If you were buying an AAD today, what would you buy?

[docjohn 0]

If you were buying a new AAD today, what would you buy and why?

(I've searched for this thread and couldn't find one - forgive me if its a repeat)


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Doc
http://www.manifestmaster.com/video

[JENNR8R 0]

I bought a Vigil last October, and I am happy with it. I did a search on these forums for "Vigil" and liked what I read.

I asked my rigger his opinion since I didn't know anyone at my DZ who had one. He said he had attended a seminar on it. The presenter and he played tug of war with the cords, and the unit still worked fine. Apparently, it is very well constructed. He told me that he was going to buy a Vigil the next time he needed an AAD. That was good enough for me.

What do you call a beautiful, sunny day that comes after two cloudy, rainy
ones? -- Monday.

[kingbunky 3]

vigil, no question. longer (projected) life and no expensive servicing every 4 years.

"Hang on a sec, the young'uns are throwin' beer cans at a golf cart."
MB4252 TDS699
killing threads since 2001

[kelpdiver 2]

" vigil, no question. longer (projected) life and no [currently required] expensive servicing every 4 years."

John - searching on Cypres vs Vigil should yield a lot of these threads, including one from just a couple weeks ago.

[leapdog 0]

Vigil.
Agreed with the first two repsonses. on construction and pricing. life time.

Gunnery Sergeant of Marines
"I would like it if I were challenged mentally at my job and not feel like I'm mentally challenged." - Co-worker

[pbla4024 0]

You missed MPAAD.

Fido

[darnknit 0]

Quote

longer (projected) life and no expensive servicing every 4 years.

RTFM. new batteries every (plus or minus) four years or 700 jumps. there is currently a service bulletin on vigil cutters in certain rigs.

customer service with regard to the problems in Thailand during the record attempts makes airtec look a wee bit better

i would spend my money on a cypres. YMMV

pulling is cool. keep it in the skin

[USPA 0]

I'm currently waiting on my new Argus. User interface, waterproofing, swoop mode (not for me, but for resale or maybe later for me), and ruggedness and last but not least price. I do have a lot of questions though, about a number of it's functions (they it works) and we have to wait and see how it operates in the field.

Plus points of AAD's in my opinion:

Cypres 2: More experienced manufacturer
Vigil: Build quality and battery system (pulse-plus)
Argus: Seems the best built quality, battery system (cheap replacements)

Negative points of AAD's in my opinion:

Cypres 2: manufacturer not always "honest" in communication (my opinion only) and thrashing other manufacturers
Vigil: Has yet to prove itself, but building up a better reputation. has been slow in communication.
Argus: New player, lots of unknowns. Using commercial of the shelf batteries (but states it has a sure way of checking it's integrity)

I do have to add that my DZ has a sponsorship deal with Argus, which allows me to get it REALLY cheap. I do however have no commitment to the manufacturer.

Just my $0.01

The trouble with skydiving; If you stink at it and continue to jump, you'll die. If you're good at it and continue to jump, you'll see a lot of friends die...

[wmw999 2,148]

I'd be tempted to buy a Cypres 2. Actually, a Cypres 1 doesn't sound bad still. It's the most proven technology, in an area where proven technology, with great transparency, is a really good thing.

The only downside for me (I don't swoop) is the regular maintenance.

Wendy W.

There is nothing more dangerous than breaking a basic safety rule and getting away with it. It removes fear of the consequences and builds false confidence. (tbrown)

[yamtx73 0]

Considering I just bought mine... a Cypres 2

The only naturals in this sport shit thru feathers...

[dzjohn 0]

I would probably buy a cypres2 but am on the fence, Just watching argus and vigil to see what kindof support and reliability they have at least cypres has a bit ore back up with years of experience.

[mjosparky 3]

Quote

You missed MPAAD.

How are you going to get approval to use the PV-030 pilot chute in say a Javelin?

My idea of a fair fight is clubbing baby seals

[kelpdiver 2]

Quote

RTFM. new batteries every (plus or minus) four years or 700 jumps. there is currently a service bulletin on vigil cutters in certain rigs.

ads say 4 years/700 jumps, replace when indicated Bat Low. Have those estimates proved accurate?

If so...Square1 sells the Vigil power pack for $125. Airtec does the 4 year service including any power pack replacements for $160.

Then you're down to the question of the 12 versus potential 20 year lifespan.

[TrickyDicky 0]

I just bought a rig with a new Cypres 2.

4 Year servicing, whether it needs it or not.

Vigil Only needs a service when it says it needs one. I am an electronic engineer and I know that you cannot test everything every time, or even come close to it. I dont think Id trust the inbuilt test to always flag when it needs a service.

Maybe in 12 years time when my current cypres expires, the vigil will be fully proven. But until then Im happy with my cypres/cypres 2.

UK Skydiver for all your UK skydiving needs.

[riggerrob 558]

Best price: second-hand Cypres 1.

Second-best for price: new Vigil.

Best for durability: Vigil or Astra.

Best for good pond swooping: Astra, that can be turned off under canopy.

Best for bad pond swooping: Cypres 2 will survive a short dunking.

Best for low maintenance: we are waiting for an answer.

[krkeenan 0]

Quote

Vigil Only needs a service when it says it needs one... I dont think Id trust the inbuilt test to always flag when it needs a service.

Therein lies the problem with Vigil (in my opinion). Trusting the device to tell you when it is malfunctioning reminds me of the HAL 9000 in 2001: A Space Odyssey. If the device malfunctions in a way that tells you it's OK, then you have a problem.

Having a unit bench tested against known test equipment is the only trustworthy way to keep it certified to operating parameters.

Buy Cypres.

Kevin K.

======================
Seasons don't fear the Reaper,
nor do the Wind, the Sun, or the Rain...

[JENNR8R 0]

Having a unit bench tested against known test equipment is the only trustworthy way to keep it certified to operating parameters.

Buy Cypres.

[TheBachelor 5]

I just bought a Vigil for my second rig. I've yet to jump it. If I like the Vigil over the next 2 years, I'll buy another to replace the Cypres that will be at the end of its life.

The total cost of ownership was the main factor for me, although I did study its safety record first.

There are battered women? I've been eating 'em plain all of these years...

[Jonsmann 0]

When one of my Cypres' expires by the end of the year, I will replace it with a Cypres2.
I don't need the uncertainty of an unproven AAD. In 5 years time maybe it will be another AAD, but now it will definitely be a Cypres2.

Jacques

[krkeenan 0]

Quote

...If I like the Vigil over the next 2 years, I'll buy another to replace the Cypres that will be at the end of its life.
The total cost of ownership was the main factor for me, although I did study its safety record first.

It seems to me that the only evaluation to be done is by studying the facts and figures. As far as "liking the performance" goes, what is there to compare ? You turn it on and you jump it. I guess if you forget to pull, and it fires your reserve, that's a plus, These things happen rarely, and if they happen to you, you may not survive to make a complaint to the Customer Service Dept. That is why saving a few bucks over a 12-year (or so) time frame is silly.

In my opinion, Cypres is the proven technology, and is the best choice for this critical application.

Kevin

======================
Seasons don't fear the Reaper,
nor do the Wind, the Sun, or the Rain...

[krkeenan 0]

Quote

I have a Vigil that I plan on having tested on the same schedule as the Cypres. Do you see any drawbacks to that plan?

Since the main selling point of the Vigil is that it doesn't need the periodic servicing, I'm not sure how that would work. The Vigil people would probably think you were nuts and it would probably end up costing you more than a Cypres.

======================
Seasons don't fear the Reaper,
nor do the Wind, the Sun, or the Rain...

[USPA 0]

The cypres2 is a different beast then the Cypres1. You simply have to look at the world record attempt to see that, if you don't believe it. The manufactorer has more experience, yes (also in customer relations / advertising), but proven technology no. At least no more proven then e.g. a vigil.

The trouble with skydiving; If you stink at it and continue to jump, you'll die. If you're good at it and continue to jump, you'll see a lot of friends die...

[bob.dino 0]

Quote

Therein lies the problem with Vigil (in my opinion). Trusting the device to tell you when it is malfunctioning reminds me of the HAL 9000 in 2001: A Space Odyssey. If the device malfunctions in a way that tells you it's OK, then you have a problem.

Having a unit bench tested against known test equipment is the only trustworthy way to keep it certified to operating parameters.

Yep. It's why, for the next few years at least, I'll continue to buy Airtec. I appreciate the fact that there are now competitors on the market, but I don't want to be the one to discover an unanticipated failure mode in a new product .

[Praetorian 1]

I'm glad my C1 has 4 more years, all comers will have that time to prove themselves before I buy my next "hopefully not needed, may not work insurance policy" ... if I had to buy now I'd go Cypress2 just because of the way SSK handeled my cypres 8 year, followed by a MISINSTALL by my "rigger" see therad FAA decision... the "install" could have damaged the unit, so they asked for it back checked it out and replaced the "potentially" damaged cord... ALL FREE.. well not the 8 year check. I know they are only protecting their rep, but their interiestes and mine coinside and I think this is good customer service

Good Judgment comes from experience...a lot of experience comes from bad
judgment.

[koppel 3]

I think that many people on this thread are forgetting something very important (especially my friendly US of A'ers ) and that is this sport was built on pioneering.

Someone has to be the first. I for one have ordered two Argus units for my rigs (one of which has a cypres1 (to be sold shortly) and the other nothing) for a number of reasons.

It is your perogative to sit back and wait to see if someone dies from a new idea/attempt/equipment etc. I will not berate you for it in the least. BUT remember that it is those that are willing to have a new idea/attempt/equipment that are progressing the sport.

Without support from our sports followers (that is you and I my friends) then in this current financial world we live in they may not get their wonderful new idea/attempt/equipment out there for everybody to use.

I do not have the mind of some of the great people in our sport with which to progress the sport (the likes of BB etc) but I can give a commitment to our sport to help support them.

Remember all those friends and family of yours who state how 'dangerous' skydiving is while you listen politely and remind you that driving your car is more likely to get you killed.

Consider in real terms the danger of supporting a new idea/attempt/equipment. What are the real dangers and how much of this is just fear of trying something new.

That is not to say that all new ideas are a good idea and you must make up your mind for yourself as to what you are prepared to risk and that which you are not.

I for one feel that the perceived risk of a new AAD is higher by far than the real risk.

Rant over.

I like my canopy...


...it lets me down.