skybytch 259 #1 March 3, 2008 T.S. Eliot wrote the following in "The Cocktail Party." QuoteWe die to each other daily. What we know of other people is only our memory of the moments during which we knew them. And they have changed since then. To pretend that they and we are the same is a useful and convenient social convention which must sometimes be broken. We must also remember that at every meeting we are meeting a stranger. So, with this in mind, can we really know anybody? Discuss... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
NWFlyer 2 #2 March 3, 2008 So he's saying that I'm really like that dude in Memento? Whoa. "There is only one basic human right, the right to do as you damn well please. And with it comes the only basic human duty, the duty to take the consequences." -P.J. O'Rourke Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
eeneR 1 #3 March 3, 2008 Who are you? Do I know you? She is not a "Dumb Blonde" - She is a "Light-Haired Detour Off The Information Superhighway." eeneR TF#72, FB#4130, Incauto Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
shermanator 3 #5 March 3, 2008 well, no, we can't 'know' them, like we may know ourselves, but we can have a strong idea of who they are, by lenghth of time talking to them, knowing heir manurisms, and habits, which don't neccessarily change very often. By surrounding ourselves by the people we call friends, we can start to predict what action they will take in certain situations, therefore, 'knowing' them. *I am thinking out loud, sorry* It is a very interesting quote. As much as we can predict on who someone is by their known beliefs, values, and such, no, I guess we really can't 'know' someone. Kinda seems to fall back on Decartes' "I think, therefore I am" .. the only thing that I can know for certain is that I exist. As far as I know, everyone else, and every object, is a figment of my imagination.CLICK HERE! new blog posted 9/21/08 CSA #720 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skybytch 259 #6 March 3, 2008 Quote Who are you? I used to know that. Nowadays, I'm not so sure. Isn't that what getting edumacated is all about? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
eeneR 1 #7 March 3, 2008 Tell me about it. Edjumacation is good though! School is teaching me lots of things. Course my current job is too. But not all in a good way She is not a "Dumb Blonde" - She is a "Light-Haired Detour Off The Information Superhighway." eeneR TF#72, FB#4130, Incauto Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
CSpenceFLY 1 #8 March 3, 2008 What he is saying is just because you liked someone does not mean that they are not an asshole now. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
poe62 0 #9 March 3, 2008 Yet Decartes' logic is flawed and circular, so we may not even know ourselves or if we exist...~Nikki http://www.facebook.com/poe62 Irgity Dirgity Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skybytch 259 #10 March 3, 2008 QuoteKinda seems to fall back on Decartes' "I think, therefore I am" .. the only thing that I can know for certain is that I exist. As far as I know, everyone else, and every object, is a figment of my imagination. Ooohhh, good one, I didn't think about it that way. I was thinking more of relating it to what is said in the book "The Four Agreements" - each of us lives in our own dream and we can't possibly know the dreams of others. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
NWFlyer 2 #11 March 3, 2008 Descartes walks into a bar. Bartender says "Hey buddy, you want a drink?" Descartes says "I think not" and *poof* ... he disappears. "There is only one basic human right, the right to do as you damn well please. And with it comes the only basic human duty, the duty to take the consequences." -P.J. O'Rourke Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
diablopilot 2 #12 March 3, 2008 Don't you know who I think I am?---------------------------------------------- You're not as good as you think you are. Seriously. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skybytch 259 #13 March 3, 2008 Quote What he is saying is just because you liked someone does not mean that they are not an asshole now. But does it not also imply that those assholes could have turned into people I might like? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
happythoughts 0 #14 March 3, 2008 Someone once said that about politicians. That they are so careful about the carefully constructed image that they portray to the public. To a smaller extent, we all suffer from that because we are constantly dealing with the image that people present. We are comparing our insides to everyone else's outsides. That will always be difficult because people conceal their issues. That intentional concealment is what will keep us from actually knowing others. Psychologist Irvin Yalom finds four issues repeatedly in his practice. One of those is what he calls "existential isolation". We are all alone. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DangerRoo 0 #15 March 3, 2008 I would say your quote is true, but with that I also think you can know someone by being in their life long enough and/or close enough to understand them. i believe, sometimes those changes, the changes that get made, the reasons why, or how things of that person will change can be seen by the predictability of what you truly know of their core character and situations they get involved in. not to say it will always be completely accurate we are only human. (I.C.D#2 VP) "<3 ..Looks like breasts coming out of an ice cream cone. Mmmm."~John Mitchell "I'm good with my purple penis straw" ~sky mama Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
NWFlyer 2 #16 March 3, 2008 QuoteDon't you know who I think I am? Well?"There is only one basic human right, the right to do as you damn well please. And with it comes the only basic human duty, the duty to take the consequences." -P.J. O'Rourke Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DangerRoo 0 #17 March 3, 2008 QuoteSomeone once said that about politicians. That they are so careful about the carefully constructed image that they portray to the public. To a smaller extent, we all suffer from that because we are constantly dealing with the image that people present. We are comparing our insides to everyone else's outsides. That will always be difficult because people conceal their issues. That intentional concealment is what will keep us from actually knowing others. Psychologist Irvin Yalom finds four issues repeatedly in his practice. One of those is what he calls "existential isolation". We are all alone. AHHH very true!! only those that find the trust or love in others might show the broken, weaker side everyone prefers to hide. (I.C.D#2 VP) "<3 ..Looks like breasts coming out of an ice cream cone. Mmmm."~John Mitchell "I'm good with my purple penis straw" ~sky mama Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ryoder 1,390 #18 March 3, 2008 Quote Don't you know who I think I am? Everybody knows you! You invented Atmonauti!"There are only three things of value: younger women, faster airplanes, and bigger crocodiles" - Arthur Jones. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
diablopilot 2 #19 March 3, 2008 It's gonna be a long year. ---------------------------------------------- You're not as good as you think you are. Seriously. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
happythoughts 0 #20 March 3, 2008 Quote Quote Who are you? I used to know that. Nowadays, I'm not so sure. Isn't that what getting edumacated is all about? I sometimes if this is a case where education is counter-productive. Education and theories and such, provide viewpoints and tools to over-think things. It is like the abstractions are examined in so many ways that no conclusion is ever reached. One day I sat down and wrote, "list of likes", "list of don't likes". That is who I am. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skybytch 259 #21 March 3, 2008 QuoteEducation and theories and such, provide viewpoints and tools to over-think things. It is like the abstractions are examined in so many ways that no conclusion is ever reached. I see it as muscle memory. Exercise your brain by thinking critically about damn near anything and you'll probably find that thinking critically becomes your default. For me, getting an education isn't about being told how to think, it's about being shown how to think for myself. And that's why I'm not quite sure who I am right now... I'm pretty sure that I'm no longer as much of a sheep as I used to be though. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
madhatter 0 #22 March 3, 2008 Quote We die to each other daily. What we know of other people is only our memory of the moments during which we knew them. And they have changed since then. To pretend that they and we are the same is a useful and convenient social convention which must sometimes be broken. We must also remember that at every meeting we are meeting a stranger. Are we who we remember ourselves to be when we wake up? You'll only ever know anyone to the extent they want you to know them, IMO. "All the world's a stage and al the men and women really players. They have their exits and their entrances, and every man in his time plays many parts." Adds to Roo's comment of trust - we all show only as much as we feel safe with A VERY MERRY UNBIRTHDAY TO YOU!!! D.S # 125 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
sunshine 2 #23 March 3, 2008 I just took some codeine...i don't know much of anything right now. ___________________________________________ meow I get a Mike hug! I get a Mike hug! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
lawrocket 3 #24 March 3, 2008 Quotecan we really know anybody? No. Not any more than we can really know ourselves. This goes back to Socrates. The Oracle at Delphi told his friend that nobody was wiser than he was. He didn't think he was wise so he went about asking the leaders and intelligencia questions and discovered them to be ignorant. His wisdom was in knowing he was unwise, thus being the only person in Greece who was truly self-aware. TS Eliot, however, is being ridiculous. We are not strangers every second. Our being reflects how we react to changes in the environment. My wife is hotter than your wife. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skybytch 259 #25 March 3, 2008 QuoteWe are not strangers every second. Our being reflects how we react to changes in the environment. Does our environment define us? Or do we define our environment? If we are not strangers every second, then we would never change. I am no longer the person who made the decisions that have put me where I am today. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
