PhreeZone 15 #51 December 27, 2002 Seeing as your profile is empty and the last info I could find on you was from last year, what is this great canopy?Yesterday is history And tomorrow is a mystery Parachutemanuals.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Treejumps 0 #52 December 27, 2002 A VX. I've had it a year and really love flying it at the ground. Swooping it is close to the rush of a low pressure base jump. Cya Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DutchSkyCam 0 #53 December 27, 2002 Brian, Since the word bracing is used in two different ways and most people are just talking about one aspect of bracing I wanted to know how both relate in this design (pure theory). I am not saying the Onyx is worse nor saying it is better. I would like to fly one and find out. I also mentioned I am not an expert, was just trying to explain the way I uderstand X-bracing MYSELF. Just draw a cross section (spanwise) of the parachute and draw the way forces are distributed. In the Onyx there is no direct way of bracing the non-loadbearing rib. I have never seen an Onyx fly (that is only partially true). On the first message in this tread they attached three photo's. Count the ribs from the topview (36) and count the ribs from the bottomview (18). I don't know what conclusion to draw from that information. at least not what it will do to performance. Finally, You are right, packing volume is also an issue. You are right, I have no supporting data, but since no supporting data is provided and this thread looks like a big marketing story of the parachute... Leaves me with little room to make supported conclusions. (But i explained quite clear how I came to the conclusion, (did I draw a conclusion???)). I need a new parachute before April and I was looking for either an FX, Velocity or XAos. Then this canopy came up. looks interesting. when can it be flown? Barry. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
indyz 1 #54 December 27, 2002 QuoteQuoteA canopy that can fly backwards or forwards would be innovative No, it would be pretty darn close to the holy grail. 180? No problem, just fly backward. Lew Sanborn was telling me about flying his canopy "in reverse" all the way to landing once. Something to do with a malfunction, maybe a PC over the nose. I think it was a Sharpchuter. Apparently in very deep brakes the canopy will go backwards but still fly well enough to steer and land without major injuries. Paragliders can do something similar (maybe not landable), and even fly one side backwards and the other forwards to do a wicked helicopter move. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ernokaikkonen 0 #55 December 27, 2002 Quote Lew Sanborn was telling me about flying his canopy "in reverse" all the way to landing once. Something to do with a malfunction, maybe a PC over the nose. Are you sure the canopy wasn't accidentally hooked up backwards? I've heard of a few people landing their canopies that way.... Quote Apparently in very deep brakes the canopy will go backwards but still fly well enough to steer and land without major injuries. That would have to be a really big canopy. Then again Sharpchuters are. I've seen CRew-doggies "fly" their canopies backwards, but that's definitely NOT landable, it's more like a controlled stall. Maybe MR. Sanborn had balls big enough to stall his canopy all the way to the ground?A parachute that flies equally well forwards and backwards hasn't been invented yet. Unless you want to jump rounds. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
freeflir29 0 #56 December 27, 2002 QuoteI think it was a Sharpchuter I could be wrong but I'm pretty sure that's a "parafoil" accuracy canopy. I believe they will "back up" a little in full brakes. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
IMGR2 0 #57 December 29, 2002 Well this canopy IS a prototype at this time and it doesn't look like it will be hitting the market very soon. If I'm not mistaken Dan will be at the PIA Symposium in Florida and you can take a closer look at the Onyx and ask as many questions as you can. I am hoping to be there myself. I apologize if this seems like a marketing ploy. I believe both Dan, myself and anyone else associated with canopy manufacturing would wait until they are ready to deliver before they try to market something. My intention is just to let the public know what is going on in the research of canopies. Not looking to start something like the Vapor camera helmet. LotsOLove Bryan Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
freeflir29 0 #58 December 29, 2002 Quote Not looking to start something like the Vapor camera helmet So you're saying it WON'T take 16 months to get one after you order it...... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
IMGR2 0 #59 December 31, 2002 You mean to tell me somebody actually has one? ROFLMAO Bryan Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
pchapman 261 #60 December 31, 2002 Some posters here have gotten the Onyx cell configuration all figured out. To help in visualizing it, here's a quick sketch scanned into JPG of my interpretation. It shows a section of cells between line attachments. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
sdctlc 0 #61 December 31, 2002 Nice sketch, That is what I would guess the three designs would look like next to each other. Maybe the powers that be could give a little bit of a yeah or ney on the design guess... Scott I still dont think it is a 36 cell but if it flys better who cares!"He who Hesitates Shall Inherit the Earth!" Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
cobaltdan 0 #62 December 31, 2002 yeah, thats more or less it... as far as the 36 cell.check out the top skin picture again.with reference to the top skin it has 36 perfect sections with the lowest spanwise distortion ever seen. what would you call it? the fact that it has 18 divisions with regards to the bottom skin only means it has a lower pack volume. aerodynamically reducing bottom skin distortion effectively does nothing to improve performance. it is all about the top skin profile. HAPPY NEW YEAR EVERYONE ! dan<><>Daniel Preston <><> atairaerodynamics.com (sport) atairaerospace.com (military) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
sdctlc 0 #63 December 31, 2002 The canopy still seems to not be a 36 cell canopy in the terms of a design with equal # of cells noted on top and bottom. Who Cares! What I mean is that the terminology used to describe it is not important if the canopy performs better than what currently is out. If the performance is better, people will buy it! The design seems to be an "Internally Supported 9-cell canopy". Aerodynamically if you have a more efficient wing you are going to get more lift. That is what the "internal supports" are designed to do, my guess. Get better efficiency with a smother top skin by postponing the smooth airflow separation until slower speeds and/or further back on the airfoil. This should translate to more lift at slower speeds which will add to swooping distance and ability to shut down the canopy. I will be interested to see more feedback from people that have test jumpeed the canopy. It seems that there have been 3 or so now that have contributed their thoughts. Scott C."He who Hesitates Shall Inherit the Earth!" Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
pal 0 #64 January 2, 2003 Hey Dan you should be calling the COBALT an 18 cell Paul Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billdo 0 #65 January 18, 2003 QuoteHey Dan you should be calling the <>COBALT<> an 18 cell Paul That's totally what I was thinking! I hate when people tell me my regular Cobalt is no different than a Stilleto except for line trim. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
hookitt 0 #66 January 18, 2003 Quote That's totally what I was thinking! I hate when people tell me my regular Cobalt is no different than a Stilleto except for line trim. Does that Really happen? What ever Laughingly TimMy grammar sometimes resembles that of magnetic refrigerator poetry... Ghetto Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Rdutch 0 #67 January 20, 2003 Quote And how is the Sabre2 not leading up to PD's hype? I don't understand, what hype, and why the saber2? Ray Small and fast what every girl dreams of! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
