BruceSmith 3 #51951 March 25, 2015 NMIWrecks***It's an intriguing, unanswered question, which boggles my mind. I have thought through some of the possibilities such as: 1. A second jumper, accomplice 2. A second jumper as a hostage 3. Additional rigs in the event some were unusable 4. Additional resources, as we know paracord was used to tie-down the money sack. It seems to me that there was a question in the plan or some other options that Cooper had in-play that may go unanswered, however I think it is of note that he requested more chutes than necessary for him to make a singular jump. I always thought he requested the extra chutes to imply he was taking a hostage with him, so the authorities wouldn't sabotage any of the chutes. That's just an opinion. Your opinion was widely shared in 1971, and still is today. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BruceSmith 3 #51952 March 25, 2015 skyjack712 front chutes and 2 chest packs that is not 4 chutes . The chest pack is just a back up in the event the main chute does not open. Asking for 2 sets would alert the athorities - he might be taking someone with him - this was to make sure the packs had NOT been tampered with. These jumpers can expain that better than I can - Bruce is not a jumper and there are only 4 or 5 real jumpers who actually post now and then to the thread. I get PM's from some of them - those who rarely post and some who never posted. Always wondered about the old gentleman who contacted when I first came to the DZ. He was not a well person & probably died all I had was is first name and his handle - would love to have met that man. There are several I really would like to meet before I go - but, that will just not happen unless they come to a jump in my area. Most no longer jump - because they are getting up in age...like Richard Peterson who knew when it was time to stop doing PULLS. It must be a fascinating feeling to fly thru the air with NO WINGs (some jumpers do have wings now & they zoom around fast) but also knowing that before you get too close you can pull that cord. Robb Heady performed his skyjacking with only one chute - a front pack, which he wore under his windbreaker. Jo, I seriously wonder sometimes if you have ever read my book, even though I have sent you plenty of copies. Wassup, girl? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BruceSmith 3 #51953 March 25, 2015 Quote"...As far as the 'Boeing Flight Services' reference, it is possible that Hayden was told to send them there, rather than directly to SeaTac Airport. Remember...Barry Halstad was already at Flight Services when they called him for chutes...." Nope. Bobby, you are kind of close, but No Cigar. Barry was at work at Pacific Aviation. Further, Barry told me that he had never heard of Boeing Flight Services, saying, "I even worked for Boeing and I never heard of that place." As for your speculations, nice try but I ain't buying any of it. Not for a second. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BruceSmith 3 #51954 March 25, 2015 Quote"...your lack of knowledge on that means you've never been to an airport smaller than a major hub, I guess..." BOBBY! You haven't even read Chapter 1 of my book!!! Does your mother get as exasperated with you as I? Whew. I rediscovered the Cooper story at Thun Field when I met the Formans, so forget the "major hub" canard. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skyjack71 0 #51955 March 25, 2015 I do not read garbage & when I see how you twist things on the thread it makes me sick to my stomach... Where is Cossey's phone? When the person is not here to defend themselves you take vulgar & garish liberties....I expect you did that in your book! Anyone who knows the crime & how you treated everyone you interviewed...would not want to read your book. You think that all of that garbage will be history one day. Betcha didn't dare mention the DZ! What your readers need to know is how GROSS & VULGAR & demeaning you are on this thread. You would never repeat a review that would put you in your place. You have NEVER apologized for the crude things you said about Tina and her family in this thread, You are a CHILDISH BULLY who does not care who he hurts to get his way!Copyright 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012 2013, 2014, 2015 by Jo Weber Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BruceSmith 3 #51956 March 25, 2015 Quote"...Betcha didn't dare mention the DZ!.." Nope. I talk about the DZ extensively. In fact, you are featured in that chapter. I call you the "godmother" of a resurgent DB Cooper investigation. Since you're clearly making one ignorant statement after another, I'm gonna cut you off- no more free books for you. You simply don't bother to read what I've written and given to you for free. From now on, sweetie, if you wanna read what I've said about you and the rest of the Norjak case, you're gonna have to pay $6.99 like everyone else. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BruceSmith 3 #51957 March 25, 2015 Quote"...but the chutes DID end up at Flight Services at Boeing. Then someone (probably a member of law enforcement) actually took them to the airport. Why don't you just ask Hayden about it? I'm sure he knows the exact arrangements...." Nope. Wrongo again, Bobby. 1. The chutes did not end up at Boeing Flight Services, where ever it may be, if in fact it even exists. WSHM documents from the estate of George Harrison clearly show that the two chutes from Hayden arrived at the NWO freight desk at Sea-Tac by taxi as arranged prior with Norman. All this was confirmed when I spoke with Norm several years ago at his shop in Renton. No need to talk to the guy again. 2. The FBI docs are in gross disarray. Get used to it Bobby; it's just the way it is. In fact, the more I read of the FBI docs the more they appear to be akin to Into the Blast. The FBI clearly needs an "editor." A supervisor would do - anyone with some smarts who could read every agent's note and sort it all out. As good a writer as John Detlor is, and he is the author of the History of the FBI, he still mucked-it-up back in '71. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BruceSmith 3 #51958 March 25, 2015 Quote"...If you are going to interview people, you need to start recording them, or at least taking notes for exact quotes once in a while, especially on key points. You have a really bad habit of just claiming someone said this or that without ANY exact quotes from them along the way...and this is very bad reporting. If you don't quote someone (exact words on a point) occasionally, there is no way to verify the reference...." Really wrong, Bobby. My book is filled with a lot more dialogue than your Into the Blast. But then how would you know, since you've never read my book, and it appears you have no intention of ever doing so. Sigh. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
thousandthings 0 #51959 March 25, 2015 18EAny theories on why he asked for 4 chutes with a combination of 2 different styles? Was there a 2nd jumper who didn't jump? I think the popular theory is that; it is to lead FBI into thinking that he'd make a hostage jump with him so they don't sabotage the gear. Accomplice on board is out of question, there were barely 36 pax and clearly they all would've gone thru rigorous background check, especially after the hijacking. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
thousandthings 0 #51960 March 25, 2015 skyjack71 Bruce you spent 15 minutes with Himmelsbach & he ASKED you to leave. Doyou think for ONE moment I believe he said what you stated above. I also wanna invite him just to have pleasure of asking him to LEAVE Isn't there ANYBODY who has not done that Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
thousandthings 0 #51961 March 25, 2015 18E So then if in fact Cooper intentionally asked for two sets of chutes to ensure that the FBI would not tamper with them, giving them the notion that he would take a hostage, one would surmise this was a very smart tactic on his part. Well that and a few other things like no one still knows where did he come from and...well...where did he go. The bugger definitely had a hell of an IQ and some serious exposure (not just training and planning I guess).... they say a lifetime of happiness cannot teach you lessons that a few bad days can. I think this man had seen war/intelligence/operations kind of stuff. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
18E 0 #51962 March 25, 2015 thousandthings*** So then if in fact Cooper intentionally asked for two sets of chutes to ensure that the FBI would not tamper with them, giving them the notion that he would take a hostage, one would surmise this was a very smart tactic on his part. Well that and a few other things like no one still knows where did he come from and...well...where did he go. The bugger definitely had a hell of an IQ and some serious exposure (not just training and planning I guess).... they say a lifetime of happiness cannot teach you lessons that a few bad days can. I think this man had seen war/intelligence/operations kind of stuff. Yes, in view of such details as this (purpose for multiple parachutes), I can see why a conclusion can be drawn as you state above. Here's what I get hung up on; if a man is well-trained in the art of war/intelligence/black-ops/etc, why does he jump into the November night sky over the Pacific Northwest with the rain, cold, wind and uneven terrain in a suit and dress shoes? (I lived in Western Oregon as a kid and am familiar with the weather). This is hardly being prepared for the elements at 10,000 feet on a cold November night. Also, it seems like very poor preparation for a botched landing that could be off-course and place him in an uncompromising position. I go on a day-long fishing trip and take fishing gear, waders, toolkit, change of clothes, cash, water, emergency first-aid, phone, and even a survival kit in the event something unlooked for happens. This guy was jumping out of an airplane at 10,000 feet into the black-of-night cold of the November Pacific NW into some possible rugged terrain with a requested chute, dressed in a suit/raincoat, no headgear, dress shoes and a bag of money wrapped around his waist. I'm just not detecting the intelligence in his prep. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
thousandthings 0 #51963 March 25, 2015 18E Here's what I get hung up on; if a man is well-trained in the art of war/intelligence/black-ops/etc, why does he jump into the November night sky over the Pacific Northwest with the rain, cold, wind and uneven terrain in a suit and dress shoes? (I lived in Western Oregon as a kid and am familiar with the weather). This is hardly being prepared for the elements at 10,000 feet on a cold November night. Also, it seems like very poor preparation for a botched landing that could be off-course and place him in an uncompromising position. I go on a day-long fishing trip and take fishing gear, waders, toolkit, change of clothes, cash, water, emergency first-aid, phone, and even a survival kit in the event something unlooked for happens. This guy was jumping out of an airplane at 10,000 feet into the black-of-night cold of the November Pacific NW into some possible rugged terrain with a requested chute, dressed in a suit/raincoat, no headgear, dress shoes and a bag of money wrapped around his waist. I'm just not detecting the intelligence in his prep. I think it's a matter of perspective. Why do crime at all in which case? I mean there are 1000s of legit ways of making more money than $200K. There are less risky illegit ways than jumping off a plane to make $200K .... I don't know either btw Anyways, no one knows what he was wearing underneath. Even if it was nothing, let's not forget some people are trained in worse conditions than what DBC attempted. Soldiers / spies / counter intelligence guys etc. put up with far worse and a lot more danger, that to in hostile territories. Often at the face of certain death and no more motivation than an "Order". Crime, on the other hand has motivation far more personal than that-PROFITS OR PERSONAL GAINS. I think while a lot of people question what you are, I think we are completely discounting the power of Human Will. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
18E 0 #51964 March 25, 2015 I'm just not detecting the intelligence in his prep. I think it's a matter of perspective. Why do crime at all in which case? I mean there are 1000s of legit ways of making more money than $200K. There are less risky illegit ways than jumping off a plane to make $200K .... I don't know either btw Anyways, no one knows what he was wearing underneath. Even if it was nothing, let's not forget some people are trained in worse conditions than what DBC attempted. Soldiers / spies / counter intelligence guys etc. put up with far worse and a lot more danger, that to in hostile territories. Often at the face of certain death and no more motivation than an "Order". Crime, on the other hand has motivation far more personal than that-PROFITS OR PERSONAL GAINS. I think while a lot of people question what you are, I think we are completely discounting the power of Human Will. Motivation is a very important aspect to understanding any crime, and thus solving it, and this crime is certainly no different. I see various profiles that can help in determining motivation: 1. Criminal-Thief. Motivation - money. 2. Government Operative. Motivation - orders, duty, loyalty. 3. Begrudged Government Operative. Motivation - revenge. 4. Nutcase. Motivation - none necessary ('Because some men aren't looking for anything logical, like money. They can't be bought, bullied, reasoned, or negotiated with. Some men just want to watch the world burn.' ~ Alfred Pennyworth in The Dark Knight. Let me know if there are other 'types' you can think of that would expand this list. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BruceSmith 3 #51965 March 25, 2015 Quote "....18E: I'm just not detecting the intelligence in his prep. I think it's a matter of perspective. Why do crime at all in which case? I mean there are 1000s of legit ways of making more money than $200K. There are less risky illegit ways than jumping off a plane to make $200K .... I don't know either btw Anyways, no one knows what he was wearing underneath. Even if it was nothing, let's not forget some people are trained in worse conditions than what DBC attempted. Soldiers / spies / counter intelligence guys etc. put up with far worse and a lot more danger, that to in hostile territories. Often at the face of certain death and no more motivation than an "Order". Crime, on the other hand has motivation far more personal than that-PROFITS OR PERSONAL GAINS. I think while a lot of people question what you are, I think we are completely discounting the power of Human Will. Motivation is a very important aspect to understanding any crime, and thus solving it, and this crime is certainly no different. I see various profiles that can help in determining motivation: 1. Criminal-Thief. Motivation - money. 2. Government Operative. Motivation - orders, duty, loyalty. 3. Begrudged Government Operative. Motivation - revenge. 4. Nutcase. Motivation - none necessary ('Because some men aren't looking for anything logical, like money. They can't be bought, bullied, reasoned, or negotiated with. Some men just want to watch the world burn.' ~ Alfred Pennyworth in The Dark Knight. Let me know if there are other 'types' you can think of that would expand this list. My Dear 18E and 1K - I offer quite a bit of information and analysis of why other skyjackers stole their plane. In fact, I did a whole chapter on Robb Heady. Plus, there is a lot on Richard McCoy. Other books touch on this subject as well, such and Tosaw's and Rhodes. I'd love to hear your comments after digesting those commentaries. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skyjack71 0 #51966 March 25, 2015 !8E and Thousanthingy not going to try figure out which said what, but regarding some of the thoughts the 2 of you communicated...I would like to comment how the apply to Weber. "definitly had a hell of an IQ and some serious exposure (not just training and planning I guess).... they say a lifetime of happiness cannot teach you lessons that a few bad days can" That statement is so very true & remember having a high IQ does not mean being well educated... things get in the way - behavior problems, wars, family loosing their home to the depression...Duane's brother was a lot older than Duane. Duane was the baby. I believe his brother if my memory serves me was 13/15 yrs older...and his sister was 6 yrs older... Duane wanted to make his parents proud...he wanted to be a pilot. The first time Duane tried to enlist at the ripe old age of 15 he was rejected and his eyesite did not meet the airforce rule - so he manages to get himself in to the navy and then kicked out of the navy in a few months for striking a 90 day wonder who would not leave a young lady alone. In April of 1943 he writes a letter home from Camp Sibert... the penmanship is excellent and the subject matter Evidently he enclose a picture of himself in his army uniform - but I never saw it and it was not something that his brother had access to and his sister tried to send me things - but, her son controlled her life during the last aspect of it as she aged. A lot of the photos I never got to see. At least not the Army picture. Duane L. Weber 35608905 Co D- 2st CWS Tng. Regt Camp Siebert, Ala. I provided the FBI with that information in 1997 and yet they claimed on 2 occassions Duane was never in the ARMY...as late a 2000 the agent was making this claim - and he excused himself from the phone and called me back about 3 hrs later. After 3 yrs of claiming Duane was NOT in the ARMY they FBI ate their words... I guess they didn't know I had a letter mail from Camp Sibert....a flimsy claim of having one of the numbers wrong....Duh! the had the same information I did and supposedly more. Even when CARR came to the thread he tried claiming Duane was not in the ARMY didn't take a heart beat to get that straightened out. NOTE the date of the letter - April 15, 1943 this is very important to remember later on...because of a very long post I will be putting up in a few days... I just found something else in the file I had forgotten about. I HAVE TOLD IN THE PAST THAT DUANE WENT TO KS & NEBRASKA IN 1990 BEFORE HE WENT ON THE MACHINE OR RIGHT AFTER HE WENT ON THE MACHINE. I DID NOT KNOW I HAD PROOF UNTIL THIS MOMENT OR I HAVE STATED IT & FORGOT IT. HE WAS IN HUTCHINSON KS. ON MARCH 14 1990....THERE WAS A $2,438. CHARGE TO MY CREDIT CARD. FROM OLD MILL ANTIQUES. WHERE IS HUTCHINSON, KS. HIS EX WIFE HAD A SISTER WHO HAD AN ANTIQUE SHOP IN KS...I WONDER IF SHE OWNED THAT SHOP IN 1990...WONDER IF THE FBI EVER CHECKED THIS OUT? AT ANY RATE DUANE DISAPPEARED FOR 3 DAYS AROUND THAT TIME AND THERE WAS A ONE WAY FLIGHT TICKET CHARGED TO MY OTHER ACCOUNT FROM TALLAHASSEE TO NEBRASKA. Sorry guys I got off track....but the date of that letter is very important for you to remember and then remember this DUANE flies off of the map for 18 months or more only to surface again in CA. where his parent lived in 1943. The entire time he is in the Army his parents are fighting the system to get his bad conduct discharged from his Navy record...how the hell - I just realized that the Army & the Navy seem at time stacked!Copyright 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012 2013, 2014, 2015 by Jo Weber Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skyjack71 0 #51967 March 25, 2015 Do not know who said what - but below are quotes that will mean something very important in a few days. "Here's what I get hung up on; if a man is well-trained in the art of war/intelligence/black-ops/etc, why does he jump into the November night sky over the Pacific Northwest with the rain, cold, wind and uneven terrain in a suit and dress shoes? (I lived in Western Oregon as a kid and am familiar with the weather). This is hardly being prepared for the elements at 10,000 feet on a cold November night. Also, it seems like very poor preparation for a botched landing that could be off-course and place him in an uncompromising position." "Anyways, no one knows what he was wearing underneath. Even if it was nothing, let's not forget some people are trained in worse conditions than what DBC attempted. Soldiers / spies / counter intelligence guys etc. put up with far worse and a lot more danger, that to in hostile territories. Often at the face of certain death and no more motivation than an "Order". " Crime, on the other hand has motivation far more personal than that-PROFITS OR PERSONAL GAINS". ************************* ************************ OK you guys just set the whole thing up & you guys & I have NEVER spoke & we do not know each other & have never met. Case #1199879 Municipal Court, Akron, Ohio May 5, 1943. The Case of State of Ohio Planitiff, vs. Duane Weber Defendant, is set for trial in the municipal court - 8th floor Police Court for Thursday May 8, 1943. 1 o'clock P.M Courtney & Manes Plaintiff Underswood Defendatn. Walter Rice Clerk. Retain this for a while - because it is going to take several days for the package to open up....and to lead the blind to Cooper....but it is here & it was in the Weber files all along - (I gave copies of all of this to the FBI) someone missed it. Maybe I am not understanding it, but it will be a few days & then you will be asked to remember this posting. A letter regarding a marriage certificate is dated October 11, 1943 in the County of Monroe - Monroe, Michigan. Duane Weber to Daisy Schuller - July 23, 1943. Duane's brother made a perplexing note on the paper he sent to me. "Note the date of letter April 15, 1943 and the court appearance May 5, 1943 and the marriage July 23, 1943 in Monroe, Mich." In October his mother verified the marriage as the information was mailed to her....was this the mother of the only child Duane supposedly had? He told his friend he had both a son and a daughter....I was only aware of a daughter who was 9 yrs old the last tiime he saw her. "Note the date of letter April 15, 1943 and the court appearance May 5, 1943 and the marriage July 23, 1943 in Monroe, Mich." ;)Does that not sound ODD to some of you - Duane's brother was an engineer with Boeing & with a great deal of education. He did not understand the information he found in the files his mother kept & frankly I didn't either...thought the FBI would have some answers, but they didn't even know all of this...nor did they ever acknowledge it.Copyright 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012 2013, 2014, 2015 by Jo Weber Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skyjack71 0 #51968 March 26, 2015 Duanes - supposed Army Record: March 31, 1943 to July 14, 1943 - did he get kicked out of the army or did they put him in a SPECIAL program.. Was he in prison - nope not until 1945. April of 1943 a specialized Training program was made available for those who did NOT fit....seemingly else where. This was Army Mountain Training Center and the 10th Mountain Division....don't get hung up here. There was prisoners there also! I finally figure this out - but, quiet by accident. I knew Duane had talked about this place and pointed out things about it - like he had been there, but I was unaware that prisoners were also housed there and co-mingled. A man Duane highly admired was stationed there - a man he spoke of. I knew little of Weber's background. I now believe Duane knew this man thru his Great Aunt in Canada who was Swedish. I have some place a picture of her and of her grave...evidently Duane went to Canada - Montreal or where-ever. I will have to find that picture and of her and the grave stone... since it was something Duane had - I think it is the key to the past & to his connections. This part is very confusing....was Duane military, questionable or a renegade from March 31, 1943 to July 14, 1943...problem is they only mentioned 2 month at Camp Siebert - did he get sent to Colorado in May & was he in Colorado in a form of encarceration until his official release in July....or did he remain encarcerated they until the next date he show up on. Some how in all of this is the Columbia encarceration at a boys school, from which he seemingly escaped - even the governent could never prove where he was util he ended up in CA and got sent to Mc Neil...but he was on the run - they couldn't seem to tie him down.. Records seemly a shambles as he escaped - but where the hell was he. Hiding in Plain site or sitting in jail someplace else...he was young & they needed the labor - & from what I do know about Duane's past - I believe this is were he was. Can anyone find out the name of the man in the picture I will attach...I know it was made in CO and that one of the individuals was a young man who went to Operation Market Garden and was wounded - I knew this man's histor without even reading about him. Duane had told me about this man, but i would not realize that until I saw this photo...I do not know if the man on the left is Weber - but he sure looks like Weber did in photo close to that time...but he has on a uniform. I was thinking maybe it was during that time for the 2 months plus after he was sent out of Camp Siebert...if this man is him - he has on a uniform. I expect the wayward men there did more than labor...perhaps enticed to change their lives. I also believe that they man Duane went to see in Seattle may have been related to the man who became a hero and an accomplished person. Like Duane he was a swimmer - some how Duane and this man knew each other on a personal basis. Remember that the man Duane went to see in WA in 1979 was Swedish also...like Aluana or Aluna or Alana - he worked in an office not far from the hotel we stayed in - it was supposedly in the same building that housed a News Paper or the guy worked for the New Paper in Seattle. Duane's past is convoluted & like a jigsaw puzzle.Copyright 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012 2013, 2014, 2015 by Jo Weber Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BruceSmith 3 #51969 March 26, 2015 Quote"...Duane's past is convoluted & like a jigsaw puzzle...." No shit, girl. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BruceSmith 3 #51970 March 26, 2015 Quote"... I believe the hijacker...selected the military chute, and seemed to know what he was doing with it...." What military chute, Bobby? You have yet to establish that a military chute, whether it be an NB-6 or an NB-8, was ever on Flight 305. What's your proof, and how did you draw you conclusion? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BruceSmith 3 #51971 March 26, 2015 Quote"... I believe the hijacker...selected the military chute, and seemed to know what he was doing with it...." So, you believe Earl Cossey? You think he told the truth about providing a military chute? How come? So, do you think that Cooper used Coss' NB-6, or was it the NB-8? How do you chose between the two, since Coss said he provided both at different times to different people. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skyjack71 0 #51972 March 26, 2015 The McNeil File is a puzzle - there were NO longer any picture available...I am the one who found them - the FBI claimed they did NOT exist & the agent changes his mind & they do exist. January of 23rd 1945 conviced & sentenced to McNeil (normally a federal prison at that time). He had been arrested in Chicago in November of 25th of 1944 & transported back to CA. I guess he went back to see the woman he married in July of 1943 - maybe she was pregnant & gave birth to a child in 1944 which would be about right for the child I have looked for all of these yrs. She would have been named Zona. Rumor had it Duane also had a son - but not something he told me. The McNeil records also an have an erroneous birth date of 6-18-20 as it was 6-18-24. Since I am way off base I will even take a stab at why he chose Nov. 24th...he was born in the yr 1924 it was Nov. 25 1944 when he was sentenced and sent to McNeil.Copyright 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012 2013, 2014, 2015 by Jo Weber Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
smokin99 0 #51973 March 26, 2015 I know details and accuracy aren't important to some folks that have a habit of just throwing any ole thing out there, but just to set the record straight..... Robert, You said that Bruce did not "steal" the parachute document from Gray and that the document has been on the vault for years. Then you gave the impression that you presented it here to uncover some truth. If you can prove otherwise from the below please do. The parachute document was originally posted here at the dropzone as a jpg attachment of a screenshot, by 377 who received it from snowmman. I posted a link to the actual pdf shortly thereafter. The pdf originated from Geoff Grays Hunt for DB Cooper web site project files which apparently he inadvertently? or not? left unprotected. After it was posted here, and set off a LOT of discussion, Gray closed access and, if memory serves, proceeded to post an article about it on his website. So.... since it was not found anywhere else I'm assuming Geoff copied it from the FBI files (those same files that you said he didn't copy and was only able to look at), and Bruce likely got it from either Geoff's site or here. Apparently, since Geoff is walking around free and hasn't been charged with purloining/distributing classified government property and/or "active case file data", I will also assume that he didn't steal it and/or had permission to copy it. Either way -- the only FBI vault that I am aware of related to Mr. Cooper "primarily" has a bunch of useless stuff like newspaper articles many of which are basically unreadable excerpts that you can read a lot easier elsewhere. Even the money list is easier viewed in Tosaw's book if you are inclined to go looking for old twenties. Pretty sure that vault has never contained the parachute document. Those same 7 pdfs have been there forever. And....just a reminder...what everyone thought was "found" news that had never been uncovered before (just like the Dan Cooper comic connection) was actually reported on in newspaper articles before the internet was a twinkle in Al Gore's eye.but....A lie gets halfway around the world before the truth has a chance to get its pants on.....Winston Churchill Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
smokin99 0 #51974 March 26, 2015 If the pics are too big I will delete.. The main point that I see in all of this at the end of the day is that there is decent documentation that Cossey at least packed the parachutes. In that sense they were "his" chutes and he was the "go to" guy because he packed them and he was the "master rigger" with knowledge of parachutes. As I've said before I think the fish got bigger and bigger and why let a few details spoil a good story. LOL -- why some folks on here would have a problem with that is beyond me. It also looks like his name is on the chest container. Someone with better eyes than I will have to come up with the date though for some reason I think I see Oct 1953. [inline Parachute_Bag.jpg] [inline PBcloseup.jpg] but....A lie gets halfway around the world before the truth has a chance to get its pants on.....Winston Churchill Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
smokin99 0 #51975 March 26, 2015 RobertMBlevinsSwitlik model 48c7155: QuoteDrawing 48C7155, Canopy and Pack Assembly – Parachute, Chest Type Drawing by Dave Gold, one of literally thousands of parachute-related items now at Wright.edu in their Dave Gold Parachute Collection. You can find the PDF by searching on Dave Gold, etc. Date of the drawing by Gold is 1948. So your guess at 1953 could be correct. First thing I thought when I saw the massive, literally unending list of Gold's parachute-related collection was this: I'll bet every jumper at DZ already knows this guy. He might even have reached godlike status by now. I think Wright actually has a museum for his stuff. I saw something about the boxes they keep it all in stretched out over a hundred feet in length. Yes, I think it is a fairly well-known collection if you've ever searched for the words parachute and history in the same string. The mother lode, but I think the problem is finding much on line (other than the index of what's in the collection at Wright).but....A lie gets halfway around the world before the truth has a chance to get its pants on.....Winston Churchill Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites