Pellosi: Why Work - Everyone else will pay for it for you . . .

[rehmwa 2]

Quote

Someone with whom you have like political ideology and when someone questions her you puff up like a horny tom turkey and say prove her wrong.

and Don't forget

Quote

Rules: ALL assertions made by either of us must be supported by FACTS.

"FACTS" as defined by who? Politics is funny - I doubt there are any 'facts', just opinions and spins.

You two can waste your time then by doing the exercise and then bickering over which facts are really true facts (facts can only be found on alternet)

...
Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants

[rushmc 18]

Quote

Quote

Someone with whom you have like political ideology and when someone questions her you puff up like a horny tom turkey and say prove her wrong.

and Don't forget

Quote

Rules: ALL assertions made by either of us must be supported by FACTS.

"FACTS" as defined by who? Politics is funny - I doubt there are any 'facts', just opinions and spins.

You two can waste your time then by doing the exercise and then bickering over which facts are really true facts (facts can only be found on alternet)

Not going to be me doing it
I just called quade out on his duplicitous stance


As for your point.

Are those your facts or just your opinions?





sorry, couldnt help myself but, for the most part your point is on the mark

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[quade 3]

Quote

"FACTS" as defined by who? Politics is funny - I doubt there are any 'facts', just opinions and spins.

I guess that's where some people differ. Some people don't know how to even define fact and opinion.

Facts are things that exist, such as the actual words of the US Constitution. It's not an opinion what the words are. An opinion might be what the words themselves mean, like the parsing of commas and the definition of the word militia.

However, the actual words themselves as written on the page are facts.

FACT: The preamble to the US Constitution begins with the words, "We the People of the United States."

OPINION: "People of the United States" means citizens.

quade -
The World's Most Boring Skydiver

[mnealtx 0]

Quote

Dude, the vast majority Beck's work doesn't hold up against a 5th grade civics textbook. The man simply doesn't know what he's talking about. Pick any show of his you can find and it's filled with errors and falsehoods.

Compare that to what Maddow did by having the guy that manufactured Tea Party astro turf web sites on. How the hell can you refute that? The guy admitted it.

So, someone getting paid for making a website constitutes 'astroturf' now?

Guess that means that Moveon, CodePink, etc etc etc are all 'astroturf' organizations too.

Mike
I love you, Shannon and Jim.
POPS 9708 , SCR 14706

[quade 3]

Quote

Guess that means that Moveon, CodePink, etc etc etc are all 'astroturf' organizations too.

If you can show where MoveOn has ever said it was a nation-wide grass roots movement rather than a political action committee, go for it and call them astroturf.

However, I'm fairly certain MoveOn has always identified itself for what it really is, a PAC.

Check it out, they even say so on their web site; http://www.moveon.org/about.html

quade -
The World's Most Boring Skydiver

[mnealtx 0]

Quote

Quote

Guess that means that Moveon, CodePink, etc etc etc are all 'astroturf' organizations too.

If you can show where MoveOn has ever said it was a nation-wide grass roots movement rather than a political action committee, go for it and call them astroturf.

However, I'm fairly certain MoveOn has always identified itself for what it really is, a PAC.

Check it out, they even say so on their web site; http://www.moveon.org/about.html

Quote

Astroturfing is a form of propaganda whose techniques usually consist of a few people attempting to give the impression that mass numbers of enthusiasts advocate some specific cause. In the UK this technique is better known as "rent-a-crowd" after the successful "rent-a-crate" business.

Given the number of people attending Tea Party events, I'd say Maddow is full of .... astroturf.

Mike
I love you, Shannon and Jim.
POPS 9708 , SCR 14706

[rushmc 18]

Quote

Quote

Quote

Guess that means that Moveon, CodePink, etc etc etc are all 'astroturf' organizations too.

If you can show where MoveOn has ever said it was a nation-wide grass roots movement rather than a political action committee, go for it and call them astroturf.

However, I'm fairly certain MoveOn has always identified itself for what it really is, a PAC.

Check it out, they even say so on their web site; http://www.moveon.org/about.html

Quote

Astroturfing is a form of propaganda whose techniques usually consist of a few people attempting to give the impression that mass numbers of enthusiasts advocate some specific cause. In the UK this technique is better known as "rent-a-crowd" after the successful "rent-a-crate" business.

Given the number of people attending Tea Party events, I'd say Maddow is full of .... astroturf.

People seem to accuse others of what they do

And here we have a perfect example of the this.

Example? There are some very old groups renting crowds for the AZ law protests. But those are called grass roots protests.

Ya, right......

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[timmyfitz 0]

Quote

Quote

Quote

The nitwits that are tea party followers are pathetic. They read the bullshit on websites bought and paid for with corporate dollars and swallow it, hook, line, and sinker.
Rachel Maddow has done an excellent job of researching

She is an excellent source of unbiased opinions. (/sarcasm)

While she may be biased, her research is excellent. Try to disprove it.

Research includes all sources, not just the ones that fit your agenda. So biased research is not excellent.

[Nastyn8 0]

Quote

Quote

Quote

Move along, nothing to see here execpt another fine example of right wingnut nitwittery.

Nitwits, and the fuckers VOTE as instructed by their corporate leaders. Tea Partiers = corporate stooges. NONE of the "tea party" bullshit is grassroots. They are all AstroTurf.

No wonder the country is headed off a cliff.

There are two possibilities as to how you and others have created this completely false idea that Tea Parties are merely a large group of paid-off political pawns -

1: You are blindly accepting what a bunch of decidedly liberal columnists and news anchors have perpetuated,

or

2: You know that it's false, and you are therefore lying.

So it's really a question of ignorance or impropriety. I'll give you the benefit of the doubt and assume that you are simply misinformed - but ignorance really isn't something to be proud of, nonetheless.

Before you attempt to convince me that the Tea Parties are a hoax, let me ask you: Have you ever actually been to a Tea Party? I have, and everyone I know that attended the Tea Party is a genuine person who showed up simply because they believed in a cause. None of them received any money for their attendance.

The nitwits that are tea party followers are pathetic. They read the bullshit on websites bought and paid for with corporate dollars and swallow it, hook, line, and sinker.

Rachel Maddow has done an excellent job of researching and exposing the OWNERSHIP of the main websites and the company that sets them up. They are totally astroturf, as in FAKE grassroots websites. The scumbag that takes the corporate money and cranks up the astroturf websites has appeared on her show.

Your lack of curiousity and inability to do any research of your own does not make your opinion correct.

I went to a local tea party event. What I saw there was a pack of racist white people who had lots of hateful things to say about the current POTUS. I heard a lot of verbal vomit that was repetition of right wing horseshit. I did not see concerned citizens with respect for our government and the constitution. I saw a scared group of easily led white folks that hate the fact that there is a person of color as president. The idea of overthrowing the government was quite popular. The methods discussed had nothing to do with winning elections. The methods were superior arms and intimidating those rotten "liberals".

Maybe the quality of people at these events has improved. As the tea party has gotten credit for Rand Paul's primary win, the odds are against it.

First of all, I'm not sure why I need to read a liberal TV/radio personality's opinion (excuse me...."research") in order to understand an event that I ATTENDED and PARTICIPATED in. Do we have to read a whuffo's news report on skydiving in order to understand what jumping means to us?

BTW - The Tea Party movement has NOTHING to do with the color of the President's skin. Just because you and other liberals have been able to hunt down racists at an event doesn't mean they represent the message of the movement. I'm not racist, I simply take issue with a government and its leaders that flagrantly disobey the group of people they were elected to represent.

I find it truly fascinating that die-hard liberals can't or won't believe that a group of regular people are capable of organizing themselves and putting together a powerful, genuine movement. Why is it so hard to believe?

[quade 3]

Quote

I find it truly fascinating that die-hard liberals can't or won't believe that a group of regular people are capable of organizing themselves and putting together a powerful, genuine movement. Why is it so hard to believe?

When and from whom did you first learn about the Tea Party? Did one of their members knock on your front door or did you see them at a registration table set up at a mall entrance or what?

quade -
The World's Most Boring Skydiver

[futuredivot 0]

Quote

When and from whom did you first learn about the Tea Party? Did one of their members knock on your front door or did you see them at a registration table set up at a mall entrance or what?

Feel free to explain the relevance of your post.

You are only as strong as the prey you devour

[quade 3]

Quote

Quote

When and from whom did you first learn about the Tea Party? Did one of their members knock on your front door or did you see them at a registration table set up at a mall entrance or what?

Feel free to explain the relevance of your post.

The answer provides the relevance. It's not on me.

quade -
The World's Most Boring Skydiver

[futuredivot 0]

Quote

Quote

Quote

When and from whom did you first learn about the Tea Party? Did one of their members knock on your front door or did you see them at a registration table set up at a mall entrance or what?

Feel free to explain the relevance of your post.

The answer provides the relevance. It's not on me.

Short answer-more blind alley misdirect from Quade. Loving the consistancy.

You are only as strong as the prey you devour

[quade 3]

Quote

Short answer-more blind alley misdirect from Quade. Loving the consistancy.

Bullshit!

He asked;

Quote

I find it truly fascinating that die-hard liberals can't or won't believe that a group of regular people are capable of organizing themselves and putting together a powerful, genuine movement. Why is it so hard to believe?

I'm asking him to explain how he learned about the Tea Party and got involved.

It's not misdirection at all. I'm asking him to tell us how "a group of regular people" made him aware of the Tea Party movement.

He's intelligent enough to answer for himself. Why are YOU derailing the question? Just let him answer it.

quade -
The World's Most Boring Skydiver

[futuredivot 0]

Quote

he learned about the Tea Party and got involved.

Well he did and is-so it was pretty effective in that case. People are involved, that covers genuine. I don't see how lack of a mall table or door ringers or paid Nuts has anything to do with it.

You are only as strong as the prey you devour

[quade 3]

Quote

Quote

he learned about the Tea Party and got involved.

Well he did and is-so it was pretty effective in that case. People are involved, that covers genuine. I don't see how lack of a mall table or door ringers or paid Nuts has anything to do with it.

Let's see how he answers first because one of his complaints was that "die-hard liberals can't or won't believe that a group of regular people are capable of organizing themselves and putting together a powerful, genuine movement."

It's important because his view of the Tea Party movement seems to be entrenched in a certain belief of how it came to be. If that belief based in reality, he has a valid point, however, if it's not, then his entire belief in the Tea Party itself needs to come under question.

It's a bit like the fundamentalist belief in Genesis. If Genesis isn't true, then why should anyone believe the rest of the book?

quade -
The World's Most Boring Skydiver

[futuredivot 0]

Quote

Let's see how he answers first.

Why would any answer matter-it sounds like you're trolling for words you can misinterpret or twist to fit an agenda. So, say he got a mailer, what's your response? Saw a news report? From a dinner conversation with a friend? What point are you trying to drive at?

You are only as strong as the prey you devour

[quade 3]

Read the last line of the post directly above yours.

Again, let the man answer for himself.

Are you afraid of his answer or something?

quade -
The World's Most Boring Skydiver

[futuredivot 0]

Quote

Are you afraid of his answer or something?

I'm not blocking his IP-how could I hinder or help his answer-it's those comments that make me believe that you're pushing for a point you can make regardless of the reality of the situation.

It started as an idea-it is now promoted by a general population. If someone you disapprove of provided a little funding along the way-so be it.

You are only as strong as the prey you devour

[quade 3]

Quote

It started as an idea-it is now promoted by a general population. If someone you disapprove of provided a little funding along the way-so be it.

Dangerous attitude to take there if you think about it for even two seconds, especially if the original idea comes from people that don't have the general public's best interest at heart.

This has happened several times over the course of history.

So, since he seems to have checked out of the conversation, do YOU believe the Tea Party began as "a group of regular people"?

quade -
The World's Most Boring Skydiver

[turtlespeed 212]

Quote

Quote

It started as an idea-it is now promoted by a general population. If someone you disapprove of provided a little funding along the way-so be it.

Dangerous attitude to take there if you think about it for even two seconds, especially if the original idea comes from people that don't have the general public's best interest at heart.

This has happened several times over the course of history.

So, since he seems to have checked out of the conversation, do YOU believe the Tea Party began as "a group of regular people"?

It depends on your definition of regular.

Was George Hewes a regular guy?

What about James Starr or Phineas Stearns?

I'm not usually into the whole 3-way thing, but you got me a little excited with that. - Skymama
BTR #1 / OTB^5 Official #2 / Hellfish #408 / VSCR #108/Tortuga/Orfun