Why do we need the census?

[airdvr 200]

How in the hell does the government not know where you live and work?

Please don't dent the planet.

Destinations by Roxanne

[VTmotoMike08 0]

I too have long suspected that a little bit of inter agency coordination could eliminate the need for the census. Whether this would be cheaper than the census, I don't know. Leave it to the government to pick the most complicated, expensive, invasive, and cumbersome way to get it done

[Andy9o8 0]

People often have multiple and/or ambiguous places of residence. So, if nothing else, the first and foremost purpose of a census is to be able to apportion Congressional and state legislative districts according to population. If you theoretically take away every other purpose or agenda for having a census, that one purpose will still exist, and must be fulfilled one way or another.

That really is the original reason why the US Constitution (and many state constitutions) required the taking of a regular census. It would take an amendment of the Constitution to change that; although I'd think that in order for such a proposed amendment to have a chance, you'd have to demonstrate a better and more reliable method than a census to accomplish that particular purpose.

[Andy9o8 0]

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I too have long suspected that a little bit of inter agency coordination could eliminate the need for the census. Whether this would be cheaper than the census, I don't know. Leave it to the government to pick the most complicated, expensive, invasive, and cumbersome way to get it done

Do you really think that inter agency coordination would in any way be less complicated, expensive, invasive, or cumbersome, not to mention more accurate, than with a centralized method? Historically, "inter agency coordination" is frequently an oxymoron.

[Gawain 0]

It's in the Constitution, though I am of the opinion that the depth of questions is beyond the mandate.

So I try and I scream and I beg and I sigh
Just to prove I'm alive, and it's alright
'Cause tonight there's a way I'll make light of my treacherous life
Make light!

[wolfriverjoe 1,371]

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It's in the Constitution, though I am of the opinion that the depth of questions is beyond the mandate.

Agreed, but at least they aren't asking if you have a toilet anymore

"There are NO situations which do not call for a French Maid outfit." Lucky McSwervy

"~ya don't GET old by being weak & stupid!" - Airtwardo

[billvon 2,478]

>How in the hell does the government not know where you live and work?

They have a good idea. But when the result of their guesses is that you lose a representative in Congress, it's best to be sure. Hence the census, which is a) more accurate and b) what the Constitution says to do.

[kallend 1,683]

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How in the hell does the government not know where you live and work?

Why do you hate the US Constitution? Are you a frikkin anarchist commie pinko America-hating bottom-feeding trough-swilling socialist fascist pig?

...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[quade 3]

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How in the hell does the government not know where you live and work?

Because it's not about individuals. It's about counting the bodies in an area, some of which the government doesn't have any record of.

quade -
The World's Most Boring Skydiver

[quade 3]

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It's in the Constitution, though I am of the opinion that the depth of questions is beyond the mandate.

Which questions and why are you opposed to those particular ones?

quade -
The World's Most Boring Skydiver

[airdvr 200]

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How in the hell does the government not know where you live and work?

Why do you hate the US Constitution? Are you a frikkin anarchist commie pinko America-hating bottom-feeding trough-swilling socialist fascist pig?

You betcha!

Please don't dent the planet.

Destinations by Roxanne

[kallend 1,683]

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How in the hell does the government not know where you live and work?

Why do you hate the US Constitution? Are you a frikkin anarchist commie pinko America-hating bottom-feeding trough-swilling socialist fascist pig?

You betcha!

Oh, OK.

...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[Gawain 0]

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It's in the Constitution, though I am of the opinion that the depth of questions is beyond the mandate.

Which questions and why are you opposed to those particular ones?

Question 3 - Doesn't matter what you live in or whether or not you own it.
Question 4 - You're counting people, if you can't understand a simple number, sure as hell can't dial a phone either.
Question 5 - You don't need names to count bodies
Question 7 - Age, as a demographic is immaterial for district zoning. The demographic gets represented in Congress and through lobby.
Question 8 - Hispanic origin, is a demographic.
Question 9 - Though, with the Civil Rights Act, this creates a conflict.

Question 6 (gender), in absolute terms isn't needed for district zoning, but is an important statistic. Questions 2 and 10 are relevant because it pertains to persons dwelling circumstance.

edit: http://www.usconstitution.net/consttop_cens.html

...just count people...that's my take.

So I try and I scream and I beg and I sigh
Just to prove I'm alive, and it's alright
'Cause tonight there's a way I'll make light of my treacherous life
Make light!

[rhaig 0]

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It's in the Constitution, though I am of the opinion that the depth of questions is beyond the mandate.

I believe the mandate is for the name of the head of household, and the number of people living there.

That's all I filled out.

--
Rob

[Belgian_Draft 0]

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...you'd have to demonstrate a better and more reliable method than a census to accomplish that particular purpose.

Well, we could just have everyone raise both hands, count the fingers, and divide by 10. Even when you consider not everybody has 10 fingers, it would still be a lot more accurate than the way it is done now.

HAMMER:
Originally employed as a weapon of war, the hammer nowadays is used as a
kind of divining rod to locate the most expensive parts adjacent the
object we are trying to hit.

[Bolas 5]

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>How in the hell does the government not know where you live and work?

They have a good idea. But when the result of their guesses is that you lose a representative in Congress, it's best to be sure. Hence the census, which is a) more accurate and b) what the Constitution says to do.

Why ask the race questions then?

I do have large issue with trying to racially balance voting districts be redrawing the lines.

Stupidity if left untreated is self-correcting
If ya can't be good, look good, if that fails, make 'em laugh.

[kallend 1,683]

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>How in the hell does the government not know where you live and work?

They have a good idea. But when the result of their guesses is that you lose a representative in Congress, it's best to be sure. Hence the census, which is a) more accurate and b) what the Constitution says to do.

Why ask the race questions then?

I do have large issue with trying to racially balance voting districts be redrawing the lines.

I have issues with allowing any politicians being allowed to draw voting district lines. A nice consistent mathematical algorithm is needed that will create the most compact districts of equal size regardless of the racial/gender/age/other makeup of the population.

...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[quade 3]

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I have issues with allowing any politicians being allowed to draw voting district lines. A nice consistent mathematical algorithm is needed that will create the most compact districts of equal size regardless of the racial/gender/age/other makeup of the population.

Way off topic and may need to be broken out into a separate thread but . . .

Have any of you seen "How the States Got Their Shapes" on the History channel? Fascinating stuff. I think it's based on the book of the same name, but is way slicker in presentation.

Anyway, the reason I bring it up is the shape of anything is usually the result of powerful political forces, not simply natural boundaries. I'd love to see districts redrawn to be more fair too, but the question always comes up, "fair to who?"

quade -
The World's Most Boring Skydiver

[masterrig 1]

What I want to know is... what was that census form we recieved back in October (2009) with all those repetitious questions and the big warning that not filling-out the form could mean a penalty for notfilling it out and filing it? I didn't fill it out and recieved a phone call from some census taker who wanted me to answer the questions over the phone. I gave her such a hard time, she finally realized how stupid the questions were and gave-up.


Chuck

[wolfriverjoe 1,371]

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What I want to know is... what was that census form we recieved back in October (2009) with all those repetitious questions and the big warning that not filling-out the form could mean a penalty for notfilling it out and filing it? I didn't fill it out and recieved a phone call from some census taker who wanted me to answer the questions over the phone. I gave her such a hard time, she finally realized how stupid the questions were and gave-up.


Chuck

Which one was that?

I never got anything like that at all.

"There are NO situations which do not call for a French Maid outfit." Lucky McSwervy

"~ya don't GET old by being weak & stupid!" - Airtwardo

[RonD1120 58]

A mathematical algorithm would not allow the same liberty to the underhanded subversives to push their agendas through voting manipulation. That's how BHO got in.

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I have issues with allowing any politicians being allowed to draw voting district lines. A nice consistent mathematical algorithm is needed that will create the most compact districts of equal size regardless of the racial/gender/age/other makeup of the population.

Look for the shiny things of God revealed by the Holy Spirit. They only last for an instant but it is a Holy Instant. Let your soul absorb them.

[redlegphi 0]

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A mathematical algorithm would not allow the same liberty to the underhanded subversives to push their agendas through voting manipulation. That's how BHO got in.

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I have issues with allowing any politicians being allowed to draw voting district lines. A nice consistent mathematical algorithm is needed that will create the most compact districts of equal size regardless of the racial/gender/age/other makeup of the population.

Actually, the GOP tend to be the most Constitutionally literalist on the statistics method, since the groups that tend to be underrepresented now due to not filling out the census tend to be minorities, who tend to vote Dem. Nice try though.

[Andrewwhyte 1]

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I have issues with allowing any politicians being allowed to draw voting district lines. A nice consistent mathematical algorithm is needed that will create the most compact districts of equal size regardless of the racial/gender/age/other makeup of the population.

Way off topic and may need to be broken out into a separate thread but . . .

Have any of you seen "How the States Got Their Shapes" on the History channel? Fascinating stuff. I think it's based on the book of the same name, but is way slicker in presentation.

Anyway, the reason I bring it up is the shape of anything is usually the result of powerful political forces, not simply natural boundaries. I'd love to see districts redrawn to be more fair too, but the question always comes up, "fair to who?"

I have always been astounded by the way the US states redistrict. Although the US does a far better job of moving the power to the actual population shifts, I think we in Canada do a better job of the actual redistricting.
As in the US it is a province by province thing. A commmission is struck with a retired judge leading. They are mandated to make the ridings roughly equal demographically, but with allowances for physical size. Rural ridings tend to be smaller demographically due to the need for representatives to physically visit the area (west Texas is much harder to represent than suburban Dallas).
The first draft is published and there are community meetings where people (and party operatives) state their claim as to why the residents feel they are naturally a part of this community rather than that one. What often comes up in these meetings are things like geographical or man made barriers to social permeability that an algorithm does not capture. High school catchment areas are often natural community makers. Freeways are dividers.Usually there are small amendments made and the results are passes in the legislature with all party support. The key is having a non-partisan chair of the committee.

[masterrig 1]

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What I want to know is... what was that census form we recieved back in October (2009) with all those repetitious questions and the big warning that not filling-out the form could mean a penalty for notfilling it out and filing it? I didn't fill it out and recieved a phone call from some census taker who wanted me to answer the questions over the phone. I gave her such a hard time, she finally realized how stupid the questions were and gave-up.


Chuck

Which one was that?

I never got anything like that at all.

I'm not sure but it might have been one of those 'selected' census. They asked how much we earned each year, How many lived in this house and our nationality, etc. What was really 'stupid' about that census was, they would ask first if, I was married. Later, they would ask (basically) the same question and if I was divorced. I told her... "I just told you I was married!" I tore-up the 10 or 12 page form I first recieved. Sometime later, I got a call from 'The U.S. Census Bureau'. She asked me a few questions like, my name, address, and etc. Then she got into the 'questions' and I told her things like; "You just asked me that and I didn't answer the first time!" "Are you with ACORN?". She finally told me that she didn't need to continue.
I refused to tell her our house payments, income and things like that. I kept it to 'name, rank and serial number'!
I recently got the 'real' census and it was nothing like the first one.

Chuck

[1969912 0]

It might have been a scam. Fishing for SS and bank account numbers.

"Once we got to the point where twenty/something's needed a place on the corner that changed the oil in their cars we were doomed . . ."
-NickDG