akarunway 1 #1 November 26, 2004 We can ban the Declaration of Independence in schools because of references to God but ======================================November 23, 2004 Thanksgiving Day, 2004 By the President of the United States of America A Proclamation In Focus: Thanksgiving 2004 All across America, we gather this week with the people we love to give thanks to God for the blessings in our lives. We are grateful for our freedom, grateful for our families and friends, and grateful for the many gifts of America. On Thanksgiving Day, we acknowledge that all of these things, and life itself, come from the Almighty God. Almost four centuries ago, the Pilgrims celebrated a harvest feast to thank God after suffering through a brutal winter. President George Washington proclaimed the first National Day of Thanksgiving in 1789, and President Lincoln revived the tradition during the Civil War, asking Americans to give thanks with "one heart and one voice." Since then, in times of war and in times of peace, Americans have gathered with family and friends and given thanks to God for our blessings. Thanksgiving is also a time to share our blessings with those who are less fortunate. Americans this week will gather food and clothing for neighbors in need. Many young people will give part of their holiday to volunteer at homeless shelters and food pantries. On Thanksgiving, we remember that the true strength of America lies in the hearts and souls of the American people. By seeking out those who are hurting and by lending a hand, Americans touch the lives of their fellow citizens and help make our Nation and the world a better place. This Thanksgiving, we express our gratitude to our dedicated firefighters and police officers who help keep our homeland safe. We are grateful to the homeland security and intelligence personnel who spend long hours on faithful watch. And we give thanks for the Americans in our Armed Forces who are serving around the world to secure our country and advance the cause of freedom. These brave men and women make our entire Nation proud, and we thank them and their families for their sacrifice. On this Thanksgiving Day, we thank God for His blessings and ask Him to continue to guide and watch over our Nation. NOW, THEREFORE, I, GEORGE W. BUSH, President of the United States of America, by virtue of the authority vested in me by the Constitution and laws of the United States, do hereby proclaim Thursday, November 25, 2004, as a National Day of Thanksgiving. I encourage all Americans to gather together in their homes and places of worship to reinforce the ties of family and community and to express gratitude for the many blessings we enjoy. IN WITNESS WHEREOF, I have hereunto set my hand this twenty-third day of November, in the year of our Lord two thousand four, and of the Independence of the United States of America the two hundred and twenty-ninth. GEORGE W. BUSHI hold it true, whate'er befall; I feel it, when I sorrow most; 'Tis better to have loved and lost Than never to have loved at all. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
sundevil777 94 #2 November 26, 2004 QuoteWe can ban the Declaration of Independence in schools because of references to God Actually no, that won't hold. But, I am very happy that liberals still think that a President is out of line for using language such as in Bush's speech.People are sick and tired of being told that ordinary and decent people are fed up in this country with being sick and tired. I’m certainly not, and I’m sick and tired of being told that I am Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
MC208B 0 #3 November 26, 2004 what the heck bothers liberals so bad when the President (or any gov. official) references our creator? I'm puzzled Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mr2mk1g 10 #4 November 26, 2004 Quoteour creator He's referencing someone who isn't the creator of ALL Americans, but as the POTUS he speaks for ALL Americans. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mr2mk1g 10 #5 November 26, 2004 I'm disturbed by religious fundamentalism no matter what guise it takes. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mnealtx 0 #6 November 26, 2004 QuoteI'm disturbed by religious fundamentalism no matter what guise it takes. Yeah! Damn those Dead White Men (tm) anyway, for being religious and referencing God in their documents!! Who did they think they were???? Mike I love you, Shannon and Jim. POPS 9708 , SCR 14706 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ScottishJohn 25 #7 November 26, 2004 QuoteAnd we give thanks for the Americans in our Armed Forces What other nationalities does America have in their armed forces. If there are any other nationalities are they not worthy of the thanks of the American people as well.---------------------------------------------------------------------- If you think my attitude stinks you should smell my fingers Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Morcyk 0 #8 November 26, 2004 Hmm good catch. There are lots of individuals in our military that are native to foreign countries. I guess when they spill their blood to aid us, it really doesn't mean as much.. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Sabre2th 0 #9 November 26, 2004 I think he may be referring to their citizenship.... excuse my spelling Nick. Those who dance, are cosidered insane by those who can't hear the music. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Nightingale 0 #10 November 26, 2004 you do not have to be a US citizen to enlist in the armed forces. you just need a green card. from army.com Only U.S. citizens or foreign nationals legally residing in the United States with an Immigration and Naturalization Service Alien Registration Card ("Green Card" -- INS Form I-151/551) may apply. Applicants must speak, write and read English fluently Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mr2mk1g 10 #11 November 26, 2004 http://www.bbc.co.uk/radio4/hometruths/20041009_vietnam_war.shtml http://icnewcastle.icnetwork.co.uk/1000expats/expatsfeatures/tm_objectid=14222285&method=full&siteid=50080&headline=glamour-of-war-name_page.html Lieutenant Harbord died a British citizen serving in the American Army. edited to add: There was quite a moving story about him the other week on the radio actually. His sister recently found his Stars and Stripes flag in some of her recently deceased mother's things. She called up a US Air force base in the UK and asked if they would fold it properly for her. They were of course honoured to do so but told her that her brother's flag must be flown first in order to accord him the proper honour. She was equally happy for this to happen. When it came to having the flag taken down they invited her to a complete ceremony where her brother’s flag was taken down in front of a full honour guard and the entire base was told the story of her brother’s service. She was then presented with her brother’s flag the proper fashion. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
storm1977 0 #12 November 26, 2004 QuoteQuoteour creator He's referencing someone who isn't the creator of ALL Americans, but as the POTUS he speaks for ALL Americans. What do you Euro's care anyway.... The guy has a religion, and he embraces it. Good for him!!!! I would rather have a religios man in office than a non rigious man in office, whether he is catholic, jew, muslim, hindu...... How is this impacting your life? How is this destroying your way of life in the UK? What is the problem with it? ----------------------------------------------------- Sometimes it is more important to protect LIFE than Liberty Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mr2mk1g 10 #13 November 26, 2004 QuoteWhat do you Euro's care anyway I don't particularly. Why do you think I do? QuoteHow is this impacting your life? It's not at the moment. Why do you think it is? QuoteHow is this destroying your way of life in the UK? It's not right now. Why do you think it is? QuoteWhat is the problem with it? Him having religion? - nothing. Him expressing that religion on behalf of people who don't? That may be a bit of a problem to them now mightn't it? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
storm1977 0 #14 November 26, 2004 QuoteHim having religion? - nothing. Him expressing that religion on behalf of people who don't? That may be a bit of a problem to them now mightn't it? No, infact it is a compliment of sorts.... You don't have to believe in God or anything, and if me or the president or whomever believes that the ultimate goal for you in this life is to go to heaven, and he prays for you to do so, what does anyone care.... He is giving that prayer, and that praise because because to him, it is important and he hopes the best for you and everyone. I had this same situation at work. My old boss was a born again Christian, and I am agnostic. When I first started he always talked religion with me and I told him to stop and that it made me uncofortable... So he did. But, when things were bad or I was having a tough day he used to say... "I know you don't understand, or even care to, but, I will say a prayer to Jesus for you tonight." Now i could have taken that many ways, but to me it was somewhat of a compliment. I didn't believe in his religion, but he felt I was important enough for him to look to his religion and pray for my well being.... It showed he really cared. He didn't have to buy me a card or gifts for me to know he thought highly of me..... I respected him for that even though I didn't share his beliefs, and you know what, he respected my non-beliefs as well. ----------------------------------------------------- Sometimes it is more important to protect LIFE than Liberty Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mr2mk1g 10 #15 November 26, 2004 No, I don't think that him praying for people - even publicly would be much of a problem for most. As you indicate there's nothing much to be offended by there. It's his first paragraph which I think will cause most upset: QuoteAll across America, we gather this week with the people we love to give thanks to God for the blessings in our lives. We are grateful for our freedom, grateful for our families and friends, and grateful for the many gifts of America. On Thanksgiving Day, we acknowledge that all of these things, and life itself, come from the Almighty God. (emphasis own) He's the president - he's elected to speak for everyone. He says "we acknowledge" - "we" is all inclusive - in this instance he means "ALL Americans". Ok, he acknowledges everything stems from God…the vast majority of the population does also... but certainly not everyone in the US - not ALL American's. The US was set up to fight for the little man. The whole point of the Republic and its constitution was that it would never allow the majority to tread on the minority. Is it a big deal? No not really - least not IMO. Do I care - no it's got nothing to do with me. Would I care if I were a US citizen? Probably not - as I said I don't really think it's that big a deal. Do I acknowledge that it may well be a big deal to some people? Yes – and that's the key point - a lot of people will be very annoyed by this statement – this thread is an example of that. It implies that they are not really part of the US because they do not acknowledge God. It says that because they are American they do acknowledge God. At best it shows a degree of insensitivity on behalf of GWB's speech writer, at worst there’s something slightly more sinister going on at the top. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mnealtx 0 #16 November 26, 2004 And anyone that is offended by that needs to grow a thicker skin.... holy shit.... He's speaking for the country as a whole, not for each individual person IN the country...Mike I love you, Shannon and Jim. POPS 9708 , SCR 14706 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Nightingale 0 #17 November 26, 2004 I don't really care what Bush said in his address, but... what is this country made of, if not individuals? How can we have a country as a whole, if we don't acknowledge the individual parts? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
storm1977 0 #18 November 26, 2004 QuoteI don't really care what Bush said in his address, but... what is this country made of, if not individuals? How can we have a country as a whole, if we don't acknowledge the individual parts? Ummm... If we tried to include Everybody that might take a while!!!!! ----------------------------------------------------- Sometimes it is more important to protect LIFE than Liberty Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mnealtx 0 #19 November 26, 2004 QuoteI don't really care what Bush said in his address, but... what is this country made of, if not individuals? How can we have a country as a whole, if we don't acknowledge the individual parts? And where does THAT slippery slope end up? With a 3 hour address so that he can address every conceivable possibility? And then some group that doesn't get mentioned sues because "they're being discriminated against".... C'mon.... next thing you know, you'll have atheists/agnostics suing because someone said "Bless you!" when they sneezed...Mike I love you, Shannon and Jim. POPS 9708 , SCR 14706 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Nightingale 0 #20 November 26, 2004 he could've just said "we gather to give thanks for..." because it would've been more inclusive. No matter what America was when it was founded, today it's very much a mix of cultures, and it would be nice if the president had acknowledged that. It would've been nice to hear about how much progress we've made, how, now, like the pilgrims and indians, today we have people of different races sitting at the same table, and people of different religions passing turkey and giving thanks for the company of family and friends, and that "family" has many different meanings. Last night at our table, we had a protestant, a few catholics, an athiest, an agnostic, two pagans, and a deist. We were all thankful for the privilege of being together, and acknowledged the people in our lives who weren't able to be with us. some things are universal. Thanksgiving isn't about who you pray to. It's about being thankful for what you have and acknowledging the blessings you enjoy every day. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JohnRich 4 #21 November 26, 2004 QuoteI'm disturbed by religious fundamentalism no matter what guise it takes. The you should send me all of your money immediately. Almost every single item of cash you possess, contains the phrase "In God We Trust". I'll be happy to relieve you of this terrible religious fundamentalism which you are forced to endure. All for the sake of altruism, of course. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kris 0 #22 November 26, 2004 QuoteThe you should send me all of your money immediately. Almost every single item of cash you possess, contains the phrase "In God We Trust". I'll be happy to relieve you of this terrible religious fundamentalism which you are forced to endure. All for the sake of altruism, of course. Really, John? The phrase "In God We Trust" is on British money now? I'm sure mr2mk1g will send all his pounds sterling over as soon as he finds that phrase.Sky, Muff Bro, Rodriguez Bro, and Bastion of Purity and Innocence!™ Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
nacmacfeegle 0 #23 November 26, 2004 "Lieutenant Harbord died a British citizen serving in the American Army.... She was then presented with her brother's flag the proper fashion. " Nice story, a classy and dignified tribute.-------------------- He who receives an idea from me, receives instruction himself without lessening mine; as he who lights his taper at mine, receives light without darkening me. Thomas Jefferson Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kallend 1,679 #24 November 26, 2004 Those who look around the world at the countries that have established religions should be grateful that the USA is not one of them. I can't begin to imagine why so many Americans would want religion inserted into their government, when the evidence of history shows that it is a corrosive influence for both the religion and the government.... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
badenhop 0 #25 November 26, 2004 Thank God for a president who will speak up.================================== I've got all I need, Jesus and gravity. Dolly Parton http://www.AveryBadenhop.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
