motion 0 #1 January 30, 2003 As you know, I'm new to the sport, but am learning lots by lurking around here... and getting new info that is potentially worrysome to me. I have a J4 container with a Sabre 190 main. BOC with hackey. My solo jumps are mostly freefly, with head-down dives, sit-flying, and just general screwing around with barrel rolls, flips, etc. Am I asking for trouble with my container? Is it freefly friendly? I've already had the gruesome experience of deploying immediately after coming out of a 30 second head down dive and never, never want to repeat that. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
AggieDave 6 #2 January 30, 2003 Basically, for a container to be considered FF safe, it needs to just be a rock solid rig: riser covers that stay closed, main flap and reserve flaps that stay closed, BOC that is secure (not wore out), good bridle protection, etc. I honestly can't think of a semi-modern rig (thinking of rigs I've seen from the mid-80s too) that isn't safe for RW per design. Now, an older rig may just be generally unsafe, but that's between you and your rigger. The biggest thing to look at with a J4 is that your flaps are still in good condition, so they won't come open on you and that the spandex BOC is in very good shape. If you have doubts, take it to your rigger and he/she will be able to tell you steps that need to be taken to make sure you're safe in the air.--"When I die, may I be surrounded by scattered chrome and burning gasoline." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mattb 0 #3 January 30, 2003 How did you acquire your gear? I hope I don't sound too rude in saying that you should have asked before buying and a good dealer should have recognized that you were a new jumper and could use suggestions. If its a late model Javelin and been well maintained it's probably freefly friendly. What happened to cause the premature deployment, or don't you know? If you have questions about if your gear is safe please ask an instructor or experienced jumper BEFORE experimenting. Oh my god - I'm turning into a gear nazi. I really need to get a job that keeps me occupied and off these forums. Matt Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PhreeZone 15 #4 January 30, 2003 I do ask why at under 40 jumps you are doing headdown. Unless you have a coach going over things with you I'd recommend mastering the sit before moving on to head down. In a head down you can very easly slide and move and unless your awareness is super high you can slide into the airspace or other groups. I'm just getting to the point at 450 jumps that I'm aware of where my group is in relation to the exit point and other groups in the air.Yesterday is history And tomorrow is a mystery Parachutemanuals.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skybytch 259 #5 January 30, 2003 You don't give us quite enough information to really answer your question. Was your "deploying immediately" experience a premature deployment (i.e. you didn't pull anything) or did you not slow down before dumping? If it was a premature deployment, was it the main or the reserve? If it was the main, have you had the BOC pocket replaced since? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
motion 0 #6 January 30, 2003 Sorry for not being complete... it was my fault. Deployed without scrubbing off speed first. Very hard opening complete with 2 black thighs for a good 3 weeks . I've learned that lesson and won't repeat it. My J4 is about 9 years old and has about 70 jumps on it. Everything is in new condition and its been gone through by a great rigger (based on referrals). Spandex on BOC is in good condition and very tight. Based on what I hear, it sounds like I'm ok? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
hookitt 0 #7 January 30, 2003 Sounds like it' might just be fine. Has a bridle cover been added to the bottom of the container? I have to add that Lots of Freestyle moves (flips and spinny things) and Sit flying is Much better than Flying on your head for the time being. (i'm too tired to go into why) 9 years ago, the Tuck Flaps were made much different than they are today. People have been known to put Bath Tub Grip Tape on the Tuck flaps of the Riser covers and the Main pin cover flap. Naturally I can't officially recommend that. :)My grammar sometimes resembles that of magnetic refrigerator poetry... Ghetto Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
lippy 773 #8 January 31, 2003 QuotePeople have been known to put Bath Tub Grip Tape on the Tuck flaps of the Riser covers and the Main pin cover flap.Care to explain this a little further? I can't picture what you're saying here. Maybe I'm just slow though.I got nuthin Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Albatross 0 #9 January 31, 2003 On a Javelin or Infinity the flap comes down over the pin and then a tuck tab goes back up under to keep it closed. Some people add rubber grip tape to the tab to create more friction of the tab against the main compartment to keep the tab from slipping out. It shouln't be needed if the container fits the main.Chris Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
hookitt 0 #10 January 31, 2003 QuoteIt shouln't be needed if the container fits the main. Thanks you beat me to it. *shouldn't* is the key word there. The Javelin in question, is 9 years old and was not built to the tighter standards of today. Don't take that wrong, the 9 year old Jav's were still kick ass. But back then it was common knowledge that you only could reach speeds of "Up To 200 MPH" in a head down. (that was said just for nostalgia) Other than belly to earth positions, weren't a consideration when that rig was originally made. but look at how close they got the first try! Countless videos show the riser flaps and main pin cover flap open even on properly matched parachute and containers. edit: spellingMy grammar sometimes resembles that of magnetic refrigerator poetry... Ghetto Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 2,407 #11 January 31, 2003 >Difference between freefly and bellyflying container? The difference SHOULD be that a freeflying container/reserve is designed and tested up to freefly speeds (say, 200+ mph.) In reality, all a 'freefly' container means is that it has good pin covers, good bridle protection and a legstrap link. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
riggerrob 558 #12 February 2, 2003 I suspect that your blackened thighs were caused by a loose harness. If the leg pads are snug up against your crotch, they will not slip far enough to slap you. Ask your rigger to check your harness size. The best short term fix may be to install an inexpensive free-fly bungee. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
riggerrob 558 #13 February 2, 2003 Here comes a history lesson. The difference between a freefly container and a belly-flying container is a question of when it was designed. Newer designs can be used for all the older disciplines and - as long as they are well maintained - many belly-flying contaieners can be used for freeflying. Over the years, design influences have included: military surplus PEP, style and accuracy. ten-way speed stars, sequential RW, canopy formations, free style, sit flying, head down, bird man suits, etc. All these generations have contributed to harness/container design safety. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
