it.)

[maadmax 0]

I do sort of have an issue with Planck length/time. I find it disturbing the universe is analogue until it reaches a point at which it becomes binary. What it means is the computer being used to run this simulation has an extremely high resolution, but then even it has a limit. ;)

_________________________________________

Sounds like a pretty good argument for God if I ever heard one.

...

[quade 3]

maadmax

Quote

I do sort of have an issue with Planck length/time. I find it disturbing the universe is analogue until it reaches a point at which it becomes binary. What it means is the computer being used to run this simulation has an extremely high resolution, but then even it has a limit. ;)

Sounds like a pretty good argument for God if I ever heard one.

Not by a LONG shot. The wink should be your clue it's a joke.

quade -
The World's Most Boring Skydiver

[JackC1 0]

Darius11

Atheism in its foundation take the extreme view of there is no god. So it is extreme at the core like a hate group

Atheism: "disbelief or lack of belief in the existence of God or gods". (emphasis mine)

Lacking belief in something is not the same as a belief in the lack of something. You can lack belief in something simply by being ignorant of it. That is not extreme or hateful although attempting to tar all atheists with the same derogatory brush just might be.

[DanG 1]

Quote

Do you believe we came from somewhere?

I believe in cause and effect, yes. That's not religion. I think your boiling down of religion is far too simplified. If religion stopped at, "we came from somewhere," then people wouldn't be killing each other over it. Religion (at least Abrahamaic ones) divide people into us and them, believers and infidels, good and evil.

Quote

I mean it comes from a root that is absolute, THERE IS NO GOD it leaves no room for interpretation no room to say we came from anything.

No, it means that I don't believe that we were designed by a higher power, and need to live our lives according to His will. That's it. You're hung up on this notion of something from nothing, but that's really not the root of it all.

Quote

I think that iron clad certainty is impossible to achieve we simply do not have enough evidence to make any definitive conclusions.

Do you believe that Jesus is the Son of God, sent from heaven to take on the sins of humanity, and only though Him can you enter into heaven? No? How can you take such an absolutist position without proof? How can you know for sure that isn't the truth?

What about Vishnu? Or Odin? Or Allah? How can you take such an absolutist position that they are not the one true God? Your beliefs (what ever they are) leave no room for interpretation either, you just don't seem to see it.

Quote

As in comparison to a hate group is meant because of the lack of logic.

Logic is all I have. Just because you don't follow the logic doesn't mean it isn't there.

Quote

I can never explain to member of the KKK why there are good black people. When he comes from the absolute belief that anything a black person does is wrong and he hates him just for being black. So there is no place to start a debate of any sort. He is already sure

I think you misunderstand atheism. I don't wake up in the morning and think, "Today I'm going to hate God and religious people. Nothing anyone says can convince me otherwise." There's no active hate like the KKK. Frankly, I'd drop the hate group thing, it's pretty offensive.

Quote

No I just mean being certain being 100% sure. I do not agree with that.

Atheist are as sure of their position as religious people are of theirs. Why is one extreme and not the other?

Quote

Religion doesn’t say there is a dude with a white beard living in the clouds that’s mans interpretation.

Since religion is man's creation, you can't separate the two like that.

Quote

It just says we are created for a reason and there is a creator. What he/she/it is we have no clue as we are limited to our field of existence.

Really? I think most religious people would disagree. They seem to know quite well what God is like, and how he expects us to behave.

Quote

Are you an atheist?
Do you claim there is no god?
How did you logically reach that conclusion?

Yes. Yes. Same way you're concluded there are no unicorns.

Quote

I think most people are selfish and will change their point of view and do mental gymnastics whenever it is convenient for them regardless of their faith or lack of faith.

I agree.

- Dan G

[Backintothesky 0]

+1

I find it shocking how those who have religious belief simply cannot see that their "choice" of religion is completely random.

If "faith" is the answer for why people believe then how on earth do they distinguish between all the tens of thousands of religions there have been, are and will be? They can't.

I have no problem with people living their lives like that. But when they hassle me about me lack of religious belief and expect to try and convert me to their religion then platitudes don't cut it.

There is no logical proof of a God and more importantly there is no way of working out which "God" it is.

But religious people tend to point to their book and say "it says its true in here". Well it says that in virtually every religious book in the world. How do you choose?

DanG

Quote

Do you believe we came from somewhere?

I believe in cause and effect, yes. That's not religion. I think your boiling down of religion is far too simplified. If religion stopped at, "we came from somewhere," then people wouldn't be killing each other over it. Religion (at least Abrahamaic ones) divide people into us and them, believers and infidels, good and evil.

Quote

I mean it comes from a root that is absolute, THERE IS NO GOD it leaves no room for interpretation no room to say we came from anything.

No, it means that I don't believe that we were designed by a higher power, and need to live our lives according to His will. That's it. You're hung up on this notion of something from nothing, but that's really not the root of it all.

Quote

I think that iron clad certainty is impossible to achieve we simply do not have enough evidence to make any definitive conclusions.

Do you believe that Jesus is the Son of God, sent from heaven to take on the sins of humanity, and only though Him can you enter into heaven? No? How can you take such an absolutist position without proof? How can you know for sure that isn't the truth?

What about Vishnu? Or Odin? Or Allah? How can you take such an absolutist position that they are not the one true God? Your beliefs (what ever they are) leave no room for interpretation either, you just don't seem to see it.

Quote

As in comparison to a hate group is meant because of the lack of logic.

Logic is all I have. Just because you don't follow the logic doesn't mean it isn't there.

Quote

I can never explain to member of the KKK why there are good black people. When he comes from the absolute belief that anything a black person does is wrong and he hates him just for being black. So there is no place to start a debate of any sort. He is already sure

I think you misunderstand atheism. I don't wake up in the morning and think, "Today I'm going to hate God and religious people. Nothing anyone says can convince me otherwise." There's no active hate like the KKK. Frankly, I'd drop the hate group thing, it's pretty offensive.

Quote

No I just mean being certain being 100% sure. I do not agree with that.

Atheist are as sure of their position as religious people are of theirs. Why is one extreme and not the other?

Quote

Religion doesn’t say there is a dude with a white beard living in the clouds that’s mans interpretation.

Since religion is man's creation, you can't separate the two like that.

Quote

It just says we are created for a reason and there is a creator. What he/she/it is we have no clue as we are limited to our field of existence.

Really? I think most religious people would disagree. They seem to know quite well what God is like, and how he expects us to behave.

Quote

Are you an atheist?
Do you claim there is no god?
How did you logically reach that conclusion?

Yes. Yes. Same way you're concluded there are no unicorns.

Quote

I think most people are selfish and will change their point of view and do mental gymnastics whenever it is convenient for them regardless of their faith or lack of faith.

I agree.