flyingferret 0 #1 February 8, 2002 I know I am about to start a flame war. But I am pretty new to freeflying and want your opinions. I have about 125 jumps, most of which have been belly to earth. Well, now for various reasons, I plan on putting most of my time into freeflying, eventually to evolve into just plain 'flying' in all attitiudes. Anyway, I would like to learn whatever I can so:a) what books would you recommend to read? (I already saw Zennie's comment on The Art of vRW)b) what are the thoughts about RSL? I have been seriously considering removing mine anyway. Now that I am freeflying, I am thinking more about it.Malachi Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
freeflir29 0 #2 February 8, 2002 I don't see that an RSL is any differen't in Free Flying except that you must make sure that you don't have any of the line hanging out. Tuck it in!! It's very improbable that it would catch enough air to deploy your reserve but why take the chance....."I only have 125 jumps, so I don't know shit..right?"-Clay Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mountainman 0 #3 February 8, 2002 the RSL debate has been beaten to death and then drug around town from the back of Slappie's truck...and then AggieDave's truck.I was thinking about it yesterday and thought that I will keep my RSL until I have a cutaway. If I actually pulled the cutaway AND the reserve handle by myself, then I'll lose the RSL. If I pulled the first and then panicked, then I'll keep the RSL. Seems like it is a good idea until you know that you'll pull both.Thoughts?JumpinDuo.com...come and sign the guestbook. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
flyingferret 0 #4 February 8, 2002 I just meant that malfunction could be more high speed in freeflying or the people around you might be approaching faster. I don't know, it just made sense to me. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
MarkM 0 #5 February 8, 2002 Quotethe RSL debate has been beaten to death and then drug around town from the back of Slappie's truck...and then AggieDave's truck.Hmm, actually I've never heard this debate before. Is the issue that the RSL tag might catch air and cause a premature reserve deployment? Could definately see how that would be a Bad Thing. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
freeflir29 0 #6 February 8, 2002 "Is the issue that the RSL tag might catch air"No...not the tag......the lanyard. I have found mine kind of hanging out before. Although it isn't attached to anything I still don't want stuff flapping. Plus....just like a reserve R/C it could catch on something with disastrous results. "I only have 125 jumps, so I don't know shit..right?"-Clay Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
LawnDart21 0 #7 February 8, 2002 As a skysurfer, freeflier & videographer, I can personally argue that there are more scenarios that I might encounter that I would not want an RSL versus the few times that I might actually want it, so I elected to not have an RSL on my rig. The simplest explanation solution I can offer is "as a general rule, if you are asking whether or not you need an RSL, you probably do need one." I don't say that at all as a flame, just an honest observation. People jumping without an RSL do so by choice, and if your not ready to make a choice, it's probably better you have it and not need it than need it and not have it. Eventaully you'll get the jump numbers in and your experience level (and your confidence level too) will grow and you'll be able to make a well informed (based on personal experiences) decisions on whether to jump with one or not. Not having one certainly provides a higher degree of control for the jumper, as you are in control of the reserve deployment seperately from the cutaway, the flip side though, is that now you have twice as much work to do in an emergency. I'd say talk with as many expeirenced jumpers at your DZ as you can, they'll certainly have good info for you."I live to EFS"Tom Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
MarkM 0 #8 February 8, 2002 QuoteNo...not the tag......the lanyard. I have found mine kind of hanging out before. Although it isn't attached to anything I still don't want stuff flapping. Plus....just like a reserve R/C it could catch on something with disastrous resultsAhh k, got it. Probably will be more of an issue when freeflying with others, goofing off and tossing each other around. I'll keep it in mind when I get to that level. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skymedic 0 #9 February 8, 2002 Quotethe flip side though, is that now you have twice as much work to do in an emergency.Isn't one of the first things that students are told is do NOT trust your equipment.....so the above really doesn't apply here...as you can't truly trust the rsl to work for you...just like a cypress...in the end it is up to you to do the dirty work...marc"...a mind stretched with new idea's will never regain its shape" Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
airann 1 #10 February 9, 2002 When you have a cutaway and shyt is moving really fast..... ( I was spinning outta control with G forces nearly holding my arms down) .... you never think about RSL on or off.My cut away was radical, the only way it would have been worse is if I had been on my back. My RSL was still attached. Jump 81 or 118 or something like that. I did pull both handles with both hands as I was taught. I think- I beat my RSL. It could very well happen. After that I did not take it off till I started jumping camera, only because I didnt really think about it. http://www.AirAnn.comUgly Girl #6 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skymedic 0 #11 February 9, 2002 exactly what I said....right???marc"...a mind stretched with new idea's will never regain its shape" Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
FreeflyGoat 0 #12 February 9, 2002 Hi Ann :)You can't beat your RSL unless you pull both handles at the same time. I thought I did but afterwards I found that I shurely did'nt.Goat aka Dereck aka SuperFreakAD A#292 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
FreeflyGoat 0 #13 February 9, 2002 I took mine off when it made a very direct effort at trying to kill me. It deployed my reserve way before I would have prefered it to deploy. You dont think about disconnecting it during a high speed malfunction.I think they are great for the inexperienced skydiver who may have a greater tendency to panic in an emergency situation. But for the experienced skydiver who has handled situations before I think it has more disadvantages.Goat aka Dereck aka SuperFreakAD A#292 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
apoil 0 #14 February 10, 2002 QuoteI think they are great for the inexperienced skydiver who may have a greater tendency to panic in an emergency situation. But for the experienced skydiver who has handled situations before I think it has more disadvantages.Nice of you to offer that opinion. I'm guessing it's based on your study of the facts at hand, which include many experienced jumpers going in each year from cutting away too low and hardly any going in as a result of their RSL functioning improperly? I Didn't think so. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
airann 1 #15 February 10, 2002 Goat, I still think I either beat my RSL or nearly beat it...Dude, I was in a serious hurry to get away from a satan canopy! And it just felt like it. Point is it doesnt really matter.I believe that the main idea is to forget about it. Its not suposed to be a back up - in your mind. -(For those students who read this)So as far as anyone knows I beat my RSL...BEWAAAFFFHHhttp://www.AirAnn.comUgly Girl #6 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
airann 1 #16 February 10, 2002 And about photo ops for this weekend... Levin couldnt come down...POOT.. so it wouldnt have been complete without Levin. (when there is a girl involved it always messes stuff up) -Go Levin!!- ...so anyway he didnt get much sleep. On top of that there is slight weather this morning. But it looks like Dallas for Levin and I this weekend -(I may be there during the week for business or not) but still I think we go. Depending on weather. So heads up Goat & Deva. LOLWe have some cool ass plans for May/June/July target frame. Levin is selling his ultralight and getting a better one and I am going to buy an RV. Since I dont have a car note, I really need a a motor home to pull Levins Ultralight around and to take breaks in from my hectic skydiving schedule. Sounds good to me. I especially like the part about the mini plastic pool on top with lawnchairs and little drinks with umbrellas in them. Maybe someday the back of my motor home will look like Scottys van with skydiving stickers all over it from every state. I really will be seeing all the dz.com people then. Watch out.....http://www.AirAnn.comUgly Girl #6 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
WmLauterbach 0 #17 February 10, 2002 i can only think of a few times when it is WISE to disconnect your RSL...1) cRW2) board flying3) flying a camera4) flying a tube or similar 'trailer'If a jumper is doing anything else, an RSL may accidently save his/her life. As for saying the lanyard flapping around while freeflying could deploy a reserve, thats just an excuse to unhook it. A jumper dont need an 'excuse' to disconnect an RSL... just because its there it dont have to be used. People all over the world spend hundreds of dollars on AAD's then dont even turn them on...If you are doing AFF and have a bad student, it (along with your reserve RC) could get pulled while trying to get him/her stable. If you are doing RW, and the formation funnels, your rig could get deployed when a stray appendage catches something. Strange things happen to skydivers, that why the center cell on the topskin of your canopy has that funny little orange warning tag..... The easiest way to avoid problems is to check your gear...When was the last time someone got a pin check before opening the door?When was the last time another jumper checked your gear before boarding... to make sure your kill-line was cocked, deployment sytems stowed properly, RSL LANYARD PROPERLY ASSEMBLED AND STOWED.... I am in the military so we 'over-safe' everything... but because we oversafe everything, having someone check my pins doesnt seem like that big a deal.... Having someone give me a thumbs up and make sure my cypress is on before I board doesnt seem like undue hassle.... If everything is rigged like it is meant to be rigged, there is no eason to worry... anything after that simply can be settled by reading the little orange panel on the tail of the canopy... Even the most well designed "freefly" rig can and will have a premature deployment if bridles arent stowed, riser covers arent closed, velcro isnt mated, and the jumpers brain isnt in freefall with the jumper..... of course thats just my opinion...... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
FreeflyGoat 0 #18 February 11, 2002 I studied the subject for weeks before I made my decision. I also based my decision on the fact that I'd pulled the reserve handle myself twice before I chose to take it off.Goat aka Dereck aka SuperFreakAD A#292 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
WmLauterbach 0 #19 February 11, 2002 I thought in your post you said it deployed your reserve "before" you wanted it to? I am confused... did it fail and you had to pull the res RC your self? Please explain, this could be a good teaching point/example for other jumpers....thanks, Billy Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
harro 0 #20 February 12, 2002 I have had a double mal due to RSL. At the moment I dont have any option for I cant afford a cypress!!. Keep it tucked in !Freemind, freesky, freebeer, freefly, freesex Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
freeflir29 0 #21 February 12, 2002 "When was the last time someone got a pin check before opening the door?When was the last time another jumper checked your gear before boarding... to make sure your kill-line was cocked, deployment sytems stowed properly, RSL LANYARD PROPERLY ASSEMBLED AND STOWED...."Yesterday.........."I only have 131 jumps, so I don't know shit..right?"-Clay Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
WmLauterbach 0 #22 February 12, 2002 OK.... OK.... fess up.....who else got a pin check this weekend!I didnt....(winds, didnt jump)blue skies Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
AggieDave 6 #23 February 12, 2002 You have to ask, man. People won't just check it out of the blue, unless there is something really obviously wrong. i.e. your risers are hooked up, etc.Of all the things I've lost, I miss my mind the most. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
