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billvon 2,450
>they going to get blamed if he committs suicide by some other mean?
This doesn't make a lot of sense. If you're an S+TA, and someone is suicidal, and they tell you this, and you tell them "well, I'm not letting you jump today; you're not in a good state of mind to skydive" - would you be responsible if they go home and kill themselves?
mnealtx 0
Quote>If they're going to get blamed if he commits suicide with a gun, aren't
>they going to get blamed if he committs suicide by some other mean?
This doesn't make a lot of sense. If you're an S+TA, and someone is suicidal, and they tell you this, and you tell them "well, I'm not letting you jump today; you're not in a good state of mind to skydive" - would you be responsible if they go home and kill themselves?
I'm unaware of any responsibility that an S&TA has outside of skydiving operations - can you show me where that's stated?
Makes perfect sense - if you're looking at the PERSON and not the TOOL they use. When you do that, "Why didn't you take his sleeping pills?" becomes equally as valid as "Why didn't you take his guns?" if you're looking to assign blame.
I love you, Shannon and Jim.
POPS 9708 , SCR 14706
Quote
....
That's a pretty bigoted statement.
*Bigot* is the wrong word in my context. Sometimes, bigotry comes with age. I still have some years left, before probably I have to deal with that .
As I am pretty grounded, I feel that thanking *ACLU* for giving back weapons to such an old man is hypocrisy.
*Bigot* is the right word for fanatical proponents of 2nd amendment, no matter what it might cost.
dudeist skydiver # 3105
billvon 2,450
>skydiving operations
And I'm unaware of any responsibility a police officer has to manage a patient's prescriptions.
>Makes perfect sense - if you're looking at the PERSON and not the
>TOOL they use. When you do that, "Why didn't you take his sleeping pills?"
>becomes equally as valid as "Why didn't you take his guns?"
?? I suppose if you think he could "blow his head off" with sleeping pills that might make sense. Can you show me someone who's done that?
But to answer your question another way, if he called in to 911 and said "I'm about to kill myself by taking sleeping pills" then it would make sense to confiscate them.
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*Bigot* is the right word for fanatical proponents of 2nd amendment, no matter what it might cost.
you misspelled "civil libertarian." Easy mistake to make when you live in a place without freedom of speech.
QuoteQuote
*Bigot* is the right word for fanatical proponents of 2nd amendment, no matter what it might cost.
you misspelled "civil libertarian." Easy mistake to make when you live in a place without freedom of speech.
I didn't *misspell* anything - come to Germany, dear. You will find paradise
dudeist skydiver # 3105
QuoteReading the original article John linked to, it seems that Mr. Weinstein was distraught at the death of his wife, and mentioned to a sheriff's deputy that he was thinking of suicide using a gun ("blowing his head off" were the actual words). It seems to me this puts the LEO in a difficult situation. If he left the guns in Mr. Weinstein's possession, and Mr. Weinstein then used them to commit suicide, the sheriff's office could be held liable.
Fear of liability doesn't warrant seizure of property. I'm not convinced they're liable in the first place. This brings back the recent thread of the bedridden nut with a gun that the cops tazed to prevent possibility of her killing herself. Maybe we can simplify matters and say that this is not a obligation by the cops.
mnealtx 0
Quote>I'm unaware of any responsibility that an S&TA has outside of
>skydiving operations
And I'm unaware of any responsibility a police officer has to manage a patient's prescriptions.
Another false argument - the doctor and pharmacist does that.
Quote>Makes perfect sense - if you're looking at the PERSON and not the
>TOOL they use. When you do that, "Why didn't you take his sleeping pills?"
>becomes equally as valid as "Why didn't you take his guns?"
?? I suppose if you think he could "blow his head off" with sleeping pills that might make sense. Can you show me someone who's done that?
Sure can't - can you show me someone whose breathing reflex was depressed until death occured due to an overdose of guns?
QuoteBut to answer your question another way, if he called in to 911 and said "I'm about to kill myself by taking sleeping pills" then it would make sense to confiscate them.
Since you're focusing on the mechanism of harm rather than the person, I'm sure it does - because NOBODY has ever chosen an alternate way to kill themself if their primary choice wasn't available.
I'm also sure that's why families NEVER sue the DZ, rig/canopy maker, pilot, aircraft manufacturer etc etc etc when their son/daughter dies in a skydiving accident, right?
I love you, Shannon and Jim.
POPS 9708 , SCR 14706
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I didn't *misspell* anything - come to Germany, dear. You will find paradise
I've been there...good beer and sidewalk food, questionable civil rights.
mnealtx 0
Quoteto such an old man
Thanks for proving it yet again, in case anyone was undecided.
I love you, Shannon and Jim.
POPS 9708 , SCR 14706
rushmc 18
QuoteQuote
....
Thank you, ACLU.
....
Yep. And now that oldie is going to buy himself a more modern weapon, why not an AK-47 or similar? That will spare him to move his shivery fingers more than once.
Jeez, what a daft comment: *Thank you, ACLU*
Will you blame or thank ACLU in case the old doter kills himself of someone in his neighbourhood???
Nope
He will be blamed as it should be
But that has not a damned thing to do with this thread
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln
billvon 2,450
Uh, right. That's my point. Doctors and pharmacists, not cops, manage people's medication. A cop (or S+TA) is not liable for people's misuse of that medication.
>Sure can't - can you show me someone whose breathing reflex was
>depressed until death occured due to an overdose of guns?
Nope. And that has nothing to do with what happened here.
>Since you're focusing on the mechanism of harm rather than the person,
>I'm sure it does - because NOBODY has ever chosen an alternate way to kill
>themself if their primary choice wasn't available.
Of course they have. But a cop can't make someone non-suicidal; all they can do is respond to a threat that someone makes to kill themselves (which is, BTW, a crime.). If they threaten to do so with a gun, it makes sense for them to remove the gun. If they threaten to do so with sleeping pills, it makes sense for them to remove the sleeping pills. In both cases it may also make sense to get a psychiatrist involved either immediately or as soon as possible.
QuoteQuote
I didn't *misspell* anything - come to Germany, dear. You will find paradise
I've been there...good beer and sidewalk food, questionable civil rights.
I know. 65 years ago, life was a bit harder here.
BTW: Our sidewalk food never was that good.
dudeist skydiver # 3105
That's a pretty bigoted statement.
I love you, Shannon and Jim.
POPS 9708 , SCR 14706
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