falxori

So you equate "radial Muslim" to "Jews" (which were the target in the original quote)? your entire debate on based on this flawed comparison. No one suggested "hunting" Muslims in general... "Carpe diem, quam minimum credula postero."

I just understand why he would be more pissed about this than the rest of the people here and why he would want to disassociate himself with what they represent. O "Carpe diem, quam minimum credula postero."

well said "Carpe diem, quam minimum credula postero."

It seems as though someone found the solution to the Israeli-Palestinian problem. I had to watch it a few times and I still can't believe such idiots exist... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nDqWGtykYNE&feature=player_embedded "Carpe diem, quam minimum credula postero."

and jordan. that's two. with all due respect, your posts show how little you understand about Israel, the Palestinians and the events taking place in the middle east. you make points, back them with examples. admit your examples are irrelevant and make more points which are not backed up by anything. go open an history book. "Carpe diem, quam minimum credula postero."

agreed. yes, i'm awsome "Carpe diem, quam minimum credula postero."

There are as many opinions as there are Israelis. I think the only statement I can make is that the majority of Israelis are willing to part with parts of their historic homeland if they get peace in return. the shift you see every few years is mostly due to whether or not Israelis feel they will actually get peace in return. take Gaza for exampls. most Israelis supported pulling out of Gaza because they were hoping the PA will finally show they can take control and govern themselves. at that point, most Israelis looked at Gaza as an experiment and people were already talking about doing the same in the west bank. after Hamas took power and rockets kept flying out of Gaza, many people saw this trial as a failure and are very worried about what will happen in the west bank (which is much closer to major Israeli cities). so, mainstream israelis are willing to give up a lot (which is not trivial) but the problem is that whenever Israel pulled out, it got more violence. "Carpe diem, quam minimum credula postero."

what you are doing is taking something and twisting it to make it sound racist. there several roads in the west bank which are closed for Palestinians after many drive by shootings against Israeli cars. there are also a LOT more roads which are for Palestinians only and are closed to Israelis for the same security reasons. I can't go in Ramallah or Nablus as an Israeli. according to your logic, the Israeli governemt is racist because I can't go there. I know you truely believe in what you say but be open to the option that these restrictions (which go both ways) are (justified) security measures and have nothing to do with religion or race. "Carpe diem, quam minimum credula postero."

so again I will tell you that that is not the base of this conflict. this conflict is about land. it is not a religious war (although some try to turn it into one because it would be benefit them to have 1B muslims against Israel). You keep repeating this mantra of "the chosen people". Jewish history and rights in this land are not because the bible says so. its because we have roots and a proven history that goes back thousands of years. I'm not saying the Palestinians have no claim here and let's not go down the "who was here first" debate because its irrelevant for any solution. again, this is not a "race" war, this is not a faith war. its a land dispute. "Carpe diem, quam minimum credula postero."

Yes, but it is not the rulling law in Israel these days. it was suitable for biblical times. many aspects of it are relevant today but most are not. "Carpe diem, quam minimum credula postero."

while I appreciate you not comparing this conflict to te holocaust (which you have done in the past), you are also wrong about the "philosophy" as you call it. the conflict between Israel and the Palestinians is a bitter conflict about land, like most wars in history. its long and bitter, but its a dispute over land. the holocaust was not about land, it was about exterminaton of an entire nation regardless of anything else. I hope you see the difference. "Carpe diem, quam minimum credula postero."

and lest we forget that Israel is a democacy and that Israeli arabs which are ~20% of the population are citizens with the same civil rights. Palestinians in Gaza and the west bank are not Israeli citizens , they are PA citizens. the analogy to SA is stupid and irrelevant. "Carpe diem, quam minimum credula postero."

I just hope he's not protesting against the government in Iran... "Carpe diem, quam minimum credula postero."

your whole post was about Gaza. now that you've reached a dead end you want to change it? fine. the exact israeli border in the west bank is yet to be set by negotiations (and not for lack of trying). there is no official recognized borders. the general belief is that Israel should pull out from the west bank. this is also the view of most Israelis. problem is that it can't do it unless there is someone who can take control over there. judging from what happened in Gaza when Israel pulled out, doing so without an agreement will lead to another terroristic entity which will not be a good thing for anybody. "Carpe diem, quam minimum credula postero."

as far as Gaza goes. exactly. "Carpe diem, quam minimum credula postero."

Thank you, but no. Israel has about 20% muslim citizens and they have the exact same civil rights as any other citizens (beside the duty to serve in the military). the Palestinians in the west bank and Gaza are not Israeli citizens, they are citizens of the Palestinian Authority, which should/could have been a Palestinian state by now. "Carpe diem, quam minimum credula postero."

such as existing? you do know that Israel has not been in Gaza for years, right? When Israel pulled out, the Palestinians could have taken the opportunity and prove they can make it on their own. instead they kept firing and then Hamas took over and things became really crappy. "Carpe diem, quam minimum credula postero."

Then you don't know Israel, Israelis and what they believe in. there is no way to completely avoid hurting civilians when Hamas hides behind them. what should Israel do? no fire back when being fired upon? I meant the Hamas government in Gaza which declared open war on Israel. funny you don't say the people in Gaza "own their government and their government's mistakes". double standards again? "Carpe diem, quam minimum credula postero."

no, it claims that it is not an effective measure. effectiveness is not binary and while I agree with some of the points, I completely disagree with others. just to make a point (not comparing the two). should the US stop patrolling it southern border? illegal immigrant still flow in, so its not effective. so why bother? I'm really not. Israel is doing its best to abide by it. it's kind of hard when facing an enemy which: fires from civilian buildings, hides explosives in schools and mosques, doesn't distinguish itself from civilian population by wearing uniforms and constantly targeting civilians in Israel. all of which are prerequisites to the Geneva convention parts protecting civilians. you can't fire from a school and then expect it to be protected as a civilian structure. if you use your own civilians as human shields, it is you who violates the rules of engagement and turned your civilians into targets. its not a punitive measure. its a result of the actions of their (elected?) government "Carpe diem, quam minimum credula postero."

this article is a repetitive opinion on whether or not it is effective and to what extent. there is no "data" to counter. the simple fact remains. as lomg as Gaza is goverened by a terroristic entity that wages war against it. Israel has every right not to supply Gaza with anything. having said that, Israel does allow for supplies to go in and you're forgetting the pretty long border between Gaza and Egypt. where is your rage against the egyptians? whether the blockade is effective or not? in some ways it is, in some ways it isn't. it still doesn't mean Israel should keep an open border with someone who is constantly attacking it. "Carpe diem, quam minimum credula postero."

I simply don't agree with what is said in the article. the fact that they manage to smuggle rockets through tunnels is only an indication of what and how many they would have got if they could get them freely. btw, if Hamas can smuggle rockets so easily, why don't they smuggle some food instead. just so you know, food supplies are going into Gaza, almost always these shipments are captured by Hamas who takes care of its own people first. "Carpe diem, quam minimum credula postero."

not 100%. but it has limitted Hamas' supply of more advanced weapons. again, there is no reason on earth for israel to provide supplies to someone who is trying to destroy it. yeap, too bad Hamas doesn't really believe in negotiations. "Carpe diem, quam minimum credula postero."

and since you depend so much on official borders. the west bank was Jordanian and the Gaza Strip was Egyptian. there were never "Palestinian". neither Jordan nor Egypt want these lands back (can't blame them...) so if you really want to follow the "law", who is the owner now? but, that's a theoretic discussion that would lead nowhere. just making a note that your claim about "occupation" is not as solid as you think. "Carpe diem, quam minimum credula postero."

no, their actions indicate that they defending themselves against ongoing attacks. lets take you oversimplifying approach. let's say the 1967 borders are the answer. what then? just pull out? did you see what happened in Gaza after Israel just pulled out? Hamas, backed by Iran took control, violently kicked the PA out and continued to shoot rockets over the borders when there was not a single Israeli in Gaza. you simple solutions are nice for the forums. they do not work in real life. "Carpe diem, quam minimum credula postero."

and what do you know about what Israelis wants? if you're still talking about the 1947 plans, it was kinda hard to "just exist" when you are attacked by 6 armies at once. you need to understand that what you see as "occupied", Israeli's (as well as Palestinians) see as their homeland. the problem is that both sides see the same land as their homeland. its not like occopying a remote territory like in colonial times. anyway, most Israelis are willing to part with parts of what they consider to be their homeland since the only viable solution is to divide the land. sadly, it takes two to make this move. "Carpe diem, quam minimum credula postero."