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jclalor

I Really Hope the news is Wrong...

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Neither you nor I know what happened in that house.



Agreed.

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But from all studies, kids that are home schooled don't get the same positive effects of socialization as kids get at school.



Errr....no. Plenty of current studies show differently. I see a lot of people say this...hell I used to say this too.....but my experience with homeschooling is that the child gets just as much socialization with other children (note: My homeschool experiences are in groups so it's not some kid locked away at home on their own). There's play time, and education time - just like a regular school.

Can homeschooling be used to isolate children? Of course, but that's a parenting problem not a homeschooling problem.

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Those are facts.



Opinions != facts.

Ian



OK so you got some socialization while home schooled. So your parents had degrees in education and were experienced in supplying education, testing, evualating etc., that you turned out OK? What distinctions can you make between a parent who teaches its children the same circulum as kids get in school. A home teacher (parent) might employee parenting aspects while supplying instruction, including IAN-- go to your room, your not agreeing that Jesus was the savior! God only knows what parents are teaching their kids while homeschooling, maybe even how to use an AR!

Kids need to be in school. IMHO.

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LOL - I wasn't homeschooled. I went to a mix of public and private schools :)

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A home teacher (parent) might employee parenting aspects while supplying instruction, including IAN-- go to your room, your not agreeing that Jesus was the savior!



I'm an atheist, my parents are Christian however. My parents respect my choices, as I do theirs. Your argument lacks logic since a parent, home or public schooled, who is going to force religion on their children will do so regardless of schooling methodologies.

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God only knows what parents are teaching their kids while homeschooling, maybe even how to use an AR!



True. But again, those teachings will happen (if the parent is so inclined) regardless of schooling system.

Bad parents are going to be bad parents, regardless of schooling systems.

Ian
Performance Designs Factory Team

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LOL - I wasn't homeschooled. I went to a mix of public and private schools :)

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A home teacher (parent) might employee parenting aspects while supplying instruction, including IAN-- go to your room, your not agreeing that Jesus was the savior!



I'm an atheist, my parents are Christian however. My parents respect my choices, as I do theirs. Your argument lacks logic since a parent, home or public schooled, who is going to force religion on their children will do so regardless of schooling methodologies.

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God only knows what parents are teaching their kids while homeschooling, maybe even how to use an AR!



True. But again, those teachings will happen (if the parent is so inclined) regardless of schooling system.

Bad parents are going to be bad parents, regardless of schooling systems.

Ian


But an elementary school teacher won't tell kids to believe in Jesus or how to load an AR at school! Jeesh. You can't be serious!
Besides, how would a parent know if their kid was GIFTED, that they might attend the GIFTED class? Parent really can't evaluate progress as there's no other students around. How about retraining, testing etc.
Unless if the parent has received instruction in how to teach and knows the subject matter they shouldn't be the instructor, same that your mom probably shouldn't be the one teaching you how to skydive, Jesus or no Jesus.

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But an elementary school teacher won't tell kids to believe in Jesus or how to load an AR at school! Jeesh. You can't be serious!



Actually, I am serious.

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Besides, how would a parent know if their kid was GIFTED, that they might attend the GIFTED class? Parent really can't evaluate progress as there's no other students around. How about retraining, testing etc.



Are you reading my posts? Seems not. YOU are the one who thinks there are no other students around. I've told you otherwise. Your choice to comprehend it or not. I can't force you to.

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Unless if the parent has received instruction in how to teach and knows the subject matter they shouldn't be the instructor, same that your mom probably shouldn't be the one teaching you how to skydive,



My child, and others, are homeschooled by *gasp* teachers (such as my wife) who have left the education system because it's such a mess and they're despondent with the state of education in the USA today.

Trust me, I understand your skepticism. I too was uneducated in these matters. Difference is, I knew it, and I didn't run around spouting nonsense about something I didn't understand.

Ian
edit: FWIW, we let our child make the choice about homeschooling vs public and our intention is continue doing so. I expect one day she'll want to go to public school and I FULLY support that too.
Performance Designs Factory Team

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A home teacher (parent) might employee parenting aspects while supplying instruction, including IAN-- go to your room, your not agreeing that Jesus was the savior! God only knows what parents are teaching their kids while homeschooling, maybe even how to use an AR!

Kids need to be in school. IMHO.



you're right, we should only let the personal biases of strangers or a very politically oriented union of strange be allowed to indoctrinate our kids.

How dare parents teach or raise their own kids!

...
Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants

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But an elementary school teacher won't tell kids to believe in Jesus or how to load an AR at school! Jeesh. You can't be serious!



Actually, I am serious.

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Besides, how would a parent know if their kid was GIFTED, that they might attend the GIFTED class? Parent really can't evaluate progress as there's no other students around. How about retraining, testing etc.



Are you reading my posts? Seems not. YOU are the one who thinks there are no other students around. I've told you otherwise. Your choice to comprehend it or not. I can't force you to.

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Unless if the parent has received instruction in how to teach and knows the subject matter they shouldn't be the instructor, same that your mom probably shouldn't be the one teaching you how to skydive,



My child, and others, are homeschooled by *gasp* teachers (such as my wife) who have left the education system because it's such a mess and they're despondent with the state of education in the USA today.

Trust me, I understand your skepticism. I too was uneducated in these matters. Difference is, I knew it, and I didn't run around spouting nonsense about something I didn't understand.

Ian
edit: FWIW, we let our child make the choice about homeschooling vs public and our intention is continue doing so. I expect one day she'll want to go to public school and I FULLY support that too.



Well if your WIFE was a former elementary school teacher then you might have a case, provided she's good at it. The point I brought up was socialization which is differnt from instruction given and instruction received. Ms Lanza knew all about socializaing kids. Hell, she didn't even let her son have a car and her x paid for one! Home schooling didn't work out so good in this instance.

I gather this parent was so protective the kid wanted out of her control! He ended up hating her.

Perhaps if MOM had her own job, not the job of dealing with her son, events might have been different. Pure conjecture of course, but info points in that direction. But she didnt' have to work.

http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2012/12/17/nancy-lanza-conn-adam-lanza/1774611/

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Perhaps if MOM had her own job, not the job of dealing with her son, events might have been different. Pure conjecture of course, but info points in that direction. But she didnt' have to work.



*sigh*

Are you actually trying to make the case that parents who take an active involvement in education should rather be 'working' and having the typical little to no involvement of today?
Performance Designs Factory Team

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edit: FWIW, we let our child make the choice about homeschooling vs public and our intention is continue doing so. I expect one day she'll want to go to public school and I FULLY support that too.



Of course a third grader, can make choices on the type of eduction and where they might be educated that YOU'LL continue to teach at home. So we wait for "ONE DAY", a day that you decide the child gets to make up there own mind. Sorry but the opportunity for your child is lost to be properly socialized with other kids. Please keep you guns locked up as you kids will hate you for not allowing them to be with other kids!

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Not sure if you guys saw this yet or not. Westboro plans on picketing the Connecticut vigil. Like those families haven't had enough to deal with already. >:(

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/12/16/westboro-baptist-church-picket-connecticut-school-shooting_n_2312186.html

"Are you coming to the party?
Oh I'm coming, but I won't be there!"
Flying Hellfish #828
Dudist #52

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The point I brought up was socialization which is differnt from instruction given and instruction received. Ms Lanza knew all about socializaing kids. Hell, she didn't even let her son have a car and her x paid for one! Home schooling didn't work out so good in this instance.

I gather this parent was so protective the kid wanted out of her control! He ended up hating her.
/



All barking up the wrong tree, as far as I am concerned. Record apparently shows the kid had at least two years in middle school and three years in high school at public schools.
"What if there were no hypothetical questions?"

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Sorry but the opportunity for your child is lost to be properly socialized with other kids. Please keep you guns locked up as you kids will hate you for not allowing them to be with other kids!



I wonder what your personal definition of "properly" is. How many kids do you have?

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Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants

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Sorry but the opportunity for your child is lost to be properly socialized with other kids. Please keep you guns locked up as you kids will hate you for not allowing them to be with other kids!



I wonder what your personal definition of "properly" is. How many kids do you have?



Perhaps I should have eliminated the the word properly and just used socialization.

If they are at home they're not getting socialized with their peers.
If they are in school they're getting socialized.

Not gaining socialization with peers is not a good thing. Socialization with peers outside the school setting is not the same as in-school socialization. Like how you were socialized you say by participating in groups outside of school.
If your wife was a former elementary school teacher she should know this.
It's not what you think you are teaching your kids, it's what they learn on their own. Your child will never ever learn how to deal with a bully, a nice person, a back stabber, if you're not letting them in society to learn on their own, at 5yr, 6yr old etc. So they'll have hard coping skills as an adult perhaps.

Somethings you can't teach, especially in a home school setting.

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Not gaining socialization with peers is not a good thing.



I 100% agree.

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If they are at home they're not getting socialized with their peers.



Nope. Wrong, again. Look, it doesn't matter how many times you ignore the fact that homeschooling can be, and often is, done in a group - it's still the way it is.

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If they are in school they're getting socialized.



Definitely. As are they in homeschool, at extra curricular activities (gymnastics in our case), kids at the dropzone, with the other neighborhood kids, and (in our case) as they travel the world with us (insert shock and awe here).

I honestly think you have this *idea* in your head of what homeschooling is, and you just cannot conceive that it's often something very different. I also acknowledge that there are homeschoolers who isolate their children from the world, and don't educate them properly, or give them misinformation. Again, education system doesn't dictate good or bad parenting.

In the end if you fell all homeschooling is that way, that's fine (although misguided IMO) - I'm going to continue to do what I think is best for my children, just like one day when you're a parent I'm sure you'll do for yours.

Ian
Performance Designs Factory Team

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Kids need to be in school. IMHO.



Many of us understand this

so the kids are not taught the constitution

So they get taught gay rights and abortion

that sex is ok early if you protect yourself

So the state has some control over what kids think of global warming and other bull shit

Your opinion is understood very well actually
"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

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Kids need to be in school. IMHO.



Many of us understand this

so the kids are not taught the constitution

So they get taught gay rights and abortion

that sex is ok early if you protect yourself

So the state has some control over what kids think of global warming and other bull shit

Your opinion is understood very well actually



My kids know the Constitution rather better than some of the posters on here based on the stuff they post. Consider yourself included.
...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

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Kids need to be in school. IMHO.



Many of us understand this

so the kids are not taught the constitution

So they get taught gay rights and abortion

that sex is ok early if you protect yourself

So the state has some control over what kids think of global warming and other bull shit

Your opinion is understood very well actually


My kids know the Constitution rather better than some of the posters on here based on the stuff they post. Consider yourself included.

:D:D:D

Desperation is not your strong suit sir

Your kids most likely want to ban guns like you do too:D
"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

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Kids need to be in school. IMHO.



Many of us understand this

so the kids are not taught the constitution

So they get taught gay rights and abortion

that sex is ok early if you protect yourself

So the state has some control over what kids think of global warming and other bull shit

Your opinion is understood very well actually


My kids know the Constitution rather better than some of the posters on here based on the stuff they post. Consider yourself included.


:D:D:D

Desperation is not your strong suit sir

Your kids most likely want to ban guns like you do too:D

You have problems with reading comprehension too.
...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

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Kids need to be in school. IMHO.



Many of us understand this

so the kids are not taught the constitution

So they get taught gay rights and abortion

that sex is ok early if you protect yourself

So the state has some control over what kids think of global warming and other bull shit

Your opinion is understood very well actually


My kids know the Constitution rather better than some of the posters on here based on the stuff they post. Consider yourself included.


:D:D:D

Desperation is not your strong suit sir

Your kids most likely want to ban guns like you do too:D


You have problems with reading comprehension too.

Ya

You have used that tired line enough too:D
"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

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Not gaining socialization with peers is not a good thing.



I 100% agree.

Quote

If they are at home they're not getting socialized with their peers.



Nope. Wrong, again. Look, it doesn't matter how many times you ignore the fact that homeschooling can be, and often is, done in a group - it's still the way it is.

Quote

If they are in school they're getting socialized.



Definitely. As are they in homeschool, at extra curricular activities (gymnastics in our case), kids at the dropzone, with the other neighborhood kids, and (in our case) as they travel the world with us (insert shock and awe here).

I honestly think you have this *idea* in your head of what homeschooling is, and you just cannot conceive that it's often something very different. I also acknowledge that there are homeschoolers who isolate their children from the world, and don't educate them properly, or give them misinformation. Again, education system doesn't dictate good or bad parenting.

In the end if you fell all homeschooling is that way, that's fine (although misguided IMO) - I'm going to continue to do what I think is best for my children, just like one day when you're a parent I'm sure you'll do for yours.

Ian



OH I know how different it must be, not only for the kid, but also the immense burden for the parent to deliver not only the required or NECESSARY instruction to his kid at home, but the attempt to socialize the child as they'd be socialized in an elementary school must be daunting! So your child can do Algebra in 5th grade as some do. Do you know advanced math well enough to teach your child advanced math? If not, child goes without opportunity.
The fact remains: if kids are home alone with MOM, or a DAD, or MOM & DAD, MOM AND DAD AND GRANDMA, or UNCLE TOMMIE, they are not with their peers in a structured class room environment where not only do they have to perform for a teacher they must keep up with peers--something you can't provide. The opportunity for you kid to debate another kid, tell another kid to stop it, or bug off, coping skills with other kids, having to adhear to policy like your child will have to do once they get out from your control, is lost. Being the elementary school is a huge burden IMHO. Besides your tax dollar pay for all the expertise why not use it?

I agree, raise your kids any way you want. But the more they are sheltered, once they learn how they were sheltered: you're the enemy.

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....
:D:D:D

Desperation is not your strong suit sir

Your kids most likely want to ban guns like you do too:D



You have problems with reading comprehension too.

Ya

You have used that tired line enough too:D

Your permant use of :D makes not only look your posts moronic.

You really seem to have a lot of fun in this thread. Rather strange.

dudeist skydiver # 3105

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....
:D:D:D

Desperation is not your strong suit sir

Your kids most likely want to ban guns like you do too:D



You have problems with reading comprehension too.


Ya

You have used that tired line enough too:D

Your permant use of :D makes not only look your posts moronic.

You really seem to have a lot of fun in this thread. Rather strange.


:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D
"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

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