Risk-taking and brain chemistry

[crwper 7]

I had heard that there was a connection in scientific literature between risk-taking behaviour and low serotonin activity in the brain. I had also heard that it is not, in fact, adrenaline which we are chiefly after, but rather dopamine. I found what looks like a fairly good introductory article here, for those that are interested:

http://www.nlada.org/DMS/Documents/1066920620.52/serotonin.pdf

The quote below is from the article:

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A profoundly important excitatory role of serotonin in the brain is its positive effect on the release of dopamine, a natural brain chemical that produces normal drives and rewards (pleasure) for behaviors including eating, love and sex, plus reduced stress and a general sense of well-being. Dopamine is critical for survival. Individuals with dopamine deficiencies due to genetic abnormalities and/or deficient serotonin activity in the brain may be virtually incapable of experiencing normal positive rewards. These people are at high risk of becoming addicted to substances and behaviors that produce unnatural rewards. This is not mere conjecture. It is firmly established in the scientific literature that dopamine activity in the brain is enhanced by alcohol, cocaine, methamphetamine, heroin, nicotine, marijuana, and by compulsive activities including risktaking behaviors.

I'm inclined not to take these things too seriously, but I am interested because it seems to offer some insight into our behaviour, and what binds our diverse community together.

Michael

[LouDiamond 1]

Do a search on type T personalities. This research has actually been around for quite some time now.

"It's just skydiving..additional drama is not required"
Some people dream about flying, I live my dream
SKYMONKEY PUBLISHING

[Sean621 0]

also try looking up mono oxy aminase

http://www.extreme-on-demand.com

[nicknitro71 0]

Also look up under BS.

Memento Audere Semper

903

[crwper 7]

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also try looking up mono oxy aminase

Or, perhaps, mono-amine oxidase?

Michael

[crwper 7]

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Also look up under BS.

Care to expand on this?

Michael

[leroydb 0]

http://www.wordspy.com/words/typeTpersonality.asp

Leroy


..I knew I was an unwanted baby when I saw my bath toys were a toaster and a radio...

[nicknitro71 0]

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Care to expand on this?

No, it'll take forever.

Bottom line is that you cannot make a direct link between molecules and behavior like popular science loves to do. Behavior reflects the complexity of the mind hence many, many phenomena at any level must be accounted for not just molecules.

All sensation seeking theories have major flaws and empirical data are lacking. This is something I would love getting into when I am done with my current line of research.

Memento Audere Semper

903

[klapaucius 0]

Abstracts of a few medical papers about psychological and physiological aspects of skydiving

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?cmd=Retrieve&db=pubmed&dopt=Abstract&list_uids=15446632&query_hl=3

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?cmd=Retrieve&db=pubmed&dopt=Abstract&list_uids=14738370&query_hl=3

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?cmd=Retrieve&db=pubmed&dopt=Abstract&list_uids=12827126&query_hl=3

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?cmd=Retrieve&db=pubmed&dopt=Abstract&list_uids=10378229&query_hl=3

[JaapSuter 0]

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...when I am done with my current line of research.

What's that? The effects of shark-cuddle sessions to improve spaghetti digestion?

For those that didn't know, NickNitro71 is a neuroscientist, so he occasionally knows what he's talking about. Don't let him fool you into believing he's Italian though.

[nicknitro71 0]

I'm Dutch through and through. Van Rugai my last name is...

Memento Audere Semper

903

[base736 0]

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Bottom line is that you cannot make a direct link between molecules and behavior like popular science loves to do.

[sarcasm]

I'm with you, man. My wife, who's a paramedic, claims to have seen people whose behaviour was altered by -- get this -- high levels of blood alcohol, or low levels of blood sugar. As if molecules can be closely correlated with particular behaviours...

[/sarcasm]

Seriously, though... While I respect that you may have a basis in mind for your statement, what you've said is clearly so broad as to be completely unsupported by the facts. If you have references, though, I'd love to read them.

[NickDG 23]

I've met a lot of BASE jumpers, and there's nothing I've noticed that psychologically binds them together. There are too many different types of BASE jumpers. There are the up for anything types that are plain brave, there are the up for anything types that are plain stupid. There are the ones who are loud and obnoxious, and the ones who say little without great prompting. There are the ones who live in the moment and the ones who live in a lifetime of moments. There are the studied and the unstudied. There are the mean, the sweet, the male and the female. We are law-abiding and sometimes not so law-abiding.

There are the young and firm ones and old and infirm ones. There are the ones who promote the sport and the ones who promote themselves. There are the ones hostile to any authority, and some who are ready to go along with anything. Some proclaim their individuality and go about their jumping alone and some proclaim their individuality and jump with a crew. Some travel the world and some never leave their own backyard. There are the very presentable BASE jumpers and the ones you wouldn't bring anywhere near your parents.

Being at a large gathering of BASE jumpers, like Bridge Day, is like being at any sizeable convention. You'll find no one type of behavior or personality, what you will find is a cross section of people, humans all, who are (mostly) just trying to have a little fun in this thing we call life . . .

NickD BASE 194

[crwper 7]

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No, it'll take forever.

It's been my experience that this usually means, "Actually, I don't have a clear answer to your question." Perhaps you're underestimating your audience.

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Bottom line is that you cannot make a direct link between molecules and behavior like popular science loves to do. Behavior reflects the complexity of the mind hence many, many phenomena at any level must be accounted for not just molecules.

As has already been pointed out, I think it's pretty obvious that molecules can have a profound and consistent effect on behaviour.

Behaviour is a combination of many phenomena, but it doesn't mean that each of the parts doesn't contribute to the whole. Nobody's saying that when you're drunk you're at the mercy of the alcohol in your blood stream. But it would be foolish to argue that blood alcohol has no impact on behaviour.

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All sensation seeking theories have major flaws and empirical data are lacking.

Maybe you can elaborate on the major flaws. I am very much interested in exploring this question, and it's really frustrating when someone offers an opinion, but won't deign to offer an explanation as well.

Michael

[yexotay 0]

there is actually a psychologist studying BASE jumpers right now and how their IQ and Personalities relate to each other and if it is possible to put a label on the type of personality. Mostly very neurotic and smart.

[KevinMcGuire 0]

There have been way too many intelligent responses to this post and frankly I'm sick of it. Wheres Skin when we need him?

[klapaucius 0]

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No, it'll take forever.

Behaviour is a combination of many phenomena, but it doesn't mean that each of the parts doesn't contribute to the whole. Nobody's saying that when you're drunk you're at the mercy of the alcohol in your blood stream. But it would be foolish to argue that blood alcohol has no impact on behaviour.

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All sensation seeking theories have major flaws and empirical data are lacking.

Maybe you can elaborate on the major flaws. I am very much interested in exploring this question, and it's really frustrating when someone offers an opinion, but won't deign to offer an explanation as well.

Michael

There is something in the four papers I listed above:
there are some common personality traits among the experienced participants.

In reductionist simplicity, the four papers present experienced skydivers as "cool, calm, and collected" who (partially by the virtue of their "coolness, calmness, and collectedness" ) may need a bigger kick to bring a broad smile on their face.

It is all obviously related to serotonin, dopamine, epinephrine, norepinephrine, cortisol, just to name a few hormones involved, but the details ARE murky.

Interestingly, cortisol levels were lower than reference before the jump, even though they usually go up under stress.

Unfortunately, testosterone levels remain low...

[crwper 7]

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There is something in the four papers I listed above

I had a look at the abstracts, but not the articles. I'm working on getting the articles themselves now.

Michael

[lifewithoutanet 0]

I know it's not the same, but maybe Abbie will grace us with his presence. I've put him on notice to get back to non-sensical posting and frankly, I think he's falling short of his commitment.
-C.

[RhondaLea 3]

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Wheres Skin when we need him?

He has nine days to go, more's the pity.

rl

[WrongWay 0]

I'm not sure if this has been posted cuz I didn't look through the whole thread...but check out the DVD of Adrenaline Rush. It explains the whole thing, and has some cool freefly/BASE footage too.

Wrong Way
D #27371 Mal Manera Rodriguez Cajun Chicken Ø Hellfish #451
The wiser wolf prevails.

[nicknitro71 0]

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I'm with you, man. My wife, who's a paramedic, claims to have seen people whose behaviour was altered by -- get this -- high levels of blood alcohol, or low levels of blood sugar. As if molecules can be closely correlated with particular behaviours...

I am currently teaching psychopharmachology. Psychoactive drugs do induce behavioral changes but you misunderstood my point.

Popular science suggests or sometimes even dictates that some natural occurring chemicals like some neurotransmitters or enzymes that break them down are responsible for certain behaviors. This is not correct or at least it does not give the full picture.

I think NickDG summarized the picture quite well and he came to the same conclusions that I did without empirical data: There is not a personality type that fits all BASE jumpers (the pinnacle of sensation seekers if you asked me) and stating that BASE jumpers have low or high levels of this neurotransmitters or that enzyme is just a shot in the dark at best.

The reason those papers upset me so much is the fact that they oversimplify the brain/mind that I so admire for its complexity. When I got into Neuroscience about 10 years ago I thought things were cool and everything made some sense “Oh cool this structure does this...this neurotransmitter does that…this circuitry is responsible for such…” After a decade in the field I am more confused than ever and I can barely grasp some of the phenomena and processes the mind is able to achieve.

We have tons of experimental data but the field as a whole is lacking solid theories like the ones for Sensation Seeking.

The thing is… it is hard to get grants just by wanting to play with theories…empirical data must be provided…so now we have this big pot of data that nobody knows how to interpret it or glue it together to come up with some solid conceptualizations.

Memento Audere Semper

903

[JaapSuter 0]

Hey Nick, do you have any thoughts on Jeff Hawkin's work?

[nicknitro71 0]

I know the name I am not familiar with his work.

Memento Audere Semper

903

[nicrussell 0]

A little more work and that could be a great poem. jk.

However if you took a cross section of ALL the people at bridgeday (spectators and jumpers) I would think you could find something more in common with all the jumpers compared to all the spectators. Not an absolut, but probably a tendency toward risk adrenaline.

nic