Charges Filed in Boston Attack

[quade 3]

Read them here:
http://www.cnn.com/interactive/2013/04/us/dzhokhar-tsarnaev-charges/index.html?hpt=hp_t1

quade -
The World's Most Boring Skydiver

[Skyrad 0]

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a weapon of mass destruction

Its an IED not a feckin nuke FFS Talk about a stretch, is this so that they can say that yes they found WMD in Iraq in years to come?

When an author is too meticulous about his style, you may presume that his mind is frivolous and his content flimsy.
Lucius Annaeus Seneca

[billvon 2,400]

>Its an IED not a feckin nuke FFS

Yep. It would suck to have him get off (at least of that charge) because the defense can prove an IED is not a WMD.

[rehmwa 2]

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a weapon of mass destruction

Its an IED not a feckin nuke FFS Talk about a stretch, is this so that they can say that yes they found WMD in Iraq in years to come?

if anyone that wets his pants and then hides, but then gives an interview can be called a hero, then any sized homemade bomb is a WMD.

...
Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants

[AggieDave 6]

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>Its an IED not a feckin nuke FFS

Yep. It would suck to have him get off (at least of that charge) because the defense can prove an IED is not a WMD.

Guys, remember you have to use the legal definitions as defined by the law in question, not what you *think* something is.

http://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/18/2332a

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(a) Offense Against a National of the United States or Within the United States.— A person who, without lawful authority, uses, threatens, or attempts or conspires to use, a weapon of mass destruction—
(1) against a national of the United States while such national is outside of the United States;
(2) against any person or property within the United States, and
(A) the mail or any facility of interstate or foreign commerce is used in furtherance of the offense;
(B) such property is used in interstate or foreign commerce or in an activity that affects interstate or foreign commerce;
(C) any perpetrator travels in or causes another to travel in interstate or foreign commerce in furtherance of the offense; or
(D) the offense, or the results of the offense, affect interstate or foreign commerce, or, in the case of a threat, attempt, or conspiracy, would have affected interstate or foreign commerce;
(3) against any property that is owned, leased or used by the United States or by any department or agency of the United States, whether the property is within or outside of the United States; or
(4) against any property within the United States that is owned, leased, or used by a foreign government,
shall be imprisoned for any term of years or for life, and if death results, shall be punished by death or imprisoned for any term of years or for life.




USC › Title 18 › Part I › Chapter 113B › § 2332a

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18 USC § 2332a - Use of weapons of mass destruction

USC-prelim
US Code
Notes
Updates
Authorities (CFR)

USCPrelim is a preliminary release and may be subject to further revision before it is released again as a final version.

Current through Pub. L. 112-283. (See Public Laws for the current Congress.)
(a) Offense Against a National of the United States or Within the United States.— A person who, without lawful authority, uses, threatens, or attempts or conspires to use, a weapon of mass destruction—
(1) against a national of the United States while such national is outside of the United States;
(2) against any person or property within the United States, and
(A) the mail or any facility of interstate or foreign commerce is used in furtherance of the offense;
(B) such property is used in interstate or foreign commerce or in an activity that affects interstate or foreign commerce;
(C) any perpetrator travels in or causes another to travel in interstate or foreign commerce in furtherance of the offense; or
(D) the offense, or the results of the offense, affect interstate or foreign commerce, or, in the case of a threat, attempt, or conspiracy, would have affected interstate or foreign commerce;
(3) against any property that is owned, leased or used by the United States or by any department or agency of the United States, whether the property is within or outside of the United States; or
(4) against any property within the United States that is owned, leased, or used by a foreign government,
shall be imprisoned for any term of years or for life, and if death results, shall be punished by death or imprisoned for any term of years or for life.
(b) Offense by National of the United States Outside of the United States.— Any national of the United States who, without lawful authority, uses, or threatens, attempts, or conspires to use, a weapon of mass destruction outside of the United States shall be imprisoned for any term of years or for life, and if death results, shall be punished by death, or by imprisonment for any term of years or for life.
(c) Definitions.— For purposes of this section—
(1) the term “national of the United States” has the meaning given in section 101(a)(22) of the Immigration and Nationality Act (8 U.S.C. 1101 (a)(22));
(2) the term “weapon of mass destruction” means—
(A) any destructive device as defined in section 921 of this title;
(B) any weapon that is designed or intended to cause death or serious bodily injury through the release, dissemination, or impact of toxic or poisonous chemicals, or their precursors;
(C) any weapon involving a biological agent, toxin, or vector (as those terms are defined in section 178 of this title); or
(D) any weapon that is designed to release radiation or radioactivity at a level dangerous to human life; and
(3) the term “property” includes all real and personal property.

http://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/18/921

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(4) The term “destructive device” means—
(A) any explosive, incendiary, or poison gas—
(i) bomb,
(ii) grenade,
(iii) rocket having a propellant charge of more than four ounces,
(iv) missile having an explosive or incendiary charge of more than one-quarter ounce,
(v) mine, or
(vi) device similar to any of the devices described in the preceding clauses;

No wonder everyone in SC gets so angry, no one seems to ever fact check.

--"When I die, may I be surrounded by scattered chrome and burning gasoline."

[Andy9o8 0]

For a big guy, you got fast reflexes, Dave.
Anyhow, what he said.

[lawrocket 3]

Charging with a weapon of mass destruction?

And people wonder why due process rights are needed. [Facepalm]

My wife is hotter than your wife.

[AggieDave 6]

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For a big guy, you got fast reflexes, Dave.
Anyhow, what he said.

Thanks.

Looks like even one of your litigious brothers in this thread slept through that lesson in law school.

--"When I die, may I be surrounded by scattered chrome and burning gasoline."

[billvon 2,400]

Wow. By that definition guns, lasers, microwave oven magnetrons and fireworks are WMD's.

[AggieDave 6]

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Wow. By that definition guns, lasers, microwave oven magnetrons and fireworks are WMD's.

It is what it is, I didn't make it up, but you have the power to change it. Call your representative.

If you ever get bored, sit down and read your state's penal code and the supporting documents to go with it. For Texas that would be the Penal Code, Code of Criminal Procedures, Health and Safety Code, Transportation Code, Family Code, Alcohol Beverage Code and Administration Code. I'm not sure what it is for California, but I promise you that you'll have more moments like this one while reading.

--"When I die, may I be surrounded by scattered chrome and burning gasoline."

[Andy9o8 0]

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Charging with a weapon of mass destruction?

And people wonder why due process rights are needed. [Facepalm]

Jerry, you gonna stand by that post? The statutory definitions are what they are.

[ryoder 1,384]

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Wow. By that definition guns, lasers, microwave oven magnetrons and fireworks are WMD's.

It is what it is, I didn't make it up, but you have the power to change it. Call your representative.

If you ever get bored, sit down and read your state's penal code and the supporting documents to go with it. For Texas that would be the Penal Code, Code of Criminal Procedures, Health and Safety Code, Transportation Code, Family Code, Alcohol Beverage Code and Administration Code. I'm not sure what it is for California, but I promise you that you'll have more moments like this one while reading.

When I lived in IN, I read all the pertinent state law I could find on self-defense with a deadly weapon, and learned that the definition of "deadly weapon" included anything that could case "extreme pain".

"There are only three things of value: younger women, faster airplanes, and bigger crocodiles" - Arthur Jones.

[normiss 622]

Depending on how they're used...sometimes it could accurately apply couldn't it?
If the desired effect is mass injuries and fatalities...I say yes.

[AggieDave 6]

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Wow. By that definition guns, lasers, microwave oven magnetrons and fireworks are WMD's.

It is what it is, I didn't make it up, but you have the power to change it. Call your representative.

If you ever get bored, sit down and read your state's penal code and the supporting documents to go with it. For Texas that would be the Penal Code, Code of Criminal Procedures, Health and Safety Code, Transportation Code, Family Code, Alcohol Beverage Code and Administration Code. I'm not sure what it is for California, but I promise you that you'll have more moments like this one while reading.

When I lived in IN, I read all the pertinent state law I could find on self-defense with a deadly weapon, and learned that the definition of "deadly weapon" included anything that could case "extreme pain".

To go down that rabbit hole, I bet there is case law in that state that further defines what "extreme pain" really means. Although we're derailing the thread a bit, if you were to guess, how many people living in a state really know what those state's laws are? They aren't secret, they're published freely and available many places for free, but how many people make assumptions on the law?

To continue, how many of those same people get angry and start making up accusations on the internet that are flat wrong?

--"When I die, may I be surrounded by scattered chrome and burning gasoline."

[skypuppy 1]

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a weapon of mass destruction

Its an IED not a feckin nuke FFS Talk about a stretch, is this so that they can say that yes they found WMD in Iraq in years to come?

well, according to some accounts I read there were certainly lots of biological weapons and ingredients found in irag, so I don't think they have to make stuff up

If some old guy can do it then obviously it can't be very extreme. Otherwise he'd already be dead.
Bruce McConkey 'I thought we were gonna die, and I couldn't think of anyone

[Andy9o8 0]

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a weapon of mass destruction

Its an IED not a feckin nuke FFS Talk about a stretch, is this so that they can say that yes they found WMD in Iraq in years to come?

well, according to some accounts I read there were certainly lots of biological weapons and ingredients found in irag, so I don't think they have to make stuff up

?? The WMD justification for Dick & Junior's invasion of Iraq have been pretty thoroughly debunked these past several years.

[DiverMike 5]

I guess it is our fault for assuming the government uses common sense when defining terms used in legislation. I don't think most people would consider a large firework that has over 4 ounces of propellant to be a weapon of mass destruction. Hell - it isn't even a finale to a fireworks show.

For the same reason I jump off a perfectly good diving board.

[skypuppy 1]

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a weapon of mass destruction

Its an IED not a feckin nuke FFS Talk about a stretch, is this so that they can say that yes they found WMD in Iraq in years to come?

well, according to some accounts I read there were certainly lots of biological weapons and ingredients found in irag, so I don't think they have to make stuff up

?? The WMD justification for Dick & Junior's invasion of Iraq have been pretty thoroughly debunked these past several years.

talking about nuclear, yes. But as I said I;ve read lots of reports about biological weapons...

If some old guy can do it then obviously it can't be very extreme. Otherwise he'd already be dead.
Bruce McConkey 'I thought we were gonna die, and I couldn't think of anyone

[Andy9o8 0]

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a weapon of mass destruction

Its an IED not a feckin nuke FFS Talk about a stretch, is this so that they can say that yes they found WMD in Iraq in years to come?

well, according to some accounts I read there were certainly lots of biological weapons and ingredients found in irag, so I don't think they have to make stuff up

?? The WMD justification for Dick & Junior's invasion of Iraq have been pretty thoroughly debunked these past several years.

talking about nuclear, yes. But as I said I;ve read lots of reports about biological weapons...

Working strictly from memory, I thought those were pretty well debunked, too....

[BillyVance 34]

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Depending on how they're used...sometimes it could accurately apply couldn't it?
If the desired effect is mass injuries and fatalities...I say yes.

3 dead and 180+ injured in two blasts. Sounds like a WMD to me. They can be of any size as far as I'm concerned if they are still able to kill and maim a bunch of people.

"Mediocre people don't like high achievers, and high achievers don't like mediocre people." - SIX TIME National Champion coach Nick Saban

[okalb 78]

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3 dead and 180+ injured in two blasts. Sounds like a WMD to me. They can be of any size as far as I'm concerned if they are still able to kill and maim a bunch of people.

Just playing devil's advocate here, but wouldn't that logic make an AR15 a WMD?

Time flies like an arrow....fruit flies like a banana

[BillyVance 34]

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3 dead and 180+ injured in two blasts. Sounds like a WMD to me. They can be of any size as far as I'm concerned if they are still able to kill and maim a bunch of people.

Just playing devil's advocate here, but wouldn't that logic make an AR15 a WMD?

Good point. Depends on the magazine size and what the law says are the max number of bullets allowed.

"Mediocre people don't like high achievers, and high achievers don't like mediocre people." - SIX TIME National Champion coach Nick Saban

[skypuppy 1]

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3 dead and 180+ injured in two blasts. Sounds like a WMD to me. They can be of any size as far as I'm concerned if they are still able to kill and maim a bunch of people.

Just playing devil's advocate here, but wouldn't that logic make an AR15 a WMD?

Good point. Depends on the magazine size and what the law says are the max number of bullets allowed.

No because you have to pull the trigger each time you want to fire the gun. Unless it was full auto, which isn't available to mass public.

If some old guy can do it then obviously it can't be very extreme. Otherwise he'd already be dead.
Bruce McConkey 'I thought we were gonna die, and I couldn't think of anyone

[billvon 2,400]

>It is what it is, I didn't make it up

Sorry, not blaming you, just commenting on the stupidity of the definition.

[billvon 2,400]

>Depending on how they're used...sometimes it could accurately apply couldn't it?

Sometimes yes. But the definition says it applies ALL the time. Magnetron wired to try to heat up a room full of people? WMD! Laser pointer that emits radiation that can blind a pilot? WMD! Gun that fires lead bullets? WMD!

It's like calling anything you dislike "fascism." After a while it doesn't mean anything any more other than "something really bad." Which is what the term WMD is becoming, both in common usage and legally.