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DB Cooper

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4 hours ago, The Cooper Vortex said:

New episode of The Cooper Vortex out today. DB Cooper was a Frogman with Matt L'Hommedieu. Matt is a former US Navy Seal, Air Force PJ, and smokejumper.

 

Enjoy!

 

https://thecoopervortex.podbean.com/e/db-cooper-was-a-frogman-matt-lhommedieu/

Thanks for the first good post of the day. I'll check it out on my way to Virginia on Wednesday.

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(edited)
On 5/5/2019 at 6:46 AM, FLYJACK said:

All the wind data shows the winds from the ESE/SSE to S around 8 PM. In line with the flightpath.. the data also suggests it was the virtually the same same direction at all alt levels but increased at elevation.

The fact that the FBI used wind data from Portland is puzzling because NOAA archives show no radiosonde (IGRA) data from Portland between June 1956 and October 1972. I contacted NOAA and they said that if data for Portland were missing, Salem was the replacement site. Data for Salem station are available for 11.24.1971 at 1600 PST and show winds at 10,492 feet AMSL from 200 degrees at 38.9 knots. Data for SEATAC station are available for 11.24.1971 at 0700 PST but show winds only up to 4000 feet AMSL, at which level the wind was from 210 degrees at 34.0 knots. 

711124-25 72694 Salem weather.xlsx

71124 72793 SEATAC weather.xlsx

Edited by DFS346
correcting time reference of NOAA data

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(edited)

RE: Chutes..

 

This document describes the observation of two "olive drab green" back chutes. No bleepers?

Then describes the two Hayden chutes with burp sacks.. #1 tan and #2 olive drab green. With burp sacks.

That indicates four back chutes involved (before the two back chutes were sent to the plane)

 

 

4backchutes.jpeg

Edited by FLYJACK

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The western flight path is beyond dead.

 

http://community.seattletimes.nwsource.com/archive/?date=20010315&slug=pilot15m
 

'D.B. Cooper' pilot dies; William Scott never talked much about 1971 skyjacking
By Susan Gilmore 
Seattle Times staff reporter


For 30 years, William "Scotty" Scott said little about the world's most famous skyjacking, shunning assorted authors and movie producers who came knocking at his door.

Mr. Scott piloted the Northwest Orient Airlines jet hijacked by the infamous "D.B. Cooper" on Thanksgiving Eve 1971. He died of prostate cancer Sunday at his home in Green Valley, Ariz., taking to the grave much of what he knew about that fateful night, said his wife, Frances.

"When he came home that night," she said, "he told his family about it, and that was the end of it. He was a very quiet man. Very reserved."

Only in recent years had he begun to talk about the skyjacking that perplexed the FBI and continues to rivet those who think Cooper may have survived the jump of 10,000 feet into the blackness of a storm over Southwest Washington.

Her husband was convinced Cooper died in the leap, said Frances Scott. "He felt he jumped into Lake Merwin (Cowlitz County) and got tangled up in dead trees and died," she said.

On the 25th anniversary of the heist, Mr. Scott spoke to a local pilots club; 200 people showed up, said his wife.

 

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Robert, please define "Major Contributor".

Yes, I belong to and greatly enjoy Shutters site. But I don't really contribute anything. I don't investigate Cooper, never have. I don't have the time, money or know how to do any of that. Sure, I could probably come up with a suspect, develop a huge case of confirmation bias, maybe even write a book and then label myself a Cooper Investigator. Nope, too much of that going on as it is. I'll just stay on the sidelines, read the forums and the news stories along with the occasional book and be just fine. I'll throw out a comment or two along the way.

My point in all of this is to point out that I am not a "Major Contributor" to anything Cooper related. So please do not label me as such. Thank You.

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The Lady Vols basketball program has turned into a dumpster fire as well. They were at one time one of the elite programs in the country as was the football team. Unfortunately those days are long gone.

I drove through downtown Kingsport this past week on my way to Virginia.

Edited by ParrotheadVol

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On 9/1/2019 at 11:13 PM, GoingBoeing said:

We use to drive through there going to Boone, NC skiing. Love it there!  Growing up sadly I pulled for Eric Robert Rudolf who was hiding out over in Murphy and the Smokies. Also we’d go to Maggie Valley and a place called Ghost town or something it had a rollercoaster and being grown up I tried my hand at the Indian Reservation card tables lol. 

I remember going to Ghost Town when I was a kid. There was a plan to re-open it this year, but it didn't happen. Last I saw it was up for sale for around $6 Million. It did re-open for a little while a few years back. There is a sledding hill with man made snow across the street from there that we go to from time to time. Hadn't been in a couple of years but I'm going to try and take the kids again this winter.

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Recca (a USAF trained PJ and accomplished skydiver) had ALL the skills but the Cle Elum landing story is just not credible. Why on earth would he tell such a story? A liar would, of course, pick a credible V 23 proximal landing area. Recca didn't. It does make me wonder...

His extensive collection of foreign passports also makes me wonder. Most of the passports were not genuine (thanks Snow for showing me evidence of counterfeiting) but why did he have them?   Was he a Walter Mitty 007 pretender or was he up to something serious? 

I do admire the candor of his Cooper proponents. Putting forth the whole story including Cle Elum has my respect. They didn't spin or cherry-pick facts. It's so tempting to ignore facts that cast doubt on favorite suspects. 

377

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The documentary on Reca was very good.

The problem with this case in general, is that someone who is not familiar with the details of it, can be easily convinced that Reca is Cooper. Same can be said for Rackstraw, Christiansen, Peterson or any of the others. For instance, the doc gives a perfectly good reason why the plane would have flown the route that would have allowed Reca to land in Cle Elum and gives a good reason why they would have hid that route from the public. I don't buy it, not for a second. But the average person that isn't familiar with the details of the case would. Same result as the Rackstraw doc, people that didn't know better just believed it. Same will happen with a Christiansen movie if it happens.

Personally, I would like to know how much of the rest of the Reca story is true, if any. Was he really an CIA operative? Watching the documentary, you get the idea that this is a forgone conclusion. I'd like to see more info on that myself. Also, was he really in Cle Elum the night of the hijacking and why? The witness that said he was comes across as very believable and doesn't strike me as a liar, but that was also a long time ago to remember the details like he does. But, you can find these folks in every one of these stories. At the end of the day, it sounds like Reca had a very interesting story, I just don't believe he was Cooper. But, if he lied about that, then how much of the other stuff is lies?

To me, the biggest evidence against Reca being Cooper is the recorded confession. He was led on many of the answers. Some of the other answers he gave were very questionable as well, such as when he said that he had no idea what kind of plane he was hijacking, and had planned to jump out the side door and had no knowledge of the aft stairs. That to me is a bigger red flag than the Cle Elum thing.

Reca also supposedly bought a house for cash some time after the hijacking. If I remember correctly, the documentary includes an interview with the guy that sold him the house. Seems like I've heard that one somewhere before.

But still, the doc is worth a watch.

Edited by ParrotheadVol

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some interesting info in FBI file #40..


The FBI compared Rackstraw’s finger prints to NORJAK and it was negative. They then sought to obtain his palm prints and tested, they were also negative.. In other files there are references to test for finger prints but not palm prints.

If the finger prints were negative, why test the palms..

That suggests they are unsure they have Cooper’s prints and the palm prints and finger prints may be from different individuals. CLEARLY,  not matching the fingerprints DOES NOT eliminate.


Tina..

This is fascinating, in 1978 the crew members were approached by somebody pushing Bryant Coffelt as Cooper for a script. They claimed to have FBI files and be working with the FBI. The FBI was concerned that the crew was going to give out “confidential” info..

Tina was contacted by the person in Minnesota Nov 1976 and in San Diego Jan 1977.

Tina kept a newspaper scrapbook and only discussed what was in the newspapers.

Tina claimed she never discussed “confidential” information.

Tina stated.. She only knows that there is _____________________ but does not know on which side. 

That sounds like a feature, on the face? and only on one side?.. a scar, mole, teeth, something??  Info held back??


“Tina” was cautioned that any information she has is crucial to this investigation and that it should not be made public. 
 


This seems to address the "sexual" assault claim.. it didn't happen

"Additionally, the hijacker did not make any overt or indicate gestures toward her or to any other stewardess to the best of her knowledge. 
She stated that she was sitting down during the entire flight and that the only time she stood up was when a passenger got up to use the bathroom. This would have been the only time or opportunity that the hijacker would have had to ______________. Additionally, she stated that during the entire flight, _________ was in the cockpit maintaining a log of the events and that she was the only stewardess in the aft of the plane with the hijacker."

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ParrotheadVol wrote: "To me, the biggest evidence against Reca being Cooper is the recorded confession. He was led on many of the answers. Some of the other answers he gave were very questionable as well, such as when he said that he had no idea what kind of plane he was hijacking, and had planned to jump out the side door and had no knowledge of the aft stairs. That to me is a bigger red flag than the Cle Elum thing."

 

Good points. The interviewer's question were sooooo leading, which would be impermissible on direct exam in a courtoom.

Opposing counsel: "objection, leading question."

Judge: "OBJECTION SUSTAINED! Counsel, I suggest you ask your witness questions not suggest his answers" 

Also, no experienced skydiver and PJ would take such a lackadaisical attitude about the aircraft type and exit locations, especially in a jet, simply not credible. In any high-speed exit, aircraft structure strikes are a huge risk. 

Lots of folks who haven't made much out of their lives sling bullshit about being CIA, Navy SEAL, Special Forces, etc. Undercover work can explain away years of apparent non-productive time. I don't know much about military special ops activities but I do know the parachuting aspects of that work. When I hear a barroom claim about being a SEAL, I  ask parachute questions. It almost always filters out the liars. I had one alleged SEAL go on and on about the "parasails" they used for deep black HALO insertions into Sakhalin Island at night where they planted acoustic tracking devices on Soviet subs. Real Mission Impossible stuff. I should have got his autograph. 

377

Edited by 377

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Capt. Bill Rataczak, C0-Pilot on that Fateful Flight, Delivers First Hand Report to NW AHC Audience

http://northwestairlineshistory.org/wp-content/uploads/2018/05/1209-newsletter.pdf

 

✈For the most part Cooper was a cool customer. He was a chain smoker, though. Raleighs were his brand. He had one cocktail. 

(other report, Cooper had two drinks)

✈President Nyrop rightly agreed with our insistence that any and all decisions were to be handled exclusively by our three-man flight crew. No interference from outside agencies. “The safety of the passengers came first and they were our passengers. Everybody’s job, on the ground or in the air, was to protect our crew and passengers and keep that airplane in one piece,” says Rataczak. “And we did that.”

✈Second Officer Anderson began monitoring the refueling, and it was soon obvious that ground personnel were delaying the process (probably on the F.B.I.’s orders, despite Mr. Nyrop’s directive not to intervene). Andy challenged the crew via his interphone and was told the truck was vapor locked. A second truck pumped only 300 of the 4,500 gallons we required. Andy ordered a third truck, which the ground crew claimed was vapor locked also. F/O Rataczak got on the interphone and told them in no uncertain terms to quit playing games. They finally cooperated and pumped the full 4,500 gallons.

(crew believed fuelling problems were an FBI ruse)

✈The FBI says Cooper had a real bomb: eight sticks of dynamite with wires, batteries, etc. He apparently threw it out when he jumped. No sign of the bomb was found by authorities in Reno.

(bomb was real??)

✈We had to hold over Seattle while Cooper’s demands were being met. What to tell the passengers? There’s a man sitting back there with you who has a bomb? No, we said we had a minor maintenance problem and asked them to please remain in their seats.

✈At 10,000 feet out of Seattle there was a cloud layer, causing icing to occur on the aircraft. We were flying what we call a “dirty airplane” with flaps and gear down. We were unpressurized. We had another problem besides Cooper. Icing.

✈ During our descent into Reno, we made a P.A. to Cooper (if he was still there) that the stairs needed to be raised for landing so they would not be damaged, which could prevent a subsequent takeoff.

✈The crew didn’t see Cooper jump nor did anybody, apparently, in the chase planes. Where he attempted to open the parachute would have had a bearing on where he landed. If he pulled it quickly he would have floated quite a ways. A late pull or no pull at all would have taken him straight down.

✈There’s been a lot of talk, some recently, about former purser Ken Christiansen being D. B. Cooper. He was fully vetted by the F.B.I., who determined he was not a person of interest.

✈Cooper offered Stewardess Tina Mucklow a packet of $20 bills before leaving. She declined.

(Tina and the other stews were offered packets of money)

✈At least two bodies have been recovered in the Cooper search area, neither of them is our man.

✈Each year, the day before Thanksgiving, the little bar/filling station town of Ariel, Wash., in Cooper territory, holds a Cooper celebration. “It would be fun to visit Ariel, then, incognito, and take it all in,” Rataczak says. “I might do that one of these years.”

Rataczak strongly opposes the folk hero moniker. “No way. He was a criminal, one of the worst kind. He was a hijacker and a thief and he endangered the lives of innocent people. There’s nothing heroic about that.”

Nonetheless, the unsolved Cooper story remains a fascinating episode, perhaps the most notorious crime in commercial aviation history.

“I agree with my good friend, FBI Agent Ralph Himmelsbach, who bird-dogged the Cooper case for many years,” Rataczak says. “I don’t think he made it out alive. I think he’s down there in the blackberry brambles someplace.”

Perhaps we’ll never know. Or we might know tomorrow. ✈

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Robert, you are not hard on anyone. your animosity is more than enough proof. what would be the reason for even making statements as you do over the years. is it people talking about you, if so, please direct me to the discussion surrounding one Robert Blevins. you do show more than enough proof it's some sort of competition with you and other boards. do you post the same on your board that millions view? shouldn't you worry about Robert vs what Shutter is or isn't doing?

For the 200th time. DB Cooper is a hobby of mine. nothing in any contract tells me I MUST promote at every corner. your site alone should be the top dog since you love to dish out the advice on running boards? this last week had NOTHING to do with Cooper and EVERYTHING surrounding my life and others around me with a devastating storm approaching south Florida. I was far too busy worrying about an decades old hijacking. I was out helping the community and now in between my regular work I have to return and help them get back to normal. I'm also considering going over to the Bahama's and help. do you think the public will approve my absence? sometimes people have better things to do. I can't spend hours on the computer till the sun comes up whining about others. you recently posted not hating anymore on Eric so you decide to whine about me again? 

You be sure to let me know when you have a life or death situation facing you that takes days to conclude causing panic throughout an entire state. you actually want to put people down now for even having a Cooper site or is it just me? nobody posted on Bruce's site since August 20th? it's no different here. one of the main posters isn't even suppose to be on the board? you of all people being a main contributor should be helping the site guidelines but you break most of them anyway...perhaps you could fly down here a really help? they pay up to $500 a day in the Bahama's cleaning up? it's right up your alley. all tax deductible..I realize it's hard work telling people I don't show pictures or links. it can take a toll trying to discredit on a daily basis. then us talking about the same old boring stuff. unlike the hot topic of Reca or what picture to post on a YouTube channel? then you wonder why nobody wishes to work with you, really? I'm trying to figure out why the public hasn't asked me why I don't allow links to be shown? is my site the only one on the internet that does that? let me jump on Facebook and look, oops, I have to JOIN to view. the number ONE social media site and I have to join it to view anything. shameful, isn't it? I've had many join and say they only wish to view vs post. they don't like it, I don't need them.....let's head over to Citizensleuths, oops, have to join to view....they have several Cooper threads..

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I fail to see any logic in your personal vendetta with conferences. you have had all the time in the world to put something together that the Decoded team was asking for. instead you complain about other events that you believe will have low numbers but once again fail to get on top of the issue and show people how it's done. it's all about business, right? you should of taken control once you realized it was going to fail in your belief? you even stated you didn't need us, so why didn't YOU come through? Eric is trying, what are you doing other than complaining? then if 30 people show or 150 you will still be telling the world how it should of been done. it's very confusing how someone with all the answers never does anything? 

Again, nothing against you but you and Jim fail to understand that the Cooper community does have fun at these events, big or small. people don't like your personality. this has nothing to do with Cooper at all as you try and make it sound by using hate and jealousy cards. you will never change. you sit here night after night putting people down and appear to be dumbfounded why you are alone?

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Robert, you fail to follow along. the second, not the minute YOU believed Eric "screwed everyone" you should of stepped in worked a deal to make it the way you keep saying one should be done since WSHS had one. you have whined about every conference since the first one by Gray. talk is cheap and you are full of it. you had the whole Decoded crew right in the palm of your hand and you did jack. there is nobody to blame except yourself. the weak lost. you have no business sense in turning anything around. I would of drove right to Jim and spoke to him face to face pitching a better deal. probably could of got Kaye, 377, and ask Flyjack for something to present. lots of options vs whining for years about the same old crap. 

Now you speaking about something years ahead that might not happen unless the film is made and yet it's a competition once again with numbers. you have to actually do one to make any numbers come true. you do realize this, right? once again it's just more talk. 

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Robert, you are way too personal about the Cooper case. you have been this way since 2010. it doesn't matter how involved you were going to be. you keep repeating over the years each time a conference is held how it should of been done. the best defense is to hold your own event doing the things you claim over the years showing how to bring the public into the case. instead you just cry about it all the time over and over. 

Jim joined my forum and I sent an email telling him I didn't wish to get involved with the event if you were part of it. I gave my reasons which I have every right to do. if he didn't join I probably would of never got involved in the first place. I had nothing to do with any of it. Bruce gave a list of things he wanted from you if he was to get involved. Jim voiced his opinion about everyone getting along and I told him everyone basically does except when it comes to you. it is what it is. you have done a lot of damage in the past. you are making a federal case about nothing. it's an age old unsolved hijacking, nothing more!. I suggest you call and speak to Eric man to man instead of side stepping. this appears to be between the both of you. more you than anything. 

The public has always been curious about Cooper. that's the extent of there involvement. they tend to believe every suspect that comes forward no matter the evidence. "has to be him, they finally found him" another broken record over the years. then Cooper fades back into the darkness as it has been doing for the last five decades. some join forums and comment a couple times and disappear. they probably do that with a lot of other cases and things on the internet. I have joined dozens of forum and haven't returned to them. 

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Completely false narrative Robert. it's my right to pick a choose who I deal with. you don't like it, tough. I don't know Jim from dick, nor do I care to. lol, who's fault is it now, mine? it's been Eric's for months. opinions are not allowed in the Cooper circle, got it? lets team up and blame it on Bruce, or even Parrot? 

 I'm not contracted to you in anyway, shape or form. as your past members on your forum said. "I will not conform to you" 

I need you to focus here, ready? I explained to Jim I didn't wish to get involved with the event. I also explained I live in Florida and my input would only be forwarding the information about the event.. you still with me? he responded wanting everyone to work together. still here? I replied that would not be possible due to the things you have done in the past and I explained those reasons. they were accurate and to the point. you still with me? this reason can not be used to try and shift the blame of the whole thing coming apart because I don't wish to be involved with projects that includes you. I never spoke with Jim surrounding anything concerning the event itself or who was to be a part of it or when the date was or anything about it what so ever. I had no part in this from the start. I was asked a question and an answer was given. how you believe that it's okay to trash people all year long and then expect people to just forget and work with someone is beyond belief. you still here? I told you the samething regarding the movie. I wanted nothing to do with it. I can't be bought, got it? I've also wished you good luck with it...all I get from you is I'm jealous lol. you are 65 years old Robert. grow up for crying out loud dude. you don't even know if the event would of materialized regardless to what happened. this started seven months ago. anything could of happened in between. 

In closing. nothing, and I mean nothing was stopping you from making this a reality yourself. you had all the tools to make it happen and your weakness shined right through bright as the sun. hell, you quit twice during the short emails to Jim. including more threats. 65 years old going on 13 sometimes screaming out when you don't get your way (internet tantrum). then you play victim....you have put this thread exactly where it left off. Cooper is secondary...

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