Democrats bite their own noses to spite their faces

[Kennedy 0]

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So how do we expect banning another tool will prevent assaults?

we don't, but we do expect it will make us feel better about our safety while we sleep behind locked gates with armed body guards protecting our children while the degrading the less fortunate individual's ability to protect themselves.

Wow, ironically assuming the character of the legislators. Nicely done! Same reason they can't believe CCW will ever work.

witty subliminal message
Guard your honor, let your reputation fall where it will, and outlast the bastards.
1*

[peacefuljeffrey 0]

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unless you live in south central LA there is no real reason why you should have a gun...this isnt the wild west....i mean...get a freakin life...find a productibe hobby

You are in effect saying this to about eighty million people in the U.S.A.

I suggest that you are the one who should get a life, if you think that "south central LA" is the only place in which a crime could happen to a person and a handgun could be used to defend against it. There are thousands upon thousands of people who have saved their own lives because they were armed.

I'd probably laugh if something like that happened to you, and because you were so contemptuous of people who feel it is right to be prepared for self-defense, you couldn't help yourself if you were attacked. With your attitude, it would serve you right.

-Jeffrey
"With tha thoughts of a militant mind... Hard line, hard line after hard line!"

[quade 3]

Wishing ill on your fellow skydivers is bad juju.

quade -
The World's Most Boring Skydiver

[Kennedy 0]

It was kind of harsh, but I don't disagree. I'd see it as karma coming around. After all, "Heaven helps those who help themselves."

witty subliminal message
Guard your honor, let your reputation fall where it will, and outlast the bastards.
1*

[3ringheathen 0]

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However, I'll be the first to tell you I'm not going to frame my own house or fix the plumbing without some serious guidnace. Am I an idiot because I'm ignorant on a few topics?

Flawed analogy. XXL said that his intelligence was questioned by someone that doesn't even know what a computer virus is.

Just as there's a vast difference between knowing that a house has plumbing and knowing how to install or repair plumbing, there's a huge difference between knowing what a virus is and being able to write one.

Someone that uses computers, even recreationally, really ought to know what a computer virus is.

The level of ignorance it would take to not have at least a basic understanding of the concept of a computer virus ought to call their general intelligence into question.
-Josh

If you have time to panic, you have time to do something more productive. -Me*
*Ron has accused me of plagiarizing this quote. He attributes it to Douglas Adams.

[Kennedy 0]

Do you know what a ballcock is? Anyone using a house [with running water] has had problems with one. Did you know that?

Just because you have problems with it, doesn't mean you know what it's called. Remember, people using dropzone.com are probably in the top 10% with regards to computer literacy, so you get used to having people around who know a lot more than the rest of the world. When someone from the next 10% down decides to start using a computer and is learning this new world, don't look down on them. Stupidity is permanent. Ignorance can be cured.

Think about the last time you were around car guys. Did one of them treat you like shit because you didn't know rotors from discs?

Or the last time you were in a gun shop, did someone act like you were an ass because you couldn't tell ejector from extractor?

I hang with both groups, so I know these things. When there is a new guy to the group he will always know less than the least informed among us. Give him time, he may show you up someday. I've also felt the glares when you don't know something "obvious." How the fuck would I know a skip from a sloop until someone told me?

My point in this long winded thread: just go easy man. There's no need to reject someone based on knowledge. Teach them. I promise it feels good. That's why I never get frustrated with whuffos, except when they tell me I'm a threat or irresponsible. I've turned three whuffos into jumpers. I happen to think that's a big leap better than just having three more whuffos who think skydivers are all assholes because I lost my temper. But that's just my opinion, I could be wrong.

witty subliminal message
Guard your honor, let your reputation fall where it will, and outlast the bastards.
1*

[Jimbo 0]

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Stupidity is permanent. Ignorance can be cured.

Amen.

-
Jim

"Like" - The modern day comma
Good bye, my friends. You are missed.

[peacefuljeffrey 0]

Alright, alright, get back to talking about guns, will you?! I won't suffer this hijacking by talk about computer viruses, especially since I now have to reinstall my system (including re-downloading the current Explorer for an hour and a half!) because of these fuckwad shitbrained criminal hackers sending viruses around the internet! I've had about enough of viruses to think about for the rest of my life!

I'd love to be faced with the piece of shit who wrote this thing -- or any hacker who wrote any virus -- and have leave to take out my frustration/revenge. These people are the lowest of the fuckin' low.

-Jeffrey
"With tha thoughts of a militant mind... Hard line, hard line after hard line!"

[quade 3]

This might sound like a simplistic answer, but have you considered an operating system not quite so susceptible to attacks?

The majority (almost all?) of attacks are written against the Microsoft Windows environment because of their ubiquity and security flaws.

quade -
The World's Most Boring Skydiver

[peacefuljeffrey 0]

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This might sound like a simplistic answer, but have you considered an operating system not quite so susceptible to attacks?

The majority (almost all?) of attacks are written against the Microsoft Windows environment because of their ubiquity and security flaws.

At this point there is nothing I can do about it. I can't afford another computer, I still have Windows 98 on a three.five year-old computer, I can't dedicate the time or effort to keeping Norton Antivirus updated, I am not going to spend money on some additional antivirus or firewall software (I think that's part of the fuckin' racket, as a matter of fact).

How can anyone believe that they can write programs tha tdo what they do, but they can't write those programs to DENY any attempts to mess within themselves?! I think they're just plain happy to have virus attacks go on -- it boosts sales of products they make to "address" the problem. It's just yet another form of human greed and corruption. Some say that cops and the feds don't want to actually stop crime, some say that doctors don't want to cure cancer or AIDS or diabetes, and some say that the computer companies don't want to stop spam or viruses -- all of these groups make their living peddling products that treat the problems with bandaids.

I just want the ability to go after virus makers and torture them to death, as they deserve. Could you imagine if we put some real adept, truly honest and dedicated detectives to work finding these people, and then actually did put them to death? We currently give them slaps on the wrists, and the go and deface government websites with taunts. Kill a few of them and see how long this shit goes on. The world is too fuckin' mamsy-pamsy about handing out STIFF, ULTIMATE PUNISHMENT to people who do things that really harm us and that really piss us off. If you seriously want to stop a problem, you have to be willing to seriously punish. If you can't or won't, you're sentencing yourself to live with the problem.

*edited to add: Maybe you can tell I'm real fuckin' fed up with this bullshit.

-Jeffrey
"With tha thoughts of a militant mind... Hard line, hard line after hard line!"

[pajarito 0]

Ok...I haven't been around on dz.com very long but I'm catching on. PeacefulJeffrey's not so peaceful.... I love it!!!

[Zenister 0]

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At this point there is nothing I can do about it. I can't afford another computer, I still have Windows 98 on a three.five year-old computer, I can't dedicate the time or effort to keeping Norton Antivirus updated, I am not going to spend money on some additional antivirus or firewall software (I think that's part of the fuckin' racket, as a matter of fact).

uh Norton can be set to auto update whenever you want....even on a machine running win 98SE (i have one i use as a 'jukebox' and it checks itself and updates every morning)

if you dont have a firewall you really should get one. there are several freeware varieties that work pretty well for basic defense, they wont stop a dedicated hacker (nothing automated really will) but most hackers are simply looking for easy targets (kinda like other criminal types eh??) and if your not one they will pass you by and pick on someone else... right now it sounds like your the 'someone else'

____________________________________
Those who fail to learn from the past are simply Doomed.

[billvon 2,400]

>At this point there is nothing I can do about it. I can't afford another
> computer, I still have Windows 98 on a three.five year-old
> computer, I can't dedicate the time or effort to keeping Norton
>Antivirus updated, I am not going to spend money on some
>additional antivirus or firewall software (I think that's part of the
> fuckin' racket, as a matter of fact).

1. Get Linux. It's really cheap, and is not as affected by common viruses. It works well on older machines.

2. Norton updates itself.

3. Security updates are free from Microsoft - although I don't know if they support 98 any more. On the plus side, many XP viruses won't affect '98 machines.

>How can anyone believe that they can write programs tha tdo what
> they do, but they can't write those programs to DENY any attempts
> to mess within themselves?

Same way some people can go to work every day but can't defend themselves against a drunk driver.

>I think they're just plain happy to have virus attacks go on -- it
> boosts sales of products they make to "address" the problem. It's
> just yet another form of human greed and corruption. Some say
> that cops and the feds don't want to actually stop crime, some say
> that doctors don't want to cure cancer or AIDS or diabetes, and
> some say that the computer companies don't want to stop spam or
> viruses -- all of these groups make their living peddling products
> that treat the problems with bandaids.

I don't think you know any doctors or DA's, then.

>I just want the ability to go after virus makers and torture them to
>death, as they deserve.

I wrote some viruses years back, although they were technically worms by today's definition. I was fascinated by the concept of artificial life and how it mimicked "real" life - how they spread, how they adapted etc. As this was 1985 or thereabouts, the only computers affected were campus VAX machines. Mine weren't very successful, but I learned a lot through writing them.

>The world is too fuckin' mamsy-pamsy about handing out STIFF,
>ULTIMATE PUNISHMENT to people who do things that really harm us
> and that really piss us off.

Agreed! Murder, theft, terrorism - that's fine, but if someone pisses you off you should get to give them a STIFF, ULTIMATE PUNISHMENT. (Who knows? They might like it!)

> If you seriously want to stop a problem, you have to be willing to
> seriously punish. If you can't or won't, you're sentencing yourself to
> live with the problem.

If you refuse to protect yourself, you're sentencing yourself to live with the problem. Bitching about it is like having sex with prostitutes, refusing to wear a condom, and then wanting to murder them when you get syphilis. Whose fault was it that you got sick?

It's really pretty easy to protect yourself against viruses, SPAM, worms, trojan horses etc. It's worth knowing how to do it, because it usually ends up being a lot cheaper to protect yourself than to fix it later.

[Jimbo 0]

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1. Get Linux. It's really cheap, and is not as affected by common viruses. It works well on older machines.

Linux is a great OS for those who care to take the time to learn it, and are willing to sacrifice their mainstream apps. Linux is not a great OS for the majority of PC users. PJ has already demonstrated a lack of proficiency in the PC area (nothing personal PJ), why would you suggest this to him?

As an aside, Wow! Talk about thread drift!

-
Jim

"Like" - The modern day comma
Good bye, my friends. You are missed.

[benny 0]

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I just want the ability to go after virus makers and torture them to death, as they deserve. Could you imagine if we put some real adept, truly honest and dedicated detectives to work finding these people, and then actually did put them to death? We currently give them slaps on the wrists, and the go and deface government websites with taunts. Kill a few of them and see how long this shit goes on. The world is too fuckin' mamsy-pamsy about handing out STIFF, ULTIMATE PUNISHMENT to people who do things that really harm us and that really piss us off.

I think tirades like this are the reason some of us like gun control. I mean really, get a handle on yourself. If you didn't want to kill everyone who pisses you off maybe we wouldn't have a problem with you playing with guns...

Never go to a DZ strip show.

[Jimbo 0]

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I think tirades like this are the reason some of us like gun control. I mean really, get a handle on yourself. If you didn't want to kill everyone who pisses you off maybe we wouldn't have a problem with you playing with guns...

Yes, only people who don't get upset should be allowed to have guns. Emotionless drones. Good idea!

That's up there on my list of "Stupidest things ever said".

-
Jim

"Like" - The modern day comma
Good bye, my friends. You are missed.

[benny 0]

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I think tirades like this are the reason some of us like gun control. I mean really, get a handle on yourself. If you didn't want to kill everyone who pisses you off maybe we wouldn't have a problem with you playing with guns...

Yes, only people who don't get upset should be allowed to have guns. Emotionless drones. Good idea!

That's up there on my list of "Stupidest things ever said".

-
Jim

Holy shit, I feel so horrible, Jim thinks I've said one of the stupidest thing ever, hold on while I cry a river for you to canoe down. What I said is stupid Jim? There are more than a few people who would consider it more than just a little, unbalanced, improper maybe to be lining up the firing squad for nuisance computer crimes. But I forgot, I am posting with the "bad" people should all be shot crew.

Never go to a DZ strip show.

[billvon 2,400]

>Yes, only people who don't get upset should be allowed to
>have guns. Emotionless drones. Good idea!

People who get so mad they want to kill people should not have guns; I would support a law that took guns away from people who try to kill other people for any reason with any weapon. That's a long way from only allowing emotionless drones to have guns.

[jkm2500 0]

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I would support a law that took guns away from people who try to kill other people for any reason with any weapon.

Bill,

There are already laws out there that DO take away guns from irresponsible people. Do we need more laws on the books?

The primary purpose of the Armed Forces is to prepare for and to prevail in combat should the need arise.

[Kennedy 0]

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People who get so mad they want to kill people should not have guns; I would support a law that took guns away from people who try to kill other people for any reason with any weapon. That's a long way from only allowing emotionless drones to have guns.

That's called attempted murder, at least if it remains inchoate. It's a felony in every state, so if someone's convicted of it, they do loose their guns.

witty subliminal message
Guard your honor, let your reputation fall where it will, and outlast the bastards.
1*

[billvon 2,400]

>There are already laws out there that DO take away guns from
>irresponsible people. Do we need more laws on the books?

I have no idea. Kennedy once told me that there's a loophole that allows a felon to not declare his status to a gun seller and buy a gun. If that's the case, then I'd be for closing that loophole. If anyone who commits an assault with intent to murder (or manslaughter, etc) loses their right to own a gun (and that's enforced) then you don't need any more laws.

[Kennedy 0]

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I have no idea. Kennedy once told me that there's a loophole that allows a felon to not declare his status to a gun seller and buy a gun. If that's the case, then I'd be for closing that loophole. If anyone who commits an assault with intent to murder (or manslaughter, etc) loses their right to own a gun (and that's enforced) then you don't need any more laws.

Forgive me for a poor explanation then. I was trying to explain why the basis for gun control can't work. It's not a loophole, it's the fifth amendment. In the thirties when gun control really picked up, a law was passed requiring people to register their machine guns [now known as Class III firearms]. According to every politician and congressional record, it was only meant to be enforced against felons.

The trouble is the Supreme Court said requiring them to register would be requiring self incrimination. So only law abiding folks were affected by this gun control. It was the start of a seventy year trend as far as I've seen.

The only people affected by gun control law are people who obey the laws. That's just the way it is.


Every time a person buys a gun from a licensed dealer [that's all the legal ones] the dealer runs an NICS check on them. If the systems turns up a hit, they are refused the sale. If the dealer doesn't run the check or sells anyway, he'll lose his FFL and go out of business, plus face lawsuits and prosecution.

as an aside, S 659 / S 1805 would not have prevented a lawsuit against him for breaking the law. There's a reason they called it the "Protection of Lawful Commerce in Arms."

witty subliminal message
Guard your honor, let your reputation fall where it will, and outlast the bastards.
1*

[gary350 0]

OMFG - Truly laughing my ass off! Compare and contrast the two statements below, by the SAME person, on the same page! Oh the irony. Oh the hypocrisy.

Regarding your virus problems, I AM laughing at YOU! (nothing personal or anything)

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I'd probably laugh if something like that happened to you, and because you were so contemptuous of people who feel it is right to be prepared for self-defense, you couldn't help yourself if you were attacked. With your attitude, it would serve you right.

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Alright, alright, get back to talking about guns, will you?! I won't suffer this hijacking by talk about computer viruses, especially since I now have to reinstall my system (including re-downloading the current Explorer for an hour and a half!) because of these fuckwad shitbrained criminal hackers sending viruses around the internet! I've had about enough of viruses to think about for the rest of my life!

I'd love to be faced with the piece of shit who wrote this thing -- or any hacker who wrote any virus -- and have leave to take out my frustration/revenge. These people are the lowest of the fuckin' low.

[gary350 0]

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> If you seriously want to stop a problem, you have to be willing to
> seriously punish. If you can't or won't, you're sentencing yourself to
> live with the problem.

If you refuse to protect yourself, you're sentencing yourself to live with the problem. Bitching about it is like having sex with prostitutes, refusing to wear a condom, and then wanting to murder them when you get syphilis. Whose fault was it that you got sick?

It's really pretty easy to protect yourself against viruses, SPAM, worms, trojan horses etc. It's worth knowing how to do it, because it usually ends up being a lot cheaper to protect yourself than to fix it later.

Gotta agree with Bill here, PJ. But on the bright side, I read something recently that may give you some relief in court, or perhaps just cheer you up. It isn't proposing actually torturing or killing them, but:

COMPUTER VIRUS MAKING TO BE PROSECUTED
AS HATE CRIME FOR TARGETING STUPID PEOPLE

Systems Administrators Now On Front Lines of Bias Crime

Washington, D.C. (SatireWire.com) — With yet another email virus spreading across the globe, 41 U.S. states and six European countries today announced that the act of creating an attachment-based computer virus will now be considered a hate crime because it intentionally targets stupid people.

Hate crime victim Bob Fnork (center) is stunned to discover he has just opened another infected attachment. "In a hate crime, the offender is motivated by the victim's personal characteristics, and in the case of email viruses, the maker is clearly singling out those who open email attachments when they've been told a thousand times not to," said California Attorney General Bill Lockyer. "Like any other segment of the population, people of stupidity need protection from bias."

The decision, however, is already causing a firestorm of controversy. In the United States, the American Civil Liberties Union vehemently opposed the action, arguing it runs counter to the spirit of hate crime laws.

"Hate crime statutes are specifically designed to protect minority groups," said ACLU President Nadine Strossen. "I'm not sure the number of stupid computer users meets that criterion."

France, meanwhile, said it would not prosecute anyone willing to write a virus in French.

But in London, the British Civil Idiots Union applauded the move, arguing that virus-based hate crimes cause victims to suffer psychological harm. "Every time we pass on one of these emails, our self-esteem is shattered when we are forced to publicize our condition," said CIU President Michael Overly. "It's always a shock to my system every time I have to write, "Hey everybody, if you get an email attachment from me, don't open it! I just found out my computer got infected by a virus! Sorry!"

In identifying virus-based hate crime activity, U.S. and European law enforcement authorities said they will focus on anyone creating a virus delivered via email attachment that contains either no subject line or a vague subject line such as "Hey, check this out!" "I saw this and thought of you!" or "I am wanting to get your opinion on this."

Congressional leaders also said they will amend the 1990 Hate Crimes Statistics Act and require the FBI to track data on crimes based on race, religion, sexual orientation, ethnicity, or stupidity. As a result, some experts expect the annual number of hate crimes in the U.S. alone to jump from 6,500 to 132 million.

Others believe the actual number will be higher, but say many crimes will go unreported because the victim refuses to recognize what has happened. Dallas, Texas resident Mike Smith is a case in point.

"I am not a victim of a hate crime because I am not stupid," said Smith. "I got an email with an attachment from my buddy in Phoenix, so naturally, I opened it. What's so stupid about that?"

What, Smith was asked, did the email say?

"It said, 'I_love_you.' Why?"

In Moline, Ill., police have already made their first arrest under the expanded laws. Matthew Spere, a 17-year-old high school senior, was taken into custody this morning after police said he had created and propagated a variant of the "Goner" virus. In a phone interview, Spere denied the charges. "My virus wasn't targeting stupid computer users specifically, just anyone using Microsoft's Outlook Express or AOL," he said. "Oh... damn."

[benny 0]

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The only people affected by gun control law are people who obey the laws. That's just the way it is.

This is a flawed logic which could easily be applied to any other law.

The only people affected by murder laws are people who obey the laws.

The only people affected by insider trading laws are the people who obey the laws.

Nope nope, it's just not true, because if you break the law and you get caught you can be prosecuted.

Never go to a DZ strip show.