Wearing Vibram Five Fingers while Skydiving?

[millertime24 8]

I wouldn't wear them and here's why. Out here in Utah we have these things pretty much everywhere we call goatheads (similar to Florida sandspurs). I know for a fact that these goatheads will puncture a very robust mountain bike tire resulting in tire deflation. My thought is, if they can puncture a thick rubber tire then surely they would have no problem at all getting through these five finger shoes and breaking off into the bottom of your foot.

Muff #5048

[phoenixlpr 0]

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I wouldn't wear them and here's why. Out here in Utah we have these things pretty much everywhere we call goatheads (similar to Florida sandspurs). I know for a fact that these goatheads will puncture a very robust mountain bike tire resulting in tire deflation. My thought is, if they can puncture a thick rubber tire then surely they would have no problem at all getting through these five finger shoes and breaking off into the bottom of your foot.

Ah, so you are the one who jumps construction boots with steel reinforcement? Sneakers would not be right with your reasoning.

[millertime24 8]

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I wouldn't wear them and here's why. Out here in Utah we have these things pretty much everywhere we call goatheads (similar to Florida sandspurs). I know for a fact that these goatheads will puncture a very robust mountain bike tire resulting in tire deflation. My thought is, if they can puncture a thick rubber tire then surely they would have no problem at all getting through these five finger shoes and breaking off into the bottom of your foot.

Ah, so you are the one who jumps construction boots with steel reinforcement? Sneakers would not be right with your reasoning.

Sneakers have more material between the foot and the ground from the five finger shoes Ive seen. But, no, I don't wear sneakers. I wear Vans (tons of padding in there). And I HAVE jumped in steel toe boots from time to time (if I go straight to the DZ from work for example).

Muff #5048

[hokierower 0]

Didn't know what a goathead but looked one up and damn, those look ugly and be a pain to deal with. I've walked on oyster shells with my VFFs but your weight is a little more spread out vs. stepping on a pointed object. I guess I'm buying a pair of shoes til I get my A-license and have some experience
Can anyone recommend a decent pair of shoes for skydiving?

[evilkalla 0]

My girlfriend had a hard landing on her AFF1 and ended up sliding in, dragging her foot. She broke her big toe and the toe right next to it. Had she not had shoes on, the damage might have been far worse, or a toe might have even come off. Makes me shudder to think about it.

[millertime24 8]

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Can anyone recommend a decent pair of shoes for skydiving?

Vans. I started my AFF in a pair of Asics I think, but once I wore a pair of Vans I never looked back.

Muff #5048

[JohnRich 4]

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how well do they grip or slide on grass/tarmac/dirt whichever landing zones you might land on ?
I prefer soles that slide.

I hear swoopers speak that preference, so they can slide across the ground on landing while bleeding off horizontal speed. But what does that do to your grip on the airplane for launching exits? It's tough to launch a clean group exit if your feet slip out from under you when you try to push off to launch out the door. These two requirements are not compatible with each other...

[hokierower 0]

Thanks for the advice. I'll see what I can find. Maybe down the road I can look at upgrading to a tougher set of VFFs. They've got a couple of pairs that have some pretty beefy soles.

[DougH 270]

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how well do they grip or slide on grass/tarmac/dirt whichever landing zones you might land on ?
I prefer soles that slide.

I hear swoopers speak that preference, so they can slide across the ground on landing while bleeding off horizontal speed. But what does that do to your grip on the airplane for launching exits? It's tough to launch a clean group exit if your feet slip out from under you when you try to push off to launch out the door. These two requirements are not compatible with each other...

John you are talking about two different conditions.

Skate shoes grip aircraft surfaces just fine, they weren't designed to slip OFF of skateboards and bike pedals. That is a function of the sole material.

The better sliding ability relates to the tread design. The treads are flatter and more even so it leads to less edges to catch the ground.

Perfect example, smooth bottom climbing shoes. The material is grippy, great for friction on rock. But they would slide and not be great for running in the grass with.

"The restraining order says you're only allowed to touch me in freefall"
=P

[Ron 7]

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I think it's highly unsafe and irresponsible to have a newbie jump in those.

I can't see how they are significantly more dangerous than anything else.

What problems am I not seeing?

As an AFFI, I'd (currently) let you wear them.... But I am open to why I should not let you.

"No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

[JohnRich 4]

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how well do they grip or slide on grass/tarmac/dirt whichever landing zones you might land on ? I prefer soles that slide.

I hear swoopers speak that preference, so they can slide across the ground on landing while bleeding off horizontal speed. But what does that do to your grip on the airplane for launching exits? It's tough to launch a clean group exit if your feet slip out from under you when you try to push off to launch out the door. These two requirements are not compatible with each other...

John you are talking about two different conditions.

Skate shoes grip aircraft surfaces just fine, they weren't designed to slip OFF of skateboards and bike pedals. That is a function of the sole material.

The better sliding ability relates to the tread design. The treads are flatter and more even so it leads to less edges to catch the ground.

Perfect example, smooth bottom climbing shoes. The material is grippy, great for friction on rock. But they would slide and not be great for running in the grass with.

Good follow-up! Smooth, yet grippy, is what's needed.

Someone tried bowling shoes once, which are designed to slide on a wood bowling alley floor. Those may be great for sliding your feet across the ground on landing, but won't do anything to grip the aluminum floor of an airplane on exit.

[billvon 2,400]

>People go barefoot all the time

It is my experience that most people who jump barefoot do so until they mangle their feet badly - at which point they decide that keeping their feet is more important than being cool (literally.)

[hokierower 0]

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>People go barefoot all the time

It is my experience that most people who jump barefoot do so until they mangle their feet badly - at which point they decide that keeping their feet is more important than being cool (literally.)

Don't see the reasoning being barefoot jumping, nor do I see the point in barefoot running. That's just me though.

John, the majority of the original VFFs (Classics, Sprints, KSO, Flows) all have what initially look like smooth surfaces, however when you bend them back you actually see that the bottom sole has little cuts in a zig-zag pattern which helps with grip. The newer shoes all have a additional sole pattern to give more grip/protection.

If you got them wet, I would think that being able to swoop with a pair of VFFs would be pretty easy, but at the same time they are incredibly grippy.

Just my $.02 after owning them for almost 2.5 years.

[jackwallace 3]

Wow this is too funny. These are the same arguments I heard 40 years ago when I put on Addida's instead of Frenchies.
Better watch out, I hears them folks up in the big city r jumpin' square parechutees and no helmets. Dang fools!

U only make 2 jumps: the first one for some weird reason and the last one that you lived through. The rest are just filler.
scr 316

[danielcroft 2]

I've jumped in Treks and KSOs, they're not a good option. When you approach the ground at speed you have a high chance of catching a toe. Think about the times you've been walking and stubbed your toe on something (I've broken a toe this way in my VFFs, my wife has too, hiking both times), multiply that by the distance you're moving across the ground and close to it under canopy. Added to that is that you're not and *can't* look where your feet are going when you're landing a parachute.

I've been learning to swoop for a while (it takes time... or maybe I suck ) and broke my toe (I think) on landing once. Since then I've only jumped in cross trainers and keens. The keens offer some toe protection and are still cool (temp).

As for climbing soles, Vibram (the V in VFF) make a lot of soles for climbing shoes.

I think skate shoes offer the benefit of distributing your weight more so you have the same weight applied to a larger surface area resulting in lower friction. I don't know fisicks or maff though so I could have that wrong.

Another point on the VFFs, I've been told not to wear them in the tunnel due to the toe/net issue, same deal as lines.

As for bare foot running and walking, there are a lot of benefits to it but that's well beyond this forum.

[hokierower 0]

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I've jumped in Treks and KSOs, they're not a good option. When you approach the ground at speed you have a high chance of catching a toe. Think about the times you've been walking and stubbed your toe on something (I've broken a toe this way in my VFFs, my wife has too, hiking both times), multiply that by the distance you're moving across the ground and close to it under canopy. Added to that is that you're not and *can't* look where your feet are going when you're landing a parachute.

I've been learning to swoop for a while (it takes time... or maybe I suck ) and broke my toe (I think) on landing once. Since then I've only jumped in cross trainers and keens. The keens offer some toe protection and are still cool (temp).

As for climbing soles, Vibram (the V in VFF) make a lot of soles for climbing shoes.

I think skate shoes offer the benefit of distributing your weight more so you have the same weight applied to a larger surface area resulting in lower friction. I don't know fisicks or maff though so I could have that wrong.

Another point on the VFFs, I've been told not to wear them in the tunnel due to the toe/net issue, same deal as lines.

As for bare foot running and walking, there are a lot of benefits to it but that's well beyond this forum.

Thank you for your insight.

[Beatnik 2]

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you are seriously suggesting that a line is more likely to get snagged in between your toes and stay there then it is to get wrapped around a regular sized shoe weather or not that shoe has laces or velcro?

you might be right but i very much doubt it

Personally if the lines went between my toes and stayed there, I would be absolutely thrilled. My concern is if they went between your toes and decided to take a toe or two with them. Plus if you look at it mathematically it is also greater. It would go from a 1 in 2 chance of not getting a snag to a 1 in 6 chance. So from that, I would say it is more likely.

[likestojump 3]

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I think it's highly unsafe and irresponsible to have a newbie jump in those.

I can't see how they are significantly more dangerous than anything else.

What problems am I not seeing?

As an AFFI, I'd (currently) let you wear them.... But I am open to why I should not let you.

the Five Finger shoes are advertised to feel as if you are bareful - they accomplish this by having a very thin rubber sole with a minimal elastic "sock" just thin enough to hold that sole to the bottom of your shoe. They offer just enough protection to the bottom of your foot to not get scraped on light pebbles.
In any impact scenario near 100% of the impact force will go straight to your legs, without any cushioning you may have from a thick sole.

Also, the separate toe pockets allow for independent movement for each toe, and make it very easy to injure a single toe as opposed to just dirty up the front of your "full shoe" in an event of a tumble (which is very likely to happen to a newbie jumper)

lastly, when one takes a faceplant (quite common with newer jumpers, right ?), a fair amount of force can be exerted in the front of the shoe - in a "normal" scenario the sole flexes and absorbs, as well as dissipating the flex across a wide/thicker surface of the sole and the the stiffness of all toes that are in the shoe. However, in the case of the five toed shoes, the front of the sole is split into five very thin and very narrow pieces of rubber (the length and width of an individual toe) thus increasing the chances of injuring individual toes.

Like I said, I am not an instructor, but I do own a pair of those shoes...

the KSO series have a 3.5mm sole which is "razor siped" - so it has ridges in it which make the working thickness even less. My guess is that Vans are about a 15mm sole.

[davelepka 4]

Get rid of this idea. Your feet are your first point of contact with the ground (even in a PLF), so you are guranteed to have an impact to that area of your body. Protect your feet with a sturdy pair of closed-toe shoes with sufficient cushoining.

Your head is way more important than your feet, but much less likely to suffer an impact. Despite this, you'll be required to wear a helmet until after student status.

Your feet may be less important than your head, but they are guarnateed to suffer an impact. Either way, the euqation adds up to the same thing as the helmet deal, wear something protective.

Some jumpers wear gloves on every jump to protect their hands, regardless of the weather. 100 degrees and humid, with very little chance of landing on their hands, and they still wear gloves.

Skydiving, even at it's best, is a tough, physical endeavour. You'll take a variety of hits and bumps in the course of making your average jump, and you should be prepared for them. Your feet may be way out at the end of your legs, but hurting one, even just a little, will have your whole body sitting out watching everyone else jump.

[hokierower 0]

Kind of interesting how this discussion is kinda like the usual motorcycle gear debate where you have guys who wear full gear all the time v. guys who don't wear squate. I made a decision when I started riding to be a part of the first group and so far I've stuck with that.

It sounds like you get the same situation in skydiving between shoes, suit, helmet, glasses, & gloves and it's up to each jumper (non-student) to decide which way they want to go.

[Scrumpot 1]

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It sounds like you get the same situation in skydiving between shoes, suit, helmet, glasses, & gloves and it's up to each jumper (non-student) to decide which way they want to go.

As you become experienced (and licensed) to decide for yourself - yes.

coitus non circum - Moab Stone

[david3 0]

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Does anyone wear a pair when you jump? I've got two pairs that I wear for most everything (except work) and want to wear them for jumping but just wanted to see if anyone else had done it previously.

I have jumped in sandals (Tevas) and Chucks. Not anymore. I have not worn the VFFs but they don’t appear to offer much cushion in the sole (the point of the design I believe). I prefer something that will offer more protection. You never know when you will stomp out a landing, have to plf, stub your toe or have any other number of surprises when you land. It may make the differences between an “ouch” and a trip to the hospital.

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[NWFlyer 2]

See attached. That was from dragging a toe on landing WITH shoes (Skechers).

Don't want to think what it would've looked like without.

"There is only one basic human right, the right to do as you damn well please. And with it comes the only basic human duty, the duty to take the consequences." -P.J. O'Rourke

[hokierower 0]

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See attached. That was from dragging a toe on landing WITH shoes (Skechers).

Don't want to think what it would've looked like without.

You're not allowed to lead up to something like that and NOT show a gruesome picture! I was expecting torn flesh and bone and all I got was a broken toe.

[NWFlyer 2]

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See attached. That was from dragging a toe on landing WITH shoes (Skechers).

Don't want to think what it would've looked like without.

You're not allowed to lead up to something like that and NOT show a gruesome picture! I was expecting torn flesh and bone and all I got was a broken toe.

Not even broken. Just very bruised. Didn't even lose the toenail.

Stick around ... you'll see plenty of gruesome in this sport (as well as lots of bumps and bruises and sprains and strains. One of my favorite things to do after a team training weekend is to play "count the bruises." )

"There is only one basic human right, the right to do as you damn well please. And with it comes the only basic human duty, the duty to take the consequences." -P.J. O'Rourke