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DB Cooper

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(edited)
1 hour ago, FLYJACK said:

an orange and white nylon chute found in the river..

From my limited research it appears that most of the NB6 containers canopies supplied to the military were multi-color.

I've also read at several sites on the internet it was common practice to cut the parachute cords from the container before selling for salvage.  Although it appears you can still buy complete NB6 containers and canopies with military packing cards at Ebay.  The below one is a 1963 (est.) Pioneer NB6.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Vintage-US-Navy-NB-6-Parachute-Vietnam-Era-Still-Packed-with-Record-Card-USN-/323777041981?hash=item4b629d963d%3Ag%3A5eYAAOSwlY1ZIzoA&nma=true&si=jlTk9sHK4DSCvXhxbfqP5Nr36GY%3D&orig_cvip=true&nordt=true&rt=nc&_trksid=p2047675.l2557

The one sold at Ebay was manufactured about 1963 (packing card) it appears and the serial number is 87404.  The serial number on my Pioneer NB6 is 187204 and was manufactured in 1968.

If the Serial Numbers are sequential then Pioneer manufactured 99804 (close to 100 thousand) NB6's between 1963 and 1968.  During the height of the Vietnam war.

If Cossey was using a NB6 container where the cords had been cut to the original canopy he might have replaced with a white canopy.  I read that he had to stuff the 28 foot canopy into the container.  The original Canopy was also 28 foot in diameter.  So maybe the 28 foot canopy he "stuffed" into the container had a deeper concave to it because there was more material to pack.  The pictures of the supposive DB Cooper canopies I've seen on the internet do look to have more of a concave WW2 profile than the C-9 type canopies.

Bruce Smith interview with Cossey regarding "stuffed"...

"When I asked for a clarification on the story that he had stuffed a 28-foot canopy into an NB-6 rather than the larger NB-8 sack, he told me the stuffing story was “pretty much accurate.”  He later said that the tightly-packed rig was another reason why this chute – that Cooper allegedly used – was a hard pull."

 

 

Edited by Coopy

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Point of Order: 

Cossey has ALSO told media on several occasions, that the Amboy chute the FBI brought to his house was made of silk, and not nylon, and that this is the reason that it could not be Cooper's. 

This statement is patently FALSE. Pictures of the chute were released by the FBI and other chute experts have determined it was ripstop nylon. Why would Cossey say something that he knew was false? It is easy to determine the difference between between silk and nylon. You can do it with a Bic lighter in seconds, for example. 

In THIS ARTICLE from CBS, agent Larry Carr says the original chute used by Cooper was a 26-foot canopy, white, inside an NB-6 container. 

Cossey also told a Seattle reporter the same week the FBI brought this chute to him that it WAS Cooper's, and the reporter was almost fired. He was going to run the story and only when his boss decided to double check that it was discovered Cossey was playing a joke on him. Some joke. 

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2 hours ago, RobertMBlevins said:

In THIS ARTICLE from CBS, agent Larry Carr says the original chute used by Cooper was a 26-foot canopy, white, inside an NB-6 container. 

Yea, I have seen this 26 foot information.  Could he be talking about the length and not the diameter?

Shortly after the hijacking the FBI documented (as shown in a post by Flyjack) that Cossey said the parachute was Twenty Eight Foot and white.

Whatever the truth is.  Cossey seemed like a type of wise-guy prankster (somewhat shady) and did not take the request for parachutes as seriously as he should have.  Hijacker with bomb on plane saying no funny business??  I do not know if I want someone like Cossey packing a parachute for me.

Why didn't the FBI request parachutes from the Military?  Would have went much smoother and better documented.

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Coopy asks in part:

'Why didn't the FBI request parachutes from the Military?  Would have went much smoother and better documented...'

It could be because the FBI went to Northwest Airlines for advice on where to get them. We know it was NWA who made the phone calls. Cooper did think some of the chutes might come from McChord AFB though. When they delayed him on the money and chutes for a while with their phony refueling stuff, etc....Cooper said it was only a twenty minute drive between McChord and SeaTac Airport. At that time it was true. Maybe neither NWA or the Seattle FBI was willing to start bringing in the military, although they did it later with SAGE radar and the chase planes. 

All of this happened in the space of a few short hours, the evening before Thanksgiving. I understand everyone knows that, but it is important to remember the context. Cooper picked the best day you could, to pull off what he did. This one had a bit of planning to it. 

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18 hours ago, RobertMBlevins said:

Pictures of the chute were released by the FBI and other chute experts have determined it was ripstop nylon.  

 

Are you sure about that? I thought the debate was that it may be nylon as opposed to silk. But ripstop nylon would have been very easily identified, or so I thought. 

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(edited)
5 hours ago, FLYJACK said:

Thanks for the link to the podcast.  Kinda boring so far.

Do you know if there is a sideview/profile sketch of DB Cooper?

If memory serves correctly, Mucklow spent many hours sitting next to him.

Be nice if Mucklow could point out a real person that looks just like DB Cooper (maybe someone dead (permission from family) with several pictures for reference and even a video) to use as a reference for finding the real DB Cooper.  Sketches are very limited when compared to a photographs.

One can also use a photograph of a person and mask it over 3d computer model mesh.

 

Edited by Coopy

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(edited)
1 hour ago, Coopy said:

Thanks for the link to the podcast.  Kinda boring so far.

Do you know if there is a sideview/profile sketch of DB Cooper?

If memory serves correctly, Mucklow spent many hours sitting next to him.

Be nice if Mucklow could point out a real person that looks just like DB Cooper (maybe someone dead (permission from family) with several pictures for reference and even a video) to use as a reference for finding the real DB Cooper.  Sketches are very limited when compared to a photographs.

One can also use a photograph of a person and mask it over 3d computer model mesh.

 

I read somewhere they discussed doing a side profile sketch but one has never been publicly released.

In the mid 70's, I think it was Flo who said her memory was fading,, I doubt any witness could ID Cooper now 50 years later, unless they remember a pic shown to them back then..

 

There were pics shown to witnesses that got a positive response but they are redacted.

I filled this one in,, the redacted letter spacing matches Hahneman, the date matches Hahneman and other indicators match Hahneman, he was in the list..  but I can't be sure. Hahneman is a strange guy in photos, I have about 12 pics of him and he looks like 3 completely different people.

Resembling the Cooper sketch is a good start for any suspect....

 

gregoryhahneman.jpeg

Edited by FLYJACK

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(edited)

"Pictures of the chute were released by the FBI and other chute experts have determined it was ripstop nylon." 

Quote

ParrotVol asks (regarding this statement):   Are you sure about that? I thought the debate was that it may be nylon as opposed to silk. But ripstop nylon would have been very easily identified, or so I thought. 

Robert replies: Good question. I will have to research this one out, because years ago I had (and MAY still have) the hi-res versions of the pictures the Seattle FBI posted of the chute. I remember doing some blow-ups and spotting the cross-hatch pattern on some of the chute material...a dead giveaway for rip-stop. I almost have too many damn files I've collected over the years. Tens of thousands of them. I think Way Back When I probably posted some of the blow ups here at Dropzone. I guess I could go looking for them, or trying to search files on our computers...but damn...I have two computers loaded with some Cooper files, and over the years I transferred many of them to 64GB USB flash drives. 

The guy to maybe ask about this is Mark M aka '377'. 

You know, the REAL point of all this is that Cossey's sole and only reason he rejected the Amboy chute was because he said the chute was made of silk and not nylon, and THAT'S how he determined it wasn't Cooper's. But silk is biodegradable, and will rot just like any other natural substance if it is buried in the ground. There have been cases where they dug up crashed planes from WW2 and found parachutes on board made of silk that were still in good condition. But all of them were still packed in their containers. The Amboy chute was buried without a container and harness...both had been physically disconnected by someone. There is no evidence of rotting on the chute, or any holes in it from degradation. Only nylon can resist that. People forget that silk is just the natural stuff from silkworms and DOES biodegrade. A simple test to determine the difference is done with a Bic lighter. Nylon melts and drips. Silk catches fire. 

What amazes me is that the Seattle FBI went along with this. They didn't exactly SAY so in the media, but I know that Cossey was the ONLY person outside the FBI allowed to see the chute. His examination was cursory and quick. He told media they dumped it in his driveway, and that he knew it wasn't Cooper's 'in less than ten seconds' to quote him from news articles. But his reason doesn't make any sense. 

It gets weird sometimes with the Seattle FBI and the Amboy chute. I have a recorded list of the articles that were coming out that week, but some of the links no longer work although you can pay money to one of those newspaper services and find them. In one article, the FBI says on a Wednesday that the chute will be sent upstairs to their lab (in Seattle) the next day. But it doesn't end up there. Instead, they put it into the trunk of a car and take it to Cossey's house in Woodinville. Shortly after that...they say it isn't Cooper's 'by a preponderance of the evidence'. They make no mention of any lab results, and it is doubtful the lab even got a chance to examine it.

To make things worse...they refuse to give a reason HOW they came to that determination. Tom Kaye and his team make an offer to examine the chute. I forwarded that offer to the Seattle FBI via Ayn Dietrich not once, but twice. And once to Agent Fred Gutt. I pointed out that the Sleuths had been allowed to examine the hard-core evidence, so why not the Amboy chute? Made sense to me. But they refused these requests, and even STRANGER...the reason they gave five years after the find was 'because it is evidence in an ongoing case.' 

I pointed out that they had dismissed it as evidence five years previously. I got the same answer. Like I said, it was weird. 

How and why does a chute get buried in the prime DZ for Cooper, with the FBI announcing 'It's the right size, the right color, and found in the right place...' and a week later it isn't under very strange circumstances? You figure it out, brother. All I know is that Cossey's assessment was baloney, that he lied to at least one media rep in Seattle about it, and for some reason the Amboy chute became off-limits to the Sleuths. I will try to dig up the hi-res images, but it's been nine years (I started investigating the Amboy find in 2011 I think) and I will have to wade through a lot of files. 

I also want to apologize about overreacting to your last post. I've been called a liar so many times that occasionally I 'go off' a bit about it. B) It gets tiresome. I'm pretty sure the only time I really 'lied' in the Cooper case was years ago when I said I had a copy of the Palmer report coming to me. The truth was I had made efforts to get it, but I didn't know if I WOULD get it...and I never got a copy anyway. The Portland State University was either unwilling to send it, or they didn't have it. And I never got an answer from Palmer's relatives about it. I thought it might be in a box somewhere with his old files. I should NOT have said it was coming, which yes...was a LIE. 

Below are some of the lower-res images I have on the main computer. But it isn't enough to tell for sure. 

AmboyChuteLGHIres.jpg.346dc7ef2d0d2b74eb107601d04946bf.jpg

Amboychute8.jpg.d94472a2a1e3446641377931e2840d5c.jpg

Edited by RobertMBlevins

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(edited)

Spent some time this early morning updating some elements of our main website at AB of Seattle. Final 'Cooper Campout' details posted, some cleaning of dead links. (such as Sluggo's website, which can now only be viewed via the Internet Archive's Wayback Machine) Things like that. 

Can't wait to bail town again for the forest and the lake. Better than being stuck at the house. That's for sure. We're still planning for the Big Cooper Party in the Woods for August. I'm starting to think it will be okay to toss the party by that time. I've even considered encouraging some musicians to show up for a jam. I probably wouldn't bring my SG, but I have a cheaper rig and a  practice amp that gets pretty loud. We have a lot of time to develop the right Craigslist Event ad for this one. I've decided I want it to be good. I have written a song about Trump based on the Steve Martin song 'King Tut,' but I call it King Trump. I think it is pretty humorous. And the one about KC, The Ballad of...you have heard of it. If I could get anyone to assist, I would certainly like to do a few classic tunes. Like the one below, for example. ^_^

 

Edited by RobertMBlevins

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(edited)
12 hours ago, RobertMBlevins said:

 

I also want to apologize about overreacting to your last post.

No apology is necessary, but I learned a long time ago that when someone offers an apology, you accept it, so I will. I have to be honest though, when I read this I wasn't sure what you were talking about. In my traveling this week, I managed to miss the post you are talking about so I had to go back and see this "overreaction". So, I won't respond to any of it other than to say - for clarification purposes - that LD Cooper is certainly not my suspect. 

I do not think that any of the known suspects are Cooper. I'm pretty much a skeptic when it comes to suspects. I think with enough effort, a circumstantial case can be made for anyone who fits the physical requirements.

At the end of the day, I just want to see the case solved. I love a good mystery, but not without the conclusion. If Kenny Christiansen were proven to be Cooper, I'd be fine with it. I say the same for any of the suspects that have been put forth.

I just want to know who did it and why. I don't think we ever get that answer.

Edited by ParrotheadVol

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(edited)
12 hours ago, RobertMBlevins said:

Below are some of the lower-res images I have on the main computer. But it isn't enough to tell for sure.

The parking spaces look dirtier than the chute.  No way to treat evidence.

On another topic...

i was thinking why the NB6 parachute I have does not have a ripcord.  One obvious reason is that it cannot be used without one.  I did some googling.

https://parachutehistory.com/darwin/cablestops.html

Wouldn't you know it... sometimes people let go of the ripcord after pulling. It went sailing off into the wild blue yonder, plummeting towards earth, finding a new home amongst the tumbleweeds.

A brilliant jumper decided to put a stop on the ripcord cable. The stop prevented the entire cable from clearing the housing - even if you dropped the ripcord handle.

Ripcord stops became somewhat popular in the 1960’s with Rec. jumpers but eventually were banned due to fatalities and complications.

i wonder if Cossey used any ripcord stops on his chutes?

I guess the right type of ripcord found in the drop zone area might be useful to narrowing down the area he landed or fell.

 

 

 

Edited by Coopy

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46 minutes ago, ParrotheadVol said:

I do not think that any of the known suspects are Cooper. I'm pretty much a skeptic when it comes to suspects. I think with enough effort, a circumstantial case can be made for anyone who fits the physical requirements.

I just want to know who did it and why. I don't think we ever get that answer.

Problem is without forensics, you can't get beyond circumstantial.. the prints might not be Cooper's and the DNA is partial and inconclusive. Now, the chute can never be confirmed..  the only thing left is to tie the money to a suspect.

WE GOT NOTHING...  if your standard is more than a (strong) circumstantial case then a solve may be unobtainium...

Circumstantial is probably the best we can do..  unless the FBI does new DNA work.. but that is out of our control.

 

I am resigned to two standards,, a legal solve (forensics) and a public solve (circumstantial).. not all circumstantial cases are equal.

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This is non-Cooper, but I think we should take a pause for some news. You may have heard about it. This was my post about it at Facebook today, talking about Oxford, Astra-Zeneca, and 300 million doses of vaccine:

Quote

'Well, it's about time the Brits bailed us out...we've done it for THEM a couple of times. ^_^ It also figures that Oxford boys would come up with something quicker than anyone else. Astra Zeneca's stock has zoomed into the sky. No surprise there...'

I was referring to the article from Reuters today. 

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1 hour ago, FLYJACK said:

Problem is without forensics, you can't get beyond circumstantial.. the prints might not be Cooper's and the DNA is partial and inconclusive. Now, the chute can never be confirmed..  the only thing left is to tie the money to a suspect.

WE GOT NOTHING...  if your standard is more than a (strong) circumstantial case then a solve may be unobtainium...

Circumstantial is probably the best we can do..  unless the FBI does new DNA work.. but that is out of our control.

 

I am resigned to two standards,, a legal solve (forensics) and a public solve (circumstantial).. not all circumstantial cases are equal.

I agree. The problem is that not everyone will have the same level of requirement for a public solve. How much circumstantial is enough? I'd love to see it, but my naturally pessimistic glass half empty attitude says we never will. I hope I'm wrong. 

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(edited)
Quote

I agree. The problem is that not everyone will have the same level of requirement for a public solve. How much circumstantial is enough? I'd love to see it, but my naturally pessimistic glass half empty attitude says we never will. I hope I'm wrong. 

I cannot sit here and try to tell you I am absolutely certain that KC was the hijacker. I can't even tell you everything we know regarding all that. Let me say this, though:

When Bernie Geestman, after lying so many times to History Channel researchers...told the cast of Decoded that Kenny could be the hijacker...and we knew without a single, solitary doubt he was WITH Kenny the entire week of the hijacking...I started to wonder. Three separate witnesses, all of whom knew each other for decades but had not seen each other for at least fifteen years prior to their testimonies...all gave this same exact story. 

Geestman, at the time he made that statement on Decoded, did not have a clue that both friends and family had told us the whole story already. Since he was under some pressure from the cast to admit his participation, he probably felt safe pointing the finger at Kenny. He could have offered an alibi, but chose not to and I wondered why he did not. Later, a fourth and very reluctant witness came forward. His own niece, who had the courage to go on-camera with the John Dower film crew and tell what she knew. Had Geestman known that these people testified what they did, he probably would have offered an alibi for both KC and himself. "Kenny couldn't have done it. He was with me down in Oakville that week." But he didn't. He pointed the finger at Kenny instead. 

As far as the John Dower production, those guys cut almost everything done in the NW that they had filmed. Her testimony, mine, even Bruce Smith's. I heard they left in the interview with the Forman couple. Oh, brother. That movie was supposed to show up on HBO by now (editing was complete just prior to the Corona crisis) but so far there has been no word on an air date. 

Edited by RobertMBlevins
'NOT seen each other...'

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(edited)
On 5/20/2020 at 6:17 PM, FLYJACK said:

Resembling the Cooper sketch is a good start for any suspect....

 

I agree that is a good place to start for those of us with limited resources and access to released reports the FBI spoon feeds the arm chair detectives.  It is a one way street with LE and they will tell you.

I heard your name mentioned several times in the Anonymous Analyst podcast.

Seems like you read every 302 that comes out.  I think that is great as you probably catch nuggets the FBI misses such at the country store break-in.

 

Edited by Coopy
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(edited)

CLOWNS DANCING AROUND A COLD CAMPFIRE DEPARTMENT:

Here's a good laugh for you. Over at the Shutter forum, (same place that made complaints to MY server for copying material from THEIR website, thereby getting us shut down) are bitching about how we post pictures here. The formats and sizes sometimes don't work for copying to the Cooper Forum.

Seen today posted by Georger. For the uninitiated, that is Jerry Warner, former university instructor, now retired.

Quote

"A quick note on photo formats being posted at DZ - Blevins photos will copy here because Blevins is using a standard Windows file format software common to the USA industry.

FLYJACK photos will NOT copy here without first doing a file type conversion, because FJ is not using a standard Windows file format, but something else - Shutter's forum will only accept Windows type photo formats but will not accept FJ's photo file types! This means a FLYJACK jpeg posted at DZ will not be accepted and post here, without first converting the FLYJACK jpeg into a Windows recognized "jpeg" ! Just try it .... FLYJACK is a true 'outlier' even in his file formats used and he probably knows this . . ."

Well, these are the same guys who supported the theft of Sheridan Peterson's one and only book he ever wrote, and ruined it for mainstream publication for like...For EVER...so their discussions of ripoff/copy/paste don't surprise me. They are so chicken shit and cowardly over there that they would rather steal from other folks' work and discuss it among themselves at a separate site without addressing the original post. Their complaints ring a little hollow. Nothing like the bank robber reaching home after his last job and bitching that the teller shorted him a bit from the cash drawer. 

Of course, most of the people they steal from have been banned from 'Honest' Dave Brown's Cooper Forum, so the victims can offer no opinions on their work anyway. Cute system.  

Wait. Yes. There's more. They even bitch about the sizing of the photographs they steal, because Shutter can't afford decent bandwidth, making some of them difficult to steal and post. That's a hoot. 

Georger says to Robert 99:

Quote

"Then look at only Blevins, FJ, and Shutter photos .... since you are incapable of posting photos yourself. For your information, Mr Engineering Man ... there is a photo limit of only 200k here vs. 300k or larger at DZ !   That translates into a vastly larger photo posting limit at DZ vs. here." 

Your DB Cooper Forum host, Shutter, aka 'Honest' Dave Brown chimes in his bit for his own defense. 
Stealing and posting larger images for his site costs money. (Theft ain't cheap, I guess.)  
And he's running the Cooper website on a budget:

Quote

"As for the DZ..I don't have the bandwidth coverage they do..I can bump it up a little more but ALL useless photo's don't belong will be removed if they are not related to the case..."

Might as well remove them, Buckwheat. Since they're stolen and posted to your website by your own members. Now you know why I called you and some of your friends the biggest phonies in Cooper history.

No. It doesn't end there. There's MORE. 

After they steal the pictures and comments, they hide everything by making the viewing of those things private by installing Special Gestapo-Type Rule #6:  They don't allow the public or anyone not registered at the site to see any of their stolen material. Sounds kinda communist to me. 

Quote

"You are not allowed to view pictures or links. Register or Login." 

Trust me, folks. This whole scenario, the theft of Sheridan's book, the ongoing theft of pictures from Dropzone by the same guys who bitch about text being copied from their website...this story needs to be made into a comprehensive article at WordPress and Quora. It is just too bizarre to be believed without one. 

But no worries. You will get full credit and proper names will be attached to certain points and items in the article, under Fair Use rules. B)

Just to piss off the plagiarists...from now on all pictures I post at Dropzone will be well ABOVE 200 kilobytes, and done in a NON-Windows format. Just to make you work a little harder. (*laughs*) I can see it now. You try to figure out how to reduce file size of your stolen pictures from 900K down to Shutter's 200K limit. Maybe you will end up with something like what is shown below. 

florenceschaffner2.png.a7408499a2c6b2454b9bb849a8a00dfa.png

What a bunch of maroons over there...as Bugs Bunny would say. 

 

 

Edited by RobertMBlevins

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(edited)

Comments regarding Memorial Day and what it means to them, from a couple of folks out in Cooperland:

From ParrotheadVol:

Quote

'Hope everyone has a great Memorial Day weekend.
To all of you that served, and had the balls to do what I did not, Thank You!'

No worries, Parrot. If the draft had been going and you had been called up, I'm sure you would have reported for duty. I'm actually GLAD that the military is all-volunteer today, although sometimes I think we waste good people by sending them into situations where they should not be sent. But they go, because that's what they do. You would undoubtedly do the same, I have no doubt. And if some national emergency came up that required ALL of us to 'stand to,' I have no doubt you would stand with everyone else.  

From Bruce Smith:

Quote

'We all serve our country in different ways, Parrot. Not only did I try to stop the Vietnam War by protesting, and endured facing US soldiers pointing their weapons at me, but I worked two years at my local VA hospital in the psych ward. I treated guys who may have had balls, but didn't have sufficient mental and emotional preparation to go into combat.'

TO BRUCE: What a load of self-serving crap THAT is. I think your protesting-and-I-worked-in-a-Veterans'-Hospital story is a bunch of lies, by the way. No one who has actually worked in a VA hospital would say dumb shit like that. No one has 'sufficient mental and emotional preparation to go into combat'. There is no way to really prepare in the first place, and if you worked in a VA hospital with psych patients, my name is Mickey Mouse. I have been in a VA hospital, (not combat-related) and trust me when I tell you it's very unlikely you ever worked in one. Because you would never say mealy-mouthed crap like that if you had. 

To Everyone Else:  Bruce may have participated in some protest or another regarding the Vietnam War. Everybody was doing that back then. But anyone who has actually WORKED in a VA hospital doesn't get judgmental on the patients. They come away (at first) shocked...(and then) sympathetic, and (finally) extremely humbled. He's full of it. 

My Personal Thoughts on Memorial Day:  They are not about me. My service was nothing. I drove lunch to trainees in the field at Leonard Wood. I pulled CQ in the evenings, and lied for my top sergeant while he partied at the EM club. I spent weekends on the range with my friends. We never saw combat. No...MY thoughts always go out to former next-door neighbor, and best friend 'Hutch,' a guy I wrote an article about exactly ten years ago. That article was published to the now-defunct site Newsvine, but I took some time to locate the original at the Internet Archive. Not so much for anyone here to read, but because it's important not to forget people like Hutch. 

Quote

A Memorial Day Tribute: Hutch, A Better Man Than I

Well, I was in the Regular Army back in the Seventies, but I didn't see any action. In fact, I joined up the month after Saigon fell and never got past Missouri.

So, my service was pretty minimal.

Every Memorial Day I think about my old friend Hutch. He's gone now. We did a lot of things together like camping and fishing and hanging out in his garage. He didn't talk about himself much.

Hutch was a door gunner on a Huey for two tours in Vietnam. He never offered any details and I didn't ask.

I knew he'd been to 'Nam, but it was six or seven years before he told me how he got that Bronze Star I spotted by accident at his house. I had never seen it before, and I finally worked up the nerve to ask him about it. After he downed the greater part of a bottle of scotch while we sat out in his garage, he finally opened up a little. He had received the medal on his last tour.

Hutch and the crew had landed in an open field to pick up some soldiers who were under heavy mortar and machine-gun fire from the tree line. Several Hueys were already on the ground when they arrived. The incoming fire was tremendous. When Hutch saw a mortar shell explode about a hundred yards away, he also saw a guy fall to the ground where the shell hit. He left his weapon and ran out to pick the guy up.

When he got there, he discovered it was his best friend - they had joined up together. On their first tour in Vietnam they had served in the same unit. On Hutch's second tour, they had been separated. The guy had taken a hit to the legs. Hutch grabbed the guy by the armpits and dragged him toward the Huey. Bullets zipped past and mortar shells exploded everywhere.

About halfway to the Huey, one mortar shell dropped directly between the wounded man's legs. His friend was killed instantly, and a lot of him ended up on Hutch. But Hutch was almost untouched because his friend's body took most of the blast.

Hutch finished dragging him back to the Huey. Then he went back out and helped a few more guys aboard the chopper, before everyone made a quick exit.

Hutch was never the same after that. He told me that when he came home from Vietnam, people spit on him at the airport. He knocked the holy crap out of one of them and he landed in jail for a few days. He began drinking heavily and finally ended up as a Delayed-Stress case.

Hutch eventually found a steady girlfriend and they lived together for many years. She managed to keep him from going completely off the deep end. He was able to hold a good job, but he smoked three packs a day and drank a half bottle of liquor nearly every day. This finally brought him serious heart problems. He had his second heart attack in the mid-1980s while leaving his parents' house after a holiday dinner - and dropped dead right on their front doorstep. He was only 42 years old.

Every Memorial Day and Veterans' Day I think about him. If I'm out camping I fire off a few shots and say something.

Hutch told me once:

'The Fourth of July don't mean s__t to me. I mean, there's nothin' wrong with it. Barbecues, fireworks, and all that stuff. But Memorial Day. That's MY day.'

He was really a nice guy. No name on the Wall, he was just another 'unofficial' casualty of the war.

Robert Blevins

Bruce Smith is full of it, and I will always believe the closest he ever got to a VA hospital was maybe emptying the trash cans, if that. :handpeace:And by the way Bruce, if you are reading this now...except for a very few instances like the Kent State tragedy in 1970, National Guardsmen were NOT issued live ammunition to cover Vietnam War student protests, or where the protesters were unarmed. And especially after Kent State happened. Just thought you would want to know. 

 

Edited by RobertMBlevins
spelling correction

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(edited)

I notice the U.S. Marshall’s adopted the Alcatraz escape case from the FBI in 1979.  Seventeen years after The 1962 escape.  

The U.S. Marshall’s will pursue a case until the person(s) are arrested, positively determined deceased or reach the age of 99.

US Marshall’s are Still actively working tips and the Case in general for at least another 9 years based on their age criteria.

Frank Morris was born in 1926 is 94 and the Anglin brothers are about 90.

DB Cooper case is orphaned and needs adoption.  No positive age on Cooper could be a hang up.

I do not know about their case adoption procedures or if The Cooper case would meet their criteria.

https://www.usmarshals.gov/news/chron/2012/060712a.htm

Edited by Coopy

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When the cops can put a name to a crime, the Statute of Limitations does not apply. They can get a warrant if they have a name. Then they can choose to keep renewing that warrant forever, or to eventually allow it to lapse. The Feds don't like escapes from custody or people convicted of espionage escaping, either. This is why they went after The Falcon with everything they had and eventually caught him up in Port Angeles, WA. There was a strong rumor going around that President Reagan threatened to dismantle the US Marshals Service if they didn't catch him. (Look what Reagan did to the air traffic controllers who went on strike.) 

The FBI acquired a John Doe warrant for Cooper, but I guess at some point they decided to stop tossing money at the case. No one was really hurt except the insurance company who paid off the ransom. And after they got burned by the Marla Cooper fiasco, maybe they just decided enough was enough. 

Good point, though. Problem with using the Marshals Service is that they wouldn't have a name to go on. Same problem the FBI had. So where do you start to look? Another problem is that the Marshals Service main duties are protecting certain people, such as witnesses, court officers, a number of things and places you might not think of. They also serve as the fugitive recovery arm for the Feds, even more than the FBI to an extent. Investigating actual crimes is a lesser function for them. 

Without generalizing them too much, they are sort of like Dog the Bounty Hunter, only with unlimited power and US government credit cards to use that don't really have a spending limit. :handok:However, if they had a name attached to Cooper, they would definitely take the case if asked. 

Edited by RobertMBlevins

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4 minutes ago, RobertMBlevins said:

Good point, though. Problem with using the Marshals Service is that they wouldn't have a name to go on. Same problem the FBI had. So where do you start to look?

I'm just saying it would be nice to have some LE out there to still take in tips and work the case.  Logically, the U.S. Marshals would be one LE high on the list.

The FBI could make it easier for everyone if they were to computerize the copies of released and not released documents into a text searchable database/format. (like many newspapers have done)  They could contract a couple of good typists (with security clearance) to enter the thousands of pages (bad quality...beyond OCR technology) into a text searchable and organized database.  Probably worth more than what they use to do by paying high price agents to go on wild goose chases.

Then the armchair researcher can search the released documents more efficiently and any LE (with permission) that is wanting to access the non-released documents can search more efficiently.

I use to scan through miles of newspaper microfilm rolls for information.  WHAT A PAIN.  Now most newspapers are text searchable and online WHAT A JOY!  A real time saver!

 

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(edited)

The FBI says they have stopped doing anything in the Cooper case. But the FBI in Seattle still has an agent assigned to the case. All the messages still go to him/her although nowadays they won't tell you who he/she is. When you speak to them or message them at the SEATTLE office, they always mention your material or message is being forwarded to the current case agent. Even today. 

Edited by RobertMBlevins

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