chuckakers 370 #51 August 28, 2013 edmacdonald Chuck, if you re-read the thread, carefully, you'll probably realize RiggerRob was not "jabbing and spewing" anything. He made one witty comment, that I suspect most of us realized was sarcastic but supportive of the point you made, and then you jumped all over him. You may have assumed he was the the previous poster that seemed to get your ire up, or maybe you're just cranky. Ah, right you are, Ed. Rob, I owe you an apology. It's bodypilot who won't engage. My 15-hour work days should never be followed by Merlot and dz.com at the same time. Chuck Akers D-10855 Houston, TX Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
virgin-burner 1 #52 September 1, 2013 piisfishI don't think it is a good idea. Not for everyone. Many jumpers are not responsible enough with their gear. is this a general observation?“Some may never live, but the crazy never die.” -Hunter S. Thompson "No. Try not. Do... or do not. There is no try." -Yoda Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
shropshire 0 #53 September 1, 2013 What's the cycle in Switzerland? Does it cause any issues? are your repacks more expensive? What are these Americans a-feared of? (.)Y(.) Chivalry is not dead; it only sleeps for want of work to do. - Jerome K Jerome Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
virgin-burner 1 #54 September 1, 2013 switzerland is 1yr. and winter is a bitch.“Some may never live, but the crazy never die.” -Hunter S. Thompson "No. Try not. Do... or do not. There is no try." -Yoda Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
freddysdaddy 0 #55 September 1, 2013 chuckakers ***The riggers themselves have the biggest interest to have short repack periods. And exactly those guys decide about those periods. In the US it's the FAA that decides on repack periods. Folks talked about the rigger short repack cycle motivation when we began considering the move to 180 days in the US too. It's crap. ... And who is consulting the FAA? Anyhow..This was quite exactly the answer, that has to come from people, who are interested in short cycles. I still see no reply to the fact, that 1-year cycles in many countries work perfectly. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
shropshire 0 #56 September 1, 2013 virgin-burner switzerland is 1yr. and winter is a bitch. Winters are for snow sports .. NEVER forget that!! (.)Y(.) Chivalry is not dead; it only sleeps for want of work to do. - Jerome K Jerome Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skyjumpenfool 2 #57 September 1, 2013 shropshire ***switzerland is 1yr. and winter is a bitch. Winters are for snow sports .. NEVER forget that!!Winters are for snow sports .. Like jumping in the winter? Birdshit & Fools Productions "Son, only two things fall from the sky." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
shropshire 0 #58 September 1, 2013 skyjumpenfool ******switzerland is 1yr. and winter is a bitch. Winters are for snow sports .. NEVER forget that!!Winters are for snow sports .. Like jumping in the winter? brrrrrrr : depends where you are :-) (.)Y(.) Chivalry is not dead; it only sleeps for want of work to do. - Jerome K Jerome Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mark 102 #59 September 1, 2013 freddysdaddy ******The riggers themselves have the biggest interest to have short repack periods. And exactly those guys decide about those periods. In the US it's the FAA that decides on repack periods. Folks talked about the rigger short repack cycle motivation when we began considering the move to 180 days in the US too. It's crap. ... And who is consulting the FAA? Anyhow..This was quite exactly the answer, that has to come from people, who are interested in short cycles. I still see no reply to the fact, that 1-year cycles in many countries work perfectly. I'd be okay with no required repack at all for personal equipment. I'd keep the current pack cycles for student/rental/tandem equipment for the time being, until we could see what sort of issues developed with personal equipment. Mark Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Divalent 89 #60 September 1, 2013 markI'd be okay with no required repack at all for personal equipment. I'd keep the current pack cycles for student/rental/tandem equipment for the time being, until we could see what sort of issues developed with personal equipment. IMO, the reserve repack cycle should be set based solely on what is *reasonably appropriate* to ensure that the reserve will function as intended. Anything else unrelated to what would be revealed by a reserve repack should not be a factor in determining the length of the reserve repack cycle. So while it may be beneficial to have a rigger inspect, say, the harness and main cutaway system, the main risers, toggles, main closing loop, etc,, every 6 months (because many owners fail to do that themselves!), that should be considered separately. By *reasonably appropriate*" I mean a reasonable trade off between the value of more frequent inspections of the reserve system detecting the onset of time-dependent problems, balanced against the cost imposed on all rig owners. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
shropshire 0 #61 September 1, 2013 freddysdaddyI still see no reply to the fact, that 1-year cycles in many countries work perfectly. Have you seen any Incident Reports that say that they don't work.. perfectly or otherwise? Because I bet there would be some if they didn't!! (.)Y(.) Chivalry is not dead; it only sleeps for want of work to do. - Jerome K Jerome Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
piisfish 135 #62 September 1, 2013 virgin-burnerswitzerland is 1yr. and winter is a bitch.1 year for most gear. As a general observation, many jumpers do not know their gear enough to go back to the rigger before the year, should the gear need it.scissors beat paper, paper beat rock, rock beat wingsuit - KarlM Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
riggerrob 558 #63 September 1, 2013 piisfish***switzerland is 1yr. and winter is a bitch.1 year for most gear. As a general observation, many jumpers do not know their gear enough to go back to the rigger before the year, should the gear need it. ................................................................................. Good point about annual inspections. The minimum inspections on privately-owned airplanes are annual inspections. Annual inspections - on airplanes - are more about corrosion, critters nesting and UV damage than wear or tear. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
tbrown 26 #64 September 2, 2013 One thing I've noticed since we went to 180 days is the number of people who show up at the dropzone but can't jump because they've let their reserve go out of date. With the 120 cycle this almost never happened, but in the last few years I've seen it happen 5-6 times, most recently this weekend. Personally, I pay my rigger for a full inspection of everything, main included. This time around he found two small holes on the tail, which I'd missed completely, even though I do my own packing. I got 'em patched before I jumped again. Let's not ever forget what we're really doing here, or what our rig does for us every time we use it. Your humble servant.....Professor Gravity ! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Longbow1415 0 #65 September 2, 2013 Yep I agree 1 year repack cycles should be brought in. I had an old two pin Teardrop with a swift reserve, packed and stored in my loft for 15 years. I decided to have a look at it and check the main out. I also pulled the reserve and the pilot chute fired off like new, and the free bag came out perfect and the reserve canopy was still crispy..pretty sure it would have worked AND NO I AM NOT SUGGESTING 15 YEAR CYCLES !!! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
freddysdaddy 0 #66 September 2, 2013 shropshire***I still see no reply to the fact, that 1-year cycles in many countries work perfectly. Have you seen any Incident Reports that say that they don't work.. perfectly or otherwise? Because I bet there would be some if they didn't!! I dont know about any case. And yor are right for sure. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
feuergnom 22 #67 September 2, 2013 piisfish ***switzerland is 1yr. and winter is a bitch. 1 year for most gear. As a general observation, many jumpers do not know their gear enough to go back to the rigger before the year, should the gear need it. and thats the most important point at least in my book some years down the road we had the same discussion in austria. repack-cycle used to be 180 days for all parachutes = skydiving-gear, tandems + pilots bailout rigs. the reasoning behind going for 1 year ran along following lines • short season - if you are lucky, start early and end late, you'll get something like 6 months. so why pack a rig that rests half a ear in the closet twice a year? well nobody forces you to keep an in-date-rig if you are not jumping - keeping with 180 would have been just fine • repacking reserves puts unnecesary stress & wear on F111 fabric. yeah. if you handle your reservepackjob (floor, no mat, no table, greasy hands etc) like shit it surely does and ruins a reserve in the 40 or so packings in gets in 20 years. any other f111-cabopy can be packed and jumped approx 400 times.... • they also have a year in germany - let's have it the same way killer arguement - everybody else does it..... • packing twice a year is expensive anybody not willing to pay a rigger twice a year a bargain price for I+R should take up another hobby. chess maybe... the whole thing became quite heated (I was pretty good in stirring the pot back then) but things went how they did and we ended up with 1 year repack-cycle... as nicholas said: most jumpers don't know shit about the gear they jump and don't care. and there's some areas you simply do not se into unless you open the rig like reserveloops once they disappear between the flaps. gets interesting if you jump a lot in desert conditions. arizona anyone? beach landings? threads can brake, housings can become loose... any rigger can tell tons of stories I bet... and if jumpers hardly know much about their gear, there's a group probably knowing even less, and that would be the pilots. and they fall under the 1-year-rule as well. I think you can guess the outcome edit 4 markupThe universal aptitude for ineptitude makes any human accomplishment an incredible miracle dudeist skydiver # 666 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
piisfish 135 #68 September 2, 2013 on many rigs, specially the bigger sizes, the fabric of the reserve compresses a little, the spring takes a deeper sit in the reserve, leaving more "slack" in the reserve loop, and having rather loose springs. I don't know of many jumpers who do their regular gear maintenance as noted by the manufacturers. With a 180 days limit, the gear gets at least twice a year the chance to have SOME maintenance.scissors beat paper, paper beat rock, rock beat wingsuit - KarlM Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
feuergnom 22 #69 September 2, 2013 i guess we know a lot of jumpers who don't even know what kind of maintenance that would be The universal aptitude for ineptitude makes any human accomplishment an incredible miracle dudeist skydiver # 666 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
