DB Cooper

[skyjack71 0]

Georger U and I need to talk and I do NOT mean on this thread. A phone line that is NOT recorded. I will call from my cell. Yes, 377 I do have a cell phone....a simple one, but what I use when I do NOT want someone to have my phone number (I never receive phone calls on it - any incoming calls are deleted other than family members). YOU are aware I do keep somethings VERY private.

What we need to talk about is NOT for this thread - but, I will say enough to peak your interest - I have sat on some things for at least 8 yrs now.

We will talk about #1 Jerry (deceased)and I do NOT mean Jerry T. and #2 Bob and I do NOT mean Knoss.

We will talk about #3 Robert and I do NOT mean Robt99.

We will talk about Laos and the 60's and Coverts and the CIA - briefly.

We will talk about planes & individuals involved in their "tranport" to X - AAAAAAA! ALL which go back to my meeting Ed - the 1st of Duane's old friends.

Mr P & Mr H are deceased and I have mention them in the yrs I have been on this thread - but, only in passing as individuals, connected to Jumping who were OLD friends of Duane.

I spoke with the 1s the 3 parties starting in 2004 to include 2006. I am not talking about Cooper "want to be's", but real people....who had REAL backgrounds....and secrets to keep.

I am a little hesitant to mention a MR X who has at one time monitored this thread at one time(posting only briefly) and threatened me.

I could tell the FBI about this ALL day long, but they would NOT have a clue what I was talking about and hope you DO!

Most of these individuals are deceased and I did NOT give clues to the ones that may still be alive.

I know P Harris and Mr. P are deceased, but never got to talk to them about their involvement. They had deceased now. But BOTH were still live in 1979...OLD men do TALK and some KNOW when to shut up....I just did NOT find Mr Harris or Mr P until they had deceased.

Everyone is gone now (Not sure about Mr Robt. - so nothing I have to say can be verified), Perhaps you are NOT the monitor I think you are, but I believe the ONLY reason U stay here.

Old men talk and Old sick men are dangerous. I am tired of the chase and have some things that need my undivided attention. These men will not be forgotten and then there are those who supposedly did not exist.

What I have to discuss will NEVER Go any further than our phone call (and if you wish in person so you can be assured none of it will be made public or recorded).

I have pressing matters that need my attention and they do NOT involve Cooper.

Hope BRUCE makes a SMASHING ass out of himself!

Copyright 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012 2013, 2014, 2015 by Jo Weber

[georger 197]

skyjack71

Georger U and I need to talk and I do NOT mean on this thread. A phone line that is NOT recorded. I will call from my cell. Yes, 377 I do have a cell phone....a simple one, but what I use when I do NOT want someone to have my phone number (I never receive phone calls on it - any incoming calls are deleted other than family members). YOU are aware I do keep somethings VERY private.

What we need to talk about is NOT for this thread - but, I will say enough to peak your interest - I have sat on some things for at least 8 yrs now.

We will talk about #1 Jerry (deceased)and I do NOT mean Jerry T. and #2 Bob and I do NOT mean Knoss.

We will talk about #3 Robert and I do NOT mean Robt99.

We will talk about Laos and the 60's and Coverts and the CIA - briefly.

We will talk about planes & individuals involved in their "tranport" to X - AAAAAAA! ALL which go back to my meeting Ed - the 1st of Duane's old friends.

Mr P & Mr H are deceased and I have mention them in the yrs I have been on this thread - but, only in passing as individuals, connected to Jumping who were OLD friends of Duane.

I spoke with the 1s the 3 parties starting in 2004 to include 2006. I am not talking about Cooper "want to be's", but real people....who had REAL backgrounds....and secrets to keep.

I am a little hesitant to mention a MR X who has at one time monitored this thread at one time(posting only briefly) and threatened me.

I could tell the FBI about this ALL day long, but they would NOT have a clue what I was talking about and hope you DO!

Most of these individuals are deceased and I did NOT give clues to the ones that may still be alive.

I know P Harris and Mr. P are deceased, but never got to talk to them about their involvement. They had deceased now. But BOTH were still live in 1979...OLD men do TALK and some KNOW when to shut up....I just did NOT find Mr Harris or Mr P until they had deceased.

Everyone is gone now (Not sure about Mr Robt. - so nothing I have to say can be verified), Perhaps you are NOT the monitor I think you are, but I believe the ONLY reason U stay here.

Old men talk and Old sick men are dangerous. I am tired of the chase and have some things that need my undivided attention. These men will not be forgotten and then there are those who supposedly did not exist.

What I have to discuss will NEVER Go any further than our phone call (and if you wish in person so you can be assured none of it will be made public or recorded).

I have pressing matters that need my attention and they do NOT involve Cooper.

Hope BRUCE makes a SMASHING ass out of himself!

check your PMs.

[georger 197]

BruceSmith

Quote

"...attached is real..."

If she would like to go to Ariel next year, I will gladly give her a personal escort.

Bruce, she was 101 in 1997! She is deceased. Sorry.

Otherwise she would go with you in a flash. She has been to
Ariel. I think she knew Donna's family, and she definitely knew
JT's wife's family... Shelley and I have discussed it years ago..

What a remarkable lady.

[BruceSmith 3]

georger

***

Quote

"...attached is real..."

If she would like to go to Ariel next year, I will gladly give her a personal escort.

Bruce, she was 101 in 1997! She is deceased. Sorry.



Alas.

[georger 197]

BruceSmith

******

Quote

"...attached is real..."

If she would like to go to Ariel next year, I will gladly give her a personal escort.

Bruce, she was 101 in 1997! She is deceased. Sorry.



Alas.

No kidding .. just a remarkable person. And she and Grandpa
were a team.

[skyjack71 0]

Not sure how much GALEN COOK knows, but I do NOT believe he knows the real truth. He has chased SO many COOPERS and "ghosts of Cooper" that little he has to say will be given a lot of attention. Gossett may indeed have had knowledge of who Cooper was & why he talked about a safe deposit box in AK and BC .
If the man in the photo below made by ME (Jo Weber) in Salt Lake City was GOSSETT then you have the connection.

If that photo was NOT Gossett it was a pilot who flew planes that may have at one time carried a man who later became known to be Dan Cooper. The man was a pilot and Duane did NOT want him to see him. Duane mentioned Air Alaska or something like that,

The Cooper thing was NOT expected & was the repercussion from someone who didn't think they got what they deserved and/or promises not kept.

Cooper did NOT expect to survive, but he did. Why do you think he did everything he could - to make it appear that he died? It was 1979 when he made the deposit of the monies in WA. The crime was 8 yrs old and he had the opportunity to do it. Those who knew him in connection to a chute only knew him by another name. One that could NOT be connected to Duane L. Weber or John Collins - perhaps only a nickname - because they were paid in CASH - 5K if they finished the mission. 5K was a lot of money in 1962 - 1965.

Because of things the ex told me I have narrowed the time frame from 1962 to 1965. THREE fricking yrs one would have thought the FBI would have figured out...but they had to have ALL of the info and that damn sure was not forth coming. $5K for a few months of your life - an excon could get a pretty good start in life with $5k in 1963 and 1964.

He knew eventually someone might figure out who he was & the reason Cooper could NOT ever be revealed was because of what he did know! (NOT sure they ever actually knew who Cooper was until 1990). Perhaps Weber cashed in on a little life insurance in 1990.

In 1971 - the government didn't want the public to know they hired men of his kind to take on certain DIRTY jobs. "The Man Who Knew Too Much" - Maybe the title was a play on words and I do believe Duane knew more than one man who was on that assignment - I can only guess why Duane left nothing in safe deposit box other than an OLD magazine with the very article that was in the older magazine I had thrown away yrs before. When he pointed out the magazine article in the other book, he commented "I used to know a couple of those guys".

Duane left behind more, but since I didn't grasp who Dan Cooper was - it just got sold with the VAN or it was something I thought was just trash. I only kept the magazine because of WHERE it was found and he had noted something about the article.

If I had known who Dan Cooper was perhaps I would have been a little cautious in disposing of things after his death.

I would have check the soles of those shoe and have looked for hidden things - but I just packed stuff up and took it to the Helping Hands.

So much for the past - it is gone & now all I can do is let someone know the things I found, but not to be revealed in a thread so some WRITER can use it in his next up and coming book or so Galen can make it part of his book & movie.

There was ONLY one Dan Cooper
and I had him all along. A coward he wasn't - perhaps a good man only because being known would have meant a certain death. I think that is why when we first moved to VA - Duane would take his eyes all around the room and I wondered about that - I only notice this action to be exaggerated in Va. Beach, Va....(Duane told me about training there -but that was all he said). He knew the military facilities backwards and forwards in that area....strange for man who had never lived there or served there?

NOW try to cipher thur all of that CRAP! I am not a writer, but I was married to one strange guy - who did a LOT of weird things. NO I did not make up things that Duane said or did - I tried to make sense out of them! Plus I wanted to remind those who have followed this - that Duane did KNOW his way around mililtary facilities.

AS far as I have been able to find out Duane was never in VA. Bch., but how the hell did he know all of the facilities there and described what was on the base and in the area. He talked about amphib training there - I do NOT know if I spelled that right - but that was the main thing he mentioned plus the on base public facilities.

Copyright 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012 2013, 2014, 2015 by Jo Weber

[BruceSmith 3]

Quote

"...Come on, now. Let's be fair. I'm 7-1 on Ozette Island crossings. Check the picture. Doesn't look THAT far across from the beach, does it? Hell, you can almost walk it.

(*insert evil laugh here*)

Of course, the second and third pictures are a bit more realistic......"

7-1, eh? Not bad. But I'm more of an 8-0 kind of guy....

[BruceSmith 3]

BruceSmith

Quote

"...Come on, now. Let's be fair. I'm 7-1 on Ozette Island crossings. Check the picture. Doesn't look THAT far across from the beach, does it? Hell, you can almost walk it.

(*insert evil laugh here*)

Of course, the second and third pictures are a bit more realistic......"

7-1, eh? Not bad. But I'm more of an 8-0 kind of guy....

Robert, I just read your Newsvine account of your love affair with Ozette Island. You are one crazy motherfucker! Does Jon Krakauer know you're loose in the wilds? You two should get together and do a book and screen play of your "adventures."

You have defied death on three occaisons, now. Wow.

[georger 197]

377

Bruce,

Et cetera ......

377

377 _ Why did Cooper have them go to 10k feet for him to bail?

During the whole period of him getting the door open and stairs
out they are at 7000 ft and have been flying at 7000 for some
time. With the door finally open and stairs out and Tina forward
they climb to 10k feet and slow the plane at Cooper's request.

Couldn't he have bailed at 7000 ?

Is there something special about 10,000 feet that only an
trained parachutist would know_beyond the extra time under
chute? Would a novice necessarily know or care if it was
7000 vs 10,000 ? Is it a visual issue given the cloud cover at
the time? What is the dominant concern Cooper is expressing
in this instruction?

Maybe this is a stupid question ?

[mrshutter45 21]

georger

***Bruce,

Et cetera ......

377

377 _ Why did Cooper have them go to 10k feet for him to bail?

During the whole period of him getting the door open and stairs
out they are at 7000 ft and have been flying at 7000 for some
time. With the door finally open and stairs out and Tina forward
they climb to 10k feet and slow the plane at Cooper's request.

Couldn't he have bailed at 7000 ?

Is there something special about 10,000 feet that only an
trained parachutist would know_beyond the extra time under
chute? Would a novice necessarily know or care if it was
7000 vs 10,000 ? Is it a visual issue given the cloud cover at
the time? What is the dominant concern Cooper is expressing
in this instruction?

Maybe this is a stupid question ?

It's about 14 minutes into the flight before the climb to 10,000, or 27 nautical miles north of Toledo. they level at 10,000 around 7:53...18 nautical miles miles from Toledo. if you go by the transcripts....

"It is surprising how aggressive people get, once they latch onto their suspect and say, 'Hey, he's our guy.' No matter what you tell them, they refuse to believe you" Agent Carr FBI

[BruceSmith 3]

georger

***Bruce,

Et cetera ......

377

377 _ Why did Cooper have them go to 10k feet for him to bail?

During the whole period of him getting the door open and stairs
out they are at 7000 ft and have been flying at 7000 for some
time. With the door finally open and stairs out and Tina forward
they climb to 10k feet and slow the plane at Cooper's request.

Couldn't he have bailed at 7000 ?

Is there something special about 10,000 feet that only an
trained parachutist would know_beyond the extra time under
chute? Would a novice necessarily know or care if it was
7000 vs 10,000 ? Is it a visual issue given the cloud cover at
the time? What is the dominant concern Cooper is expressing
in this instruction?

Maybe this is a stupid question ?



Hardly. It begs a further questions: How do we know the metrics Cooper purportedly demanded are what Boeing recommended for a jump, ie:

1. 10,000 feet
2. Flaps at 15
3. Gear down and locked
4. Speed under 200 mph

etc.

I've just heard this so often I've considerd it Gospel Truth. (The approved gospels from the Council of Nicea, of course, not the others ones buried back in Alexandria, such as the Gospels of Philip, Thomas, or Mary...)

[Hominid 0]

BruceSmith

It begs a further questions: How do we know the metrics Cooper purportedly demanded are what Boeing recommended for a jump, ie:

1. 10,000 feet
2. Flaps at 15
3. Gear down and locked
4. Speed under 200 mph

etc.

I've just heard this so often I've considerd it Gospel Truth.

"We" know because "we" haven't read the "transcript" or "we" haven't understood what was said there about the topic. If you've heard this so often, etc., you've been listening to the clueless. Look in the TTY part of the "transcript" for what Boeing said was needed. (Read "flat position" as "flap position.")

Let's not divert attention from the original question.

[skyjack71 0]

georger

377 _ Why did Cooper have them go to 10k feet for him to bail?

During the whole period of him getting the door open and stairs
out they are at 7000 ft and have been flying at 7000 for some
time. With the door finally open and stairs out and Tina forward
they climb to 10k feet and slow the plane at Cooper's request.

Couldn't he have bailed at 7000 ?

Is there something special about 10,000 feet that only an
trained parachutist would know_beyond the extra time under
chute? Would a novice necessarily know or care if it was
7000 vs 10,000 ? Is it a visual issue given the cloud cover at
the time? What is the dominant concern Cooper is expressing
in this instruction?

Maybe this is a stupid question ?

Georger, IS not a stupid question.
I am going to give my old woman who knows nothing about altitudes and what the visibilty difference would be, but, here goes.

On a short flight to Atlanta, Ga from Pensacola FL I flew on one the last Boeings like Cooper jumped from.

There was two Pilots sitting not far from me - this was day light, but there was breaking clouds below us and I asked them how high we were. I do NOT now remember their answer, but it would have been between 7 and 10.

A guess on my part - but you pilots out there might understand what I am saying. If there was Clouds and if Cooper did NOT know a storm had come into the area - WHAT could he have seen from 10,000 ft he could not see at 7,000 ft? PERHAPS hazes created by high towers! ONE of the tallest and brightest was the one at one of the dams in 1971.

Since my memory is getting so bad I do not know which one, but I would say the newest damn & the light on it. Duane told me you could see it for miles (we were on the ground when he made this statement in 1979 so it might NOT mean a fricking thing). My other question is HOW did he know about that specific Dam and how bright the light was?

It was in this same conversation he told me about the communications system at the dams. How they talked to each other and about the quich where a man was let go.

WHAT exactly was that quich - was it more than the communications? WAS this guy able to increase the intensity of the light or make any changes like causing it to go dim and then brighter? Could the light be made to FLICKER!

DUMB stupid OLE Woman QUESTION? Maybe someone familiar with the Dams and the lighting could answer that question.
Duane said the light could be seen for miles - and mentioned a man who was let go, but was reinstated. Another question HOW the hell did he know this - it was NOT public knowledge as far as I know?

Can those LIGHTS be controled in any way? Could (even on a regular night) those light be seen and what was their intensity. Evidently the lights were so flights would NOT hit them or get too close - THEY had to be intense and more so than regular lower microwave towers or other light towers.

These Dams are on the River and this one dam was located the closest to the mountain - St. Helens. Would that have meant that one tower would have had to be MORE intense?

Another question - does any one know the name of the man who worked the tower Nov 24, 1971?
If so WHAT was his background?

Copyright 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012 2013, 2014, 2015 by Jo Weber

[skyjack71 0]

Hominid

***
It begs a further questions: How do we know the metrics Cooper purportedly demanded are what Boeing recommended for a jump, ie:

1. 10,000 feet
2. Flaps at 15
3. Gear down and locked
4. Speed under 200 mph

etc.

I've just heard this so often I've considerd it Gospel Truth.

"We" know because "we" haven't read the "transcript" or "we" haven't understood what was said there about the topic. If you've heard this so often, etc., you've been listening to the clueless. Look in the TTY part of the "transcript" for what Boeing said was needed. (Read "flat position" as "flap position.")

Let's not divert attention from the original question.

Dumb Stupid OLE Woman answer.
The flaps slowed the speed of the plane down.

Copyright 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012 2013, 2014, 2015 by Jo Weber

[skyjack71 0]

This is NOT off topic, but as I do it I have Classical music playing so loud from my kitchen on the only workable CD player I have (single play). Lighting got the system in 2004 and it is too heavy for me to take in and NO one around here works on the old systems. I need music right now and I need calming music - I am trying to finish up what I MUST do at this time so I can address more serious problems that do NOT involve me or Cooper or my health.

What I am going putting in this thread is information I have - but I will not divulge the articles so I have to use MY WORDS. I apologize to the man who wrote the article and hope I do not infringe on his rights. As what I am stating is only my version of what has been told and published.


A former Air Force Lieutenant from 1960 to 1965 wrote the article from which I have taken the liberty of telling about in my own words.

The man was active - 1960 to 1965 and his encounters with Smoke jumpers.....during that time frame.

Parts of this involves Intermountain Aviation, CIA operations and Marana, Az.

He talks about some of the colorful characters who claimed particpated in the Bay of Pigs, Arctic ice islands & Laos. He himself was NOT involved I presumed - just story told by some of the rough edge guys he came in contact with.

Copyright 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012 2013, 2014, 2015 by Jo Weber

[skyjack71 0]

I got ahead of myself so deleted this post. Old women do that!

A little more of what I am trying to tell, but it means nothing - just a story told by someone else.

He mentions Operation COLD FEET!
Interesting just because.

He mentions 1962 and Intermountain Aviation B-17 with the Fulton Skyhook apparatus.

Not mentioned: During the Skyhook ventures one trainee made the wrong knot almost costing someone else his life. Inserted just because Duane told me that story.

He mentions Cargo kicker...a terminolog we have often thought Cooper could have been.

This mean ZERO and has nothing to do with anything.

The article is NOT about Cooper - just part of my research and has things in it that - seemingly have some kind of connection to WEBER. Maybe Duane just told me stories he read - or heard - or perhaps about people he knew.

Copyright 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012 2013, 2014, 2015 by Jo Weber

[Robert99 37]

RobertMBlevins

It's not a stupid question, and I have some thoughts on it.

1) Maybe Cooper knew about V-23, but not neccesarily the exact positions in the vicinity of that route of places like Mt Adams, St Helens, and the higher foothills. So climbing to 10,000 would ensure you don't jump and then find out you are only three or four thousand feet above the ground, when you were flying along at 7,000 feet.

2) Some clues indicate Cooper had no intention of remaining aboard 305 any longer than a few minutes, for whatever reason. I have (*personal opinion*) doubts that Cooper actually planned to jump anywhere south of an east-west line starting at Olympia. He may have wanted to jump even farther north. But once that plan stalled, he was forced into jumping over territory that almost no one could have memorized for a night jump. Jumping from a greater elevation could just be a safety thing for him, or at least he may have thought so.

3) The cloud cover may have been heavy, but it may not have been at 100% coverage. There may have been breaks here and there. At a higher elevation you might have a better chance to get your general bearings. For example, from 10,000 along V-23 it's entirely conceivable the hijacker might spot the headlights to the west on Interstate 5, see the city of Olympia, Centralia, Chehalis. This would tell you which way was west, anyway. At a lower altitude, you might not be able to spot these things at all. The most important thing to the hijacker when he jumped would be to reach the ground safely. The SECOND most important thing could have been which way to go after he landed.

Total guesswork, of course...

Blevins, There are a few problems with your "guesswork".

First, Cooper specified the 10,000 feet altitude while the airliner was on the ground in Seattle and then didn't mention it again. Maybe he felt that the flight crew could be trusted not to run into a mountain.

Second, Cooper didn't say a single word about V-23 or any other route.

Initially, he said only that he wanted to go to Mexico. But when told that the airliner could not fly nonstop to Mexico in the configuration he specified, he agreed to go to Reno.

If nothing else, the above suggests that Cooper was not familiar with the range capabilities of the 727 with various configurations of the flaps and landing gear. Perhaps he was not as aeronautically qualified or as familiar with the 727 as some give him credit for being.

Also, if you think Cooper is going to locate his position by a glimpse through an overcast and two or three additional cloud layers in the middle of the night and while in the middle of nowhere, then I can only conclude that you do not have a realistic understanding of the situation that Cooper was in at that point.

Cooper never explained why he selected the altitude, speed, and aircraft configuration that he specified. And there does not seem to have been a compelling reason for stating more than he did on those subjects.

Robert99

[georger 197]

RobertMBlevins

******Bruce,

Et cetera ......

377

377 _ Why did Cooper have them go to 10k feet for him to bail?

During the whole period of him getting the door open and stairs
out they are at 7000 ft and have been flying at 7000 for some
time. With the door finally open and stairs out and Tina forward
they climb to 10k feet and slow the plane at Cooper's request.

Couldn't he have bailed at 7000 ?

Is there something special about 10,000 feet that only an
trained parachutist would know_beyond the extra time under
chute? Would a novice necessarily know or care if it was
7000 vs 10,000 ? Is it a visual issue given the cloud cover at
the time? What is the dominant concern Cooper is expressing
in this instruction?

Maybe this is a stupid question ?

It's not a stupid question, and I have some thoughts on it.

1) Maybe Cooper knew about V-23, but not neccesarily the exact positions in the vicinity of that route of places like Mt Adams, St Helens, and the higher foothills. So climbing to 10,000 would ensure you don't jump and then find out you are only three or four thousand feet above the ground, when you were flying along at 7,000 feet.

2) Some clues indicate Cooper had no intention of remaining aboard 305 any longer than a few minutes, for whatever reason. I have (*personal opinion*) doubts that Cooper actually planned to jump anywhere south of an east-west line starting at Olympia. He may have wanted to jump even farther north. But once that plan stalled, he was forced into jumping over territory that almost no one could have memorized for a night jump. Jumping from a greater elevation could just be a safety thing for him, or at least he may have thought so.

3) The cloud cover may have been heavy, but it may not have been at 100% coverage. There may have been breaks here and there. At a higher elevation you might have a better chance to get your general bearings. For example, from 10,000 along V-23 it's entirely conceivable the hijacker might spot the headlights to the west on Interstate 5, see the city of Olympia, Centralia, Chehalis. This would tell you which way was west, anyway. At a lower altitude, you might not be able to spot these things at all. The most important thing to the hijacker when he jumped would be to reach the ground safely. The SECOND most important thing could have been which way to go after he landed.

Total guesswork, of course...

Be aware ... Im not sure it was Coop who set 10,000 but Flt
Ops and the pilots, mainly to streamline flying under the configs
Cooper did request and to preserve fuel. But Cooper did ask for
"unpressurised". 10,000 feet may have been the optimal
compromise .... set by who ?

There are posts about this back in the thread.

I want to know if anyone else has a reason (or source) to
believe Cooper asked for 10,000 feet?

Why? Because it has become evident or alleged Cooper made
requests that are not in any Transcript.

Im beating some bushes to see what flushes out ...

[Robert99 37]

georger

Be aware ... Im not sure it was Coop who set 10,000 but Flt Ops and the pilots, mainly to streamline flying under the configs Cooper did request and to preserve fuel. But Cooper did ask for "unpressurised". 10,000 feet may have been the optimal compromise .... set by who ?

There are posts about this back in the thread.

I want to know if anyone else has a reason (or source) to
believe Cooper asked for 10,000 feet?

Why? Because it has become evident or alleged Cooper made requests that are not in any Transcript.

Im beating some bushes to see what flushes out ...

During the flight to Reno, perhaps in the Oakland ATC transcripts, there is a conversation between the controllers and flight crew. The point was that if the airliner went much above 10,000 feet there was a possibility of the cabin oxygen masks being deployed. They did not want that to happen because they thought it would set Cooper off if he was still onboard. The tone of that conversation was that Cooper had specified the 10,000 feet altitude.

Nevertheless, the airliner did gradually climb to 11,000 feet in Northern California before turning toward Reno just north of Red Bluff. This additional altitude was needed to cross the intervening mountains. And the cabin masks did not drop down.

As a general aviation rule, oxygen is recommended when the cabin altitude is 10,000 feet or higher. And that is especially the case at night due to adverse effects on night vision without oxygen.

However, the flight crew (and Tina?) had oxygen masks in the cockpit on an entirely separate system from the cabin drop down masks. And the flight crew was told to use that system at various times.

Robert99

[Robert99 37]

skyjack71

What I am going put in this thread is information I have - but I will not divulge the articles so I have to use MY WORDS. I apologize to the man who wrote the article and hope I do not infringe on his rights. As what I am stating is only my version of what has been told and published.


A former Air Force Lieutenant from 1960 to 1965 wrote the article from which I have taken the liberty of telling about in my own words.

The man was active - 1960 to 1965 and his encounters with Smoke jumpers.....during that time frame.

Parts of this involves Intermountain Aviation, CIA operations and Marana, Az.

He talks about some of the colorful characters who claimed particpated in the Bay of Pigs, Arctic ice islands & Laos. He himself was NOT involved I presumed - just story told by some of the rough edge guys he came in contact with.

Jo, You seem to feel that Duane was involved in every interesting program that you see on cable TV. Why don't you just say you saw it on TV instead of claiming you knew the author of some articles on the same subject.

Or is it just a strange coincidence that some of the events you described above were covered on cable TV not to long ago. Are you infringing on the rights of the television people?

Robert99

[georger 197]

Robert99

***

Be aware ... Im not sure it was Coop who set 10,000 but Flt Ops and the pilots, mainly to streamline flying under the configs Cooper did request and to preserve fuel. But Cooper did ask for "unpressurised". 10,000 feet may have been the optimal compromise .... set by who ?

There are posts about this back in the thread.

I want to know if anyone else has a reason (or source) to
believe Cooper asked for 10,000 feet?

Why? Because it has become evident or alleged Cooper made requests that are not in any Transcript.

Im beating some bushes to see what flushes out ...

During the flight to Reno, perhaps in the Oakland ATC transcripts, there is a conversation between the controllers and flight crew. The point was that if the airliner went much above 10,000 feet there was a possibility of the cabin oxygen masks being deployed. They did not want that to happen because they thought it would set Cooper off if he was still onboard. The tone of that conversation was that Cooper had specified the 10,000 feet altitude.

Nevertheless, the airliner did gradually climb to 11,000 feet in Northern California before turning toward Reno just north of Red Bluff. This additional altitude was needed to cross the intervening mountains. And the cabin masks did not drop down.

As a general aviation rule, oxygen is recommended when the cabin altitude is 10,000 feet or higher. And that is especially the case at night due to adverse effects on night vision without oxygen.

However, the flight crew (and Tina?) had oxygen masks in the cockpit on an entirely separate system from the cabin drop down masks. And the flight crew was told to use that system at various times.

Robert99

I recall all of this, above.

But you don't recall anything about Cooper wanting 10,000 ?

[BruceSmith 3]

Quote

"...But you don't recall anything about Cooper wanting 10,000 ?..."

I'll check my inteview notes with Rataczak. I believe he confirmed the 10K demand from Cooper.

Also, Dona Elliott said the plane was lower than 10K when it went over Amboy. She told, Bobby B, me and Meyer it was about 3-4,000 feet when we talked with her in Ariel in 2012.

[skyjack71 0]

Robert99

Jo, You seem to feel that Duane was involved in every interesting program that you see on cable TV. Why don't you just say you saw it on TV instead of claiming you knew the author of some articles on the same subject.

Or is it just a strange coincidence that some of the events you described above were covered on cable TV not to long ago. Are you infringing on the rights of the television people?

Robert99

OHHHhhhh! Robert U do NOT know me. I do NOT have cable TV & I average 2 hours per day on the 3 major channels I get. I watch the news if I remember to turn the TV on.
Today the TV has not been turned on.

My world does NOT revolved around the TV. What I said in a recent posting is what I have experienced and the research I did yrs ago and my unrelenting search for TRUTHS. One does NOT find those on TV nor in our local library.

Eat YOUR words!. I used to get the history channel, but it is NO longer available by antennae.

The last time I watched a Cable program was the program Blevins promoted and I made arrangements to view that with a friend I trusted, who has NOW moved away. Most of my friends HAVE no idea what I am involved in. Only one of those friends lived here and is now in N.C.

YOU KNOW zero about JO.

There is a place about 24 miles from here I visit in attempts to get books for research & I can renew the loan by phone if I am unable to make the trip to renew it. If I find a book - I pay for it - I like to own what I read.

Casual reading - I use the large print books - so I wait until someone donates one to the Friends of the library. RARELY does an infomative research book become availabe there on any subject.

The regular library gets those and the books I am looking for they do not keep....they just do NOT clutter up their limited shelf space with research books. If there is a large sale of donated books - I go and search for books that might be helpful. They are usually OLD books and only twice in 14 yrs have I found books that were helpful.

NOT a TV person.....! I hate the hype and the chopping . All you get is the sensationalization (not a real word, but you get the meaning - I hope).. Look beyond your limitations regarding me.

Dumb Blonde Sydrome - I do NOT get jokes. I also do NOT understand a lot of what I read, but at least I make the attempt.

Until this last yr - got 2 newspapers daily, but with everything getting so expensive I had to give up one of those. The print is so light and what little national new they carries seems to be llimited.

Copyright 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012 2013, 2014, 2015 by Jo Weber

[skyjack71 0]

RobertMBlevins

This implies locality as well, and some amount of desperation. He wanted out ASAP and was ready to do it.

NOTHING Cooper stated implies he was LOCAL. Knowing a place and having worked there in the past does NOT make someone LOCAL.

Copyright 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012 2013, 2014, 2015 by Jo Weber

[skyjack71 0]

BruceSmith

Quote

"...But you don't recall anything about Cooper wanting 10,000 ?..."

I'll check my inteview notes with Rataczak. I believe he confirmed the 10K demand from Cooper.

Also, Dona Elliott said the plane was lower than 10K when it went over Amboy. She told, Bobby B, me and Meyer it was about 3-4,000 feet when we talked with her in Ariel in 2012.

You trust her to know what 4000 ft is?
Of course on down the road there were 4 other individuals who claimed they could see the outline of the plane thru the clouds and said it was not more than 6K.

Then just East of Lake Meriwin and over toward Cougar others claimed to have heard the plane. They were told it was the chase planes making turns, but both are military wives who like myself have lived near bases - we know a airline sound, a transport sound and the sound of the small planes and the sound of the small fast planes - they all sound differently.

The witness reports had the plane all over the place! Don't forget the one who claimed she could see the aft stairs and a flare. It has been proven one could NOT see the aft stair open at the distance the plane had to have been at that point.

I live near 4 installations and I would not dare guess how many feet the plane is above my head. The sounds are a definite yes.

I can tell you how low an old transport was - because I looked up at the skywindow and I could see the rivets. Another time I was outside and you could see the tree tops reacting it was so slow. BOTH time we made complaints - it has NOT happened again. Most of this area is VERY low, but the small area I live in is the highest elevation in this low area....these TRANING missions were TO low! THEY never go over this area any more. You can see and hear them South of us and North of us - but, NOT over head.

I think they maybe completely out of service now - forget the reason stated.
They were prop transporters. I can still see and hear manuevers at night to the East and West of me....outside of the Pops and booms - the small planes and the helicopters are NOT noisy. When it is a clear night it is interesting to watch the skies - but this last yr there was NOT even much of that.

Copyright 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012 2013, 2014, 2015 by Jo Weber