DB Cooper

[FLYJACK 654]

1 hour ago, Robert99 said:

FlyJack, as pointed out earlier, 3100 was one of 78 possible hijack codes in 1971.  It was not "the" hijack code.

The ARINC teletype copies you include relate to communications between the airliner and NWA in Minneapolis and are NOT air traffic control communications.  No time is given in your post for the airliner switching to 3100 which should have been coordinated with air traffic control in this particular instance.

Note the interesting time stamps in the ARINC teletype copies.  The first message is listed as being sent at 3:54 PM PST and the teletype copy was sent at 2358 Zulu which was 4 minutes later.

The second message is listed as being sent at 3:55 PM PST and the teletype copy was sent at 2359 Zulu which was also 4 minutes later.

Since the airliner was hijacked at about 3:00 PM PST, air traffic control was not informed of that fact until at least an hour later at which time the airliner was already holding northwest of SEATAC.

Somewhere there is a comment that the SEATAC tower was not informed of the hijacking until the airliner was in the process of landing.

Wrong,, Chaucer got it right.

1972..

https://archive.org/details/ReadersDigestVol20No115October1972AsiaEdition/page/n7/mode/2up

"Capt. Tommy Hill dialed Code 3100 - the signal reporting a hijacking - on his cockpit transponder"

Edited October 6, 2023 by FLYJACK

[georger 197]

1 hour ago, FLYJACK said:

Wrong,, Chaucer got it right.

1972..

https://archive.org/details/ReadersDigestVol20No115October1972AsiaEdition/page/n7/mode/2up

"Capt. Tommy Hill dialed Code 3100 - the signal reporting a hijacking - on his cockpit transponder"

And what difference does any of this make in the case?  None?   This looks like a pissing contest.

Edited October 6, 2023 by georger

[FLYJACK 654]

19 minutes ago, georger said:

And what difference does any of this make in the case?  None?   This looks like a pissing contest.

This doesn't meet the definition of a pissing contest.. 

Robert is impervious to facts...   you can't have discussion with people who just reject the facts. Reminds of the Reca nonsense.

[Robert99 37]

55 minutes ago, FLYJACK said:

This doesn't meet the definition of a pissing contest.. 

Robert is impervious to facts...   you can't have discussion with people who just reject the facts. Reminds of the Reca nonsense.

FlyJack, I don't reject "facts".  But we do seem to have some differences about what constitutes a "fact".  In reality, the number of actual "facts" related to this hijacking are extremely limited. 

[FLYJACK 654]

2 hours ago, Robert99 said:

FlyJack, I don't reject "facts".  But we do seem to have some differences about what constitutes a "fact".  In reality, the number of actual "facts" related to this hijacking are extremely limited. 

Fact.

3100 was the squawk for a hijacking.

 

[FLYJACK 654]

3 hours ago, Slim King said:

L@@KS like this thread is more of a pissing match rather than a search for truth. I wonder why all the Red Herrings? Is it because this thread is NOT supposed to seek the truth but rather cover up a lie?

That is what a FED would say...

[Chaucer 103]

On 10/6/2023 at 4:15 PM, Robert99 said:

FlyJack, I don't reject "facts".  But we do seem to have some differences about what constitutes a "fact".  In reality, the number of actual "facts" related to this hijacking are extremely limited. 

You sound like Trump with your "alternative facts".

The truth is you stopped investigating this case years ago. Instead, you chose to mock, condescend, and insult those people who continued to pursue the facts - particularly those inconvenient to your pet theories. 

The problem for you is that those same people - like me -  ignored you,  persevered, and carried the torch. 

Now, you and your ridiculous, completely unsubstantiated  claims of an FAA/FBI coverup and westerly flight path are burning up in flames before your eyes. I expect a panicked, directionless series of posts before you finally fade away. 

Your feeble attempts at being a smug, know-it-all at at an end. 

You're ten years behind the rest us, and it's impossible to keep up.

My biggest shame is that I wrote all of this knowing you read about a third of it.

Either way, I'm still right.

[FLYJACK 654]

16 hours ago, Chaucer said:

You sound like Trump with your "alternative facts".

The truth is you stopped investigating this case years ago. Instead, you chose to mock, condescend, and insult those people who continued to pursue the facts - particularly those inconvenient to your pet theories. 

The problem for you is that those same people - like me -  ignored you,  persevered, and carried the torch. 

Now, you and your ridiculous, completely unsubstantiated  claims of an FAA/FBI coverup and westerly flight path are burning up in flames before your eyes. I expect a panicked, directionless series of posts before you finally fade away. 

Your feeble attempts at being a smug, know-it-all at at an end. 

You're ten years behind the rest us, and it's impossible to keep up.

My biggest shame is that I wrote all of this knowing you read about a third of it.

Either way, I'm still right.

Discussions with a few who can't accept the facts here are frustrating..

But,  that is a bit harsh and hyperbolic...

 

[FLYJACK 654]

20 minutes ago, Slim King said:

Prove to me that the FBI doesn't lie and you might get some respect. But the FBI lies and everyone knows it. J. Edgar Hoover was dead within a year or so after Patriots stole the FBI files and gave them to the newspapers exposing their horrendous lies and misdeeds to the public. Cooper was part of the billions of lies.

Sure, the FBI lies..

but you need to prove they lied or where they are wrong in this case from the start of the hijacking.. and also prove that everyone else involved lied including live transcripts. 

You never prove anything because you can't. It is nonsense.. Instead, you cling to a made up story that actually proves Reca was NOT Cooper.

So, the Reca story is an actual lie you believe to be true and all the Cooper case evidence is a lie...  

Not very good for a mentalist or discussions on a forum...

 

 

 

 

Edited October 9, 2023 by FLYJACK

[FLYJACK 654]

18 minutes ago, Slim King said:

I'm so happy that you admit the FBI lies!!!! Now to decide when they were telling the truth. Were they telling the truth when they LOST/DESTROYED the cigarette butts with invaluable DNA on them?

There is no evidence that 305 took any other path than the path that they all take ....V2.  Over the pass and behind the mountain range. Only an IDOIT would fly a plane with a bomb aboard over the most populated areas of Washington and Oregon...Just an Insane idea. And all these REDACTIONS???? There is no hard evidence whatsoever. Just some people saying what the FBI told them to say ... No evidence.

There was no DNA in 1971,, they tested the cigarettes for prints which was negative and they disposed of them..  no lie, no conspiracy.

You are lying, all planes don't take an East path to Reno.. 

The normal route is v-23.

 

 

[georger 197]

1 hour ago, FLYJACK said:

There was no DNA in 1971,, they tested the cigarettes for prints which was negative and they disposed of them..  no lie, no conspiracy.

You are lying, all planes don't take an East path to Reno.. 

The normal route is v-23.

 

 

DNA fingerprinting was first used in forensic science in 1986 when police in the UK requested Dr. Alec J. Jeffreys, of University of Leicester, to verify a suspect's confession that he was responsible for two rape-murders. Tests proved that the suspect had not committed the crimes.

The 1970s saw the development of a technique known as DNA fingerprinting, which uses restriction enzymes to split DNA into smaller fragments that are then sorted and visible on a gel. This technique was first developed by British geneticist Alec Jeffreys.

https://www.uniqgene.com/post/when-did-dna-testing-start

[FLYJACK 654]

11 hours ago, Slim King said:

 The normal rout is V23??????  This is the route as of 30 seconds ago.... North then East over the pass then straight to Reno. You are so BUSTED!!!!

You are the one BUSTED...

That path doesn't go East to Cle Elum.. not even close..

The normal route is V-23.. you claimed ALL planes flew East, a lie.

Why do you perpetuate the Reca hoax..  nobody with a basic understanding of the case believes it unless they have an ulterior motive.

 

Edited October 9, 2023 by FLYJACK

[FLYJACK 654]

1 hour ago, Slim King said:

Reca/Peca is the most obvious suspect. He fits the description of the very first artists sketch. He has all the qualifications and finally admits it over thirty years later. The only reason that you don't believe him is because you have been lied to by the FBI about an invented flight path with no eye witnesses even though they sent out 6 planes to find it. 200,000 hunters found NOTHING!!!!

Reca was a well known serial liar, you admitted that.. He doesn't fit the description, he talks like he has a grade 8 education.. he made many gross errors in his fake confession. You don't need to trust the FBI to eliminate Reca, he does it himself. Cowboy Jeff proves Reca wasn't Cooper.. he said he met somebody in Cle Elum who looked like Reca.. he can't prove it was Reca.. if it wasn't Reca then the entire story is a lie, if it was Reca then he wasn't Cooper because the plane went South not East.

The Walter Reca being Cooper narrative is a HOAX. 

Why do you keep pushing a HOAX. The Reca authors have a reason, what is yours.

 

Edited October 9, 2023 by FLYJACK

[Andrade1812 51]

The Reca people haven't even bothered to buy an old parachute and plant it in their dropzone, how are we to take them seriously?

[SeventyWonderful 18]

You know, it sure has been a fun past couple of weeks for speculation.

My purpose for taking another look at what Cooper wore is to perhaps tell us more about the man himself.  We can demonstrate that he wasn't someone who jumped ill prepared in freezing weather over the uncharted wilderness.

We can also say that he wasn't a schlub who simply wore old clothes during the hijacking (although it's not like you're going to wear your Sunday best when planning to jump out of a plane).

Assuming the clothes he wore were drip dry it would demonstrate that he came thoroughly prepared.  Haspel's Sir Perior had a blend of 75% Dacron polyester & 25% cotton according to a 1957 ad.  By 1964 that blend had changed to a more breathable mixture of 65% Dacron & 35% cotton. The jacket on eBay was made during that period.  The breathable cotton/polyester material would be the ideal choice for someone wearing thermals underneath during the hijacking and then for the getaway on the ground.

An older suit would also be an ideal choice in disposing of it after the hijacking, because Cooper certainly destroyed anything linking himself to the crime after he got to safety.

It may also tell us more about his background.

Haspel is still in business in French speaking New Orleans.  New Orleans is of course on the Gulf of Mexico and home to a significant Italian community and various Indian tribes from throughout the region.  

Then there is French speaking Vietnam and equally hot French speaking countries in North Africa where wearing a breathable drip dry suit would be an asset. Going back to the scene of the crime, might having a drip-dry suit be an asset in the rainy Pacific Northwest as well?

I also stuck my toes in the pool of government documents and the textile industry over the weekend, and realized I was waaaay in over my head. Government regulations and industry standards probably didn't dictate or limit the patterns for textiles (at least I don't think so).

Now what we can do is continue to research in other ways.  Over the past year I've gone through the catalogues for major retailers of the period, magazines, advertisements, and online listings, but so far no other brown suits with a distinct black pinstripe has surfaced (with one exception).  It may be that cheap suits from over half a century ago just aren't around any more to be found, or it could be that his suit/jacket looked something like this instead.  Botany 500 provided the wardrobe for many a tv game show host from coast to coast.  This jacket has a much finer black pinstripe, although it could be more distinct in real life than in the photo, and Tina was able to note the pebble grained leather in his shoes after all.

Regardless, I could be reading way too much into what Tina said about Cooper's suit, but I just can't shake the feeling that feeling that he wanted to be James Bond on a budget.

[temporary17 5]

On 9/24/2023 at 11:50 PM, Slim King said:

 

 

2 hours ago, SeventyWonderful said:

it could be that his suit/jacket looked something like this instead

 

Is that Slim selling Reca's coat?

[georger 197]

If you missed FBI Parts 80=87 they are available here: https://vault.fbi.gov/D-B-Cooper ?b_start:int=80

 

[FLYJACK 654]

On 10/9/2023 at 3:46 PM, SeventyWonderful said:

You know, it sure has been a fun past couple of weeks for speculation.

My purpose for taking another look at what Cooper wore is to perhaps tell us more about the man himself.  We can demonstrate that he wasn't someone who jumped ill prepared in freezing weather over the uncharted wilderness.

We can also say that he wasn't a schlub who simply wore old clothes during the hijacking (although it's not like you're going to wear your Sunday best when planning to jump out of a plane).

Assuming the clothes he wore were drip dry it would demonstrate that he came thoroughly prepared.  Haspel's Sir Perior had a blend of 75% Dacron polyester & 25% cotton according to a 1957 ad.  By 1964 that blend had changed to a more breathable mixture of 65% Dacron & 35% cotton. The jacket on eBay was made during that period.  The breathable cotton/polyester material would be the ideal choice for someone wearing thermals underneath during the hijacking and then for the getaway on the ground.

An older suit would also be an ideal choice in disposing of it after the hijacking, because Cooper certainly destroyed anything linking himself to the crime after he got to safety.

It may also tell us more about his background.

Haspel is still in business in French speaking New Orleans.  New Orleans is of course on the Gulf of Mexico and home to a significant Italian community and various Indian tribes from throughout the region.  

Then there is French speaking Vietnam and equally hot French speaking countries in North Africa where wearing a breathable drip dry suit would be an asset. Going back to the scene of the crime, might having a drip-dry suit be an asset in the rainy Pacific Northwest as well?

I also stuck my toes in the pool of government documents and the textile industry over the weekend, and realized I was waaaay in over my head. Government regulations and industry standards probably didn't dictate or limit the patterns for textiles (at least I don't think so).

Now what we can do is continue to research in other ways.  Over the past year I've gone through the catalogues for major retailers of the period, magazines, advertisements, and online listings, but so far no other brown suits with a distinct black pinstripe has surfaced (with one exception).  It may be that cheap suits from over half a century ago just aren't around any more to be found, or it could be that his suit/jacket looked something like this instead.  Botany 500 provided the wardrobe for many a tv game show host from coast to coast.  This jacket has a much finer black pinstripe, although it could be more distinct in real life than in the photo, and Tina was able to note the pebble grained leather in his shoes after all.

Regardless, I could be reading way too much into what Tina said about Cooper's suit, but I just can't shake the feeling that feeling that he wanted to be James Bond on a budget.

You may be reading too much into Tina's account, but here is a link to scans of an extensive library of historical department store catalogs.. maybe Cooper bought his suit or shoes from a major department store..

https://christmas.musetechnical.com

[olemisscub 466]

So, it's interesting to me that when the FBI boarded the plane they found the 1960 packing card "in the pocket of this parachute." No mention of the 1957 card. Then, on the 26th when Giorlamo inspects the chute, he also only mentions the 1960 packing card. The 1957 card isn't mentioned until the Dec 21st FBI doc where they are cataloging it for evidence. Just odd that BOTH the FBI on the 24th and Giorlamo on the 26th missed the 1957 card.  

[FLYJACK 654]

22 minutes ago, olemisscub said:

So, it's interesting to me that when the FBI boarded the plane they found the 1960 packing card "in the pocket of this parachute." No mention of the 1957 card. Then, on the 26th when Giorlamo inspects the chute, he also only mentions the 1960 packing card. The 1957 card isn't mentioned until the Dec 21st FBI doc where they are cataloging it for evidence. Just odd that BOTH the FBI on the 24th and Giorlamo on the 26th missed the 1957 card.  

Yes, perhaps the 1957 card wasn't in the pocket.. maybe tossed on the floor.

[olemisscub 466]

4 minutes ago, FLYJACK said:

Yes, perhaps the 1957 card wasn't in the pocket.. maybe tossed on the floor.

Bruce seems to believe that there was a packing card found on the floor. Obviously that's not in any 302's that we've seen. I wonder where he got that idea from. 

[FLYJACK 654]

6 minutes ago, olemisscub said:

Bruce seems to believe that there was a packing card found on the floor. Obviously that's not in any 302's that we've seen. I wonder where he got that idea from. 

I have never seen any evidence for the card being found on the floor but Tosaw said in his book that Cooper checked the packing cards.. maybe Bruce is going off that and assuming.

It is also possible that the 1960 card was put back in the wrong chute pocket by somebody who found the chute and card in the plane..

Hard to know exactly what went down..  

 

[FLYJACK 654]

1 hour ago, Slim King said:

It doesn't seem to bother you that Walter Reca/Peca knew the man who packed the chutes??????

 

Not interested in participating in your delusions.

[Andrade1812 51]

1 hour ago, Slim King said:

It doesn't seem to bother you that Walter Reca/Peca knew the man who packed the chutes??????

 

Meaningless even if true. And it probably is true, any active skydiver at the time would probably know of Cossey who was a world champion competitor, and was a licensed rigger in the state Reca was in. Regardless, knowing Cossey means nothing. Lots of people knew Cossey.

[georger 197]

1 hour ago, Andrade1812 said:

Meaningless even if true. And it probably is true, any active skydiver at the time would probably know of Cossey who was a world champion competitor, and was a licensed rigger in the state Reca was in. Regardless, knowing Cossey means nothing. Lots of people knew Cossey.

All kinds of people knew Cossey - he was school teacher, a member of a large area church,  past member of the School Board, a member of the country club, and on the area casino Board, and a public figure!  

Did Slim's suspect 'know; the King of England?  I doubt it. Who cares!  Not relevant!   

Edited October 11, 2023 by georger