What is it about gay marriage?

[okalb 78]

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Do you see what I am saying?

I understand exactly what you are saying and my only response is too bad. Suck it up and follow the rules or be discharged. Soldiers can think whatever they want and as long as they don't take action based on those feelings I don't care. I understand that it is an emotional thing. So what, there are plenty of times in the military that you have to control your emotions and follow orders whether you like it or not. Why should this be any different?

Time flies like an arrow....fruit flies like a banana

[Will_Evo 0]

Ok, so I am not sure where you stand, do you think dont ask dont tell should stay or go? Your last reply is a little confusing?

Zoo Crew

[okalb 78]

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Ok, so I am not sure where you stand, do you think dont ask dont tell should stay or go? Your last reply is a little confusing?

It absolutely should go. I was referring to rules about taking action against fellow soldiers. DADT is nothing more than government approved discrimination.

Time flies like an arrow....fruit flies like a banana

[billvon 2,400]

>except you missed the point of my post, the rules would have to be
>different.

This is what I don't get.

I mean, black soldiers (all soldiers actually) are covered under EO. But if a black soldier said "I don't want to shower with whitey, it's against my beliefs" they wouldn't build separate showers for blacks. If a white soldier said "Private Miller looks at me in the shower and it makes me uncomfortable" they don't build Private Miller a separate shower, whether he is gay or not. Why should gay soldiers be any different than the above?

[StreetScooby 5]

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Peace and happiness to all!! whatever floats your boat

Yes, that's about where I'm at in my life. But, personal responsibility in the civil society you find yourself must be paramount.

We are all engines of karma

[StreetScooby 5]

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In college I lived in a living group with coed bathrooms.

Now, I understand you better than I ever hoped to.

We are all engines of karma

[StreetScooby 5]

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I mean, I just don't know how to defend against a statement like that

It's a warrior culture.
That is the right answer to defend our country, forever.
A warrior is...

I tell my children at the dinner table that serving our country is a high calling.

We are all engines of karma

[Will_Evo 0]

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>except you missed the point of my post, the rules would have to be
>different.

This is what I don't get.

I mean, black soldiers (all soldiers actually) are covered under EO. But if a black soldier said "I don't want to shower with whitey, it's against my beliefs" they wouldn't build separate showers for blacks. If a white soldier said "Private Miller looks at me in the shower and it makes me uncomfortable" they don't build Private Miller a separate shower, whether he is gay or not. Why should gay soldiers be any different than the above?

Well in this situation, a soldier who said his reason for not wanting to shower with another soldier because of race, would more than likely receive some sort of correction whether it be by the UCMJ, or kept at a company level.

Right, but they would take steps to change the situation, aka give pvt miller and the other soldier specific shower times, to avoid any concern, I have actually seen this happen before, not because they were sexually uncomfortable, but because the two soldiers just did not get along. So maybe they wouldn't build new showers then, maybe there would be different shower times, regardless, is it worth it? I am playing the devils advocate here obviously.

Zoo Crew

[labrys 0]

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Right, but they would take steps to change the situation, aka give pvt miller and the other soldier specific shower times, to avoid any concern, I have actually seen this happen before, not because they were sexually uncomfortable, but because the two soldiers just did not get along. So maybe they wouldn't build new showers then, maybe there would be different shower times, regardless, is it worth it? I am playing the devils advocate here obviously.

What you've described here is an NCO managing a situation when it's reasonable to manage. All that reasonable management goes to hell under stress.

Maybe I'm old school.... but I think the answer is to tell the soldiers to work together or both of them need to pack a fucking bag.

Owned by Remi #?

[billvon 2,400]

>Right, but they would take steps to change the situation, aka give pvt
>miller and the other soldier specific shower times, to avoid any concern . . .
That's a reasonable solution, and would seem to work no matter what private Miller's sexual orientation was.

I guess I don't get why living with, or showering in the same locker room as a gay man is much different than doing the same with a straight man. I understand that it really bothers some people. But again, I don't see much difference between someone who is bothered by homosexuals and someone who is bothered by blacks. In both cases, it might make sense to accommodate their issues - but a better solution is that they should learn to deal with their (unreasonable) fears.

[HeadCone 0]

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Besides the biblical aspect, what concerns do people have about gay marriage?

It is repulsive to think about. We don't want our children or grandchildren thinking it is OK.

Except it is ok and I think all kids need to be raised knowing that.

Not in my family.

Pft. *facepalm*

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[Sangi 0]

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So, you're one of the people that thinks it's possible to talk somebody out of being gay? That if you preach to them enough, they'll go straight?

It appears that emotion has overridden intellect. I'm out.

Pwned haha. Love it how he stfu'ed and went out..

I love it when good ol' logic and sense is being rubbed into the prehistoric religious mindset zealots face and he actually realizes it, then doesn't know what to say and quits.

"Dream as you'll live forever, live as you'll die today." James Dean

[virgin-burner 1]

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Besides the biblical aspect, what concerns do people have about gay marriage?

It is repulsive to think about. We don't want our children or grandchildren thinking it is OK.

Except it is ok and I think all kids need to be raised knowing that.

Not in my family.

you shouldnt be allowed to reproduce; your kind makes the world hell to live in..

“Some may never live, but the crazy never die.”
-Hunter S. Thompson
"No. Try not. Do... or do not. There is no try."
-Yoda

[alge 0]

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I understand "don't ask don't tell" is going away, but is it necessarily a good thing? I mean, I look at it like this, being recognized is good, it removes that burden of feeling like you have to hide who you are, but at the same time, this is not an ideal world, and I guarantee the tornado that is "Equal Opportunity" will get a slap in the face the second a straight soldier finds out one of his squad mates is gay and is showering with him.

Maybe I can give some empirical data here. I served one year in the Norwegian army, 3/4 of that year as openly gay. Now I won't claim that it was entirely problem free; there were some homophobes in the platoon and I took a bit of abuse. But still it was waaay better for me than being in the closet, as I had been in high school.

I would also claim that I did a net positive contribution to the army, both on a technical (digital radio comms) side and personal (being someone people would come and talk to about shitty stuff) side.

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Now I know, I could care less, I understand just because they are gay doesn't mean they want to fuck everyone, but to the same regard, just because I am a man, doesn't mean I want to fuck every woman I see, but I still can't shower with women.

Showering was not a problem. It's not like I get an instant hard on whenever I see a naked guys. If someone had a big problem with showering together with me they never said so.

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It would be unavoidable, segregated showers and bathrooms in the military, [...]

I'm pretty sure that's wrong. While Norway might be slightly more progressed in the gay rights scene, I don't see any big differences in the cultures that would require segregated showers for USians.

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[..]but I am thinking realistically, rationally, being able to openly announce you are gay, will come with consequences, unfortunate ones but it will, so I ask again, is it necessarily a good thing?

That's a valid question. The answer for me was "YES!".

[Royd 0]

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So, you're one of the people that thinks it's possible to talk somebody out of being gay? That if you preach to them enough, they'll go straight?

No more so, than you can talk someone out of being a thief or a liar...Afterall, they were born that way.... You just pay the consequences, when you get caught. There ought to be a law against persecuting liars and thieves.

[Royd 0]

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It's a "there goes the neighborhood" type of sentiment.

And it comes from people who need to feel exclusive to feel special.

Thus, HOA's.. It should be my right to buy a $250k house, in an exclusive neighborhood, and park cars and boats, on blocks.... It's just an expression of my true self.

[Tiger6513 0]

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Besides the biblical aspect, what concerns do people have about gay marriage?

It is repulsive to think about. We don't want our children or grandchildren thinking it is OK.

Except it is ok and I think all kids need to be raised knowing that.

Not in my family.

you shouldnt be allowed to reproduce; your kind makes the world hell to live in..

I agree that people like Ron have absolutely no sense of reality. It's his hate and those like him that make me want to be racist, agaist organizations such at White sups, KKK and so on.. I am white and straight and have both gay and black and brown and far eastern friends alike. Go ahead Ron hate me for not seing people for what they look like or like to fuck. I see people for how genuine they are on the inside and how much fun they are to be around.
People like him make me so frustrated... gay is not an addiction fool get a damn clue.

Travis Roy Foundation. At very least its a tax write off

[champu 1]

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It's a "there goes the neighborhood" type of sentiment.

And it comes from people who need to feel exclusive to feel special.

Thus, HOA's.. It should be my right to buy a $250k house, in an exclusive neighborhood, and park cars and boats, on blocks.... It's just an expression of my true self.

I think you'll be okay here... studies have shown that all gay people drive smart cars, so parking won't be a problem.

Interesting/disturbing note: I went to google, "all gay people drive smart cars" to find a ridiculous article to link to with that statement and before I'm done typing the attached "popular" search suggestion flashed up there.

[jakee 1,256]

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So, you're one of the people that thinks it's possible to talk somebody out of being gay? That if you preach to them enough, they'll go straight?

No more so, than you can talk someone out of being a thief or a liar...Afterall, they were born that way.... You just pay the consequences, when you get caught.

What are the consequences of getting caught being gay? Who's doing the catching?

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There ought to be a law against persecuting liars and thieves.

Do you seriously equate gay people with liars and thieves?

Do you want to have an ideagasm?