Gawain 0
Recommended Posts
quade 3
QuoteThe government has had the child for the majority of his/her waking hours since the age of 5 and through 17/18.
I don't know what school you went to, but the schools I went to ran from about 8 am to 3 pm Monday through Friday with about three months off during the summer.
I don't think that's the majority of the average kid's waking hours.
quade -
The World's Most Boring Skydiver
The World's Most Boring Skydiver
Gawain 0
QuoteQuoteThe government has had the child for the majority of his/her waking hours since the age of 5 and through 17/18.
I don't know what school you went to, but the schools I went to ran from about 8 am to 3 pm Monday through Friday with about three months off during the summer.
I don't think that's the majority of the average kid's waking hours.
Indeed, but believe it or not, school environment plays a much larger role in shaping a kid's mind as they grow up even moreso than I would've given credit to. Check out the book "The Tipping Point" by Malcom Gladwell. Pretty interesting stuff.
So I try and I scream and I beg and I sigh
Just to prove I'm alive, and it's alright
'Cause tonight there's a way I'll make light of my treacherous life
Make light!
Just to prove I'm alive, and it's alright
'Cause tonight there's a way I'll make light of my treacherous life
Make light!
labrys 0
QuoteI would think that most parents would prefer their kids never hit such a low that they must serve the military.
I would hope most parents would prefer their kids aspire to serve in the military or another similar federal or global service. WTF?
Owned by Remi #?
QuoteQuoteI would think that most parents would prefer their kids never hit such a low that they must serve the military.
I would hope most parents would prefer their kids aspire to serve in the military or another similar federal or global service. WTF?
So you would hope that most parents prefer their children to be trained killers and destroyers for hire?
That's the purpose of the military .
It's not to hand out cookies. It's not to march in a parade.
The purpose of the military is to kill whoever gets in the way of the politicians' foreign policyi
I know!
"Too much truth" for a white suburbanite!
Blues,
Cliff
2muchTruth
QuoteQuoteThe government has had the child for the majority of his/her waking hours since the age of 5 and through 17/18.
I don't know what school you went to, but the schools I went to ran from about 8 am to 3 pm Monday through Friday with about three months off during the summer.Quote
My bad!! I was remembering detention,Saturday school and summer school.
Blues,
Cliff2muchTruth
Gawain 0
QuoteQuoteQuoteI would think that most parents would prefer their kids never hit such a low that they must serve the military.
I would hope most parents would prefer their kids aspire to serve in the military or another similar federal or global service. WTF?
So you would hope that most parents prefer their children to be trained killers and destroyers for hire?
That's the purpose of the military .
It's not to hand out cookies. It's not to march in a parade.
The purpose of the military is to kill whoever gets in the way of the politicians' foreign policyi
I know!
"Too much truth" for a white suburbanite!
Blues,
Cliff
Yeah, all the rest of the military service experience isn't worth mentioning, the esprit-de-corps, life time dependable relationships, discipline, for many - job skills (not everyone is an Infantryman) in tangible trades...all at the same time while carrying out a sworn duty, so we also have honor, integrity...throw in college and additional education...
Indeed, the mission of the Army is to kill people and break things, but it is not some "programmed indoctrination zombie creation". My entire military experience was nothing short of amazing, and I've been through the wringer.
Oh my God Cliff! You're right, how terrible it is for people to find value in such ideas that they might volunteer to do such a thing! Though, I glean from this statement that you have not had the privilege of such experience.
So I try and I scream and I beg and I sigh
Just to prove I'm alive, and it's alright
'Cause tonight there's a way I'll make light of my treacherous life
Make light!
Just to prove I'm alive, and it's alright
'Cause tonight there's a way I'll make light of my treacherous life
Make light!
labrys 0
QuoteSo you would hope that most parents prefer their children to be trained killers and destroyers for hire?
Cliff... seriously.
You seem to be implying that military service somehow relates directly to an inability to discriminate right from wrong. That's complete bullshit.
If a child makes it into military service without knowing a moral order from an immoral order then that burden of incompetence lies with the parent, not the military.
If you don't think you could trust your children to serve then you might want to think about how you've failed to teach them to act as reasonable, thinking, responsible adults.
Owned by Remi #?
Quote[
all at the same time while carrying out a sworn duty, so we also have honor, integrity...throw in college and additional education...Quote
"Sworn duty" to defend the Constitution.
Don't tell us about honor and integrity when that "sworn duty" has been ignored.
Blues,
Cliff2muchTruth
Gawain 0
QuoteQuoteall at the same time while carrying out a sworn duty, so we also have honor, integrity...throw in college and additional education...
Quote
"Sworn duty" to defend the Constitution.
Don't tell us about honor and integrity when that "sworn duty" has been ignored.
Blues,
Cliff
I'm sorry, please tell me where I did not carry out my sworn duty...and while you do that, please share how you have managed to do differently.So I try and I scream and I beg and I sigh
Just to prove I'm alive, and it's alright
'Cause tonight there's a way I'll make light of my treacherous life
Make light!
QuoteQuoteAnd of course, they could improve their pool immediately by ending their discrimination against gays.
There's irony in that statement because there really is nothing that prevents someone who is gay from serving in the military. If he/she doesn't tell anyone, there's no limit to their career.
So nothing other than the fear that you could be outed and thrown out at any point, and the disdain for serving a country/organization that considers you a subclass. Why would you risk your life to defend the Constitution if your rights don't count?
If the military considers 75% of its pool incapable of service, these are people it can't really afford to give up.
Gawain 0
QuoteQuoteQuoteAnd of course, they could improve their pool immediately by ending their discrimination against gays.
There's irony in that statement because there really is nothing that prevents someone who is gay from serving in the military. If he/she doesn't tell anyone, there's no limit to their career.
So nothing other than the fear that you could be outed and thrown out at any point, and the disdain for serving a country/organization that considers you a subclass. Why would you risk your life to defend the Constitution if your rights don't count?
If the military considers 75% of its pool incapable of service, these are people it can't really afford to give up.
I understand what you are saying, but it does not defeat my point. I understand (and disagree) with those that have a problem with the military's policy about gays serving opening in the military. I also see where the "don't ask/don't tell" policy removes sexual orientation from the equation. It's not perfect, but serving in the military should not be about that. It's about the service itself, and if someone can't maintain the humility to serve under whatever given conditions, then perhaps it's not important enough to them.
If a kid is fat, and wants to serve badly enough, he/she will be willing to do what it takes to serve.
If a kid is straight, and wants to serve badly enough, he/she will be willing to do what it takes to serve.
If a kid has a record, and wants to serve badly enough, he/she will be willing to do what it takes to serve.
If a kid is homosexual, and wants to serve badly enough, he/she will be willing to do what it takes to serve.
Why should there be a different expecation?
So I try and I scream and I beg and I sigh
Just to prove I'm alive, and it's alright
'Cause tonight there's a way I'll make light of my treacherous life
Make light!
Just to prove I'm alive, and it's alright
'Cause tonight there's a way I'll make light of my treacherous life
Make light!
QuoteQuoteSo you would hope that most parents prefer their children to be trained killers and destroyers for hire?
Cliff... seriously.
You seem to be implying that military service somehow relates directly to an inability to discriminate right from wrong. That's complete bullshit.
If a child makes it into military service without knowing a moral order from an immoral order then that burden of incompetence lies with the parent, not the military.Quote
Yes ,well.., right this minute we have soldiers fighting in Pakistan, Somalia,the Phillipines, Iraq, Afghanistan, and countless other areas of the world.
If Congress hasn't declared a war against any of these countries then I would venture to say that the morality quotient of todays US military personelle isn't so great.
You can blame it on the parents if you want to.
I blame it on the governments' propaganda and brain washing of the citizenry.
I believe the government takes advantage of the "less inteligent" inorder to ensure the profits of the ruling elite.
Hey ,labrys, did you know that members of our Congress have personaly invested over three hundred million dollars in denfense contracting companies?
Do you think they aren't at least a little biased when voting on defense spending?
Blues,
Cliff2muchTruth
QuoteQuoteQuoteall at the same time while carrying out a sworn duty, so we also have honor, integrity...throw in college and additional education...
Quote
"Sworn duty" to defend the Constitution.
Don't tell us about honor and integrity when that "sworn duty" has been ignored.
Blues,
Cliff
I'm sorry, please tell me where I did not carry out my sworn duty...and while you do that, please share how you have managed to do differently.
I don't know the time period when you were in the military.
If you'll let me know I'll glady point out your failures in defending the Constitution.
Blues,
Cliff2muchTruth
labrys 0
QuoteThere's irony in that statement because there really is nothing that prevents someone who is gay from serving in the military. If he/she doesn't tell anyone, there's no limit to their career.
True enough, Max... but please imagine that you are going to bond with your team while you can't ever let a gender reference slip. It's hard, Max. It's hard to focus the energy that you've shown. It's hard to imagine anyone being able to step up to the level you've presented under duress not to mention anything so personal as a partner.
I'm conflicted even arguing this because I know you've sacrificed so much, Max. But imagine how this would have played out for you if you couldn't acknowledge how much you want to thank your wife for her support.
You can tell, Max. How would you feel if you couldn't tell? How would you feel if you had to hide your wife?
And edit... how would your wife feel if you had to ignore her contribution to your recovery because your relationship to her was "conduct unbecoming"
Owned by Remi #?
Quote
If a kid is straight, and wants to serve badly enough, he/she will be willing to do what it takes to serve.
If a kid is homosexual, and wants to serve badly enough, he/she will be willing to do what it takes to serve.
Why should there be a different expecation?
Are you suggesting there's no difference in the permissible actions for these two groups? Or that each has to make some differing level of sacrifice to serve?
Young people have a strong sex drive, and one of those two groups is free to indulge it, the other expelled for it.
There's irony in that statement because there really is nothing that prevents someone who is gay from serving in the military. If he/she doesn't tell anyone, there's no limit to their career. So, your argument doesn't wash.
As for the kids, you have to pass a basic physical fitness "primer" before they'll let you go in. It is not difficult for anyone with full mobility to accomplish. It's pretty sad. For women it's three push ups, three sit ups and running two miles in something like 18 minutes. For men, it's 17 push ups, some amount of sit ups, and running two miles in like 16 or 17 minutes.
Basic training will trim the rest, but if you're 18, 5'9" and 220 lbs...if it's not muscle, you're going to be miserable (moreso than normal anyway)...
Just to prove I'm alive, and it's alright
'Cause tonight there's a way I'll make light of my treacherous life
Make light!
Share this post
Link to post
Share on other sites