skydyvr 0
QuoteBut their guns worked JUST FINE to kill how many high school kids? Where did they get their guns? They might have focused on pipe bombs? Prove it!
Dillon and Klebold (the Columbine kids) made some pipebombs and carried them them into the school intending to kill a LOT more kids than they did. Fortunately, the bombs didn't detonate as planned due to faulty design. Feel free to "prove" this for yourself if you want to actually know what you are talking about.
The fact that they used lethal weapons other than guns just bolsters the very tired but entirely true point that it isn't GUNS killing people, it is whacked out people killing people.
. . =(_8^(1)
Two words, John Kerry.
never pull low......unless you are
QuoteThis whole thread has been like masturbating with a cheesegrater... slightly amusing, but mostly painful!
Try it with a good quality lubricant!
-
Jim
Gun oil works good.
never pull low......unless you are
Quote>No, Conservatives want to preserve the rights granted by the Bill of
> Rights. Liberals want to bend and change the Constitution to suit
>their own agenda.
It was a joke, but if you insist:
If you consider this administration as "conservatives," conservatives are doing their level best to destroy the protections of the first, fourth, fifth and sixth amendments. In the name of "fighting terror" of course. Sorry, but those protections, to me, are a lot more important than the protections of the second amendment (although in my ideal world you don't mess with the constitution at all.)
False premise. I have said as recently as today I don't consider the Bush Administration to be Conservatives. It appears you assume all Republicans are Conservatives. Does this also mean you consider all Democrats to be Liberals? With this startling new information now in mind, go back and re-read what I said.
Kennedy 0
Quoteposted article
Sen. John Warner, R-Va., who opposed the assault weapons ban when Congress approved it 10 years ago but supported the amendment Tuesday
The entire article, rather than a few quotes. A slightly liberal slant, but it shows some politicians can come to see reason. as seen HERE
QuoteWASHINGTON: Feingold Votes Against Assault Weapons Ban
BY FREDERIC J. FROMMER
Associated Press
WASHINGTON — Wisconsin Sen. Russ Feingold was one of only six Democrats to vote against extending the ban on military-style assault weapons Tuesday, reversing a position he took on the original ban a decade ago.
The ban passed the Senate, 52-47, but was killed hours later when the Senate defeated the bill to which it was attached. That measure would have immunized the gun industry from lawsuits.
Feingold, who is up for re-election this year, also voted against that larger bill.
"Although I voted for the ban on certain kinds of semiautomatic weapons in 1994, I have come to believe that it is a largely arbitrary and symbolic measure," Feingold said in a Senate speech. "Citizens see it as a first step towards confiscating their firearms."
The other Democrats to vote against the assault weapons ban were Max Baucus of Montana, Ben Nelson of Nebraska, Mary Landrieu of Louisiana, Zell Miller of Georgia and Harry Reid of Nevada. Ten Republicans crossed party lines to vote for the ban.
Feingold did vote with his party on another amendment, to require background checks on all buyers at private gun shows. That, too, went down with the overall immunity bill.
Feingold may be trying to counter Republican attacks that he is a liberal out of the mainstream on many issues, University of Wisconsin-Madison political science professor Ken Mayer said.
"If I'm an incumbent senator and I can find some ways to take some of those issues off the table, that's a perfectly rational strategy," Mayer said. The vote "could easily be reflective of awareness of the fact that he's got an election coming up."
Mayer noted, however, that Feingold has throughout his career made strong statements in favor of gun rights. Feingold reiterated those sentiments in his Senate speech, saying the Second Amendment "was not an afterthought, that it has meaning today and must be respected."
But Feingold said say no reason to provide immunity protection to the gun industry.
"There is no evidence that liability lawsuits threaten the very existence of the gun industry in America," he said.
Brian Siebel, a senior attorney with the Brady Center to Prevent Gun Violence in Washington, challenged Feingold's reading of the assault weapons ban.
He said the group's own study found that the law contributed to a substantial reduction of assault weapons in crime.
Wisconsin's other senator, Democrat Herb Kohl, voted to renew the assault weapons ban.
"This ban has taken weapons off the street that endanger everyone, from our friends and family members to the law enforcement officers responsible for protecting us," Kohl said in statement.
edit to add link
Guard your honor, let your reputation fall where it will, and outlast the bastards.
1*
QuoteBrian Siebel, a senior attorney with the Brady Center to Prevent Gun Violence in Washington, challenged Feingold's reading of the assault weapons ban.
He said the group's own study found that the law contributed to a substantial reduction of assault weapons in crime.
And my own studies have shown that if you base 100% of your diet intake on bananas, monkeys will fly out of your ass.
Seriously tho, I am glad to see that Sen. Feingold had the nuts to present the truth in this matter. I am sure he just ensured his reelection bid among gun owners.
mike
Girls only want boyfriends who have great skills--You know, like nunchuk skills, bow-hunting skills, computer-hacking skills.
Kennedy 0
They just keep making more and more sense.
Guard your honor, let your reputation fall where it will, and outlast the bastards.
1*
mike
Girls only want boyfriends who have great skills--You know, like nunchuk skills, bow-hunting skills, computer-hacking skills.
QuoteQuotean AR 15 or similar weapon isn't ideal for most civilians because it's too big. Kind of awkward to conceal, put in your night stand and what not.
A lot of people say a shotgun is best for home defense, and it has all the same problems which you list above.
How long a gun happens to be, is not necessarily a factor making it unsuitable for home defense.
Quote
Context John, context.
The discussion wasn't limited to home defense exclusively. If you factor in concealed carry, or something that can easily and safely be stored near you bed without sacrificing quick access, handguns become the clear winner.
FWIW, I don't have a particularly strong opinion on gun laws. I'm probably one of the few that could possibly be swayed one way or the other by reasoned arguments.
Near as I can tell, most people already have their minds made up.
-JoshIf you have time to panic, you have time to do something more productive. -Me*
*Ron has accused me of plagiarizing this quote. He attributes it to Douglas Adams.
billvon 2,400
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> lists them on their site, we can't possibly believe that, but if the
> Brady Bunch runs their own study, that ranks with the Gospel. Yep. Uh huh.
I'd say both groups have their own agendas, and select the studies they promote accordingly. They'd be fools to do otherwise.
Quote
OK, that might be true, but conversely, *not* knowing what a computer virus is, is a highly reliable indicator of stupidity.
One would have to have there head pretty far up their bum to miss all of the computer virus related posts, newspaper, television, magazine and radio stories.
-JoshIf you have time to panic, you have time to do something more productive. -Me*
*Ron has accused me of plagiarizing this quote. He attributes it to Douglas Adams.
Kennedy 0
QuoteI'd say both groups have their own agendas, and select the studies they promote accordingly. They'd be fools to do otherwise.
Bill, when I link to any study or statistic listed on the NRA site, even if it DOJ or California AG, you blow it off and act like it doesn't exist. Read the words below again. These people couldn't buy a reasonable study, they actually have to do their own.
QuoteHe said the group's own study found that the law contributed to a substantial reduction of assault weapons in crime.
Guard your honor, let your reputation fall where it will, and outlast the bastards.
1*
Quote
You just can't admit that killing kids isn't funny, can you?
You betcha:
Killing kids isn't funny.
However, joking about it can be!
Historically, jokes have been intimately tied to unsavory and awkward things.
Nothing new here.
-Josh
*Ron has accused me of plagiarizing this quote. He attributes it to Douglas Adams.
Kennedy 0
The ATF collects data on gun traces, including where they left federal supervision [first sale].
A spokesman for the ATF actually issued a press release to stating that the Brady Bunch was full of shit and the report didn't mean that at all.
It kind of makes sense that the biggest dealers in a given area will have more traces come back to them, don't you think?
[FYI - not all traces are the result of a crime]
Guard your honor, let your reputation fall where it will, and outlast the bastards.
1*
billvon 2,400
>if it DOJ or California AG, you blow it off and act like it doesn't exist.
I am certain it exists. I am also certain it has been selected wisely to be in line with their goals. I can find studies by impartial, well-studied scientists that "prove" that global warming is nonsense on the Coalition for Affordable and Reliable Energy website, a site backed by the coal industry. One gem - "Do you find lobster more difficult to order at your favorite seafood restaurant? Are you paying more for it? We didn’t think so."
On the other hand, I can find studies that show it's a huge problem on the Sierra Club website. Neither site is a good place to go for unbiased information. Likewise, I wouldn't go to either the NRA or the Mothers Against Horrible Gun Violence blah blah for information on gun violence.
The National Rifle Association--That's pretty cut and dry to me. An association of gun owners for gun owners. The NRA was established to promote marksmanship in order to create a stronger national defense. When gun owner's rights started to be attacked, the NRA developed a defense system and infrastructure to attempt to prevent infringement of those rights.
The Brady Campaign to Prevent Gun Violence--An association of people who want to end gun violence. Yet, their conception was National Council to Ban Handguns which was later traded for the name Handgun Control, Inc. They began life as a group which was for the elimination of gun ownership in all forms but began focus on handguns, because that's what the public was most afraid of. The organization renamed itself The Brady Campaign to Prevent Gun Violence as it began to shrink and die due to the exposure of myths it perpetuated as it worked toward the goal of the elimination of private firearms ownership. It renamed itself to create an appearance of centrism and took a more amiable position against gun violence in our society. Obviously, considering their strenuous support of recent legislation to ban an entire class of firearms which have only cosmetic differences from firearms, which they currently say they approve of. They have worked tirelessly to block passage of concealed carry legislation which has proven to reduce crime.
In the words of HCI founding chair, Nelson T. Shields, III.:
Quote"I'm convinced that we have to have Federal legislation to build on. We're going to have to take one step at a time, and the first step is necessarily--given the political realities--going to be very modest ... Our ultimate goal--total control of handguns in the United States--is going to take time ... The first problem is to slow down the increasing number of handguns being produced and sold in this country. The second problem is to get handguns registered, and the final problem is to make the possession of all handguns, and all handgun ammunition totally illegal."
I cannot establish the validity of this item, but it is reported to be the notes of a White House meeting which took place in 1994 (edit: 1993, actually) and a rough-draft of a five-year plan, which looks like it was pretty accurate for their maneuvering at the time. It was posted on the Free Republic. Take a look.
mike
Girls only want boyfriends who have great skills--You know, like nunchuk skills, bow-hunting skills, computer-hacking skills.
Quoteit's so sad that the victims of gun violence will still be able to (unsuccessfully) seek financial damages from gun manufacturers.
Maybe rather than giving immunity to the well connected from a disfunctional litgition system, the NRA should do their bit for a better America by lobbying Congress to change the whole system. If it doesn't work for gun manufacturers, it doesn't work for anyone.
On the other hand, if there is preemption legislation in place, yet another precedent is set, baring the suing of a law-abiding manufacturers of a legal, yet misused product.
mike
Girls only want boyfriends who have great skills--You know, like nunchuk skills, bow-hunting skills, computer-hacking skills.
You just had to go and remove any doubt about the lack of sense of humor, didn't you?
-Josh
You just can't admit that killing kids isn't funny, can you?
never pull low......unless you are